RANDOM VIDEO GAME NEWS

[Blarghagh]

The thread for Video Game News about random titles! Last topics:

 

- Fallout IV Graphics - are they subpar or not? Also Bethesda's penchant for awful animation.

- Deus Ex - Mankind Divided trying to reinvent the Sidequest: http://www.gamesradar.com/deus-ex-mankind-divided-reinventing-art-side-quest/

- Blizzard to stop reporting WoW subscriber numbers and what went wrong with Warlords of Draenor that so many left.

[Amentep]

Random observation:

 

A number of RPG fans all the time say that graphics are secondary to story and modern games suffer from being too focused on "kewl" graphics and not enough on the RPG aspects...

 

...but then RPG fans (as represented here and elsewhere) spend an inordinate amount of time bitching about Fallout 4's graphics.

 

Is it just me or is this odd?  I mean honestly I haven't thought any of the Bethesda games post Morrowind was graphically bad (and that was only because I found Morrowind's graphics to actively hurt the ability to play and understand the game - interiors were awful to navigate) and what I've seen from the legit sources, Fallout 4 seems to not be Morrowind 2.

[Chilloutman]

Random observation:

 

A number of RPG fans all the time say that graphics are secondary to story and modern games suffer from being too focused on "kewl" graphics and not enough on the RPG aspects...

 

...but then RPG fans (as represented here and elsewhere) spend an inordinate amount of time bitching about Fallout 4's graphics.

 

Is it just me or is this odd?  I mean honestly I haven't thought any of the Bethesda games post Morrowind was graphically bad (and that was only because I found Morrowind's graphics to actively hurt the ability to play and understand the game - interiors were awful to navigate) and what I've seen from the legit sources, Fallout 4 seems to not be Morrowind 2.

Thanks because F3 onward was more FPS than RPG

Edited November 4, 2015 by Chilloutman

[Amentep]

 

Random observation:

 

A number of RPG fans all the time say that graphics are secondary to story and modern games suffer from being too focused on "kewl" graphics and not enough on the RPG aspects...

 

...but then RPG fans (as represented here and elsewhere) spend an inordinate amount of time bitching about Fallout 4's graphics.

 

Is it just me or is this odd?  I mean honestly I haven't thought any of the Bethesda games post Morrowind was graphically bad (and that was only because I found Morrowind's graphics to actively hurt the ability to play and understand the game - interiors were awful to navigate) and what I've seen from the legit sources, Fallout 4 seems to not be Morrowind 2.

Thanks because F3 onward was more FPS than RPG

 

 

That's actually a really good point, actually.  As I'm not as big a fan of FPS, I only passingly pay attention to them but graphical presentation seems to be very, very much top on the list of things people want to be as advanced as possible in FPS (that and large non-linear maps).  Mind you Bethesda's games now are almost hard to quantify as they're not really RPGy or FPSy to really be either but contain elements of both.

[Keyrock]

Random observation:

 

A number of RPG fans all the time say that graphics are secondary to story and modern games suffer from being too focused on "kewl" graphics and not enough on the RPG aspects...

 

...but then RPG fans (as represented here and elsewhere) spend an inordinate amount of time bitching about Fallout 4's graphics.

 

Is it just me or is this odd?  I mean honestly I haven't thought any of the Bethesda games post Morrowind was graphically bad (and that was only because I found Morrowind's graphics to actively hurt the ability to play and understand the game - interiors were awful to navigate) and what I've seen from the legit sources, Fallout 4 seems to not be Morrowind 2.

1) I bitch just as much, actually more, about Bethesda's crappy writing and complete inability to create compelling characters as I do about graphics.

 

2) Bitching about graphics does not preclude someone from not liking the writing.

 

3) Fallout 4 isn't out yet, none of us have played the game and thus none of us have experienced the story.  We have, however, seen screenshots and videos showing off how the game looks.  We can't really criticize the game's story, outside of making predictions and jokes about it based on Bethesda's previous work, since no one has experienced it.  We can criticize the graphics because we've seen them.

[Amentep]

 

Random observation:

 

A number of RPG fans all the time say that graphics are secondary to story and modern games suffer from being too focused on "kewl" graphics and not enough on the RPG aspects...

 

...but then RPG fans (as represented here and elsewhere) spend an inordinate amount of time bitching about Fallout 4's graphics.

 

Is it just me or is this odd?  I mean honestly I haven't thought any of the Bethesda games post Morrowind was graphically bad (and that was only because I found Morrowind's graphics to actively hurt the ability to play and understand the game - interiors were awful to navigate) and what I've seen from the legit sources, Fallout 4 seems to not be Morrowind 2.

1) I bitch just as much, actually more, about Bethesda's crappy writing and complete inability to create compelling characters as I do about graphics.

 

2) Bitching about graphics does not preclude someone from not liking the writing.

