RANDOM VIDEO GAME NEWS

[Elerond]

Nordic Games was first in retail EA games.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2014/06/29/developer-comments-on-kickstarted-planetary-annihilation-being-sold-at-retail-as-early-access-title.aspx

[Keyrock]

Nordic Games was first in retail EA games.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2014/06/29/developer-comments-on-kickstarted-planetary-annihilation-being-sold-at-retail-as-early-access-title.aspx

Well, nuts.  I guess Nordic wins the shameless award.  Sorry, Atari, you lose again.

[Zoraptor]

Don't worry, Atari zombie Infogrames is used to it.

 

Oddly enough the idea of selling an 'early access' kickstarter game retail doesn't phase me much at all. Theoretically it ought to be as bad but I guess when you've funded via, essentially, the unsecured credit/ hopes and dreams of thousands of nerds it just doesn't seem such a big deal to sell a merely incomplete product as opposed to one that doesn't exist at all.

Edited March 26, 2016 by Zoraptor

[Lexx]

 

Developer Ryan Green noted in a blog post that since its launch over two months ago, That Dragon, Cancer has only sold an estimated 14k copies, according to SteamSpy. That's not that much for a team of eight across the past three years.

 

"Our studio has not yet seen a single dollar from sales," said Green. As for the existing revenue, he clarified "We decided to pay off all of our debt as soon as possible."

 

The developer suggested that the reasons sales were so low was because many folks chose to watch Let's Play videos of the two-hour game rather than purchase it. "We underestimated how many people would be satisfied with only watching the game instead of playing it themselves," Green lamented.

 

"If you compare the millions of views of the entirety of our game on YouTube to our sales as estimated on SteamSpy, you can hopefully see the disparity," he continued. "We have seen many people post our entire game on YouTube with little to no commentary. We've seen people decompile our game and post our soundtrack on YouTube. We've also seen many, many Let's Players post entire playthroughs of our game, posting links to all of their own social channels and all of their own merchandising and leaving out a link to our site."

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-03-25-that-dragon-cancer-has-not-yet-seen-a-single-dollar-from-sales

 

 

 

But what if people watched the Let's Players and then decided this game isn't something that suits their taste, therefore didn't bought it themself? Can't  blame the Let's Players here, imo. That merchandising stuff is something else entirely, though.

[Elerond]

 

 

Developer Ryan Green noted in a blog post that since its launch over two months ago, That Dragon, Cancer has only sold an estimated 14k copies, according to SteamSpy. That's not that much for a team of eight across the past three years.

 

"Our studio has not yet seen a single dollar from sales," said Green. As for the existing revenue, he clarified "We decided to pay off all of our debt as soon as possible."

 

The developer suggested that the reasons sales were so low was because many folks chose to watch Let's Play videos of the two-hour game rather than purchase it. "We underestimated how many people would be satisfied with only watching the game instead of playing it themselves," Green lamented.

 

"If you compare the millions of views of the entirety of our game on YouTube to our sales as estimated on SteamSpy, you can hopefully see the disparity," he continued. "We have seen many people post our entire game on YouTube with little to no commentary. We've seen people decompile our game and post our soundtrack on YouTube. We've also seen many, many Let's Players post entire playthroughs of our game, posting links to all of their own social channels and all of their own merchandising and leaving out a link to our site."

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-03-25-that-dragon-cancer-has-not-yet-seen-a-single-dollar-from-sales

 

 

 

But what if people watched the Let's Players and then decided this game isn't something that suits their taste, therefore didn't bought it themself? Can't  blame the Let's Players here, imo. That merchandising stuff is something else entirely, though.

 

 

Lack of sale even after millions of views may lead situation where publisher and indie devs start in mass say that they don't allow Let's Plays of their games (as in many places Lets plays can be done only if Game's rights holder don't forbid them), or go Nintendo route (and force lets players to give them percentage of their income). Although I would say that problem mostly only applies to this kind virtual experience products that have very narrow amount game mechanics, where there is little variance to be found and where major of the entertainment comes form narrative, as one can actually experience the game quite wholesomely without playing it. 

[the_dog_days]

 

 

 

Developer Ryan Green noted in a blog post that since its launch over two months ago, That Dragon, Cancer has only sold an estimated 14k copies, according to SteamSpy. That's not that much for a team of eight across the past three years.

 

"Our studio has not yet seen a single dollar from sales," said Green. As for the existing revenue, he clarified "We decided to pay off all of our debt as soon as possible."

 

The developer suggested that the reasons sales were so low was because many folks chose to watch Let's Play videos of the two-hour game rather than purchase it. "We underestimated how many people would be satisfied with only watching the game instead of playing it themselves," Green lamented.

 

"If you compare the millions of views of the entirety of our game on YouTube to our sales as estimated on SteamSpy, you can hopefully see the disparity," he continued. "We have seen many people post our entire game on YouTube with little to no commentary. We've seen people decompile our game and post our soundtrack on YouTube. We've also seen many, many Let's Players post entire playthroughs of our game, posting links to all of their own social channels and all of their own merchandising and leaving out a link to our site."

