Politics 2017 part V

[Gromnir]

This is insane. And the optics aren't right. Need an independent commission or special prosecutor to investigate Trump.

is absolute nothing wrong or curious 'bout President nixon firing archibald cox.

 

oh, wait...

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Leferd]

Shouldn't eveyrone be happy about this? I have no issue with Comey but 'both sides'; seemed to be butthurt with him. Which, likelymeans he was doing hsi job. L0L

Comey screwed Clinton, and had missteps along the way, but most people in government at least respected his integrity and independence from politics.

 

Waiting on the following names to be leaked for the vacancy:

 

Guiliani

Christie

Kushner.

 

Kidding/Not kidding.

[Volourn]

He didn't screw Clinton. Clinton screwed Clinton.

[Leferd]

To be honest, I don't think Bill and Hillary have shared a bed since leaving the White House.

[Chilloutman]

To be honest, I don't think Bill and Hillary have shared a bed since leaving the White House.

 

did you seen her? i doubt it even before xD

[Bartimaeus]

So basically, he's fired everyone that has investigated him - Sally Yates, Preet Bharara, and now Comey. Didn't Nixon fire the special prosecutor for his impeachment right before it happened? May it be that we are lucky enough that this is the case here.

[Leferd]

So basically, he's fired everyone that has investigated him - Sally Yates, Preet Bharara, and now Comey. Didn't Nixon fire the special prosecutor for his impeachment right before it happened? May it be that we are lucky enough that this is the case here.

 

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/92340-politics-2017-part-v/?p=1911164

 

[Bartimaeus]

I'm a zombie right now after having gotten back from a funeral and subsequently spending the rest of the day watching Stranger Things, so whoops, good call.

[Leferd]

I'm a zombie right now after having gotten back from a funeral and subsequently spending the rest of the day watching Stranger Things, so whoops, good call.

 

Sorry to hear. And Stranger Things seem thematically appropriate considering what's going on.

[Leferd]

Behind Comey’s firing: An enraged Trump, fuming about Russia

 

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/10/comey-firing-trump-russia-238192

 

• (Trump) had grown enraged by the Russia investigation, two advisers said, frustrated by his inability to control the mushrooming narrative around Russia. He repeatedly asked aides why the Russia investigation wouldn’t disappear and demanded they speak out for him. He would sometimes scream at television clips about the probe, one adviser said...

 

• Trump had grown angry with the Russia investigation — particularly Comey admitting in front of the Senate that the FBI was investigating his campaign — and that the FBI director wouldn't support his claims that President Barack Obama had tapped his phones in Trump Tower...

 

• But several other people familiar with the events said Trump had talked about the firing for over a week, and the letters were written to give him rationale to fire Comey...

 

• While shock dominated much of the FBI and the White House, the mood was more elated at Roger Stone's house in Florida. Several Stone allies and friends said Stone, who has been frequently mentioned in the investigation, encouraged the president to fire Comey in conversations in recent weeks. On Twitter, Stone signaled praise for the move by posting an image of Trump from The Apprentice saying "You're fired." Stone declined to comment Tuesday night but said he was enjoying a fine cigar.

[Gromnir]

while not an immediate obvious outcome o' the comey firing, am thinking the most unfortunate long-term impact o' the fbi director's removal will be the conclusion o' future directors to avoid transparency.  in an attempt to avoid the perception o' bias, comey were forthright and honest.  unfortunate, in a climate dominated by alternative facts and polarized parties, comey's efforts to dispel claims and concerns 'bout impropriety only magnified the perception o' investigative malfeasance and/or incompetence.  comey's fate is gonna be a cautionary tale for future fbi directors.  taciturn and anonymous.

 

HA! Good Fun! 

[redneckdevil]

Comey was NOT honest or forthright in Clinton emails. The reason why he is getting sacked is because of his biased actions. His first major blow was when he said Clinton did NOT send classified information and admitted she did use an unauthorized server but wouldn't punish her bc there I was no 'intent" to save Clinton'son's ass but WikiLeaks proved with actual untampered emails. Second blow was when he tried to save his image by shortly before elections that "new" stuff came up and was reopening the investigation on Clinton with the emails.

He played the game and ended up tarnishing his reputation by being biased and protecting Clinton. When it was obvious to the public that the FBI was showing different standards to her than others in govt for sharing an using unauthorized servers, he tried to save his ass with the reopening.

Comey was viewed as honest and forthright BEFORE the emails thing, but tarnished his reputation and his act of biased special treatment towards a Democrats, when your supposed to keep both parties in check, how trustworthy can he be so I agree he needs to go.

[Raithe]

The balance of whether its political commentary or more snark for the funny things thread....

