Which did you enjoy more, Poe or Poe2?

[bringingyouthefuture]

One thing now that I think about it some more, the boss fights in POE1 were much better and more interesting, requiring various tactics - but in general, most encounters in POE1 in my second play through were pretty easy.  I've played parts of POE2 over and over again, and the fights remain challenging.  I never felt like either game had many useless battles, but I enjoy the combat - if I'm not frustrated than I'm not having fun lol.

 

I would argue too that D&D combat works better in its original form, turn-based.  I never really liked D&D combat with RtWP.  You really lose out in being able to maximize your feats, spells, etc.  I am glad POE1/2 evolved it somewhat to work with RtWP better - one of the things that makes combat great in POE games.  PK perfect example - I never use combat feats in that game because they are so bugged, and positioning with those huge characters is terrible.  Your better off just maximizing your AC and taking the passives for boosts.  If it was turn-based though I could see building a character around certain feats.  That could just be my play style though.

Edited March 12, 2019 by bringingyouthefuture

[thelee]

One thing now that I think about it some more, the boss fights in POE1 were much better and more interesting, requiring various tactics -

 

Seriously - what boss fights? When Tyranny came along and actually had technical aspects boss fights (e.g. the enemy is signaling that they're about to use some big ability, run away!) it blew my mind since I had gotten so used to the IWD-style combat of PoE1 where "big encounters" are just normal encounters with more stats. Maybe the dragons, but once you've fought one dragon, you've fought them all essentially. Even Thaos the only thing "special" about him is the ability to spam cleansing flame and crowns for the faithful, and if you've fought broodmothers that isn't that special anyway.

 

if anything i wish there were more big fights in Deadfire like in Tyranny or like the small sample we got in the BB with engwithan saints and titan (having to deal with grabs, heavy kicks [titan] or the positional aspects of fighting saints (their frost aoe, seals of pain)); honestly was a bit disappointed that the fights/dungeon of Poko Kohara was the exception, not the norm.

Edited March 12, 2019 by thelee

[Daidre]

 

 

You kinda tried to make it look as if you're commenting on the Obsidian crew, but in fact you were only talking about your own unbased opinions and biases.

 

Yes, I am horribly biased against people who wrote Xoti and Tekehu and then posted on twitter how proud they are of their work.

 

Even more biased against people who decided to put biggest parts of game plot on picture slides with wordy descriptions and wrote this descriptions.

[CarrO]

PoE2: Deadfire is better in every single way except dungeon quality / amount.

 

And I strongly dislike the unlimited rests mechanic. What's the point of wounds if you can just rest infinitely many times between fights. 

 

Apart from that, I enjoyed Deadfire more overall. And the full voice-acting is the best investment ever. So so so so so ****ing good I can't go back to reading simulators now.

 

 

[Boeroer]

So, obviously my taste is horrible.

Fixed it for you.

Edited March 12, 2019 by Boeroer

[bringingyouthefuture]

 

One thing now that I think about it some more, the boss fights in POE1 were much better and more interesting, requiring various tactics -

 

Seriously - what boss fights? When Tyranny came along and actually had technical aspects boss fights (e.g. the enemy is signaling that they're about to use some big ability, run away!) it blew my mind since I had gotten so used to the IWD-style combat of PoE1 where "big encounters" are just normal encounters with more stats. Maybe the dragons, but once you've fought one dragon, you've fought them all essentially. Even Thaos the only thing "special" about him is the ability to spam cleansing flame and crowns for the faithful, and if you've fought broodmothers that isn't that special anyway.

 

if anything i wish there were more big fights in Deadfire like in Tyranny or like the small sample we got in the BB with engwithan saints and titan (having to deal with grabs, heavy kicks [titan] or the positional aspects of fighting saints (their frost aoe, seals of pain)); honestly was a bit disappointed that the fights/dungeon of Poko Kohara was the exception, not the norm.

 

 

I was thinking about the Dragon's mostly ... each one had its particular debuff if I am remembering correctly.  Thaos was interesting too because there was a few spells that made the fight so much easier   If you had the right combo of spells and melee attacks in POE1, you could pretty much breeze through them, but it took some testing.  Plus the Concelhaut in POE1 was a challenge, and even some of the first battles with say Raederic were pretty tactics heavy for me.  It's as people say buffing and debuffing meant a lot more in POE.

 

One of the things that bugs me most about the bosses in POE2 is they are always in the center of the game board and they just spin around (I haven't played Seeker, Slayer, Survivor yet), BoW the bosses were more interesting but I used the same tactics on the Dragon as I did the Beast of Winter to win ... which is cool but not as cool as the Kraken in POE1, or those giant faceless things There was something satisfying about killing those things with one shot from a hammer ...