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-03-25-that-dragon-cancer-has-not-yet-seen-a-single-dollar-from-sales

 

 

 

But what if people watched the Let's Players and then decided this game isn't something that suits their taste, therefore didn't bought it themself? Can't  blame the Let's Players here, imo. That merchandising stuff is something else entirely, though.

 

 

Lack of sale even after millions of views may lead situation where publisher and indie devs start in mass say that they don't allow Let's Plays of their games (as in many places Lets plays can be done only if Game's rights holder don't forbid them), or go Nintendo route (and force lets players to give them percentage of their income). Although I would say that problem mostly only applies to this kind virtual experience products that have very narrow amount game mechanics, where there is little variance to be found and where major of the entertainment comes form narrative, as one can actually experience the game quite wholesomely without playing it. 

 

 

I can only see LPs doing that sort of damage if the product isn't up to consumer standards. Lately I've been watching EpicNameBro's latest LP of Dark Souls. I eventually bought Dark Souls, not because I intend to play it (I don't; it's simply not the kind of game I would enjoy playing) but out of artistic appreciation of the product. It isn't an unreasonable conclusion other many consumers would be willing to do the same if the product is particularly good. (Note: I'm being biased, and I know it. That still doesn't invalidate my opinion.)

[Elerond]

 

 

 

 

Developer Ryan Green noted in a blog post that since its launch over two months ago, That Dragon, Cancer has only sold an estimated 14k copies, according to SteamSpy. That's not that much for a team of eight across the past three years.

 

"Our studio has not yet seen a single dollar from sales," said Green. As for the existing revenue, he clarified "We decided to pay off all of our debt as soon as possible."

 

The developer suggested that the reasons sales were so low was because many folks chose to watch Let's Play videos of the two-hour game rather than purchase it. "We underestimated how many people would be satisfied with only watching the game instead of playing it themselves," Green lamented.

 

"If you compare the millions of views of the entirety of our game on YouTube to our sales as estimated on SteamSpy, you can hopefully see the disparity," he continued. "We have seen many people post our entire game on YouTube with little to no commentary. We've seen people decompile our game and post our soundtrack on YouTube. We've also seen many, many Let's Players post entire playthroughs of our game, posting links to all of their own social channels and all of their own merchandising and leaving out a link to our site."

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-03-25-that-dragon-cancer-has-not-yet-seen-a-single-dollar-from-sales

 

 

 

But what if people watched the Let's Players and then decided this game isn't something that suits their taste, therefore didn't bought it themself? Can't  blame the Let's Players here, imo. That merchandising stuff is something else entirely, though.

 

 

Lack of sale even after millions of views may lead situation where publisher and indie devs start in mass say that they don't allow Let's Plays of their games (as in many places Lets plays can be done only if Game's rights holder don't forbid them), or go Nintendo route (and force lets players to give them percentage of their income). Although I would say that problem mostly only applies to this kind virtual experience products that have very narrow amount game mechanics, where there is little variance to be found and where major of the entertainment comes form narrative, as one can actually experience the game quite wholesomely without playing it. 

 

 

I can only see LPs doing that sort of damage if the product isn't up to consumer standards. Lately I've been watching EpicNameBro's latest LP of Dark Souls. I eventually bought Dark Souls, not because I intend to play it (I don't; it's simply not the kind of game I would enjoy playing) but out of artistic appreciation of the product. It isn't an unreasonable conclusion other many consumers would be willing to do the same if the product is particularly good. (Note: I'm being biased, and I know it. That still doesn't invalidate my opinion.)

 

 

It isn't necessary even question do LPs do damage for game, but if LPs don't help games to sell, game's rights owners may come in conclusion that they don't like that other people profit from their product and as currently laws are in favor of game's rights owners if they want to block LPs. So if people want things continue like they current are they need to convince rights owners that they benefit from how things current are or change laws so that rights owners can't block things continuing like they currently are. Although it is quite likely that current state, where there aren't clear and comprehensive rules, will stop in some point in future.

[Hurlshort]

I'm pretty sure it is unreasonable to expect people to buy games based on artistic appreciation.  What a bizarre world we live in where you can spend years creating a game, and then the people playing the game can make more money off it than you.

 

edit:  It's simply unsustainable.  Eventually it will change, and LPers will need to put a percentage of their profits towards the game creators.  LPers deserve to profit as well, given that they are creating their own content off the game.  The other option would be to raise the price of the initial game a ton, like you see with design tools.  

Edited March 26, 2016 by Hurlshot

[the_dog_days]

What a bizarre world we live in where you can spend years creating a game, and then the people playing the game can make more money off it than you.

If such a thing were to happen I would blame poor business practices rather than laws allowing LPs. Unfortunately, from what I've seen a lot of the companies that struggle are quicker to blame either consumers or the market for their own poor decisions.

Edited March 26, 2016 by the_dog_days

[Elerond]

 

What a bizarre world we live in where you can spend years creating a game, and then the people playing the game can make more money off it than you.

If such a thing were to happen I would blame poor business practices rather than laws allowing LPs. Unfortunately, from what I've seen a lot of the companies that struggle are quicker to blame either consumers or the market for their own poor decisions.

