Cheaters!

[Volourn]

O RLY?

 

Those old NES games were easy for anyone I have ever seen play them. Easy.

 

This is simply a fact proven time and time again by allowing kiddies to play them.

 

 

"Hell an 8 y/o would probably have a problem beating them."

 

Nope.

 

 

"And despite what your ego would tell you, you aren't the center of the universe. Nor are you typical of a gamer of any kind."

 

This sin't about me. It's about how easy these games were for anyone i've sene play it.

[LadyCrimson]

I've never minded cheats for single-player use. How someone wants to use their game, that they've paid for, is no concern of mine. It's only when they start being used in on-line game worlds where cheats can seriously affect 'legit' players (particuarly game-world economy-wise) that I become annoyed with them.

 

If these "achievements" are about on-line game status in some fashion or another, then I'd be against people being able to use cheats to gain them. But as Tigranes mentioned, I don't see why they cannot detect built-in cheat codes useage, at least, and make players/characters/savegames who use them unable to compete for these 'achievements' or titles.

[Xard]

O RLY?

 

Those old NES games were easy for anyone I have ever seen play them. Easy.

 

This is simply a fact proven time and time again by allowing kiddies to play them.

 

 

"Hell an 8 y/o would probably have a problem beating them."

 

Nope.

 

 

"And despite what your ego would tell you, you aren't the center of the universe. Nor are you typical of a gamer of any kind."

 

This sin't about me. It's about how easy these games were for anyone i've sene play it.

 

 

*sigh*

 

Bring me 2 years old who can beat one of those very sadistic old games.

 

And even better question, did you check my link at all

[Calax]

For those who don't know, the way achievements work is that during you gameplay period if something happens (for example, in dead rising if you kill 53000 or so zombies and clear out the entire town) you get an achievement that gives you points.I'm not saying that I know how everything works between the devs and Microsoft, but there has been a distinct lack of cheats in games put out for the more recent generation of conosles. It was my supposition that this was caused by the fact that achievements exsisted and in order to get more money/support out of microsoft, devs would try and jam as many achievements into their game as they can imagine and so as to not invalidate the achievements they take out the codes.

 

PC games don't have this problem and often codes will be included that have some... interesting easter eggs (like for example the Company of heroes big head mode... yes that's right, big head mode with proper physics for those giant noggins.)

[Hell Kitty]

Though I"m not sure how it all works in particular, youv'e got to wonder why they dont' make it so that saved games which haved used cheats are diqualified from Achievements.

 

Saint's Row does that. If you input cheats using the in-game cellphone and save, you'll never earn achievements with that savegame.

 

Anyway, some achievements are pretty lame, like getting 50 points in Oblivion just for exiting the tutorial dungeon.

[Tigranes]

Hey now, that's like a "Congratulations, you bought our game!".

 

If Saint's Row does that then there should be no problem at all. I wonder if the issue with cheat codes lie elsewhere. Also are we talking exclusively about 'natural' cheatcodes? Because maybe this is just to get GameShark and other paraphernalia sales up.

[metadigital]

"Age =/= skill"

 

Sorry; but games that can be beat by a 2 year with no help from an adult are easy.

Right. I'll beleive you when you actually do what you say: come back when you get beat the original Pacman. Then tell me how easy it was.

It took almost twenty years, but on July 3, 1999 for the first time ever, a perfect score of 3,333,360 was achieved on Pac-Man by Billy Mitchell at the Funspot Family Fun Center, Weirs Beach, New Hampshire. To achieve this, Billy had to eat every single bonus prize and every possible blue ghost in all 256 levels of the game - a feat which took him over six hours to complete. Not only that but he didn't lose a single life. It was the first ever perfect game of Pac-Man.

 

On completing the game, Billy announced "I never have to play that darn game again". He had been playing for seventeen years.

[greylord]

Meta:

 

Your not dead on in your assumptions, but then your not completely off base.

