The All Things Political Topic

[Sarex]

1 hour ago, Azdeus said:

The Uighur situation is pretty well known, I'm surprised it has flown past you completely.

I know of it, I was expressing doubts to the validity of what was reported in the western media.

1 hour ago, Azdeus said:

The mistreatment of indiginous people in western countries historically and today, doesn't mean we can't **** on the CCP for doing those things actively in the present. Me and others have continually criticized governments and companies for decades for doing this kind of business, it's not a new thing. China isn't the leader in computer sciences, and while computing would've been more expensive I don't think it would have been much less fast at this stage. And that the economic gaps we have today beeing smaller is a huge thing, it is not a good thing anywhere or at any time.

Ok, but then let's realize if we only want to buy things from countries that have done no wrongs we would not be buying anything at all. I never thought that China was a leader in computer sciences, but it's a cold fact that had the west not had access to cheap/slave labor to manufacturer said electronics it's a big question if PC and mobile phones would have been as common as they are today. I think computers would have been restricted to companies and wealthy people and gaming as a whole would have looked much different today.

[uuuhhii]

1 hour ago, Azdeus said:

From what I can tell from Swedish court hearings, it's not only based on their chips, but also on the fact that China is a hostile nation. Having them build up even parts of a 5G network when there is a good chance that they would be literal enemies would be a security concern per definition, and would be a disruption of services that no nation would want to have. Huawei is subject to CCPs intelligence services laws. As for wether or not China is hostile? I don't know what goes on in your guys countries, but almost every year here in Sweden we've had Chinese spies been arrested for spying against Swedish companies.

That our western governments are spying on us is indisputable, but atleast we can use democratic processes in the EU and for a few more weeks the US, to curtail or even stop those things.

The Uighur situation is pretty well known, I'm surprised it has flown past you completely.

The mistreatment of indiginous people in western countries historically and today, doesn't mean we can't **** on the CCP for doing those things actively in the present. Me and others have continually criticized governments and companies for decades for doing this kind of business, it's not a new thing. China isn't the leader in computer sciences, and while computing would've been more expensive I don't think it would have been much less fast at this stage. And that the economic gaps we have today beeing smaller is a huge thing, it is not a good thing anywhere or at any time.

 

 

democratic processes to curtail spying

that is just nonsense of words

it would be delinquent of duty if a nation doesn't send out spy

[Azdeus]

21 minutes ago, Sarex said:

I know of it, I was expressing doubts to the validity of what was reported in the western media.

Ok, but then let's realize if we only want to buy things from countries that have done no wrongs we would not be buying anything at all. I never thought that China was a leader in computer sciences, but it's a cold fact that had the west not had access to cheap/slave labor to manufacturer said electronics it's a big question if PC and mobile phones would have been as common as they are today. I think computers would have been restricted to companies and wealthy people and gaming as a whole would have looked much different today.

The difference is that the Uighurs have no recourse, indiginous people in the west do, because we are democratic nations and we are (at times) trying to better ourselves and right our past mistakes. Even the US have been fixing some things the past years, surprisingly, such as bail reforms. Movements such as Black Lives Matters would have been all incarcerated in China and killed.

Atleast if things would've rolled that way, nvidias prices would've made some sense.

  

11 minutes ago, uuuhhii said:

democratic processes to curtail spying

that is just nonsense of words

it would be delinquent of duty if a nation doesn't send out spy

I wasn't only refering to sending out spies, I'm talking about spying on the general population and invasion of privacy.

Edited Monday at 12:21 PM by Azdeus

[uuuhhii]

6 minutes ago, Azdeus said:

The difference is that the Uighurs have no recourse, indiginous people in the west do, because we are democratic nations and we are (at times) trying to better ourselves and right our past mistakes. Even the US have been fixing some things the past years, surprisingly, such as bail reforms. Movements such as Black Lives Matters would have been all incarcerated in China and killed.

Atleast if things would've rolled that way, nvidias prices would've made some sense.

  

I wasn't only refering to sending out spies, I'm talking about spying on the general population and invasion of privacy.

 

google and microsoft are already selling everything

there is no effort required other than paying their price

[BruceVC]

29 minutes ago, Sarex said:

I know of it, I was expressing doubts to the validity of what was reported in the western media.

 

Al-Jazeera has reported consistently and constantly on what China is doing to the Uyghurs and they have an active page dedicated to this ongoing state sponsored abuse of a minority group 

And they not "  Western media " so you should be able to trust them

https://www.aljazeera.com/tag/uighur/

 

 

[BruceVC]

23 minutes ago, Azdeus said:

The difference is that the Uighurs have no recourse, indiginous people in the west do, because we are democratic nations and we are (at times) trying to better ourselves and right our past mistakes. Even the US have been fixing some things the past years, surprisingly, such as bail reforms. Movements such as Black Lives Matters would have been all incarcerated in China and killed.