 

And don't get me wrong I still find the average combat in POE2 way better, but honest I think that main fights in POE1 had a lot more going for them.

 

EDIT:  And I agree about the fights in POE2, but I would consider all the fights you mentioned as normal fights. not boss fights - except maybe the Titan, that was a good one

Edited March 12, 2019 by bringingyouthefuture

[Boeroer]

I hope Microsoft will hire this people good editor who will cut all "high philosophy beyond understanding of weak minds" out of texts

I hope not. 'Cause that would mean all those weak minds will come here and post weak stuff. Ugh...

[Daidre]

Fixed it for you.

 

 

I am playing Might and Magic 6 now and enjoy it more then anything in Deadfire ever (Was desperately trying to play DLC I payed for week ago but dropped it again).

You cant even imagine how horrible my RPG tastes are.  

[Boeroer]

Mighty horrible?

[xzar_monty]

PoE2: Deadfire is better in every single way except dungeon quality / amount.

 

 

I think the amount at least was a very conscious decision, given how a dungeon crawl has pretty much become a cliche of the genre. I for one definitely enjoyed the fact that there was no biggie of a dungeon in the game (unless the last DLC contains one -- I haven't visited that area yet).

 

As for the quality, I'm not too sure. I very much enjoyed the Undercity, because some of the encounters there were nicely planned. There's one where you initially come across a set of enemies and then, some time later, additional enemies surface (literally) and attack you. I thought that was a brilliant move and required some off-the-cuff readjustment of my strategy.

 

Od Nua was a lovely idea in PoE, and some of it was really good, but quite frankly there were a couple of levels where you noticed the developers had run out of ideas and just had to come up with something (the one with the spiky floor room, the one with the confusion-inducing critters, at least).

[demothios]

Storywise, PoE1. In Po2, I keep getting this sense that one faction, one sequence of quest progression, one endgame choice is THE right choice, the writer's favorite choice. Otoh, I frigging love naval combat, that companions now have favored/disfavored dispositions, and that the geopolitical scale of conflict of the PoE2 factions vs the local squabbles of Defiance Bay's factions has a greater impact on the story's future.

[rjshae]

I think I might have enjoyed PoE2 more if it was a fresh starting adventure with a focus on exploration, battle, and politics. The deity squabble just didn't quite work for me as it seemed to upset the pacing.

[xzar_monty]

Love that term, "deity squabble". It should be a contradiction in terms, shouldn't it (except maybe in the Greek pantheon), but that's exactly what it is in Deadfire.

[Saito Hikari]

I find that PoE1 had far better writing (especially in regards to companions, although it probably helps that the companions in PoE1 were actual companions and weren't extensions of the major factions above all) and a far more compelling setting/exploration, but PoE2 had the better overall gameplay.

[thelee]

 

PoE2: Deadfire is better in every single way except dungeon quality / amount.

 

I think the amount at least was a very conscious decision, given how a dungeon crawl has pretty much become a cliche of the genre. I for one definitely enjoyed the fact that there was no biggie of a dungeon in the game (unless the last DLC contains one -- I haven't visited that area yet).

 

As for the quality, I'm not too sure. I very much enjoyed the Undercity, because some of the encounters there were nicely planned. There's one where you initially come across a set of enemies and then, some time later, additional enemies surface (literally) and attack you. I thought that was a brilliant move and required some off-the-cuff readjustment of my strategy.

 

Od Nua was a lovely idea in PoE, and some of it was really good, but quite frankly there were a couple of levels where you noticed the developers had run out of ideas and just had to come up with something (the one with the spiky floor room, the one with the confusion-inducing critters, at least).

 

Forgotten Sanctum is basically one dungeon crawl. I loved it. It reminds me of the Severed Hand-type dungeon of Icewind Dales 1/2... not quite as big, but full of encounters, traps, but also occasional non-hostile NPCs to interact with. (Also I loved actually being able to sneak around to fulfill a quest objective - sneaking is still woefully undersupported in this game.)

 

Reflecting again, objectively Deadfire didn't have that much less than PoE1 in terms of dungeoneering as PoE1. Poko Kohara, Oathbreaker's Sanctum, Old City were all decent multi-level dungeons; there was also Ashen Maw (though I'm inclined to exclude "dungeons" where you can make/keep everyone friendly). I think my perception is skewed by many of the island encounters where it's just basically one room with a couple encounters. In total I'm sure it's a roughly similar amount of content in total, but you don't really get a chance to really get *into* the dungeoneering experience if you're already out within 30 minutes (like with the many Fampyr/vessel crypt areas).

Edited March 12, 2019 by thelee

[Daidre]

 

 

In Po2, I keep getting this sense that one faction, one sequence of quest progression, one endgame choice is THE right choice, the writer's favorite choice.