 

My main problem is that with the advent of the Achievements cheat codes and such have been all but eradicated in order to allow for achievements that would be invalidated by cheats. And while the idea is FANTASTIC for fostering desire in your system (by having people match their gamer scores against one another) It's also what's leading the charge to remove any method of easy victory other than grinding your bum off early on so your a good sight stronger than most of your opponents.

 

Volo:

there is not a two year old in this world who can actually play a game of the complexity of those old NES games and expect to beat them. Hell an 8 y/o would probably have a problem beating them. The easing of game difficulties was done in an attempt to get more people to get into games. And despite what your ego would tell you, you aren't the center of the universe. Nor are you typical of a gamer of any kind.

 

I know a two year old that is okay with Mario, and I know some 5 year olds that could beat it (dang it, I know I introduced them a little early to video games, but these kids are gaming LORDS compared to me in what they can do...this 5 year old is AMAZING in the video games). They are really good with the older games that are NOT RPGs. Not so good with some of the newer games that have a little more complexities to them however and a few more buttons for them to push and figure out.

 

I have no problems with cheats in a SP game.

 

However, my suggestion...don't play the 5 year old in a Street Fighter type game, he has no mercy, and will spank your fighter hard.

 

PS: I don't think you could beat PacMan, it seems to go on forever. I've never reached the end at least...being Mr. Obvious I suppose.

Edited August 8, 2007 by greylord

[Tale]

If cheat codes were still proliferating as they once were, I'd have beaten Condemned: Criminal Origins long ago. I hate being so ridiculously tense all the time and often cheat my way through scary games.

 

I cheated through:

Resident Evil

Resident Evil 2

Doom 3 (but, I blame this on Doom 3 being too long)

Resident Evil Remake (using the infinite grenade glitch)

 

I have not cheated through:

Resident Evil 3 (they started adding action elements)

Resident Evil Code Veronica (You could kill anything with just the knife)

Resident Evil 4 (almost full action game at this point)

Silent Hill 1-4 (and have never gotten even halfway through one)

Eternal Darkness (and have not beaten)

Call of Cthulhu: Dark Corners of the Earth (and have not beaten)

Condemned: Criminal Origins (almost have beaten!)

FEAR (action game, barely scary when you understand it)

 

What I'm pointing out here is that, for me, cheat codes help ensure I can finish a game, experiencing the story and mechanics (even if muted mechanics). It's becoming common knowledge in gaming that relatively few players seem to complete any individual game. I think encouraging cheat codes to be included can result in more players being able to finish. I think that the more players that finish, and the more the developers can trust the players to finish, the more effort they'll be willing to put into the end game. This is a train of logic I like to follow for "cheat codes = good ending."

Edited August 8, 2007 by Tale

[Deraldin]

If cheat codes were still proliferating as they once were, I'd have beaten Condemned: Criminal Origins long ago. I hate being so ridiculously tense all the time and often cheat my way through scary games.

 

I've done that with several games. I've managed to work my way down from God Mode to multiplying ammo capacity by 10. Shotguns with 500 ammo clips makes me feel brave.

[Pope]

One link tells more than 1000 words

 

Although that is VERY retarted, I have to admit

 

That was the funniest movie I've seen linked in a long time.

 

HAHAHA, OMG, that was so hilarious and so familiar at the same time!!!

 

There's one thing he didn't know though... there is a way to avoid all the obstacles and move through the entire level by walking on the ceiling. It's amazing I remembered that after all this time...

that was in Mario Land on Gameboy iirc

 

 

I used to be a huge cheater when I was a kid. Never played through a game without. Nowadays, the only cheats I use are weapon and health cheats in GTA when I'm rampaging just for the hell of it. And even then it takes all the challenge - and thus fun - out of the game. At least to me.

 

Oh yes, and I tend to use Shadowkeeper on the occasional rerun through BG to alter npc's classes and such, but that has nothing to do with overcoming difficulties.

