Dragon Age 2

[Volourn]

Costs, loosts, whatever word you lose it don't matter. DA more than covered itself and made a healthy profit unless there's soemthing we don't. It (along with ME2) are BIO's most successful games. It doesn't need DA2 to 'recoup' anything.

[Morgoth]

Nah, I think NWN was Bio's most succesful game, in terms of head-count/profit ratio.

[Monte Carlo]

Nah, I think NWN was Bio's most succesful game, in terms of head-count/profit ratio.

 

I think you're right IIRC.

[Volourn]

No. DA and ME2 are BIO's most successful games. Just deal with it.

[Tale]

Now I'm imagining Volo with sunglasses.

[Monte Carlo]

No. DA and ME2 are BIO's most successful games. Just deal with it.

 

I'm trying Vol, honestly I'm trying ::sobs::

[Nepenthe]

I guess it's not even worth getting into absolute profits (which DAO and ME2 top) and relative profit ($ return per $ spent). Am guessing that the latter was significantly higher for ME2.

[Hassat Hunter]

Well, I really like DA:O. Tried the DA2 demo and... OMG... What have they done? WHY BIO WHY?

 

* BINK movies with broken sound.

* Horrible combat with abilities that recharge almost instantly. Back-stab can be cast once you pop up. How can enemies hit us if we're behind them 24/7? (and seeing how the 'actual' section evade has the same cooldown I assume same is true for backstab)

* More BINK's with soundissues

* Longest loading time... ever! (I thought it crashed!)

* Horrible voice for Male Hawke . Why couldn't we have stayed mute?

* What's the point of level 1 if you start 7/10th way in it? Hopefully that's just for the demo.

* Horrible UI. Having to select character - one you desire - abilities - then an ability tree just to read one possible ability for purchase (nope, not all are readable easily like the DA:O UI allowed)? And that's just one example.

* Why are resistances and attributes 2 screens instead of 1? *confused*

* I want more zoom

* Oooh, I don't even need to fight. But what the hell was that cutscene about. Especially if the blondish girl is nowhere to be seen after it. What the hell BioWare?

* Typical, now it DOES crashes on me.

 

Yup, uninstalled and convinced I should go for The Witcher II instead. Or The Dragon Saga (off to trying that demo now)...

 

@ Volourn; If DA was so successful, why did they rape it like this?

[Volourn]

Because of you, and your crying.

 

 

P.S. the changes in DA2 from DA1 are pretty minimal for the most part. DA2 is DA1's sequel. It plays, acts, and reads like it.

[Zoraptor]

I guess it's not even worth getting into absolute profits (which DAO and ME2 top)

Per EA (a somewhat more reliable source than volo et alia parroting how ME2 sold a billionty billion copies!!! FACT!!!) ME2 had only sold 1.6 million units after three months, a full million less than DAO had at a similar time. I'd suspect either Baldurs Gate game/ NWN or KOTOR made more absolute profit even if it was distributed to a lot more parties as licenced IP/ publisher deals since the teams that made them were far smaller than those that made any of Bioware's recent games.

[Nepenthe]

The whole "the beginning is exaggerated" part seems to have been a bit too much for poor old Hassat.

 

So far agreeing on the zoom and hawke's VO, but willing to give the latter the benefit of the doubt.

[entrerix]

the first five minutes of the demo are so mindbendingly bad that if someone didnt know it was like that intentionally as a joke they might just immediately uninstall and demand a refund.

 

the camera angle I assume will be one of the first things modded, fixing that, i'm more than willing to give the rest of the game the benefit of the doubt as well

[Meshugger]

The important question isn't whether it's aggreably profitable or not.... but how much more profit they can squeeze out of it...

 

It's a capitalist business.

The key concept is "how do we make more money" not "hey, we made profit, that's good enough."

 

That's entirely possible. It also depends on what the CEO of EA has promised for its shareholders on what kind of ROI they should expect from their Bioware division. If the bar is set to high, then more cost-effective measures will be implemented.

 

Back to DA2 though, seems like you can finish it pretty quickly:

 

 

From the looks of it, it seems like the screenshot was taken from PS3-version.

Edited March 5, 2011 by Meshugger

[sorophx]

two evenings? bleh

[Gorgon]

They should have spent more money on promotion instead of showing people what a load of crap they are actually selling.

Edited March 5, 2011 by Gorgon

[aries101]

Baldur's Gate did not sell that well - in the beginning. BG2 did not either. However, after 5 or 10 years or more, BG2 has sold, I think, 2,5- 3,0 millions? 1,6 millions during the first 6-8 weeks is not (that) bad. More will buy ME2 copies at some point. [interestingly, though ME2 is now already an EA Classic....I was like when I saw this....]. Ray M. and Greg Z. has said once (jokingly?) that they'll need to sell 10 million copies. This means coming close to the sold units for Call of Duty - or is that really shipped units? As Bioware and EA will be paid when the game is shipped to stores.