 

It really surprised me in finale. All factions were more or less equal in good/bad things in their politics and then Ruatai suddenly tells me: go drown one city block in blood while we bomb civilians in another. And I was "What?! Are you crazy, no sane person will agree to do this."

 

It was like writer decided to tell me: 

No matter they are right about incompetent Huana leadership that hurts its own citizens more then helps. No matter they have a point about how stupid it is to mine Luminous Adra.

They are bad! Militaristic countries are bad! Invasions are bad! 

Look how bad they truly are! 

 

With same level of subtlety.

Edited March 12, 2019 by Daidre

[baldurs_gate_2]

 

I like, when you can get high end level gear, in the beginning, if you know the game. And you can level up very quickly.

 

Couldn't think of a better way to demonstrate how differently people approach these games. Here's a metagamer whose intention is powergaming, plain and simple. I couldn't think of a more displeasing way to play -- if the intention is to be as powerful as possible, why not simply rig stuff in your favor? And if the intention is to metagame, why play at all? I mean, you've already ruined all the surprises the story may have, so why bother?

 

Again: no blame or criticism intended in any of this. I think it's just lovely that our approaches to the same game are so diametrically opposite.

 

I want a easy time, even on the highest difficulty. I can not understand, ppl that play Dark Souls and try to kill every boss without gear or something like that. It's challenging yes, but i don't want to invest so much time, to become that good in one particular game.

[Starwars]

I find it hard to pick between them. Personally I find that where Deadfire improved in some areas, it also did things worse in other areas. PoE1 had a greater impact on me but a lot of that can also be attributed to the hype level and the fact that we were finally getting a game like that again. But anyways...

 

-I like PoE's bigger focus on per-rest mechanics a lot more, and I also enjoyed the health/endurance system more than what we got in Deadfire. Of course, that being said, Deadfire also managed to tune up the feel of the combat. Everything is clearer and easier to discern. Controlling it all feels smoother. I also find that the rate of encounters is *much* better in Deadfire overall.

 

-I flove Deadfire's open world.. It's a lot of fun to explore. The system used in PoE never bothered me at all but Deadfire is really fun to explore with the world map.

 

-I prefer the writing in Pillars by quite a lot. I never found it to oppressively bleak as some did and I never minded the fact that it tended to be a bit textheavy at times. I enjoy that even though the quality did vary. I don't mind the change in tone in Deadfire at all (I do think it was a good move just to set them apart) but I think I just enjoyed Pillars' style more. I like the companions more as well.

 

-I definitely prefer Deadfire's approach to the structure of the game. That being the focus on the factions and who you ally with, exploring their motivations. That freedom of choice is one of my absolute favorite things with Deadfire.

 

-With the DLC/expansions, I greatly prefer the White March.  While I kind of enjoyed the DLC in Deadfire I must admit that my view on them has kinda soured a bit over time, they were really not at all what I wanted even though there are some nice points to them. I had a hard time with some of the writing in them and the gameplay is imo mostly tedious.

 

-Neketaka has a big enough presence in Deadfire that I feel it's a thing that has to mentioned. I loved exploring it and I really feel like it pushed the game to new heights. PoE doesn't have anything that makes it feel as "dense" as that.

 

-Deadfire has multiclassing, and that is just pure fun. Meanwhile, I do think the smaller party in a small bummer because I find that final party slot to be fun to sorta experiment with a bit.

So yeah, there are parts to both that I both prefer and dislike. Again, PoE probably had a bigger impact on me but they are both great games to be sure.

[Frak]

I enjoy Deadfire more. But my reasons are mainly cosmetic, you could argue.

 

- Pillars 1 couldn't really decide whether it wanted to be texted or voiced. That marred m experience of it. It seemed disjointed

- There was something 'off' with running,/walking animations compared to Deadfire. My characters felt ... weightless.

- Combat sounds in Pillars 1, somehow grated me sometimes. The 'clang' of metal vs metal sounded 'tinny' to my ears. It needed heft.

 

- I enjoyed Pillars 1, I loved the writing and the setting. And I would probably enjoy it more if I did a second playthrough.

 

But Deadfire resonates better with me. It seems more wholesome. Also, better combat. I like the combat.

[xzar_monty]

What I think is really interesting is that PoE emphasized the darkness of the tone and setting. Soulless children, a group of people hung on the branches of a massive tree, funereal-sounding bells tolling at the birth of a child, and so on (all these examples from the start of the game). And it succeeded.

 

Deadfire, on the other hand, has a significantly lighter tone which is reflected in just about everything, including the actual colours used. And this, again, succeeds.

 

Frak: The best thing about Deadfire combat is that there is approximately 90% less filler combat. I really like that. There's way too much of it in PoE. Thus, combat almost never gets boring in Deadfire, while it does just that much of the time in PoE.

