Critical Cricism...I hate to say it, but I agree

[greylord]

With all those who are saying it's not a Dungeon Siege game. Now I'm not a newcomer to this forum just saying this to troll or complain, and I've given it chances while I played. I played it on Casual (yes, Casual, since everyone else and their dog had it before me apparantly because it was released so late in the US [or pirated by everyone but a few of us] my goal was to see how accurate the complaints were or weren't and analyze more exactly what the good and bad were). I played both SP and MP.

 

The feel of the game and how it flows is NOTHING like the other DS games. Period. If I were a DS fan...oh wait...I am....

 

Many DS fans are probably livid. Their reactions are actually a LOT more sedate than I would have thought. This game is something other than the other DS games that have come out. If a hardcore DS fan reviewed this game I'd expect them to give it score no higher than a 4 in relation to how it is with the other games if their bias was included.

 

As a NON-DS game however, and how it should properly be reviewed, the SP portion is OUTSTANDING. As a game on it's own, without the DS name to rely on (which would mean sales would be lower in my opinion) I think it's a stellar effort. I didn't run into bugs, the graphics look gorgeous, the dialogue choices are great, and overall the game runs awesomely. If SP was the only factor it was rated on I think it should be an 8 or higher. Maybe a 9 even.

 

The only real complaint I have is that there there is no real explanation of what the stats do, how they affect your character, and how the weapons work in relation to them. It took me a quarter of the game to figure out all the relations of the stats and equipment...and I don't think I'm that stupid (maybe I am though). There needs to be more information in the instruction booklet, or a better tutorial in the game. It's NOT intuitive in and of itself.

 

Second, with sell back being so little, there's no reason for random junk for other characters to pop up. It makes the extra equipment more into a finding junk game that is absolutely useless. Either make sell back worth a little more, or simply give you weapons that are applicable to your character in the SP game.

 

Now MP is MESSED UP! In a MAJOR WAY.

 

This should be rated a 6, maybe a 5 overall. First off, I think they ramp up the difficulty in MP to MUCH. I played MP on Casual with my daughter (yes, she's only 6, but that's one other reason to play Casual). I was dying constantly...ON CASUAL. Now, I had just beaten the game in SP...so theoretically I should not die THAT much in MP. In fact, I started dying early on against bosses, which after beating the game should have meant I had the skill to literally tromp them to the dust. Not so...

 

They need to patch it so at least on Casual the MP portion does NOT ramp up this much. Period. It shouldn't feel like I'm playing on Hard while doing the game in MP on casual. It's stupid.

 

Secondly, the enemies go off screen, especially the bosses, and attack you. No so much a problem in SP, but in MP...if one is handling minions and the other trying to attack the boss, but you can't see the boss = stupid.

 

In fact ridiculously so. We're being attacked by things we can't attack back? That actually feels like a cheap tactic. This screen thing needs to be fixed pronto via a patch...IMO.

 

I don't have tons of time right now, but for the short end...they need to fix the MP portion, whether online or side by side with your buddy (in my case my daughter, and she's not bad with videogames overall, before people crash too hard on my parade...also remember I DID beat this same difficulty in SP so I don't think it should be THAT much tougher in MP).

 

I understand why DS fans are outraged. The SP portion of the game is outstanding nonetheless...Great job Obs.

 

No real bugs that I've run across. Great Job Obs and SE.

 

The MP portion...now that's just screwed up big time.

[Tel Prydain]

With all those who are saying it's not a Dungeon Siege game.

....

Many DS fans are probably livid. Their reactions are actually a LOT more sedate than I would have thought. This game is something other than the other DS games that have come out. If a hardcore DS fan reviewed this game I'd expect them to give it score no higher than a 4 in relation to how it is with the other games if their bias was included.

I'm sure both of them are very upset.

 

I played the original games, and they weren

[sorophx]

man, I still don't get this "it doesn't play like a true DS game" thing. why do you care? Fallout New Vegas doesn't play like Fallout 2, so I just keep replaying Fallout 2 over and over, because it's such a great game, I don't need a new game that plays exactly the same, I have my old one, which is perfect in every way.

 

so why do you?

 

Either make sell back worth a little more, or simply give you weapons that are applicable to your character in the SP game.

