What you did today

[Guard Dog]

Been very busy with work lately. Both my regular work and a new business venture I've bought into. I'm only a minority partner in that one. One of many. I'm getting the feeling I've bet on a losing horse though. Plus personal life has become, interesting to say the least. Women complicate things don't they? 

[BruceVC]

Not to tell folks with fancy mod-badges how to comport themselves on the forum, but I think everybody would enjoy themselves a little more if we kept the political wrangling to the (numerous) threads dedicated particularly to such political wrangling. 

 

 

The weather around here lately has been getting pleasantly cool.  I really need to stop putting off un-installing the window air conditioner in our bedroom.  Makes it a bit drafty at night. 

 

I have to disagree, Mods are human and I prefer and appreciate the fact that they can have debates between each other that we are privy to. We all know each other on Off Topic and I don't think this undermines the forum in anyway. For me having the Mods participate in debates with us and each other adds more of a personal touch to the website. Also we know that all of us tend to jump around on topics and subjects. I want to add that when it comes to really censoring necessary topics and managing large discussions they do an excellent job.

 

Also I've had several protracted debates with Gfted1 and everyone knows he's seldom right

Edited September 26, 2013 by BruceVC

[Guard Dog]

[LadyCrimson]

I love picking up my cat because he likes to lick my face and nibbles on my hair like he thinks he's a puppy. Which makes my face swell up a bit and itch like mad before I dash to the bathroom to rinse. But it's worth it!

 

...contemplating ordering some cheap Chinese food or making something out of the fridge, after which I shall holler to my spouse to get off that darn BL2 game so I can watch some TV.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

What is up with the missus GD?

 

Spent two hours of lecture hitting on a cute blonde only to find out she is Lesbian. Currently studying for an exam by drinking with friends, which will likely result in taking 30 minutes to order **** from taco bell.

[ManifestedISO]

I think I heard California was trying to get a $12 minimum wage going recently. Did that go through? Not that $12/hour gets you very far in metropolitan Calif.

 

Just $10, up from $8, over the next three years. 

[Walsingham]

Isn't California bankrupt? So passing unenforcable legislation is par for the course.

[Nepenthe]

Heading out to class. More than likely going to focus more on a girl than the lecture.

 

Yesterday at court was kind of similar, was in a bigger city and the prosecutor scored high on the ice maiden/probably moonlighting as a highly paid dominatrix scale. Especially since I said my bit in the first 15 minutes and had to just sit there for the remaining few hours. Niiiice.

[Guard Dog]

 

Heading out to class. More than likely going to focus more on a girl than the lecture.

 

Yesterday at court was kind of similar, was in a bigger city and the prosecutor scored high on the ice maiden/probably moonlighting as a highly paid dominatrix scale. Especially since I said my bit in the first 15 minutes and had to just sit there for the remaining few hours. Niiiice.

 

  And I'm guessing you were so turned on you couldn't sit still!

[Nepenthe]

 

 

Heading out to class. More than likely going to focus more on a girl than the lecture.

 

Yesterday at court was kind of similar, was in a bigger city and the prosecutor scored high on the ice maiden/probably moonlighting as a highly paid dominatrix scale. Especially since I said my bit in the first 15 minutes and had to just sit there for the remaining few hours. Niiiice.

 

  And I'm guessing you were so turned on you couldn't sit still!

 

 

Dude, am LL.D. The main thing you take away from an advanced law degree is the ability to sit still in almost any situation. :D

 

Also, frankly, not my type, but still something to rest my eyes on while everybody else is jabbering

[Azdeus]

 

Dude, am LL.D. The main thing you take away from an advanced law degree is the ability to sit still in almost any situation. :D

 

Also, frankly, not my type, but still something to rest my eyes on while everybody else is jabbering

 

 

Oh, man, I'd love that. Hell yes! Domineering finnish woman... Some kinkyness in there and it's... yeah, niiiiice... I'd so love it if she spoke Swedish too, with that awesome accent... Oh! I wonder if she likes knives like the rest of the fins?

[JFSOCC]

Why is Denmark trying to cut the program?

The Netherlands.

