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Beta IV - General Feedback [The Good // The Bad]

Beta Feedback The Good The Bad IV

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#121
dunehunter

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My biggest complaint with the current beta is a lack of first level passives, especially for fighters.

 

Next biggest complaint is that I can't figure out how or if I can turn off pushes in combat. I just had the Rogue shove my Soul Blade out of range when he was trying to use Soul Annihilation, wasting the ability. With the increase in recovery time, it was really irritating having to wait another 4 seconds to attack not to mention draining all his focus.

 

For multiclass characters, I also hope that we'll be able to spend both ability points on the same class when we hit a new power level.

 

Yep, happens a lot to me when there are a lot mobs in a small area, one bump another away and make me miss my target(out of range) and lose my abilities.


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#122
AndreaColombo

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Also (in this case), the Robust inspiration will get removed by an appropriate affliction. 

 

Is this actually the case. Not that ive been messing with the beta i just saw this on somethingawful

 

IIRC, it is. Try a Berserker/Wizard, for example. Cast Infusion of Vital Essence to gain an INT Inspiration, then go berserk. The Confused Affliction wipes your INT Inspiration; the net effect is that you're free of both and get to reap the benefits of the berserk rage without Confusion.


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#123
PatrioticChief

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My biggest complaint with the current beta is a lack of first level passives, especially for fighters.

 

Next biggest complaint is that I can't figure out how or if I can turn off pushes in combat. I just had the Rogue shove my Soul Blade out of range when he was trying to use Soul Annihilation, wasting the ability. With the increase in recovery time, it was really irritating having to wait another 4 seconds to attack not to mention draining all his focus.

 

For multiclass characters, I also hope that we'll be able to spend both ability points on the same class when we hit a new power level.

 

Strong agreement for your first sentence. 



#124
Dr. Hieronymous Alloy

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Oh, a minor point on the combat log:

 

 

good: I LOVE that it can now filter by character

 

Bad:  I hate how short it is. If you filter by character in a big fight you'll only see a few seconds back, usually one or two actions at most, because of the length limit on the overall log. Don't truncate it; let me scroll back over the whole fight. It can't be a significant amount of memory to do that.


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#125
IndiraLightfoot

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Indeed. I don't know how many times I've been making experimental parties, and than after each fight, when I check the log, muttering: "What use is a combat log if it's just a snub?"


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#126
PatrioticChief

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Anyone else hate that slots for cypher abilities appear even if you haven't selected a single ability for that level? It just clogs up the UI. Waving over it, having nothing there, and faded text on the side not in the box, it looks almost like a bug its so ugly. 


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#127
Boeroer

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Yes, me. Same for chanters.
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#128
AndreaColombo

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And other casters. Agreed it looks bad.

#129
Doppelschwert

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When comparing abilites with each other one has to be aware of the advantages of passives over actives. For example Constant Recovery is a passive while Exhalted Endurance is an active ability. A passive will stack with everything (won't get suppressed) while the robust regeneration may get supressed by other active healing effects. I'm only assuming this (did not test this case yet) - but given the general stacking rules of Deadfire this may happen. THat can be a reason why the bonuses of passives are generally lower than those of active abilities.
 
Also (in this case), the Robust inspiration will get removed by an appropriate affliction. Constant Recovery will not get cancelled by anything.

 

That's a valid point, but I'm still not convinced. Constant Recovery and Ancient Memory where both nerfed in PoE from being unlimited to a limited time. Now Ancient Memory is unlimited again in the shape of a chant and, according to the tool tip, heals more than Constant Recovery distributed over the whole party (my Constant Recovery is stated to heal 6 hp/3s while Ancient Memory states 1 hp / 1s - that comes to 3hp/s vs 5hp/s when seen from the party's perspective). I don't follow the logic of Ancient Memory being fine unlimited while Constant Recovery is still limited.

 

Weapon & Shield Style gives you +6 deflection (and even more reflex) while it forces you to wear a shield (loosing dps) - while Superior Deflection stacks with it and has no drawbacks. But I agree that +4 is laughable. Why nerf it from 5 to 4 in the first place? It's like somebody said "Whooha look at that! +5? Let's stomp this overpowered thingy down to 4, that will balance things out a bit and teach it a lesson, show it some modesty!".