I had more than 200000 gold at the last shopkeeper you meet in the game, there was nothing to spend it on, I already had the best stuff for both characters. that "junk" is there so you never run out of money. but its purpose isn't to make you rich, because there's nothing to do with all that gold.

[athlondude]

Yeah, I liked DS3 better when it was called Gauntlet. Seriously DS3 is nothing more than an arcade version of the original game, and there is so little of the first two in this one that it has nothing to do with the DS universe other than the name. I find this shocking especially since obsidian put out Never Winter Nights 2, and a few other killer titles so I can't help but be dissappointed. Thank God Blizzard is doing Diablo as I am sure it will up to its name.

[C2B]

Yeah, I liked DS3 better when it was called Gauntlet. Seriously DS3 is nothing more than an arcade version of the original game, and there is so little of the first two in this one that it has nothing to do with the DS universe other than the name.

 

It has a LOT to do with the DS "Universe". Multiple charachters of previous Games are constantly refrenced and the entire lore builds up on the previous games.

[MonkeyLungs]

The gameplay is quite a reboot though. Also peoples concerns/comments/complaints/rants etc. about this title are quite similar, even the folks around here that get labeled as haters and trolls .. the comments share core elements. Cool single player title, though a bit short but ok because each of the 4 characters is really unique, multiplayer is a letdown. Now the wording and tone changes from person to person, I'm a little more gruff for instance, but there is definitely recurring themes and they are easy to recognize.

[Sacrosanct]

As a NON-DS game however, and how it should properly be reviewed, the SP portion is OUTSTANDING. As a game on it's own, without the DS name to rely on (which would mean sales would be lower in my opinion) I think it's a stellar effort. I didn't run into bugs, the graphics look gorgeous, the dialogue choices are great, and overall the game runs awesomely. If SP was the only factor it was rated on I think it should be an 8 or higher. Maybe a 9 even.

 

It's called Dungeon Siege 3 and it should be reviewed as a NON-DS game? Seriously just LOLOLOL to that. I'm delighted you find the SP so outstanding. To me it had the camera straight from Satan's bottom, a DIRE loot system and it was over before I knew it. 7 hours for a full-priced game? lofl.

[Alpha]

gamers sometimes want to be so demanding that end being tools of others IMO that maybe never played the game and bash it to join the wagon.

Edited June 27, 2011 by Alpha

[AlcoJaguar]

With all those who are saying it's not a Dungeon Siege game.

....

Many DS fans are probably livid. Their reactions are actually a LOT more sedate than I would have thought. This game is something other than the other DS games that have come out. If a hardcore DS fan reviewed this game I'd expect them to give it score no higher than a 4 in relation to how it is with the other games if their bias was included.

I'm sure both of them are very upset.

 

I played the original games, and they weren’t anything that inspired a whole lot of passion. Other then a tiny bit of steam-punk it was about as generic as it’s possible for an RPG to be.

I’d have liked a few more of the DS1/2 features in DS3 (party mechanics, pack animals), but other then that I’m not sure there was much else worth salvaging that Obsidian didn’t carry over.

 

Frankly, the DS world presented in DS3 has about 100 times the character of the first two games combined.\

 

To me this felt like what happened with Dragon Age II. I think what bothers me the most is that all these sequels to great games that I really enjoyed turn out to be substantially different than the name and legacy led to me believe. I think the OP has a point. On its own the game is good but when you associate it with the expectation of its title it really does conjure up false excitement. I don't think I would have bought this game so quickly had I know it wasn't the type of dungeon crawler I've come to expect from the DS series. This isn't because the title isn't good, its just not the kind of game I was looking for. The Fallout comparison is valid as Dungeon Siege is a bit of a cult classic. Only those who wanted a Fallout faithful to its origins really had a problem with the series being hijacked and they were a small crowd. If this were an independent title, or a temporary segue of the series (like Renegade was for Command and Conquer) I don't think there were be too much complaint. Using the name Dungeon Siege III means that, at least for now, hopes of a true successor to the line are dashed. Who knows if Obsidian will reverse course and come out with a Dungeon Siege IV more in line with I and II.

 

 

Now MP is MESSED UP! In a MAJOR WAY.

I like that the Multiplayer element of this game is tailored for groups of friends who want to experience the game together. This is infinitely preferable to the level mixing ‘random dropping in and out’ model used in other RPGs.