[Darth Drabek]

For those who don't know, the way achievements work is that during you gameplay period if something happens (for example, in dead rising if you kill 53000 or so zombies and clear out the entire town) you get an achievement that gives you points.

 

So what is the point of accumulating these "Achievement points" anyway? Bragging rights on Xbox LIVE? Does collecting X number of achievement allow you to download online content you'd normally have to pay for?

 

Now here's my two cents: Cheating should always be an option. Hell, I never would have been able to finish BG2 without cheating. I shouldn't be denied access to the ending of a great story just because I got sick of restoring my level-drained characters, then finding somewhere to rest, then repeating the process again.

 

Interestingly enough, I was able to get to the very end of BG1 without cheating. But the point is, I play those games for the story, not the challenge.

 

Fast forward several years: The KOTOR games were much easier. That may be because the developers were making a game with much broader appeal. So, they had to create a game in which players wouldn't be forced to start from scratch if they gimped their character out of ignorance of the game's rules.

 

Of course, there are exceptions. I hear the new Ninja Gaiden and the God of War games can be ball-bustingly difficult at times. But I think if the growing prevalence of online gaming makes cheat codes taboo, we may continue to see single-player games turn into cakewalks.

Edited August 9, 2007 by Darth Drabek

[Tale]

For those who don't know, the way achievements work is that during you gameplay period if something happens (for example, in dead rising if you kill 53000 or so zombies and clear out the entire town) you get an achievement that gives you points.

 

So what is the point of accumulating these "Achievement points" anyway? Bragging rights on Xbox LIVE?

It is Microsoft's way of capitalizing on human competitiveness.

[taks]

oh, that's a riot!

 

taks

[Musopticon?]

Well, there's an achievement for playing Gears of War online for over 1000 hours. I think it was something like "go out for a while" or "get a life".

 

Go brag to the fora with that!

Edited August 9, 2007 by Musopticon?

[Bokishi]

Yeah I cheat, but not until after I beat the game

 

Doom 3 is an exception, it was so long ass

Edited August 9, 2007 by Bokishi

[Calax]

For those who don't know, the way achievements work is that during you gameplay period if something happens (for example, in dead rising if you kill 53000 or so zombies and clear out the entire town) you get an achievement that gives you points.

 

So what is the point of accumulating these "Achievement points" anyway? Bragging rights on Xbox LIVE?

It is Microsoft's way of capitalizing on human competitiveness.

actually if you earned enough fast enough you could concievably become a beta guy for the 360 (One of the guys at my store has a friend who had this happen with 10k Achievement points)

[Blarghagh]

Honestly, I've cheated my way through some games. Most notably, I cheated myself all the way through WarCraft III when it came out. I finished it cheatless a later time, but the first time I just wanted to know the story as quickly as possible.

[Deraldin]

Honestly, I've cheated my way through some games. Most notably, I cheated myself all the way through WarCraft III when it came out. I finished it cheatless a later time, but the first time I just wanted to know the story as quickly as possible.

 

 

I did the same thing with Warcraft 3, although I did manage to play through the human campaign before I started cheating. I thought the story was interesting, but the game play just didn't hook me. I wonder how widespread this was with WC3. I know that at least 2 people that I know in real life did the same thing.

[Krookie]

Most 360 games now days don't have cheats. I wish Dead Rising had cheats. That would make the ultimate game even more ultimate.

[karka]

Honestly, I've cheated my way through some games. Most notably, I cheated myself all the way through WarCraft III when it came out. I finished it cheatless a later time, but the first time I just wanted to know the story as quickly as possible.

 

 

I did the same thing with Warcraft 3, although I did manage to play through the human campaign before I started cheating. I thought the story was interesting, but the game play just didn't hook me. I wonder how widespread this was with WC3. I know that at least 2 people that I know in real life did the same thing.

 

Same here.

[Krookie]

Crackdown's cheats are fun. There's a glitch, when using the cheats, that lets you get the Supercar up to 400MPH.