 

3) Fallout 4 isn't out yet, none of us have played the game and thus none of us have experienced the story.  We have, however, seen screenshots and videos showing off how the game looks.  We can't really criticize the game's story, outside of making predictions and jokes about it based on Bethesda's previous work, since no one has experienced it.  We can criticize the graphics because we've seen them.

 

 

*shrug*  I've seen official screenshots and haven't seen anything to dislike, really.  They seem functional, and not that dissimilar to Bethesda's other games post-Morrowind.

[Nonek]

Well my last Bethesda game played was New Vegas and the graphics were perfectly viable to me, it was the horrid UI, the floaty movement, and a hundred and one other things that irked me, not the rendering. In truth beyond Mr Sawyers excellent mod I see no need for extra graphical fidelity in a playthrough, though they are nice.

 

Then again I routinely play games from twenty plus years ago, so my view may be somewhat skewed.

[Bartimaeus]

Random observation:

 

A number of RPG fans all the time say that graphics are secondary to story and modern games suffer from being too focused on "kewl" graphics and not enough on the RPG aspects...

 

...but then RPG fans (as represented here and elsewhere) spend an inordinate amount of time bitching about Fallout 4's graphics.

Mm, personally, I would disagree with the premise that "graphics are secondary to (other stuff)". If I find a game visually unappealing (particularly if it's very much so), I'm unlikely to want to much play it or really even give it a chance to begin with. Personally, I find Baldur's Gate, Planescape: Torment and Project: Eternity to all be very visually appealing, but I find Neverwinter Nights (1 or 2) and the Dragon Age series to both be nearly *unbearably* the exact opposite. Graphics are particularly important, for me, as they relate to characters: for me to really fall in love with characters in the context of whatever role they're playing, and whether they're villains, party members, random NPCs, my own character...I need to be able to at least be able to sort of appreciate the way they're visually relayed to me. If a character is visually relayed to me poorly (if I think they look completely ridiculous, if they have certain visual elements I despise about them, if the entire graphical style is one I dislike to begin with like in the case of anime/manga-inspired styles, etc.), I will likely have a much more negative impression of them (and the game as a whole), which will make it that much harder to appreciate them. I'd be better off with no actual image impression of them at all, like I would for a book: after all, if I like a character for the traits I know about them, I'm likely to paint a positive picture of them in my head, anyways, right?

 

There are other things that are important about graphics, of course, but that's one of the most important to me in regards to RPGs. For games that are supposed to be immersive experiences, I think animation quality is extremely important, for example...terrible animations can instantly take you right out of a game. So I really think it just depends...but that's just me.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Bartimaeus

[Amentep]

I'm a whole package kind of guy.  As long as the graphics work for the purpose of the game, I don't care.

 

Mind you I also watch films like PLAN 9 FROM OUTER SPACE for fun so my opinion of what's acceptable in games is pretty broad.

[Bartimaeus]

Characters, whether they're from games or movies or books or whatever else, are very much near the top of my list for biggest determiners whether I really like a work. So, visuals as they relate to them are pretty important to me.

 

I can get used to a visual style if necessary: I do, after like, like Neverwinter Nights 2 (particularly Mask of the Betrayer) significantly more than I like Pillars of Eternity, even though I think Neverwinter Nights 2's visual style is vastly inferior to Pillars' (...still really dislike the Dragon Age series, though ). Nevertheless, it still plays a significant part of the experience.

[Amentep]

I can understand that; we all have things that appeal differently.

[Nonek]

@Bartimaeus: I'd agree on the inferiority of NWN1 graphics and Dragon Ages, but I thought NWN2 was a very pretty game and an enormous improvement on the first game. To be honest however it's the art design that puts me off the former two, and attracts me to the latter, as well as those you mention, Poe and the IE games. Indeed i'd argue that the art design of Poe is really one of the srongest parts of the game, it's simply beautiful and detailed.

 

Edit: Though I did miss the dance of death animations from NWN1 in the second game, i'm still unsure why that was dropped, made combat far more interesting visually to me.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Nonek

[pmp10]

A number of RPG fans all the time say that graphics are secondary to story and modern games suffer from being too focused on "kewl" graphics and not enough on the RPG aspects...

 

...but then RPG fans (as represented here and elsewhere) spend an inordinate amount of time bitching about Fallout 4's graphics.

Just as some fans would bash Fallout 3 for it's graphics but found no wrong in New Vegas.

It's all about the developer.

[Bartimaeus]

@Bartimaeus: I'd agree on the inferiority of NWN1 graphics and Dragon Ages, but I thought NWN2 was a very pretty game and an enormous improvement on the first game. To be honest however it's the art design that puts me off the former two, and attracts me to the latter, as well as those you mention, Poe and the IE games. Indeed i'd argue that the art design of Poe is really one of the srongest parts of the game, it's simply beautiful and detailed.

 

Edit: Though I did miss the dance of death animations from NWN1 in the second game, i'm still unsure why that was dropped, made combat far more interesting visually to me.