I agree with the camera complaints.

 

Its not an unheard of system for Multiplayer. Magicka does roughly the same thing but handles a shared camera much more gracefully (I think we all agree that the camera is horrendous). I have the same gripe as before I won't go off on a rant here, I just wish multiplayer was the same as the previous two titles. There's also the fact that PC players tend to co-op from different boxes that are of significant geographical distances from each other. DS III seems to assume you'll always be in the same room together playing on the same system (i.e., you can definitely tell the PC version is just an afterthought, a port from console once they got it just the way they wanted). Console has a bigger market, and those players tend to be fairly casual, have families, and want something to share. That's fine, just advertise it as such so I can avoid it (a stick on the box or warning before purchasing in Steam will do nicely, hehe).

Edited June 27, 2011 by AlcoJaguar

[MonkeyLungs]

Multiplayer that allows for more freedom ... ie persistent characters and newgame+ and different difficulty levels and free mode and story mode DOES NOT IN ANY WAY LIMIT THE ABILITY FOR FRIENDS TO CREATE THE EXACT SAME TAILORED TO THEIR GROUP EXPERIENCE THAT THIS GAME OFFERS.

 

It just so happens that you can get this same DS3 style experience (with a better camera) AND have tons of other options.

 

I can get my group of gamer friends together and do a focussed group specific playthough of Sacred 2 or Borderlands, or even D2, and we can all create characters to only play the game with each other. We can get the exact same experience people claim is some kind of unique feature to DS3 AND AND AND have tons of other options available to us.

[XxTaLoNxX]

Yeah, I liked DS3 better when it was called Gauntlet. Seriously DS3 is nothing more than an arcade version of the original game, and there is so little of the first two in this one that it has nothing to do with the DS universe other than the name. I find this shocking especially since obsidian put out Never Winter Nights 2, and a few other killer titles so I can't help but be dissappointed. Thank God Blizzard is doing Diablo as I am sure it will up to its name.

 

Ok I will present to you a choice.

 

1) You are ignorant, cynical and spouting the same nonsense that every CLUELESS hater is spouting.

2) You have no idea what you are talking about and forgot the mantra, "Better to be silent and appear stupid, than open mouth and remove all doubt."

 

Throughout THE ENTIRE GAME events and characters of the past are referenced over and over and over again. IN FACT there is an entire level in the game dedicated to those past games... AND a quest called Dungeon Siege. If that is Obsidian's way of going off the beaten path of the old games then I am sure as hell glad they didn't give this game to BioWare. In every possible way, DS3 is better than DA2. In every way. So I can only assume the reason the review scores are so low is that people are snubbing Obsidian and they have their heads up BioWares asses.

 

Obsidian and DS3 are 1000 times better than BioWare (or any other RPG developer right now, and that include SquEnix.. FF13? a joke).

 

Arcade? Seriously? Where are you putting your quarters? Wait.. I dunwannaknow. Yeah, calling DS3 (a dungeon crawling hack n' slash) arcade-like is about as smart as calling any fighting game an arcade game.

[Sacrosanct]

gamers sometimes want to be so demanding that end being tools of others IMO that maybe never played the game and bash it to join the wagon.

 

 

I played the first two games and quite liked them. No way should this game be reviewed or judged as anything other than a DS game that's how it's marketed and that's the tool they used to sucker people into buying it. Having said that, if it was a GOOD game in its own right I really wouldn't care. It would be foolish to dislike a game just because of what it isn't instead of what it is. 7 hours for a single player RPG is absolutely pathetic no matter how you look at it and especially one with a camera that does its level best to hinder you every single step of the way.

 

People who applaud games like this deserve absolutely everything they get. In a few years they'll be saying how glad they are that they paid 70 dollars for DS4 and how they enjoyed the full 60 minutes entertainment they got from it and how they can't understand what people are complaining about.

[Flouride]

gamers sometimes want to be so demanding that end being tools of others IMO that maybe never played the game and bash it to join the wagon.

 

 

I played the first two games and quite liked them. No way should this game be reviewed or judged as anything other than a DS game that's how it's marketed and that's the tool they used to sucker people into buying it. Having said that, if it was a GOOD game in its own right I really wouldn't care. It would be foolish to dislike a game just because of what it isn't instead of what it is. 7 hours for a single player RPG is absolutely pathetic no matter how you look at it and especially one with a camera that does its level best to hinder you every single step of the way.