 

The Netherlands has been pushing for the European Union to enforce stricter budget laws. Thanks to the Dutch government, it is now European rules that a nations budget cannot have more than 3% deficit.

Which is great, I absolutely agree with this. I just don't think it's wise to do that during an economic crisis.

 

Of course, the Netherlands used to be one of the strongest economies in the EU, but crisis hit, and now our own government has asked to delay that 3% and try to do 4% budget deficit for this fiscal year instead.

 

Instead of really fixing the problems by increasing revenue, we have a centrist right wing government (which would still be considered liberal by American standards, I'd wager) set on

A. getting that budget deficit down, no matter who suffers

B. doing so by spending cuts, rather than taxation.

 

continues on a political rant...

 

These spending cuts are taking place everywhere where the politicians have no personal stake in them, IE: the social safety net, education, healthcare, and by privatising the Energy and public transportation markets, as well as our postal service.

 

The results have been disastrous, but the political right doesn't want to acknowledge this, as they're stuck in their ideology of "a person is responsible for his own success of failure in life" (which is inaccurate) Ever since in the early 2000's the political right has surged, we've seen everything we've carefully built up over decades destroyed.

Contraception no longer gets paid for by healthcare, and teen pregnancy has been going up (shocker)

Various mental disorders are no longer considered to be grounds for disability benefits, and the number of vulnerable people failing to make ends meet has risen drastically. Privatising the energy markets has led to increase in cost, effectively legal cartels, a lack of innovation, and failing infrastructure. Privatising public transportation has had the same effects, with prices for tickets soaring way over our inflation levels. (way way over) We have perpetual shortages in the care for the elderly, not because we don't have enough nurses, but because we don't hire enough nurses. subsequently, they are overworked and cannot spend enough time taking care of their duties. Our postal service doesn't deliver mail 3 days in the week (used to be no mail on sunday only) all postmen have been fired and rehired on part-time basis, because that's cheaper and you don't have to pay as much benefits. We used to have post-offices everywhere, they've all been closed.

 

I really could go on forever, but suffice to say, I'm no fan.

Our government is set on buying 37 Joint Strike Fighters even though the Netherlands hasn't had to fight a defensive war since Indonesia declared independence (and then only there). That's about 4.5 billion, meanwhile the government is trying to cut spending by another 6 billion.

 

cutting the loan program for our universities and colleges, as well as imposing a steep fine on those who take too long (more than 2 years than the course you take) is bound not only to drop graduation rates, but also impose early debt on those just finishing their education.

And we can see how that works out, because that's what's been going on in the US, a nation in perpetual debt, brainwashed to think it's the greatest most powerful, smartest, most exceptional nation in the world.

 

Ignoring the crippling debt, blatant corruption of their political system, both in its fundamentals and its officials, horribly obsolete infrastructure desperately in need of maintenance

http://www.infrastructurereportcard.org/

, large income inequality, third world birth rates, absurdly low wages (a minimum wage that hasn't been inflation adjusted for over 40(!!!) years), ridiculously expensive healthcare, infantilising partisan media, low internationally scoring education standards, over 3 million people in prison (privately run) at any time

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarceration_rate

(that's 0.7/100 Americans! costing about 38.000 dollar a year per person)

An obsolete economy driven largely by manufacturing (yay Detroit!)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cC0JPs-rcF0

, even though America can no longer be competitive worldwide in manufacturing, and a military complex which costs the economy more than most nations have in GDP.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_military_expenditures (only comes after Saudi Arabia) 39% of the TOTAL world expenditure on the military

 

 

Edited September 26, 2013 by JFSOCC

[Nepenthe]

 

 

Dude, am LL.D. The main thing you take away from an advanced law degree is the ability to sit still in almost any situation. :D

 

Also, frankly, not my type, but still something to rest my eyes on while everybody else is jabbering

 

 

Oh, man, I'd love that. Hell yes! Domineering finnish woman...

 

 

That's the only kind there is, really.

[Gfted1]

@JSFOCC: An informative post but doesn't it come down to the fact that they can no longer afford the "good old days" and now must make adjustments? I totally understand that everyone wants everything for free, but where does it come from? Inb4 someone mentions "the rich".

 

Do you think continuously raising taxes to pay for all your social programs is a sustainable model, even in a country as small as yours?

