alternative facts

[Hurlshort]

 

It seems that the fake news media cannot even report correctly on something as simple as hat signing.

 

 

That's, kind of the point though, isn't it? Any 'news' source that wastes time reporting on non-events like this isn't really worth paying attention to. It's the same thing as those 'news' sources that pop up with stories about a President not saluting someone or not putting his hand over his heart during the pledge. These stories are just designed as clickbait for people that want to believe the President is some sort of cartoon villain. 

 

There are a few things any reasonable person can take for granted about every one of the Presidents that has ever served in office. They are working tremendous hours for the betterment of the United States. You can disagree with their policies and question the outcomes of their decisions, but it is good to always remember the incredible pressure and responsibility that comes with the office. It is the most difficult job in the country.

[Guard Dog]

 

That's, kind of the point though, isn't it? Any 'news' source that wastes time reporting on non-events like this isn't really worth paying attention to. It's the same thing as those 'news' sources that pop up with stories about a President not saluting someone or not putting his hand over his heart during the pledge. These stories are just designed as clickbait for people that want to believe the President is some sort of cartoon villain. 

 

There are a few things any reasonable person can take for granted about every one of the Presidents that has ever served in office. They are working tremendous hours for the betterment of the United States. You can disagree with their policies and question the outcomes of their decisions, but it is good to always remember the incredible pressure and responsibility that comes with the office. It is the most difficult job in the country.

 

If anyone doubts that just have them look at the before and after pictures of the Presidents.

[Leferd]

Or if only people can tell the difference between legitimate primary-sourced reporting and not get distracted/mislead by click-bait news aggregators and their hot take cousins.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

Remember when we were laughing at Mitt Romney saying Russia was the US' greatest geopolitcal adversary?

 

Anyways I'm hungry and gonna have an alternative salad for lunch.

[Pidesco]

There are a few things any reasonable person can take for granted about every one of the Presidents that has ever served in office. They are working tremendous hours for the betterment of the United States.

That stopped being true a few months ago, apparently.

[Guard Dog]

Are they really working for the betterment of the United States? I'm sure most like to think so. Differences of political philosophy are in the eye of the beholder since there are varying opinions of what actually will better the United States. But I wonder, did Barack Obama really believe the United States would be better if the IRS started persecuting political dissent. Did he truly believe the ACA driving up the cost of everything from home thermometers to veterinary care would better the lives of Americans? Did George W Bush believe crating a massive new federal bureaucracy that takes an interest in the activity of everyday Americans would make us better? If so perhaps the questions isn't their character so much as their intelligence.

 

I believe the real goal of people in power is more power. That is what they are really working tirelessly for. Perhaps they really do believe taking power and freedom from people will lead to their betterment. Perhaps they tell themselves that lie to ease their conscience. Either way, even if it's done with benevolence in their heart (patronizing as it is), it joins them in the company of some truly evil people throughout history. To a degree at least.

 

If a government really wants to better it's people and nation step one would be to not hurt them. Step two is to establish a set of rules everyone must live by with no exceptions. Step 3 confine itself to only enforcing those rules and leave the people to look after their own betterment.

[Pidesco]

I was specifically thinking about the "working tremendous hours" bit.

 

I'm of the opinion that both W. and Obama were well meaning. This is iffier if considering their entire administrations, of course.

 

Stating that the cause of rising health care costs was the ACA is misleading to say the least. Healthcare costs in the US were already ridiculous and increasing long before the ACA. The ACA was an underwhelming solution because the US, as a whole, is ridiculously and irrationally dysfunctional regarding anything that attempts to tackle the unmitigated catastrophe that is healthcare in America.

[Wrath of Dagon]

Funny how foreigners keep coming over here to partake in the "unmitigated catastrophe".

[aluminiumtrioxid]

Funny how foreigners keep coming over here to partake in the "unmitigated catastrophe".

 

Clearly, if people prefer to live in a country where they can earn five times as much as they could in their homeland, it's a sign that literally no problems could possibly exist in that country.

