IndiraLightfoot Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Although I don't agree on everything, what a great post with a superb vid to beat, Endrosz! I still share Sensuki's sentiments that the invo mini-game, if done reasonably well, breaks up the pace of the story delving, combat and other adventuring. It also has a therapeutic value as a solitaire, and can work decently well as a strategic limiter too. I'm not saying it's a fun game, but it makes sense and creates a nice rhythm to a CRPG. If everything is streamlined, we will soon not be playing at all, but pseudo-playing a CRPG, which is where actually many AAA titles are today: they almost lack gameplay entirely, but the graphics and sounds/music are great. 2 *** "The words of someone who feels ever more the ent among saplings when playing CRPGs" ***
prodigydancer Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Yeah, lack of special ammo is definitely a loss of gameplay variety. I hope there'll be special ammo in the game and it'll be in limited supply. But I thought the topic was about plain arrows/bolts.
WebShaman Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 I am for special ammo in limited supply (perhaps craftable and/or enchantable?) AND for poisoned weapons (and arrows, etc). After all, there is poison in the game, so why can't we use it?
jones092201@gmail.com Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 I just hope the add visible quivers. This, of course, is purely aesthetic, but I always have trouble with the pull an arrow out of shoulder blade thing. to arrows, I liked having to buy them in the IE games, but I guess shot and powder would also need to be included for the guns.
Sanasolis Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 I liked having some specialized arrows..but standard arrows were a hassle to carry. So I would suggest standard arrows/bolts do not have to be carried or equipped, but awesome arrows of mindblowing should be pricey and not just an ability.
Wintersong Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 How exactly do I carry those thousands upon thousands of coins? And why don't they take space in the same way than gems? And weight? As with many things, fun gameplay ends being more important that spreadsheet gameplay. Carrying capacities rules? Only pure hardcore would apply them 100%. The rest? Only when the character was trying to emulate Atlas. Arrows? Guess what. I liked IE inventory management. Sometimes it could get annoying, like with arrows. I micromanaged the hell out of those little bastards. If OB had used the same system, I'd have been ok. But I'm ok with the current one too. It includes no worries about common arrows? It's fine. I don't see my characters answesring the call of nature (the pee needs of my characters could add some strategic element... but it's not really that fun, would slow down gameplay and this is not "The Sims Medieval: IE Edition") so they will survive bows that work like that of Hank in the D&D cartoons. Altough I'd prefer it if special/magical arrows were limited somehow (even by an X/Encounter!!!). And to a point, I'd love a "The Sims Medieval: IE Edition". Want simulation in your RPG? Go truly hardcore, baby! Inventory limited by weight and volume, physical and social needs, limited ammunition, aging characters, catching colds... But people seem to prefer to be selectively hardcore*. Weaklings. * including myself
Sarex Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 (edited) The problem of arrows is solved with a container. I never did figure out why the IE games didn't have them, when they had a container for everything else. Edited August 28, 2014 by Sarex "because they filled mommy with enough mythic power to become a demi-god" - KP
Sensuki Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 (edited) The whole notion that putting items from here to there is some kind of glorious old-school activity that is being dumped to appeal to the casual masses is laughable to me. I suggest you join the Royal Society for Putting Things of Top of Other Things. Imagine the fun they have at their weekly meetings! I think you're grumbling more at some of the annoying things that the IE games didn't do such as automatically sort your items properly. There is nothing wrong with an inventory tab for each character. The thing that many people think is the issue with a multi character inventory actually has nothing to do with the inventory being multi-character, it's about auto-sorting and item stacking. For instance - When your inventory slots were full, you couldn't pick up stackable items off the ground Low item stack numbers (fixed with mods) When you manually dragged an item into an inventory slot it would stay separate from the stacked items The Encumberance system - people didn't like having to shift items around based on weight classifications Those three things create inventory busywork. I don't mind encumberance systems as I have a bit of inner simulationist, but the other three are awful - and it would have been nice if they improved those things Edited August 28, 2014 by Sensuki 2
Gfted1 Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 The problem of arrows is solved with an container. I never did figure out why the IE games didn't have them, when they had a container for everything else. BG2 at least offered the Quiver of Plenty +1/+2 and a bow and sling that didn't require ammo at all. But yeah, otherwise it was arrows out the wazoo. "I'm your biggest fan, Ill follow you until you love me, Papa"
archangel979 Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 If they don't plan to include different arrow types having ammo is not really needed.