 

That's certainly one way to look at it, but you can also consider how much stats are added in total. Weapon & Shield style is available from lvl 1 and grants you +6 Deflection and Shield bonus to Reflex, which amounts to at least +10 Reflex depending on shield, resulting in at least +16. The tool tip doesn't properly explain the workings of Deep Faith, but I guess regardless of dispositions, you get at least +2 to every defense, which amounts to at least +8, more likely +12.

 

Superior Deflection on the other hand comes much later, grants only +4 and has a much greater competition (like the affliction resistances and other stuff).

 

My idea of balancing is that passives that are available later should grant more useful bonuses, and that regardless of multiclass combination, there should always be a proper incentive to pick one passive over the other. I think this is simply not the case for superior deflection; the argument to take it should definitely not be that it still stacks with the others after you got them first (which is the case once you decide on using a shield, and that's bad design in my opinion).

 

IMHO, Weapon and Shield Style should only confer the shield bonus to reflex, and superior deflection should be a lvl1 fighter ability and buffed in order to compete with Deep Faith, so that a Crusader has an actual choice between the two.

 

In general, I don't like the overlap of the passives at all, since they only serve to blur their purpose. The increase in movement speed of all classes versus the one from the monk is another example for this.

 

I'm all for passives, but balance them properly against each other when they have overlap or make them disjoint.


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#130
Merany

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Finally got an hour to spare so I decided to fire up the latest beta.
Can't comment too much on mechanics and whatnot but as far as UI goes, the number one thing that struck me is how cool of an idea the speed slider is but also how hard it was to use. I just had a really hard time moving it. Haven't looked if hotkeys were available, maybe that is the solution? Or make it bigger?
I found the granularity to be off too. When you're at the minimum, it's like, really really slow. But when you go just one level faster, it's too fast I felt. There needs to be a value in between.
Hope you guys can have a look before the release cause that's huge quality of life here.

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#131
Wormerine

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Finally got an hour to spare so I decided to fire up the latest beta.

Can't comment too much on mechanics and whatnot but as far as UI goes, the number one thing that struck me is how cool of an idea the speed slider is but also how hard it was to use. I just had a really hard time moving it. Haven't looked if hotkeys were available, maybe that is the solution? Or make it bigger?
I found the granularity to be off too. When you're at the minimum, it's like, really really slow. But when you go just one level faster, it's too fast I felt. There needs to be a value in between.
Hope you guys can have a look before the release cause that's huge quality of life here.

Yeah, the slider is tricky to use with mouse. There are shortcuts for it (https://imgur.com/EJXZO83), though for some reasons they are inverted - with smart camera I have no longer need for WASDa so I bound the slider to  and D as it was in PoE1. Now all I want is to use the same shortcut for out of combat acceleration. I often press D outside a combat out of habit, and once the combat starts I am in Benny Hill mode. 

I personally like the assigned speeds. Maybe its customizable via game files? 


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#132
Night Stalker

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I personally like the assigned speeds. Maybe its customizable via game files? 
 

 

 

I think Sawyer mentioned in the last Q&A stream that they were. I don't have a clue in which of the .json files the values are in though.



#133
Dr. Hieronymous Alloy

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One further bit of feedback as I mess around further:

 

Armor doesn't seem that useful right now, at least heavy armor doesn't (edit: and the same may be said of high-penetration weapons, like the Arquebus). It feels like simple clothing is the best gear for casters, for example, and even heavy tanks might not want more than scale mail. Heavy armor slows you down so much and the balance is skewed towards penetration anyway, so you're better off using medium to light armor just to prevent *overpenetration*, rather than to force enemies to get the "no pen" message.
 

On a similar note, I hope there is plenty of "fine" and otherwise enchanted/improved quality "clothing" of the various types. The Vailian frock coat especially is boss and I'm gonna want to pimp that coat on the regular,but unlike the prior game, it isn't enchantable.


Edited by Dr. Hieronymous Alloy, 15 April 2018 - 02:10 AM.

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#134
drchocapic

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On a similar note, I hope there is plenty of "fine" and otherwise enchanted/improved quality "clothing" of the various types. The Vailian frock coat especially is boss and I'm gonna want to pimp that coat on the regular,but unlike the prior game, it isn't enchantable.

 

I'm hoping for the same thing as my Fire God-like Mage looks pretty baller with the Kuaru Clothing.

 

q6Hjm3y.jpg


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#135
hilfazer

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IMHO, Weapon and Shield Style should only confer the shield bonus to reflex, and superior deflection should be a lvl1 fighter ability and buffed in order to compete with Deep Faith, so that a Crusader has an actual choice between the two.

