Dragon Age 2

[Gromnir]

Look, the 'unreliable narrator' is a long-established literary convention (Emily Bronte's Wuthering Heights is a classic example) which only goes to show the pretensions that drive this project.

 

As the man said earlier, the unreliable narrator will be a device whereby whatever you do, Bio still tells you what happened. The excuse being, "it's an unreliable narrator, a classic literary device, look how clever we are."

 

Lastly, the time frame will merely provide new, linear, activity hubs (Years 1-3, Years 3-7, Years 8-9 the YeAr 10 ThE YEaR of DaRk HERoiC FantASy!!).

 

How do I know this, sport fans? Because of the hyperbolic spin around every previous Bio title since BG2.

 

Cheers

MC

 

 

we would like to give bio some Benefit of the Doubt points, but it is getting ever more difficult to do so. the ten year span seeeeeeeeeems like a good thing. if, for instance, the Hawke character starts at age 18, the writers may be able to differentiate the rp experience by having the treatment o' the protagonist's perceived youth change depending 'pon the player's choice o' beginning locales. is not a major thing, but it can add to the game and storytelling experience... particularly if the developers add some genuine gameplay obstacles related to age... or elapsed time. unfortunately, am not confident that bio will take advantage o' such opportunities. am increasingly worried that they will simply do as mc suggests.

 

unreliable narrator? is a meaningful technique when writing a novel, but am not seeing a point with a crpg... other than to do as mc suggest. unreliable narrator is useful when it serves to contrast or distinguish what actually happened... or may have happened. the reader of a novel, unaware o' the author's Reality, may gradual learn that the narrator is unreliable and the reader needs must reexamine some preconceptions they made during the course o' reading. but in the case of da2, the player will be experiencing reality, so the untrustworthy narrator can have less meaningful impact... unless this is da2: the psychedelic experience.

 

*scratches head*

 

dunno, but too many o' the da2 features is looking like little more than resource saving devices for the developer. as with the dialogue wheel from me, bio is once again attempting to convince consumers that less = more; they will sell you the notion that their shortcuts ain't cuts, but is instead a concerted effort to improve the role-play experience. bio is treating their fans like marks in an extreme large (but not too subtle) confidence game... and the game journalists is so clueless that they is actual aiding biowarian efforts to bamboozle. would be funny if we were not convinced that bio's/ea flim-flam efforts regarding da2 will eventual be successful... 'cause, "there's a sucker born every minute."

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Magnum Opus]

I'm calling it: The unreliable Narrator in DA2 will be the main antagonist for the game. Narrator, they say, is looking for Hawke. Well, maybe Hawke is looking for Narrator, too.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

... tho that might be getting into the psychedelia previously mentioned, and something best served with a side order o' 'shrooms.

[Volourn]

"this game looks more and more like "The Witcher" to me, even the both games' main characters look alike, and it could be a good thing. I just hope they ditch the romance and let Hawke be a womanizer, collecting medieval era panties or something..."

 

Well.. Hawke can be a female...

[Tigranes]

Well, as long as it's not DA2: It all happened in the Matrix, silly...

[Gromnir]

Well, as long as it's not DA2: It all happened in the Matrix, silly...

 

there is a da universe analog... it all happened in the fade. it were all a dream, or was it? ack.

 

*shrug*

 

am curious to see how bio chooses to use various announced devices, but the past few games from the cannucks has taught us to limit our expectations. am not suggesting that game will be bad, but most o' these kewl improvements don't seem like improvements so much as resource saving moves to try and make a Q1 2011 release a reality.

 

HA! Good Fun!

[funcroc]

Game Informer feature: An Epic In Progress video

[Oner]

I'm calling it: The unreliable Narrator in DA2 will be the main antagonist for the game. Narrator, they say, is looking for Hawke. Well, maybe Hawke is looking for Narrator, too.

Almost.

The narrator will be your dwarf friend (or "friend") and he's telling the story to an inquisitor.

[Thorton_AP]

dunno, but too many o' the da2 features is looking like little more than resource saving devices for the developer. as with the dialogue wheel from me, bio is once again attempting to convince consumers that less = more; they will sell you the notion that their shortcuts ain't cuts, but is instead a concerted effort to improve the role-play experience.