[Gfted1]

They should value their lives over the filthy dollar. I am disappoint.

[Wrath of Dagon]

 

Funny how foreigners keep coming over here to partake in the "unmitigated catastrophe".

 

Clearly, if people prefer to live in a country where they can earn five times as much as they could in their homeland, it's a sign that literally no problems could possibly exist in that country.

 

I meant they're coming over here to get medical treatment, I wasn't talking about immigration. Edit: Btw, my healthcare is fine, and so is most people's. Edited April 20, 2017 by Wrath of Dagon

[Gfted1]

They are probably just passing through to Canada or Cuba.

[Pidesco]

Wait, your healthcare is fine? Oh, never mind then. Everything must be peachy keen for everyone, everywhere.

[HoonDing]

Nothing a jar of leeches and a bottle of brandy can't cure.

[Guard Dog]

I was specifically thinking about the "working tremendous hours" bit.

 

I'm of the opinion that both W. and Obama were well meaning. This is iffier if considering their entire administrations, of course.

 

Stating that the cause of rising health care costs was the ACA is misleading to say the least. Healthcare costs in the US were already ridiculous and increasing long before the ACA. The ACA was an underwhelming solution because the US, as a whole, is ridiculously and irrationally dysfunctional regarding anything that attempts to tackle the unmitigated catastrophe that is healthcare in America.

The thing I was specifically referring to was a tax on medical devices that was included in the ACA. It's only a 2.3% tax but it is applies to just about everything. For example, if I take my dog to the vet for a check up, blood test and X-Ray. The tax applies to the syringe, the vial the blood goes in, the X-Ray machine, the stethoscope, the otoscope, the lab that analyzes the blood has it applies to all of their equipment.  So all of this costs more for the Vet & lab to provide and the added costs are passed on to me. So because we have the ACA, which has nothing to do at all with Veterinary care, my dogs annual exam and senior dog wellness test which used to cost $98, now costs $166 for the exact same service. And it is only because all taxes, fees, and costs mandated by the government are ultimately paid by the consumer.   

[Wrath of Dagon]

I'm not sure how a 2% tax on everything causes your cost to double. Sounds to me like your vet is making a killing.

[Guard Dog]

I don't believe the MDT was 100% responsible. The price of everything escalates over time because the cost of everything goes up. But in 2005 that service cost $85 give or take (going from memory here). In 2010 it was $98 so about a 15% change over five years give or take. So if it follows that rate of increase it should cost between $115-$120 ballpark. So the actual difference cause by the tax (which kicked in in 2011) is $46, and increase of thirty something percent.

Edited April 20, 2017 by Guard Dog

[Hurlshort]

 Edit: Btw, my healthcare is fine, and so is most people's.

 

 

Edit: You know, probably just a waste of breath. Living in a different world, I suppose. 

 

Edit 2, where I decide to waste breathe.

 

I'm not fine with this: http://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2017/04/20/524774195/what-country-spends-the-most-and-least-on-health-care-per-person

 

No one in the US should be "fine" with the costs of healthcare. We are all one emergency away from catastrophic medical bills that can bankrupt all but the richest of us.

Edited April 21, 2017 by Hurlshot

[Elerond]

 

 

Funny how foreigners keep coming over here to partake in the "unmitigated catastrophe".

 

Clearly, if people prefer to live in a country where they can earn five times as much as they could in their homeland, it's a sign that literally no problems could possibly exist in that country.

 

I meant they're coming over here to get medical treatment, I wasn't talking about immigration. Edit: Btw, my healthcare is fine, and so is most people's.

 

 

Healthcare system and being able to get good medical treatment aren't same thing even though they are connected.

 

As healthcare system is usually used when people are talking about people's ability access medical treatment they need.

 

So country may have world best medical treatment facilities, but if only handful people are actually able to use them country's healthcare system maybe bad for most of the citizens of that country. Meaning that if rich foreigners come and buy those treatments that most people in country can't access it really don't tell anything about country's healthcare system.

[Wrath of Dagon]

 

Edit: Btw, my healthcare is fine, and so is most people's.