[algroth]

 

 

 

In Po2, I keep getting this sense that one faction, one sequence of quest progression, one endgame choice is THE right choice, the writer's favorite choice.

 

It really surprised me in finale. All factions were more or less equal in good/bad things in their politics and then Ruatai suddenly tells me: go drown one city block in blood while we bomb civilians in another. And I was "What?! Are you crazy, no sane person will agree to do this."

 

It was like writer decided to tell me: 

No matter they are right about incompetent Huana leadership that hurts its own citizens more then helps. No matter they have a point about how stupid it is to mine Luminous Adra.

They are bad! Militaristic countries are bad! Invasions are bad! 

Look how bad they truly are! 

 

With same level of subtlety.

 

 

Their intentions were always colonization through conquest and it was very clear that in their eyes, the ends justified the means and Huana and Vailian lives were entirely expendable if it furthered the Rauataiian cause. This was pretty evident throughout with their actions, be it following Maia's storyline, or visiting Hasongo and looking at the dynamics between the 'colonized' Huana and Rauataiians there, and so on. Even if their core intentions or justifications may seem noble, they are invaders and a militarist company through and through, and well, they'll do as those have done across history. "To make an omelette you gotta crack a few eggs" and all that.

[MaxQuest]

 

I like, when you can get high end level gear, in the beginning, if you know the game. And you can level up very quickly.

Couldn't think of a better way to demonstrate how differently people approach these games. Here's a metagamer whose intention is powergaming, plain and simple. I couldn't think of a more displeasing way to play -- if the intention is to be as powerful as possible, why not simply rig stuff in your favor? And if the intention is to metagame, why play at all? I mean, you've already ruined all the surprises the story may have, so why bother?

 

Again: no blame or criticism intended in any of this. I think it's just lovely that our approaches to the same game are so diametrically opposite.

 

There are dozens of us ^^

 

I enjoy meta/powergaming starting from 2nd playthrough and beyond, as well.

And to answer your question about riging: any "I win" button is taboo. As for intention, it is: to figure out how to tackle the highest difficulty, and make it feel almost easy. One gets the satisfaction of puzzle solving here.

 

I want a easy time, even on the highest difficulty. I can not understand, ppl that play Dark Souls and try to kill every boss without gear or something like that. It's challenging yes, but i don't want to invest so much time, to become that good in one particular game.

Sharing your view.

Solo or naked full-length runs, is not really my thing, unless the difference in time is not that big; and that depends on the game. In Tyranny my second run was solo, because it was actually faster than with a full party. In PoE1 I've tried to solo-naked Alpine Dragon, because the encounter could be finished under 10 minutes. But huh, now way I am trying this with Deadfire megabosses ツ

[xzar_monty]

 

 

I like, when you can get high end level gear, in the beginning, if you know the game. And you can level up very quickly.

Couldn't think of a better way to demonstrate how differently people approach these games. Here's a metagamer whose intention is powergaming, plain and simple. I couldn't think of a more displeasing way to play -- if the intention is to be as powerful as possible, why not simply rig stuff in your favor? And if the intention is to metagame, why play at all? I mean, you've already ruined all the surprises the story may have, so why bother?

 

Again: no blame or criticism intended in any of this. I think it's just lovely that our approaches to the same game are so diametrically opposite.

 

There are dozens of us ^^

 

I enjoy meta/powergaming starting from 2nd playthrough and beyond, as well.

And to answer your question about riging: any "I win" button is taboo. As for intention, it is: to figure out how to tackle the highest difficulty, and make it feel almost easy. One gets the satisfaction of puzzle solving here.

 

 

 

Fair enough, that's a perfectly satisfactory explanation! My playing is so story-oriented that there's almost certainly only going to be one playthrough, and I am not interested in spoilers. If it turns out I've made bad choices in terms of specialization or skill selection, so be it. If I don't find the weapons I've been betting on, so be it.

 

I can see the attraction in battling against the game mechanics, so to speak, but my main interest is in the story, the character interactions and discovering stuff on my own, for the first time.

[lady gray]

Deadfire by a mile. That game, in my opinion, is a masterpiece. I was three hours in before I realized that THIS was my new favorite game, hands down. 

[-dib-]

Deadfire, in almost all aspects. Main things I love are: Open world, multiclasses, overall better graphics, no huge boring dungeons, slightly less pretentious writing, streamlining of class skills. Can't say much about companions since I almost never use them but I remember how much I hated almost all companions in PoE (which was the reason I stopped using them). Also PoE felt like a real slog before I could "get into" it. Once I forced myself over that threshold it was fun to play but it took a while to get there. I never felt that slog period with Deadfire, although I realize that might be because I already played the first game before it.