 

Was this still the case in Mass Effect 2? I've been giving it a try and so far haven't noticed any "different dialogue options leads to the same VO" but the first two dialogues were pretty trivial, and I've only really spoken to Jacob so far.

 

It's a crazy time consuming process but I haven't noticed dialogue options at any point having the VO line associated with them in the early going.

[Monte Carlo]

particularly if the developers add some genuine gameplay obstacles related to age... or elapsed time.

 

If he starts at 18 (and fit as a fiddle) and the game ends at the relatively tender age of 28 then I suppose the biggest potential obstacle is facial hair management and trying to avoid a nascent beer belly.

[Bos_hybrid]

"this game looks more and more like "The Witcher" to me, even the both games' main characters look alike, and it could be a good thing. I just hope they ditch the romance and let Hawke be a womanizer, collecting medieval era panties or something..."

 

Well.. Hawke can be a female...

 

So? That just means we get a womanizing female collecting medieval panties.

 

But didn't TW have romances? The witch and the other red hed? Wait a sec....

[Gromnir]

particularly if the developers add some genuine gameplay obstacles related to age... or elapsed time.

 

If he starts at 18 (and fit as a fiddle) and the game ends at the relatively tender age of 28 then I suppose the biggest potential obstacle is facial hair management and trying to avoid a nascent beer belly.

 

if an 18 year old refugee were trying to convince Gromnir that he should be given troops to fight an Ancient Evil or that he had successfully scouted and destroyed a darkspawn enclave, we would be dubious. different cultures gots different notions regarding age of manhood. individual people is also having varied opinions. as for the physical impact o' 10 years o' combat...

 

*shrug*

 

assume for a moment that healing spells and potions don't make you 100%... they leave scars. would that change mc pov 'bout tender age o' 28 following 10 years o' combat? we played high school football and three years o' collegiate div 1 American Football... + 1 summer as an ironman arena league player, but that is a story for another day. regardless, we were playing a seasonal contact sport and we got scars both visible and hidden. we can only imagine what kinda trauma 10 years o' bloody combat would do to a body.

 

HA! Good Fun!

Edited July 27, 2010 by Gromnir

[Monte Carlo]

^ That's a fair point. Shame Bio is more likely to fling assets at soppy romances.

[Gromnir]

^ That's a fair point. Shame Bio is more likely to fling assets at soppy romances.

 

agreed, but romances is popular. nevertheless, it would be refreshing to see bio use their incredible resources to do... more.

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Nepenthe]

Didn't Icewind Dale already have an unreliable narrator?

 

dunno, but too many o' the da2 features is looking like little more than resource saving devices for the developer. as with the dialogue wheel from me, bio is once again attempting to convince consumers that less = more; they will sell you the notion that their shortcuts ain't cuts, but is instead a concerted effort to improve the role-play experience.

 

Was this still the case in Mass Effect 2? I've been giving it a try and so far haven't noticed any "different dialogue options leads to the same VO" but the first two dialogues were pretty trivial, and I've only really spoken to Jacob so far.

 

It's a crazy time consuming process but I haven't noticed dialogue options at any point having the VO line associated with them in the early going.

 

Less in ME2. I'm still thinking it's less a question of saving in VO,* but more actually having a lot of people believe that it's revolutionary in some way.

 

*I'm sure it was a factor in ME1, though.

[Gromnir]

Didn't Icewind Dale already have an unreliable narrator?

 

dunno, but too many o' the da2 features is looking like little more than resource saving devices for the developer. as with the dialogue wheel from me, bio is once again attempting to convince consumers that less = more; they will sell you the notion that their shortcuts ain't cuts, but is instead a concerted effort to improve the role-play experience.

 

Was this still the case in Mass Effect 2? I've been giving it a try and so far haven't noticed any "different dialogue options leads to the same VO" but the first two dialogues were pretty trivial, and I've only really spoken to Jacob so far.

 

It's a crazy time consuming process but I haven't noticed dialogue options at any point having the VO line associated with them in the early going.

 

Less in ME2. I'm still thinking it's less a question of saving in VO,* but more actually having a lot of people believe that it's revolutionary in some way.