An enormous improvement on the first game? Yes. Actually suited to my tastes? No. I always thought characters looked really weird...and the perpetually stiff-looking animations never helped much, either. To be fair, though, that seems like a problem with pretty much every game I've played where characters spend significant time just standing around talking, so I don't particularly fault it. I would probably be much more positive about Neverwinter Nights (2) if it had been isometric first instead of 3D first...

 

Yes, I really like the painting-esque quality of the 2D isometric games...such a shame that I disliked Pillars of Eternity in virtually every way except the graphics, particularly with Shadows of Amn likely being my favorite game of all time.

 

In regards to the Fallouts, I don't like either Fallout 3 or New Vegas...albeit for reasons completely unrelated to (admittedly poor) graphics, but rather because of its horrifically bad (IMO) combination of first person shooter and RPG. I'm more of the S.T.A.L.K.E.R. variety, personally.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Bartimaeus

[Malcador]

Guess it's aesthetics == gameplay > graphics.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Malcador

[Volourn]

NWN graphcis are underrated and the animations are probably the best ever.

 

Supposed, they removed the 'dance of death' from NWN2 because  they tried to pretend it took attacks away but it never did. I played the game for 1000s of hous and never once though, huh i should have had had another attack'. I think it is bogus.

 

 

"it's simply beautiful and detailed."

 

Nah.
 

[Zoraptor]

Random observation:

 

A number of RPG fans all the time say that graphics are secondary to story and modern games suffer from being too focused on "kewl" graphics and not enough on the RPG aspects...

 

...but then RPG fans (as represented here and elsewhere) spend an inordinate amount of time bitching about Fallout 4's graphics.

 

Is it just me or is this odd?  I mean honestly I haven't thought any of the Bethesda games post Morrowind was graphically bad (and that was only because I found Morrowind's graphics to actively hurt the ability to play and understand the game - interiors were awful to navigate) and what I've seen from the legit sources, Fallout 4 seems to not be Morrowind 2.

 

Graphics only have to be functional, but part of 'functional' is not to be obviously inconsistent and to promote verisimilitude. I'm perfectly happy with low fidelity/ dated/ low poly graphics if they're consistently applied and part of the overall aesthetic. Bethesda's problem has always been that they half arse the consistency of their approach in pretty much everything. Their motions make their models look like their joints are rubberised- I half expected waifu to do the Rick Grimes meme head telescope it was so elastic- and they have some of the worst uncanny valley effect and have ever since Oblivion- look at the bloke in the background of the chargen sequence virumor posted, fine for a 2006 era game or a retro/ small budget game but a literal lol for a 100 mill AAA title. Their AI ends with people raking their carpets and staring at walls for hours or putting pots on their heads and their RPG systems are either laughably exploitable, laughably imbalanced or (lately) laughably simplified so much so that they are barely RPG any more. And the story itself... to be fair they are at least very good at general world building so people can larp their own more meaningful story.

 

Now, I say that as someone who hasn't played a post F3 Bethesda game and has no intent to buy F4 except in a hypothetical future where it's steam free and very, very cheap- or 2nd hand for console- but those problems are the reason why I have so little interest in buying their games. More than anything it's that they don't seem to be interested in actually fixing those problems but just treat them as part of the charm/ modders will fix it. F4 probably has more budget than TWitcher 3 and the scopes are similar, it's to that that F4 has to be fairly compared. Of course comparing the two on pre release screenshots and videos which aren't from PC is potentially a can of worms but I'd be pretty confident that TW3 will be better than F4 on pretty much every single one of the above criteria.

[Azdeus]

Oh, look - paid mods are back.

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2015-11-04-steam-launches-official-item-stores

[Orogun01]

Oh, look - paid mods are back.

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2015-11-04-steam-launches-official-item-stores

Better than before but stupid idea, publishers should take mods at a lost while cutting cost on developing useless DLC. But it might be too much to expect them to pay modders, on the other hand players really don't want to pay for stuff they used to get for free. This might work if for large expansions that justify a purchase but not for one costume.

[Humanoid]

So you can sell costumes, but how can you sell the far more common removal-of-costumes in an item shop?

[Orogun01]

So you can sell costumes, but how can you sell the far more common removal-of-costumes in an item shop?

As long as they don't hardlock people from creating their own mods and publishing them for free or on their own, it will happen. Which I would be glad to see, prudishness should not stifle innovation; but i'm not sure how I feel about depravity driving it.

[Malcador]

[Keyrock]

That's a trailer, alright.

[Lexx]

YOU DONT FIND THE INSTITUTE THE INSTITUTE FINDS YOU!

 

Goty 2015

Edited November 5, 2015 by Lexx

[Gfted1]

Huh, I didnt know you could upgrade your house / home base. Steam tells me I got 18 hours out of FO:NV before a failed quest trigger stomped out my desire to play so Ill be picking up this installment after a few patches.