 

Edit: You know, probably just a waste of breath. Living in a different world, I suppose. 

 

Edit 2, where I decide to waste breathe.

 

I'm not fine with this: http://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2017/04/20/524774195/what-country-spends-the-most-and-least-on-health-care-per-person

 

No one in the US should be "fine" with the costs of healthcare. We are all one emergency away from catastrophic medical bills that can bankrupt all but the richest of us.

 

We're not all one emergency away, because most of us have health insurance. You're exaggerating same as most people on this topic. Our system is far from perfect, but one reason the costs are high is that Americans are demanding and spoiled. We won't accept long waiting times or rationing.

 

Edit: From your chart, the closest in spending to us are Norway, Luxembourg and Switzerland. What's the common denominator? These are all very rich countries.

Edited April 21, 2017 by Wrath of Dagon

[Hurlshort]

We're not all one emergency away, because most of us have health insurance. 

 

 

This is completely false. The vast majority of health insurance covers a percentage, and it has a yearly cap. If you end up in the hospital for a month you will literally be drowning in debt.

[Guard Dog]

 

We're not all one emergency away, because most of us have health insurance. 

 

 

This is completely false. The vast majority of health insurance covers a percentage, and it has a yearly cap. If you end up in the hospital for a month you will literally be drowning in debt.

 

Hmmm... unless your health insurance is drastically different than mine that cap is your out of pocket maximum. For example, my insurance has an out of pocket maximum of $10k. Although I do get some discounts and benefits for using doctors and labs "in network" I'm responsible for all of my healthcare up to $10k. After that I'm fully covered. That's the way most of them work in my experience. It's unusual for someone to hit the "big number" so it's a pretty good deal for the insurance companies even if 30-40% of policies go over.

[Hurlshort]

Ah, looks like the ACA ended yearly and lifetime limits on coverage, that is good news.

 

Still, that 10K is nothing to shake a stick at, and that does not include deductibles, which continue to rise.

 

My cap is actually much lower, at 1k a year. But that is for each individual in the family, so we've met to cap for my wife but we could still hit it for other family members. Of course that is on top of the monthly $700 I pay and the few thousand my employer kicks in. Also prescriptions and dental seem to be on different plans.

 

Here is some data that Kaiser put together: http://kff.org/health-costs/report/the-burden-of-medical-debt-results-from-the-kaiser-family-foundationnew-york-times-medical-bills-survey/

[Guard Dog]

Ah, looks like the ACA ended yearly and lifetime limits on coverage, that is good news.

 

Still, that 10K is nothing to shake a stick at, and that does not include deductibles, which continue to rise.

 

My cap is actually much lower, at 1k a year. But that is for each individual in the family, so we've met to cap for my wife but we could still hit it for other family members. Of course that is on top of the monthly $700 I pay and the few thousand my employer kicks in. Also prescriptions and dental seem to be on different plans.

 

Here is some data that Kaiser put together: http://kff.org/health-costs/report/the-burden-of-medical-debt-results-from-the-kaiser-family-foundationnew-york-times-medical-bills-survey/

Actually there was a bill before the ACA that did that too. It was signed around 2003 IIRC. The ACA nullified some of it's provisions which is why it was added in. I forget the name of it. They offer better plans but I took this one with the additional carrot of a one time $1k in my HSA. Plus since it's a high deductible plan I can use my HSA with no tax penalty without going over the "big number". Dental insurance now.... they all suck. Some more than others. They actually do have coverage caps and they are pretty low. It's enough to make you want to brush your teeth right now.

[Hurlshort]

This is probably a better link for the Kaiser study, gets into the details of people who struggle with medical bills: http://kff.org/report-section/the-burden-of-medical-debt-section-1-who-has-medical-bill-problems-and-what-are-the-contributing-factors/

 

I'm part of this group, by the way. Every year someone in our family has had something unexpected that has cost us a few thousand dollars in medical bills. It's always a strain. It doesn't bankrupt us, but makes it difficult to set anything aside.

Edited April 21, 2017 by Hurlshot