 

*I'm sure it was a factor in ME1, though.

 

 

"unreliable" is not same as "bad guy". winchester, from iwd, were only unreliable in retrospect with the final revelation o' the game... were akin to horror movie "gotcha" moment. such a revelation is not what one would typical identify as an unreliable narrator. is the reader/player ever presented with an opportunity to catch the iwd narrator in a fabrication o' some sort? does the iwd narration seem particularly self-serving for winchester? just 'cause you can see a motive for the narrator to lie does not result in a necessarily unreliable narrator.

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Niten_Ryu]

Game Informer feature: An Epic In Progress video

 

Bah, Bioware continues to design encounters where players position is about the worst possible and enemies have the superior advantage that would make Sun Tzu proud. It gets old really fast to be tactical idiot after dialogue or moving into new area.

 

It also creates huge balance issues. Mages, followed by ranged have huge advantage in situations where players position terrible. And it's not likes mages needed more advantages over rest of the classes.

[Oner]

So this game will be a kiting simulator too?

[sorophx]

Well.. Hawke can be a female...

 

this is actually what bugs me, doesn't seem right to make Hawke anything but male, since Bio is pedaling the male Hawke looks so much. they'd probably be better off concentrating on a male Hawke story and scratching the female option entirely.

 

But didn't TW have romances? The witch and the other red hed? Wait a sec....

 

no it didn't thank god. every time you met a female NPC, critical to the plot, you had the possibility to sleep with her and get her card, and that was that. it was completely optional, I intentionally missed most of it to save time. I guess it's pretty much the same in DA:O, only you get absolutely nothing for seducing members of your party. and in ME2 it was even worse. god, to think Bio would put it into each and every one of their games... I'd rather have a well-written love story inside the main story, maybe intertwined with the plot, involving a single character, preferably not in your party.

 

there are other ways to make a good RPG, w/o giving the player these godawful minigames and miniquests.

[Volourn]

"this is actually what bugs me, doesn't seem right to make Hawke anything but male, since Bio is pedaling the male Hawke looks so much. they'd probably be better off concentrating on a male Hawke story and scratching the female option entirely."

 

Illogical. They focused the ME series hype on a male Shepard yet it didn't hurt female Shepards at all.

 

 

 

"I guess it's pretty much the same in DA:O, only you get absolutely nothing for seducing members of your party. and in ME2 it was even worse. god, to think Bio would put it into each and every one of their games... "

 

False. It added more role-playing, more story, more awesomeness, and I'm no 'romance freak'; but I like anything that adds the above features.

[Tale]

Yeah, but it hurt male Shepards. Why do I not get a Jennifer Hale companion, huh? This is criminal.

Edited July 27, 2010 by Tale

[sorophx]

Illogical. They focused the ME series hype on a male Shepard yet it didn't hurt female Shepards at all.

oh yes it did, I played both ME and ME2 with male and female chars, female was horrible. it's very subjective really, a matter of personal preference and whatnot, to me it makes a little more sense to give players another Gordon Freeman, than to make it seem like players actually have a choice when there's none. take away the possibility to pick a race but leave - sex? puh-lease

[Amentep]

My experience with ME and ME2 was that I enjoyed playing FemShep more than ManShep. Different strokes for different folks, I guess.

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

Wow, that small bit of gameplay just looked... bad.

[Nepenthe]

I couldn't make out enough of the combat bit to scream that the sky is falling just yet.

 

Yeah, but it hurt male Shepards. Why do I not get a Jennifer Hale companion, huh? This is criminal.

 

THIS!

[Volourn]

"oh yes it did, I played both ME and ME2 with male and female chars, female was horrible. it's very subjective really, a matter of personal preference and whatnot, to me it makes a little more sense to give players another Gordon Freeman, than to make it seem like players actually have a choice when there's none. take away the possibility to pick a race but leave - sex? puh-lease"

 

Your opinion is one of many. Some prefered male Shep, others prefered female Shep. Seems BIO did their job. Gave people options, and various people enjoyed one of them. *shrug*

 

Focusing on male Hawke will not help or hinder female Hawke. It's irrelevant.

 

P.S. Why did you hate FemShep so much?