[JFSOCC]

@JSFOCC: An informative post but doesn't it come down to the fact that they can no longer afford the "good old days" and now must make adjustments? I totally understand that everyone wants everything for free, but where does it come from? Inb4 someone mentions "the rich".

 

Do you think continuously raising taxes to pay for all your social programs is a sustainable model, even in a country as small as yours?

I get your argument, let me counter with mine:

Cutting social programs drives up costs, because those who will fall through the cracks now will eventually cost more to help. It's a case of it's cheaper to prevent than to solve. A man who cannot afford his living wages is more likely to resort to crime, gambling, drugs, violence, etc. A person who gets sick cannot work, a person who is dead cannot pay taxes. (well, once) A recent study reported that people who are poor are often psychologically in less shape to deal with problems, making it a vicious cycle unless help is given.

 

I believe that we can run up our budget deficit, I think in times of economic crisis, you need investment more than ever. Typically you don't save your grain *in* the lean years, but rather, *for* the lean years.

 

Our social programs have been (fairly) successful and (fairly) affordable for decades. They are effective and shouldn't be cut.

 

And yes I do believe higher taxes on those who make more than say, 250.000 Euro a year would help a great deal. The strongest shoulders bear the heaviest burden and all that. I also believe that you can live a perfectly happy life (AND STILL BE RICH) when everything you make over 250.000 gets taxed heavily. We tax income in scales here. Meaning the first 20k we make gets taxed 37% everything from 20k to 56k gets taxed 42% and currently everything above gets taxed 52%. In some countries it goes even higher. Point is, the first 20k you make will never be taxed higher. You don't actually lose money for being rich.

It is society which in large part is responsible for giving you the opportunities for success, and it's a civic duty to repay society when you get to succeed in it.

 

Yes, there is a strong moral imperative. I think it's dishonest, both intellectually and ethically, not to want to contribute to society, especially when it is in dire need, and when it benefits everyone, yourself included.

You make use of the roads, the bridges, the education system (unless you're wealthy enough to go to private schools), you make use of the fire department, the police department, the sewage treatment plant, the water filtration plant, etc etc. And that needs to be paid for.

So a wealthy person pays a little more, that's not going to have a significant impact on his wealth or lifestyle. (Because nations tax money income, not money ownership)

 

Let me ask you this, in +/-40 years of "trickle down" economics, have you seen the wealth trickle down? Someone who can has his own private island, three cars, do you think they will quickly spend that extra money they have? Above a certain point, the numbers become meaningless as you earn faster than you can spend.

And yes, there's charity, but it's no substitute for taxes.

 

Taxation works. Taxation based on carrying capacity works better.

 

It's not that I want nice things for free, it's that I want essential things.

Even if somehow you don't make use of everything your money goes to, doesn't mean you never will.

That's the notion of a welfare state. It's not to coddle the lazy, or to give handouts to social parasites; It's to provide opportunities and chances to improve their life, help them through a bad time, and acknowledge that poverty or disease is NOT A PERSONAL FAILING.

And when I get to do better, and I will because of the social safety net that we have, I will be proud to pay more taxes. I would consider myself a social parasite if I didn't pay taxes when I could.

 

Because *that* is what "serving your country" means. It means acknowledging that you are not alone in your society, and that success is dependent on our social abilities: cooperation, trust, tolerance for failure. Because most people fail many times before they succeed. If any of those failures cripples a person permanently, you're denying them the opportunity to find success later.

Edited September 26, 2013 by JFSOCC

[Gfted1]

For me, reading that post was like looking at an alien world. Ill never understand why the successful should be penalized to take care of the unsuccessful. But on the bright side, as I advance to my twilight years, at least I too will be able to become a burden to my society.

 

*sigh* That's not true, I responsibly have a retirement plan.

[Gorgon]

Welfare costs money, so really the most important long term welfare policy is to ensure that the economy is sound. It is entirely possible to have a booming economy as well as a relatively large ammount of redistribution, but not if you keep spending money you don't have. 

[Rosbjerg]

Yes, there is a strong moral imperative. I think it's dishonest, both intellectually and ethically, not to want to contribute to society, especially when it is in dire need, and when it benefits everyone, yourself included.