 

 

Laws don't allow LPs. LPs currently exist only because game developers let them. Game developers could easily do same as music and video producers that copyright claim or take over monetization of Lets Play YouTube videos if there is even second of material that they own (and LPs that don't show the game itself probably will not get that much views). Even cases where LP fall under Fair Use categories, developers have legal right to take down the video and then video maker can use Fair use as reason in court why their video should be allowed exist even though it breaks developers IP rights. So in short under current laws LPs exist only because of good will of developers and publishers.

[Malcador]

Says something about the game if people are content enough after a LP and don't need to bother.

[HoonDing]

This just in: Automatron is terribland.

[Elerond]

Says something about the game if people are content enough after a LP and don't need to bother.

 

I would say that those interactive story experiences are closer movies than typical games.

[HoonDing]

There is a God

 

EDIT:

 

 

"The first DLC, entitled Two Worlds II: Call of the Tenebrae will be available at the end of Q2 2016 and focuses on the Hero's return to Antaloor, where he witnesses the shocking murder of DarPha! The killers are a never-before-seen tribe of hideous, rat-like creatures known only as "The Chosen", who control a mysterious, powerful new magic! Their genocidal plot threatens every living creature in Antaloor, and it's up to the Hero to find a way to stop them!"

This made me laugh uncontrollably for three minutes.

Edited March 26, 2016 by HoonDing

[Lexx]

In case you people missed it: The Banner Saga 2 is on Steam now and will be released in 3-something weeks.

 

http://store.steampowered.com/app/281640/?l=german

 

I've already looked for my old savegame. Though I actually forgot most of what I did by now...

[Agiel]

Says something about the game if people are content enough after a LP and don't need to bother.

Sort of makes me think back to these old Old Man Murray pieces:

 

From the Mixed Up Files of Roberta S. Williams

 

The Death of Adventure Games

 

While I hardly think the devs of That Dragon Cancer thinks of its audience and gamers at large are "uncultured dimwit" it probably should have occurred to them what it is exactly about games that makes the medium differ from movies and TV.

Edited March 26, 2016 by Agiel

[Malcador]

Never saw people's complaint with Williams' statement there, seems pretty accurate and is how pretty much every genre has changed. That puzzle in GK3 wasn't even done by Jensen, was some stopgap as the one she wanted couldn't be done, if I recall. Not particularly a good example of a typical puzzle of the genre really.

 

Then again, I've met some people confounded by Full Throttle of all things...

[Majek]

In case you people missed it: The Banner Saga 2 is on Steam now and will be released in 3-something weeks.

 

http://store.steampowered.com/app/281640/?l=german

 

I've already looked for my old savegame. Though I actually forgot most of what I did by now...

Will they even use old savegame import or will you just choose at the begining what you did?  I mean, i only remember 2 tough choices i made in the whole game. The one with the Axe unit guy and the choice at the end.

[Lexx]

No idea. I just know that people are talking about savegames everywhere.

[Oerwinde]

 

In case you people missed it: The Banner Saga 2 is on Steam now and will be released in 3-something weeks.

 

http://store.steampowered.com/app/281640/?l=german

 

I've already looked for my old savegame. Though I actually forgot most of what I did by now...

Will they even use old savegame import or will you just choose at the begining what you did?  I mean, i only remember 2 tough choices i made in the whole game. The one with the Axe unit guy and the choice at the end.

 

The kid at the beginning can survive to the end if you do like 5 things right.

[Drowsy Emperor]

Two games to look out for:

Stellaris - Paradox 4x/grand strategy inspired by Master of Orion. Has a lot of nice touches, such as a sophisticated race creation, a lot of random exploration related events that influence things like leaders, the game's tech tree (opening unique tech), decent visuals (most games of the type are horrible to look at), interesting social engineering choices.

No Man's Sky - Procedural generated space exploration/trading/fighing game with an infinite universe. Stunning visuals.

[Oerwinde]

Two games to look out for:

 

Stellaris - Paradox 4x/grand strategy inspired by Master of Orion. Has a lot of nice touches, such as a sophisticated race creation, a lot of random exploration related events that influence things like leaders, the game's tech tree (opening unique tech), decent visuals (most games of the type are horrible to look at), interesting social engineering choices.

No Man's Sky - Procedural generated space exploration/trading/fighing game with an infinite universe. Stunning visuals.

I watched a video of Stellaris in action and it impressed me. Like a mix of EU4 and Master of Orion, but with the race creation you're unlikely to meet the same race twice. Definitely in my to buy list. Been watching a Hearts of Iron 4 video too, looks much simpler than HOI3, and more fun.

[pmp10]

Valve losses case over lack of refunds in Australia

Finally a ruling that games are a product and not just a service.

[Zoraptor]

Software as a product has been the rule here for more than a decade via the Consumer Guarantees Act (which is a genuinely excellent bit of legislation). I haven't read the SSA recently but at one point there was NZ explicit stuff dealing with software-as-product issues and we'd obviously be a smaller market than Aus.

[Humanoid]

It becomes a bit harder to argue that they're "not conducting business in Australia" when they have regional pricing specific to Australia. :D