 

People who applaud games like this deserve absolutely everything they get. In a few years they'll be saying how glad they are that they paid 70 dollars for DS4 and how they enjoyed the full 60 minutes entertainment they got from it and how they can't understand what people are complaining about.

 

I seriously don't know how you can finish the game in just 7 hours. That being said, I'm fairly certain Obsidian never claimed that DS3 would play out just the way the old games did.. They even released a demo for people to see and test it before buying it....

[Xy232]

Obsidian and DS3 are 1000 times better than BioWare (or any other RPG developer right now, and that include SquEnix.. FF13? a joke).

 

Come on, really.I wouldn't compare Bioware and Enix to Obsidian, because Obsidian is not even allowed to step in the shadows of Bioware and Enix.

 

Based on history, look back and see how many bestseller Bioware and Enix had, Obsidian still have way to go.

 

I do agree that FF 13 is not that good, and even Bioware's DA2, but Obsidian's Alpha Protocol/Fallout new vegas aint something to write home about either.

 

Maybe your thinking i hate Obsidian, i dont, i like them, and support them by buying the games they create.

[ELVN2011]

Dungeon Siege 1 is the first RPG ever to have no loading screens and weather effects like, rain, snow, etc.

 

Also area transistions from a forest to a cave changed as did the music, Dungeon Siege set the bar high, Dungeon Siege 2 offered even more in the way character classes, pets and so on.

 

Dungeon Siege 3 offers even more, A well done game engine also no loading screens and area transisions are smooth, as with the other Dungeon Siege games it's Linear with a few side quests.

 

I really like the artwork, level design and characters, I'm not even sure why some say it's short I have yet to finish and I'm level 10 now, The battles are alot harder then the demo also thats good.

Edited June 27, 2011 by ELVN2011

[Renevent]

Dungeon Siege 1 is the first RPG ever to have no loading screens and weather effects like, rain, snow, etc.

 

Also area transistions from a forest to a cave changed as did the music, Dungeon Siege set the bar high, Dungeon Siege 2 offered even more in the way character classes, pets and so on.

 

Dungeon Siege 3 offers even more, A well done game engine also no loading screens and area transisions are smooth, as with the other Dungeon Siege games it's Linear with a few side quests.

 

I really like the artwork, level design and characters, I'm not even sure why some say it's short I have yet to finish and I'm level 10 now, The battles are alot harder then the demo also thats good.

 

Does Dungeon Siege III even have weather? On the 360 levels do actually load too...you will stop running and your character will walk really slowly while the next area loads. Dunno if this happens on the PC though or if you install the game to the 360's hardrive either.

 

Anyways DS3 has MUCH smaller and more linear levels. Overall the world feels smaller and has less content. Then we factor in no new game+, less items, multiplayer with no persistent characters or open content, no modding built in, more party members, pets, high level content, and many other features...well honestly I really have no idea how someone who has played all three games (and remembers them) can say DS3 offers "even more" with a straight face.

 

Not saying it's wrong for anyone to like the new game more (or the same) than the originals. It has a new action based controls and a greater emphasis on story which people may like more, but content wise these games don't compare.

Edited June 27, 2011 by Renevent

[athlondude]

Yeah, I liked DS3 better when it was called Gauntlet. Seriously DS3 is nothing more than an arcade version of the original game, and there is so little of the first two in this one that it has nothing to do with the DS universe other than the name. I find this shocking especially since obsidian put out Never Winter Nights 2, and a few other killer titles so I can't help but be dissappointed. Thank God Blizzard is doing Diablo as I am sure it will up to its name.

 

Ok I will present to you a choice.

 

1) You are ignorant, cynical and spouting the same nonsense that every CLUELESS hater is spouting.

2) You have no idea what you are talking about and forgot the mantra, "Better to be silent and appear stupid, than open mouth and remove all doubt."

 

Throughout THE ENTIRE GAME events and characters of the past are referenced over and over and over again. IN FACT there is an entire level in the game dedicated to those past games... AND a quest called Dungeon Siege. If that is Obsidian's way of going off the beaten path of the old games then I am sure as hell glad they didn't give this game to BioWare. In every possible way, DS3 is better than DA2. In every way. So I can only assume the reason the review scores are so low is that people are snubbing Obsidian and they have their heads up BioWares asses.