 

[Guard Dog]

It's funny, I don't recall the wailing and gnashing of teeth when Bill Clinton fired the FBI director in '93. Of course the FBI had taken an interest in Clinton's real estate dealings much the same way as they have the Trump/Russia connections. The difference is Clinton (a Democrat) does it and no one (in the media) complains. Trump (a sort of Republican) does it and it's the second coming of Nixon.

 

I keep telling you guys there isn't a nickel's worth of difference between the Republicrats and the Democans. Only in who the cheerleaders cheer for.

 

Don't blame me I voted for Johnson.

[Malcador]

Comey was NOT honest or forthright in Clinton emails. The reason why he is getting sacked is because of his biased actions. His first major blow was when he said Clinton did NOT send classified information and admitted she did use an unauthorized server but wouldn't punish her bc there I was no 'intent" to save Clinton'son's ass but WikiLeaks proved with actual untampered emails. Second blow was when he tried to save his image by shortly before elections that "new" stuff came up and was reopening the investigation on Clinton with the emails.

He played the game and ended up tarnishing his reputation by being biased and protecting Clinton. When it was obvious to the public that the FBI was showing different standards to her than others in govt for sharing an using unauthorized servers, he tried to save his ass with the reopening.

Comey was viewed as honest and forthright BEFORE the emails thing, but tarnished his reputation and his act of biased special treatment towards a Democrats, when your supposed to keep both parties in check, how trustworthy can he be so I agree he needs to go.

Guess government does move slow if it took 4 months.

[Gromnir]

Comey was NOT honest or forthright in Clinton emails. The reason why he is getting sacked is because of his biased actions. His first major blow was when he said Clinton did NOT send classified information and admitted she did use an unauthorized server but wouldn't punish her bc there I was no 'intent" to save Clinton'son's ass but WikiLeaks proved with actual untampered emails. Second blow was when he tried to save his image by shortly before elections that "new" stuff came up and was reopening the investigation on Clinton with the emails.

He played the game and ended up tarnishing his reputation by being biased and protecting Clinton. When it was obvious to the public that the FBI was showing different standards to her than others in govt for sharing an using unauthorized servers, he tried to save his ass with the reopening.

Comey was viewed as honest and forthright BEFORE the emails thing, but tarnished his reputation and his act of biased special treatment towards a Democrats, when your supposed to keep both parties in check, how trustworthy can he be so I agree he needs to go.

complete mischaracterization.  for instance, comey noted how clinton Did send multiple classified emails from her private server and he observed how clinton actions were "extremely careless."  in fact, comey went out of his way to express the brobdingnagian scope o' clinton fumbduckery and how her actions regarding handling o' sensitive information were unique in his experience.  

 

might as well simple repost

 

https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/87025-us-election-2016-part-ii/?p=1825582

 

https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/87025-us-election-2016-part-ii/?p=1825704

 

https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/87025-us-election-2016-part-ii/?p=1826111

 

nobody had ever been prosecuted under the statute for gross negligence.  doing so in clinton's situation woulda' proved extreme difficult.  so comey observes how while no reasonable prosecutor would attempt to pursue criminal charges under the statute, clinton's actions were irresponsible to a significant degree.  he pointed out how clinton genuine claimed an inability to distinguish classified documents in spite o' the big "C" on such items. comey were doing everything he could to express the magnitude o' clinton's error, but all some folks wanted were criminal charges. 

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Wrath of Dagon]

So this leads us back to this. Propagating dogmatic zealotry in a rising tide of nationalistic/nativist populism in a non-homogeneous country is bad. Mob majority rule at the expense of minority rights is very bad no matter where in the world.

What you described is nothing like nationalist populism in the US, and any comparison is ridiculous. Get back to me when someone gets charged with blasphemy.

 

Investigation into Trump's campaign is headed by the Justice Department, not the FBI, and there's a grand jury seated, which wasn't done in Clinton's whitewash: http://www.cnn.com/2017/05/09/politics/grand-jury-fbi-russia/index.html

[Guard Dog]

I have no issue with Comey as far as his handling of the Clinton and Russia thing go. The FBI is a non political entity and he is in a terrible position when he's dragged into the political arena. But I do have a big problem with this: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/fbi-wants-access-to-internet-browser-history-without-a-warrant-in-terrorism-and-spy-cases/2016/06/06/2d257328-2c0d-11e6-9de3-6e6e7a14000c_story.html?utm_term=.f71573a12f25

 

As we heard in the great repository of political wisdom, Star Wars, "All who have power fear to lose it." That's only half of it though. The other half should be "All who have power want more". I'm even more distressed the response from the Senate wasn't "No f---g way".