 

Yes thats  a huge and obvious difference between state sponsored human rights abuses in places like Russia or China and the West or countries like South Africa

 

You can literally find daily protests in the latter group and the media covering both real and exaggerated criticism of the state. For some people its how they earn there money

But you wont find that within China, there is no legal recourse for citizens 

Its definitely not the same 

 

 

[Sarex]

57 minutes ago, Azdeus said:

The difference is that the Uighurs have no recourse, indiginous people in the west do, because we are democratic nations and we are (at times) trying to better ourselves and right our past mistakes. Even the US have been fixing some things the past years, surprisingly, such as bail reforms. Movements such as Black Lives Matters would have been all incarcerated in China and killed.

I mean historically protest and civil movements have not gone well in China and caused pretty high death tolls, or to put it a bit differently "protests hit different in China". I think China is very careful not to allow history to repeat itself. Also culturally they are just different, the people have a different mentality.

As to the rights in the US/Canada, I do not see what you are talking about. In the US the jails have become a business and it's been documented multiple times that judges willing help fill them.  If anything the difference between the rich and poor is huge, in their standard of living and their treatment in court. As for the indigenous people, I really don't know what else to say other then you are wrong. They have been ethnically cleansed and marginalized to the point where giving them any rights/allowances is laughable at this point.

Again, for the 10th time, I am not saying the West is evil, but what I am saying is that people tend to have different rules for China and other countries which are not considered allies. Shouldn't China be given the same opportunity to better itself socially as the west was given. People forget how recently China was in the depths of poverty, their focus now is economy and the security of it's borders. Once they get to the same level as the US, where the economy is no longer in question as it's too big to fail, I'm sure the people will start focusing on social well being and improvements.

edit: Also let's not forget Guantanamo bay and what happens to Muslims there.

Edited Monday at 01:17 PM by Sarex

[Zoraptor]

7 hours ago, Azdeus said:

..because we are democratic nations and we are (at times) trying to better ourselves and right our past mistakes.

We certainly like to pay lip service to that, but it equally certainly doesn't take much for the mask to slip. See all the people outraged about African nations not following the west's lead on foreign affairs and who think they should be OK with colonialism because it was "decades ago" and "we're sorry for it". So sorry for it they want them not to have an independent foreign policy and slavishly follow the Euro lead. Not really sorry if it's treated as an inconvenience as soon as it's, well, inconvenient.

In the end it's mostly about making people feel good about themselves.

(Same thing tends to happen with internal inquiries over things like abuse in care. Almost always held after the perpetrators are dead or too old to be punished, and in many cases after the victims are too; coincidentally this means that it costs less since even the low ball compensation adds up rapidly. But Something Was Done, so we can all feel good about things and know nothing similar will ever happen again; until the next time it does)

6 hours ago, BruceVC said:

And they not "  Western media " so you should be able to trust them

Al Jazeera supports pan Turkism as an Editorial Position, and Uighurs are Turkic. So they are pretty biased.

Though they are at least pro Uighur, whereas western media are just anti China. Or to put it another way, Al Jazeera would still care whoever was doing the oppression of the Uighurs; if China was a western buddy it'd be crickets from the rest.

[BruceVC]

https://edition.cnn.com/2025/01/06/americas/justin-trudeau-set-to-resign-canadian-prime-minister-intl/index.html

 

Trudeau has resigned

@Malcador

Whats your opinion on this is, is it good or bad? Are you glad he has resigned 

And what would  be the real justification, I see article says " A viral confrontation with a steel worker, who criticized Trudeau for not addressing the high cost of living, captured the growing discontent among Canadians.

“You’re not really doing anything for us, Justin,” the worker remarked, highlighting a sentiment that resonated widely. "

 

So is it really about inflation? I can understand that but this is a global reality and every country has suffered from that since the lockdowns ended and people will naturally blame the government but in this case inflation was caused primarily by a global event and no country was spared 

 

[Malcador]

It means we'll have an election and probably a Reform, er, sorry, Conservative PM. That's all right now.  Was PM for 9 years or so, that's quite a long time - either the people get sick of them or they get taken out by in party knives. 

It's funny seeing Americans think Trump is responsible for this, but the ones to say that are retarded.

[Hurlshort]

9 years is a very long time. I don't understand this idea that it is healthy to have one person entrenched in a powerful position for a long time. Turnover is good.

[Malcador]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/trump-canada-tariffs-51st-state-news-conference-1.7424897

Good thing you Americans elected a **** poster for President