 

Today, however, it seems that games, like movies, need to have an ROI (return of investment) during the first 4-6, or maybe 8, weeks after the game's first release period. Such is the way of the market, apparantly.

[Niten_Ryu]

Bioware boards are like CoC RPG insanity checks. More you read, more likely you'll get brain damage

 

I was certain that MMOG boards circa 2002 would forever hold the world record in that area, but I was wrong. I watched some live stream earlier but even that got boring. Guy didn't bother with any strategies or tactics (ok, game doesn't require any or support 'em so I don't really know who to blame here) and just rushed away. Story didn't feel anything special and dialogue just made me want to turn sound off. Now I'm begining to doubt if this game is even worth Steam holiday sale price. I think I'll wait some let's play run with good commentary, hopefully there's something to be salvaged out of this wreck.

 

That complite run time is most likely accurate, especially if you play normal difficulty.

[HoonDing]

There's not even a need to wait for a Let's Play. There's a thread on the Bioboards where the entire game is spoiled.

[Nepenthe]

I guess it's not even worth getting into absolute profits (which DAO and ME2 top)

Per EA (a somewhat more reliable source than volo et alia parroting how ME2 sold a billionty billion copies!!! FACT!!!) ME2 had only sold 1.6 million units after three months, a full million less than DAO had at a similar time. I'd suspect either Baldurs Gate game/ NWN or KOTOR made more absolute profit even if it was distributed to a lot more parties as licenced IP/ publisher deals since the teams that made them were far smaller than those that made any of Bioware's recent games.

I'm not exactly sure how BG, NWN or KOTOR are relevant to the question of DAO (probably) having had an astronomical budget? Since I get the feeling you're trying to disagree with me, but the statistics, while interesting, aren't exactly relevant from the "theories why EA is pushing DA sequel out so quickly".

 

The prevalent ones being A) they're EVIL b1) DAO cost too much and b2) didn't work as a DLC platform. )

[greylord]

I guess it's not even worth getting into absolute profits (which DAO and ME2 top)

Per EA (a somewhat more reliable source than volo et alia parroting how ME2 sold a billionty billion copies!!! FACT!!!) ME2 had only sold 1.6 million units after three months, a full million less than DAO had at a similar time. I'd suspect either Baldurs Gate game/ NWN or KOTOR made more absolute profit even if it was distributed to a lot more parties as licenced IP/ publisher deals since the teams that made them were far smaller than those that made any of Bioware's recent games.

 

Funny seeing everyone and their dog was saying they sold more than this after the first MONTH (some would say week) of ME2's release. I'll even give several sources

 

http://www.1up.com/news/mass-effect-2-week-sales

 

http://www.mcvuk.com/news/37369/Mass-Effect-sales-top-2m

 

No matter how many times you repeat this, doesn't make it any more true...still is false from what I can tell. Of course those sales are related to those copies shipped verses those reported sold via retail...which is where you 1.6 mil copies come in...but in retail ME2 sold MORE than DA:O over the same time period...so your argument is still rather defunct.

 

In PC sales during that period ME2 sold ~600K copies with Xbox360 selling ~900K copies...and were listed in the top 3 selling games for both and overall. DA:O did not make an appearance in the top 3 during that time period. (edit: Though DA:O was #1 right after it's release for a platform...the period of ME2's release it DA:O didn't make an appearance in top 3

 

For more information....ME2 had shipped/sold 2/3 the number of copies within the first month that DA:O had done already. OF course the releases were so close that basically they were almost overlapping in sales...but DA:O had the benefit of HOLIDAY sales which ME2 did not...and made ME2 even a bigger shock in some ways.

 

When comparing RETAIL sales for the same amounts of time (a quarter after DA:O was released compared to ME2 was released) for US NUMBERS...the amount appears that DA:O sold 1.3 retail copies (vs. shipped, which was around 3.2 million...at the same period which was ME2's 2 million) compared to when the equivalent time had passed for ME2 being 1.6 (though my math shows 1.5) million copies sold at retail.

 

We don't know full numbers of foreign sales...so with those included it's possible DA:O actually did sell more than ME2...but only EA and Bioware would know that answer. From what they've been doing with DA2....the indications are that ME2 actually sold more worldwide than DA:O...but that's only an educated guess.

Edited March 6, 2011 by greylord

[Zoraptor]

Dude, it's from an official EA shareholder release. There's no question as to its accuracy.

 

[Edit links, first showing that DAO shipped 2.7million, second showing they then shipped an extra 500k, illustrating the fact that at the very least the vast majority of the 2.7 million must have sold:

 

http://kotaku.com/5467174/left-4-dead-2-se...oses-82-million

 

"Leading video game developer BioWare™, a division of Electronic Arts Inc. (NASDAQ: ERTS), announced today that Dragon Age™: Origins has sold-in over 3.2 million* units worldwide."]