 

And this is where northern Europe and the rest of the world is different. We've created a system so all encompassing that we are in a very real sense "the state", while for the rest of the world 'The State' is something barely tolerable, cumbersome, corrupt, disingenuous - a necessary evil.. This is a functioning social democracy, as close to Democratic communism as you get.. We believe and trust in the inherent good of our state and the system - and hate the politicians that wants to change it too much (but never hate the state).. Which is why the rich here make a lot less of a fuss when they hand over 60-70% of their income.

Now for your average American or southern European however, it's almost like it's the exact opposite. There are some politicians that do good, but the state will always almost always do bad. So why should they pay 70% of their income to something they see as inherently bad? of course they won't..

 

It's great it works here and I too fear that short sighted politicians here will ruin it.. But it won't work outside of our countries, unless they massively restructure their mindset, civic administration, checks and balances and societal feeling of responsibility - not just communal. They need to find their own way of creating a better system for them, I seriously don't believe they will ever be able to use ours. just as it would be catastrophic for us to use theirs.

 

I think the best course for America is regional state power and a much much looser federal government, much like the original idea of EU (something we should also move back to imo).

[Hurlshort]

Isn't California bankrupt? So passing unenforcable legislation is par for the course.

 

California has rebounded nicely, thanks to a fiscally conservative governor.  Some cities are still in trouble because they are not making necessary cuts, but the state had a budget surplus in 2013 after years of deficits.

[Walsingham]

Wouldn't this political stuff normally have its own safe cosy thread? Just repeating Enoch's point.

 

Unless this is some kind of meta-what you did today which is going over my head.

[Enoch]

For me, reading that post was like looking at an alien world. Ill never understand why the successful should be penalized to take care of the unsuccessful. But on the bright side, as I advance to my twilight years, at least I too will be able to become a burden to my society.

 

*sigh* That's not true, I responsibly have a retirement plan.

 

Retirement plan notwithstanding, depending on how long you live, it is quite likely that the cost to Medicare of keeping you going in your twilight years will dramatically exceed everything you've paid in over the years. 

 

The rational argument in favor of redistributive state action is largely based on the concept of a veil of ignorance-- what kind of tax/benefit/etc. system would you design if you had no idea whether you would be born rich or poor, smart or dumb, healthy or sickly?  In general, success (or lack thereof) depends far more on circumstance and dumb luck than most people who consider themselves successful are willing to believe.  (The oddity about America is that a whole lot of Americans tend to think that they are either already successful, or that they will be in the very near future.) 

 

 

(Edit:  And here I go compounding the problem I complained about. )

Edited September 26, 2013 by Enoch

[Gfted1]

In general, success (or lack thereof) depends far more on circumstance and dumb luck than most people who consider themselves successful are willing to believe.

I agree that being in the right place at the right time is beneficial but to discount individual effort falls flat imo. Ill use myself as an example. I grew up with nothing. NOTHING. My father died when I was 7 and my mother, who had only been a housewife up to this point, took the only job she knew how to do, she became a waitress at local diners. I never even had new clothes until high school. All of my clothes came from resale shops like Goodwill and Salvation Army. We were poor as hell. She died when I was 17 and I was on my own from that time. Apparently defying the odds, I managed to not turn to crime, hard drugs or homelessness. Am I some kind of unique case? Of course not. People do that every day.

 

It would be an interesting counterpoint if being coddled by the state actually perpetuates the problem. Im not so sure JSFOCC would still be chillin at home at 27 if the mechanism wasn't in place to support that lifestyle. He would have been forced into action long before now. Possibly.

[Malcador]

Cool story.

[Gfted1]

 

I figured it was a mistake to post that.

[ShadySands]

I have a similar origin story as Gfted1 and I still think we can and should do more

 

On topic, I'm on call this week and I had 3 calls in the middle of the night and into the wee hours of the morning

 

 

EDIT:

Forgot I also had a weird dream where I was either insane or the gov't was mind controlling me or both and a cousin who I grew up with and is more like a brother to me turned out to be a crackhead. This is what I get for reading the news right before bed

Edited September 26, 2013 by ShadySands