[Elerond]

It's funny, I don't recall the wailing and gnashing of teeth when Bill Clinton fired the FBI director in '93. Of course the FBI had taken an interest in Clinton's real estate dealings much the same way as they have the Trump/Russia connections. The difference is Clinton (a Democrat) does it and no one (in the media) complains. Trump (a sort of Republican) does it and it's the second coming of Nixon.

 

I keep telling you guys there isn't a nickel's worth of difference between the Republicrats and the Democans. Only in who the cheerleaders cheer for.

 

Don't blame me I voted for Johnson.

 

Watching old news clips about Bill Clinton firing William Sessions, gives indication that was much better orchestrated firing and reason that was given didn't go against what Clinton had in past said about Sessions. Also Clinton was more popular when he did his move than Trump has ever been. Meaning that it shows that Clinton was much better in political games than Trump and he was quite successful in putting Sessions in bad light and himself in good light.

 

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/president-clinton-fired-fbi-director-william-sessions-july/story?id=47323746

[Leferd]

 

So this leads us back to this. Propagating dogmatic zealotry in a rising tide of nationalistic/nativist populism in a non-homogeneous country is bad. Mob majority rule at the expense of minority rights is very bad no matter where in the world.

What you described is nothing like nationalist populism in the US, and any comparison is ridiculous. Get back to me when someone gets charged with blasphemy.

 

Investigation into Trump's campaign is headed by the Justice Department, not the FBI, and there's a grand jury seated, which wasn't done in Clinton's whitewash: http://www.cnn.com/2017/05/09/politics/grand-jury-fbi-russia/index.html

Right, so a demagogue running on nativist populism wasn't just elected to be President of the United States of America?

 

Hey look -- Trump just signed a (I admit, clumsily put together) Executive Order that bars restrictions for religious institutions to engage in politics under the guise of free speech and religious liberty.

 

Not saying it's going to happen, but weeds start small, and before you know it...Your entire garden is overrun with them.

 

Re: Grand Jury subpeonas and federal criminal investigations. You have no idea how they work, do you?

[Bartimaeus]

McConnell rejecting calls for a special prosecutor because it would just "impede" the investigation. As opposed to firing the guy in charge of probably the most major one of those investigations...

[Wrath of Dagon]

 

 

So this leads us back to this. Propagating dogmatic zealotry in a rising tide of nationalistic/nativist populism in a non-homogeneous country is bad. Mob majority rule at the expense of minority rights is very bad no matter where in the world.

What you described is nothing like nationalist populism in the US, and any comparison is ridiculous. Get back to me when someone gets charged with blasphemy.

 

Investigation into Trump's campaign is headed by the Justice Department, not the FBI, and there's a grand jury seated, which wasn't done in Clinton's whitewash: http://www.cnn.com/2017/05/09/politics/grand-jury-fbi-russia/index.html

 

Right, so a demagogue running on nativist populism wasn't just elected to be President of the United States of America?

 

Like Obama wasn't a demagogue.

 

Hey look -- Trump just signed a (I admit, clumsily put together) Executive Order that bars restrictions for religious institutions to engage in politics under the guise of free speech and religious liberty.

 

Not saying it's going to happen, but weeds start small, and before you know it...Your entire garden is overrun with them.

Yes, just like Indonesia, everything's a slippery slope.

Re: Grand Jury subpeonas and federal criminal investigations. You have no idea how they work, do you?

A much better idea than you do apparently.

 

Edited May 10, 2017 by Wrath of Dagon

[HoonDing]

He'd fire all Congress if he could.

[Gromnir]

listening to spicer pressers is always surreal.  sarah huckabee sanders (we continue to leave off the sanders) were a nice change o' pace, but equal perplexing.

 

is 2017 and alternative facts is the norm.  even so, while we were not surprised to hear the claim, we were disappointed when the wh insisted the rank and file within the fbi had lost confidence in comey.  is an easy claim to make 'cause is not easily proven or disproven, but our experience is vast different.  we got admitted limited exposure to fbi, but what feedback we has received has been overwhelming and near universal positive when folks in the bureau speak o' comey. probable the chief reason we feel bad 'bout comey firing is 'cause the bureau folks we know is gonna be disappointed to see comey leave.  from our pov, the director were respected by those working for him. 

 

HA! Good Fun!

Edited May 10, 2017 by Gromnir

[Wrath of Dagon]

Sure, we're the evil nativists because we want laws enforced and borders secured: http://www.bostonherald.com/news/local_coverage/2017/05/suspect_in_doctors_slayings_avoided_deportation_with_plea_deal_for

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/05/10/illegal-immigrant-deported-15-times-arrested-in-hit-run-crash-that-hurt-6-year-old-boy.html