 

Obsidian and DS3 are 1000 times better than BioWare (or any other RPG developer right now, and that include SquEnix.. FF13? a joke).

 

Arcade? Seriously? Where are you putting your quarters? Wait.. I dunwannaknow. Yeah, calling DS3 (a dungeon crawling hack n' slash) arcade-like is about as smart as calling any fighting game an arcade game.

 

My goodness did that suck! Wow and I thought you were smarter than that.

 

First off I could give a rip less if they referenced every character, landmark, what the hell ever in the last two games because the second game never referenced any of that crap in the first so dont EVEN pull that crap on me. Secondly, why the hell are you bringing up Bioware and Dragon Age 2? I sure as hell didnt, I dont even own DA or DA2 so ummm.....you go on hating it I dont care. Third I never said "I hate Obsidian". I sure as hell dont like what they did with DS3 mainly because IN MY OPINION it is not a true Dungeon Siege game. There were things specific to Dungeon Siege that I feel were essential to making a good and true Dungeon Siege experience and this game had none of those, so TO ME it blows goat ass!

 

Now as far me being ignorant and clueless, I dont think so. I have been a long time fan of the DS series which originated on the PC and considering I shelled out $50 for the damn game and since I am the one who is not satisfied with it so yeah I'll spout all the hate for it I want. As far as not knowing what I am talking about? Yeah I think I do, considering how many games I have played and all the Dungeon Siege time I have put in you bet your ass I do.

 

And yes I said it, ARCADE! Are you kidding me? You really think this game is some hard hitting in depth RPG? The damn game lasts 12 to 14 hours max. The game play is way to similar to that of Fable or Kingdom Hearts two very ARCADE style games, and yes even Gauntlet (especially the sword of seven sorrows).

 

Obsidian and DS3 1000 times better than Bioware and any other RPG developer? I am shocked that all the WOW lovers haven't flamed you for that statement alone, I mean come on dude, I'm no fan of WOW, but even I have to admit that Blizzard wrote the book on RPGs.

 

Wow, now after writing all that I feel much better, mainly because it looks like the real clueless person here who doesnt know what they are talking about is you!

[AlienOne]

Obsidian and DS3 are 1000 times better than BioWare (or any other RPG developer right now...)

 

Dude... Seriously?

 

 

....Seriously?

 

Bioware has the Mass Effect series (so far two of the best RPGs ever made), Knights of the Old Republic, the ORIGINAL Neverwinter Nights, and the original Dragon Age (which was awesome--they didn't deliver as well with the 2nd one, I'll admit)...not to mention that they're in charge of one of the longest-running and most successful mmoRPGs of all time (Ultima Online).

 

And Obsidian has... Fallout: New Vegas and Neverwinter Nights 2?

 

 

Oh, oh... wait.... I almost forgot... Bioware did Baldur's Gate and Baldur's Gate 2--two of the most influential RPGs in gaming history.

 

Might want to actually use your brain and think a bit before you open your mouth and insert your foot squarely in it.

 

I like Obsidian. They've done pretty good work, and they have a LOT of potential. But they are LIGHT YEARS away from even being compared to one of the most successful RPG developers of all time.

 

"Alien"

Edited June 28, 2011 by AlienOne

[Tigranes]

Wait, what? Bioware's in charge of Ultima Online?

[WorstUsernameEver]

Wait, what? Bioware's in charge of Ultima Online?

 

Mythic is. "BioWare" is a brand now.

[XxTaLoNxX]

My goodness did that suck! Wow and I thought you were smarter than that.

 

Uh huh, yeah been here for a whole day and you assume you know me. I guess you assume you know a lot of things...

 

First off I could give a rip less if they referenced every character, landmark, what the hell ever in the last two games because the second game never referenced any of that crap in the first so dont EVEN pull that crap on me.

 

Wait, first you say that this Dungeon Siege had nothing to do with and was unrelated to the other games and when someone points out that you are incorrect you tell us not to "pull that crap on you"? Ok, now that is just ignorance being bliss, but the thing is you aren't keeping that ignorance to yourself. You are sharing it with the world for us all to see.