Sarex Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 BG2 at least offered the Quiver of Plenty +1/+2 and a bow and sling that didn't require ammo at all. But yeah, otherwise it was arrows out the wazoo. I'm playing a highly modified IWD and it has a munition belt, makes things so much easier. "because they filled mommy with enough mythic power to become a demi-god" - KP
lobotomy42 Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Stocking up on arrows was one of the most inventory-cluttering aspects of the IE games. Good riddance. 3
Sarex Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 (edited) Stocking up on arrows was one of the most inventory-cluttering aspects of the IE games. Good riddance. So your answer to that is to get rid of arrows? Edited August 28, 2014 by Sarex 1 "because they filled mommy with enough mythic power to become a demi-god" - KP
Sloul Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Yes to arrows. I wish they are expensive, and not just an inventory annoyance, but really feel like a resource. Arrows were pretty expensive in middle age. Probably not as much as a sword, but I would say 5 of them could buy you a short sword.
Havelok Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 I'd prefer ammo-as-item, but for the convenience factor, make them Huge Stacks. It's a compromise between completely immersion breaking and simulationist. *shrugs* 1
wanderon Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Yes to arrows. I wish they are expensive, and not just an inventory annoyance, but really feel like a resource. Arrows were pretty expensive in middle age. Probably not as much as a sword, but I would say 5 of them could buy you a short sword. They were also able to be recovered (provided you won the battle) but if they did that then we would have to have the fletcher ability to repair them as well...alas nothing difficult is ever easy... Nomadic Wayfarer of the Obsidian Order Not all those that wander are lost...
Cluas Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Aaaarggh!! The problem with making a spiritual successor game is that you can never please the fans of the original. It' would have been easier to please IE fans (or at least some of them), if there hadn't been so many unnecessary changes .... Well it's too late now anyway. I'm still glad I bought this game, it has got so much potential
wolfstriked Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 No arrows???No effects? What happens with no ammo is that you cant have special arrows then and save your cheap stuff for fodder.And what about finding that magical bow that doesn't need arrows?Some of the design choices are strange coming from guys that made the IE games.Sadly its IMO a way to stay mainstream even if mainstream sucks!
Headbomb Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 No to arrows... however... Yes to quivers! +4 Damage Quiver +2d4 Fire Damage quiver. +2d4 Shock Damage quiver +5 Accuracy quiver Etc... 1
wolfstriked Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Regardless, I'm confident they have their ducks in a row. They've entirely redone their pathfinding system in a very short amount of time(it's waiting for deployment, I believe), so that's a moot point. The scale is, beyond a certain point, a done deal, I believe(given the number of variables that would have to be shifted to change it significantly), so that falls into something you don't like rather than a bug. When Josh was explaining why they took time to model big heads into the game he stated that it wasn't work put into just modeling big heads but more a way to show they can change scale of characters easily and actually there individual parts.They could ask the forums for advice as to what the scale should be set to or put someone who is good at setting scale and be done with it.The guy in charge of this aspect is just not in tune,sorry just saying. IMO the images on this preview from 2013 is what the game should look like.Somewhere along the way the dev team took an idea that the characters were too small,ran with it and hence we have what we have now. http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/12/10/mega-impressions-obsidians-pillars-of-eternity/
PrimeHydra Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 (edited) Good question, OP. I thought arrows added a nice dimension of depth in the IE games, due to all the different effects they could carry. And the more powerful ones (like acid arrows, or arrows of dispelling) were limited by their short supply/high cost. It felt good as one progressed to go from scrounging normal arrows off Kobolds, to buying multiple stacks of +2 Arrows from the smithy. With inventory space as limited as it is, though, I don't know where we'd put all of our ammo. Rangers will feel like they have an artificially smaller inventory due to having to carry arrows. But I'm not the only one who thinks we don't have enough carrying space as it is. What can I say, I want this game to live up to BG/IWD as closely as possible. So yea to arrows. Edited August 28, 2014 by PrimeHydra Ask a fish head Anything you want to They won't answer (They can't talk)
Shadenuat Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 (edited) quivers Special ammunition in IE was a resource you'd save up for special encounters. Like the op detonation arrows. Magical quivers aren't more special than just a weapon enchantment, even if they add a bit of flexibility (which also can be achieved with enchantment). Edited August 28, 2014 by Shadenuat
wolfstriked Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Magical quivers?Man you really wanna change stuff just to change stuff huh? 1
Mayama Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 What about potions, basicaly you can dip your arrows into potions and poisons when you are out of combat giving them bonuses or extra debuffs on hit.
Recommended Posts