 

 

No chance universal talents will be modified because of one multiclass.



#136
Ashen Rohk

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Hey everyone, been a while since I've posted. I've just loaded up the latest backer beta after not being all that impressed with the first one.

 

And WOW.

 

Everything is better. Everything looks better, the ship combat, the handrawn Tikwara map...gorgeous. The revamped UI and the enemy healthbars and markers look great too.

 

I don't know what's changed...it feels a lot more like the first game now. Obviously still missing the sixth slot and the usual stuff, but I didn't feel annoyed by penetration (if it's even still in) and the empower ability is great.

 

Been running a Bleakwalker Monk. Sicked Flames of Devotion as an additional melee attack is OP as heck.

 

The one big issue I still have with the levelling is that the passive abilities are per-class and I feel like they shouldn't be (probably covered elsewhere in the forum) as I'm finding the power level progression quite limiting on customising your characters abilities and having to dump a point in a Will/Fortitude increase, for example.

 

The animations have got a lot better and the fight sequences connect a lot more smoothly than they did before.

 

All in all, I'm now excited for the full release again. Woo!



#137
Dr. Hieronymous Alloy

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One further bit of feedback as I mess around further:

 

Armor doesn't seem that useful right now, at least heavy armor doesn't (edit: and the same may be said of high-penetration weapons, like the Arquebus). It feels like simple clothing is the best gear for casters, for example, and even heavy tanks might not want more than scale mail. Heavy armor slows you down so much and the balance is skewed towards penetration anyway, so you're better off using medium to light armor just to prevent *overpenetration*, rather than to force enemies to get the "no pen" message.
 

On a similar note, I hope there is plenty of "fine" and otherwise enchanted/improved quality "clothing" of the various types. The Vailian frock coat especially is boss and I'm gonna want to pimp that coat on the regular,but unlike the prior game, it isn't enchantable.

 

 

Just to follow up on this, I'll crosspost something I said on SA:

 


 I went through and put the various current beta weapons in a spreadsheet:
 
 
Even though that isn't adjusted for things like two-handed style etc, looking at those base values and comparing with armor, I feel relatively confident in suggesting, at least as a trial, moving most of the weapon penetration values down one. Right now, vs. most weapons, there's very little reason to wear chain over leather; it doesn't give any additional advantage. If all weapons were one penetration value lower, then
 
1) most one-handed weapons would have a 25% penalty vs chain or scale
2) there would be a realistic tradeoff between the high-pen and low-pen weapons
3) the slash/pierce weapons (great sword, sword) would still be equivalently effective vs scale and brigandine
 
It would probably be a good idea to leave the explicitly "high penetration" weapons (estoc, mace, arquebus, arbalest, crossbow) as they are, perhaps also the "high pen / two damage types" weapons (warhammer, war bow, sceptre), so that those could still be effective vs. plate wearers.


#138
Alot

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Are there any other people participating in the Backer Beta getting the impression that PotD in Deadfire seems "easier" than PotD in PoE1?

 

This has been on my mind for a while because I'm not sure if I fully support the sentiment. I seem to be having a much easier time with fights in the Beta than I would in the first game in a similar level range. I can't help but wonder if this means that difficulty in PoE2 will be more loaded unto the mid- and endgame or that difficulty in general is lower.

 

Edit: Accidentally a word


Edited by Alot, 15 April 2018 - 03:46 PM.


#139
dunehunter

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Are there any other people participating in the Backer Beta getting the impression that PotD in Deadfire seems "easier" than PotD in PoE1?

This has been my mind for a while because I'm not sure if I fully support the sentiment. I seem to be having a much easier time with fights in the Beta than I would in the first game in a similar level range. I can't help but wonder if this means that difficulty in PoE2 will be more loaded unto the mid- and endgame or that difficulty in general is lower.


I’d say yes if you know how to build the team. But I think it’s easier than PoE1 when solo too.

#140
djinnxy

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Are there any other people participating in the Backer Beta getting the impression that PotD in Deadfire seems "easier" than PotD in PoE1?

 

This has been on my mind for a while because I'm not sure if I fully support the sentiment. I seem to be having a much easier time with fights in the Beta than I would in the first game in a similar level range. I can't help but wonder if this means that difficulty in PoE2 will be more loaded unto the mid- and endgame or that difficulty in general is lower.

 

Edit: Accidentally a word

 

I fully expect a game that will also be on console... I'll let you form your own opinion on that. That said it is still in beta.







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