 

Sell in vs sell through. Unsurprisingly games journalists have little to no clue as to the difference hence the breathless "blah sold a billionty billion copies in one day!!!!" headlines. If you change shipped to sold then you can turn anything from Daikatana on up into great successes. Ultimately the only way to guage actual success is by the sell through.

 

I'm not exactly sure how BG, NWN or KOTOR are relevant to the question of DAO (probably) having had an astronomical budget? Since I get the feeling you're trying to disagree with me, but the statistics, while interesting, aren't exactly relevant from the "theories why EA is pushing DA sequel out so quickly". original.gif

 

The prevalent ones being A) they're EVIL b1) DAO cost too much and b2) didn't work as a DLC platform. wink.gif)

 

I'm not exactly disagreeing, just pointing out that you can get an awful lot of protection against a big budget if you're selling well- movie wise something like Titanic comes to mind, games wise you don't mind a GTAesque $100 million budget if you're also selling a GTAesque 15 million copies.

 

On the subject of the 'rush', I'm actually of the opinion that it isn't being unduly rushed, as I think it's clear that a significant proportion of the DAO team started work on the sequel pretty much straight after the PC version stopped being developed, six months prior to the release. Which gives almost exactly a two year development cycle- not unreasonable for a sequel.

Edited March 6, 2011 by Zoraptor

[Volourn]

"Back to DA2 though, seems like you can finish it pretty quickly: "

 

*shrug* Tghat's true for pretty much every EVERY rpg ever. Heck, Fo can be betaen in less than an hour. EASY.

 

 

Anyways, ME2 and DA have both sold over 3mil. Just a fact of life so get over it.

 

 

"Baldur's Gate did not sell that well - in the beginning. BG2 did not either."

 

yes. yes, they did. Did they sell DA/ME2 numbers/ No, but sales were a different beast back then when 1-2 mil copes = big success. Now, you likely need 2mil copies to be consiered one if not 3. Hek, JE sold 1.5-2mil copies but has no sequel yet even thoguh BIO had amde it clear theyw er einetrested in doing one but why do a JE for 2mil copies sold instead of a DA2 or ME3 for 3mil? Does. not. compute.

[greylord]

Dude, it's from an official EA shareholder release. There's no question as to its accuracy.

 

[Edit links, first showing that DAO shipped 2.7million, second showing they then shipped an extra 500k, illustrating the fact that at the very least the vast majority of the 2.7 million must have sold:

 

Dude, and you are comparing the shipped to sale through. That number (2.7 million) is comparable to at least 3 million for ME2 (and they shipped even MORE later...some estimate upwards of that). For actual sales you are comparing it's 1.3 million to 1.6 million...DUDE.

 

I might not be disagreeing with you on your point, but at least be honest about what you want backing you up, or you aren't going to get those who DO disagree with you to listen at all.

 

What we don't know is how foreign sales went overall. From the response on what they are doing with DA2 (on that I DO like what they are doing...call me just too casual of a gamer...except for the entire call home to authenticate and then call home everytime you are online deal) I'd say that ME2 did better and they are taking cues from that...but when we get to that I'll admit...that's totally me guessing and could be WRONG as day.

 

I've heard (not from EA at all, or even official Bioware statements, or even NON-Official Bioware statements) that Bioware DID say DA:O was the best selling game they ever had (which could be where the foreign markets come in) in the Summer of last year...but the US numbers don't seem to indicate that.

Edited March 6, 2011 by greylord

[Gorth]

Finally got around to play the demo a bit. Wow... just wow...

 

the first five minutes of the demo are so mindbendingly bad that if someone didnt know it was like that intentionally as a joke they might just immediately uninstall and demand a refund.

I know the demo is free, otherwise I would ask for a refund for the 30 minutes of my life.

 

Well, I really like DA:O. Tried the DA2 demo and... OMG... What have they done? WHY BIO WHY?

So, I wasn't the only one...

 

Horrible combat

That was my first and still lingering impression. I fear that this game is going to focus more on it's bad combat that on other things.

 

Horrible UI

A matter of taste. I didn't like it either.

 

I want more zoom

Beg to differ, I was frantically trying to zoom out, wrestling with my mouse, trying to get some kind of overview of the mess going on on the screen. Bye bye tactical combat >_

 

I guess I'll never figure out now if the Gorthling spawn that Morrighan ran off with is going to be one half swamp with, one half Gorth and one half old dragon essence

[Mera]

Anybody know how does the autoattack work on consoles?

I read somewhere that there is no global switch, instead you have to activate it from menu for every single enemy. Is this true?