 

Secondly, why the hell are you bringing up Bioware and Dragon Age 2? I sure as hell didnt, I dont even own DA or DA2 so ummm.....you go on hating it I dont care. Third I never said "I hate Obsidian". I sure as hell dont like what they did with DS3 mainly because IN MY OPINION it is not a true Dungeon Siege game. There were things specific to Dungeon Siege that I feel were essential to making a good and true Dungeon Siege experience and this game had none of those, so TO ME it blows goat ass!

 

I was using a similar game as a reference point. And here is the thing, as far as hack n' slash RPGs go... this is the best in years and will be at the top as far as quality goes until Diablo is released. My point is that Obsidian did a good job, and a hell of a lot better than an industry RPG "giant" or whatever the BioWare fan boys are calling them. In fact BioWare started taking the suck train and never got off since ME2.

 

I have been a long time fan of the DS series which originated on the PC and considering I shelled out $50 for the damn game and since I am the one who is not satisfied with it so yeah I'll spout all the hate for it I want. As far as not knowing what I am talking about? Yeah I think I do, considering how many games I have played and all the Dungeon Siege time I have put in you bet your ass I do.

 

Great! Yeah, me too. I played DS1 and DS2 years ago. I enjoyed them both but those games were as generic as they come and at least Obsidian/SquareEnix put story at the top of their "to-do" list with this game. So yeah, in a way you're right. DS3 is nothing like the first two DS games... it has a story.

 

And yes I said it, ARCADE! Are you kidding me? You really think this game is some hard hitting in depth RPG? The damn game lasts 12 to 14 hours max. The game play is way to similar to that of Fable or Kingdom Hearts two very ARCADE style games, and yes even Gauntlet (especially the sword of seven sorrows).

 

Going to have to cut you off again. See, I lived in the Age of the Arcade and DS is NOT an arcade game. It's more of an action-rpg. See arcade games all share one real big thing in common... Highscore charts and Leaderboards. DS3 doesn't have that single defining trait. There is no similarity between DS3 and StreetFighter vs Capcom.

 

Obsidian and DS3 1000 times better than Bioware and any other RPG developer? I am shocked that all the WOW lovers haven't flamed you for that statement alone, I mean come on dude, I'm no fan of WOW, but even I have to admit that Blizzard wrote the book on RPGs.

 

Wow, now after writing all that I feel much better, mainly because it looks like the real clueless person here who doesnt know what they are talking about is you!

 

1) Why would WoW fans flame me because I think Obsidian is better than BioWare? WoW has nothing to do with BioWare.

2) Blizzard wrote the book on RPGs? What book are you reading? It's wrong. SquareSoft/Enix wrote the book on RPGs.

2a) Final Fantasy

2b) ChronoTrigger

2c) Secret of Evermore

2d) Dragon Warrior

2e) etc, etc, etc

[hopfrog16]

2) Blizzard wrote the book on RPGs? What book are you reading? It's wrong. SquareSoft/Enix wrote the book on RPGs.

 

Huh.

 

I guess Dungeons & Dragons doesn't count for anything (Gary Gygax and Dave Arneson more specifically, heh).

Edited June 28, 2011 by hopfrog16

[Oner]

Bioware

the ORIGINAL Neverwinter Nights

Not exactly.

[Bakercompany86]

2) Blizzard wrote the book on RPGs? What book are you reading? It's wrong. SquareSoft/Enix wrote the book on RPGs.

 

Huh.

 

I guess Dungeons & Dragons doesn't count for anything (Gary Gygax and Dave Arneson more specifically, heh).

 

Think he's talking about video game RPG's.

[Vilhelm]

2) Blizzard wrote the book on RPGs? What book are you reading? It's wrong. SquareSoft/Enix wrote the book on RPGs.

2a) Final Fantasy

2b) ChronoTrigger

2c) Secret of Evermore

2d) Dragon Warrior

2e) etc, etc, etc

 

Looks like someone knows nothing about what he's talking about. CRPGs originated in the West and Japanese RPGs were inspired by games such as Ultima and Wizardry. Specifically, Final Fantasy was inspired by Dragon Quest, which was inspired by Ultima/Wizardry.

 

And of course, before that we had tabletop games, the biggest and most influential one being Dungeons & Dragons.