[Oerwinde]

Honestly, I've cheated my way through some games. Most notably, I cheated myself all the way through WarCraft III when it came out. I finished it cheatless a later time, but the first time I just wanted to know the story as quickly as possible.

 

 

I did the same thing with Warcraft 3, although I did manage to play through the human campaign before I started cheating. I thought the story was interesting, but the game play just didn't hook me. I wonder how widespread this was with WC3. I know that at least 2 people that I know in real life did the same thing.

 

Same here.

 

Put me down as another. I played through with cheats to see the story, then played through again without. I do that with a lot of Blizzard games. Makes me wish they would make an actual RPG.

[Blarghagh]

Well, StarCraft II is in some parts looking to be almost like "practice" for an RPG. According to the Single Player Demo Video, between RTS missions you basically do the same thing you did between planets in Knights of the Old Republic. Hang out on your space-ship and talk to the people there, complete with dialogue trees!

 

Anyway, I think the thing about WarCraft III was that it was an RTS game but driven by an RPG story with RPG elements. It felt like an RPG, but it didn't have enough RPG stuff to support that, basically making it not worth playing, and the RTS elements barely even appeared in the campaigns. Besides, in StarCraft you got to fight every faction in every campaign. That was one of the things that bothered me in WarCraft III. As humans, I never got to fight the Night Elves, and only a rabble of orcs who didn't have a proper base. Nor did I get to fight other humans. I never really got to explore the races in the campaigns.

Edited August 13, 2007 by TrueNeutral

[St_Jimmy]

While pc gamers have always been able to hack and slash their way though code in order to come up with a trainer or other little toy to make themselves into god incarnate (which several games have said you are but you can still be killed by your average human with a knife... wierd) Console gamers have recently watched as the number of cheats on their systems get slashed again and again (particularly on the 360) And while there are going to be some people who scream in happiness that others won't be able to "illegitimately" get through a game without serious know how (like turning your XboX into a portable computer... of a sort), I think that it's kind of a bad thing. While people won't be able to use the codes to hack and slash their way to fame and fortune online, they can still get what they feel is a fulfilling experience by beating things up faster than a semi can destroy a picket fence.

 

Now I've picked out Consoles in particular because in the console wars Microsoft has recently come out with the idea that people should be rated on what they do and given a number of points for doing a particular stunt or stupid stupid thing, Achievements. This effectively kills cheats because if a company puts in a god mode cheat, they won't be able to have a 'damage taken' 'damage regenerated/healed' achievement and thus ultimately lower the point value of the game. And in a competitive world like ours (earth... not gaming) people will probably only play the game AFTER they've exhausted every other source of achievement points that they can.

 

I will admit I am a bit selfish in posting that cheats be brought back to games. I have ADD, and if I retrace my steps in an RPG or find myself facing guys who put up a hard fight when everything else I've seen in the entire game died as soon as I administered the Fingerpoke of Doom! to them, I tend to just flat out stop playing. This also goes for grinding like a maniac to get a team of people up to par because the leveling system either A) doesn't give people in reserve XP, just arbitrarly raises their levels when you start pushing a limit B) your characters in the party start to gain 1/2 again as much xp as those outside your party C) theres just so many people that your army of followers can be from lvl 8 to lvl 72. or D) the difference between two dungeons in terms of levels is so dramatic that you find yourself using every res item and spell at least once within five fights. (That last one usually happens in JRPG's where you get a period of "hey find everything you can and do it before the final dungeon" time, then you charge down the dungeon only to find yourself facing guys that are 10-20 levels higher than the last major fight you had) (oh and C only really applies to Suikoden but I wish more RPG's would have that many possible members.)

 

 

Thoughts?

 

Cheating is fine by me, as long as it is not multiplayer. It's quite useful when one wants to get through a game to experience the plot and not necessarily the gameplay (I.E. Deus Ex Invisible War..... I did not like the gameplay at all (MEGHHH) )

 

Yet I find it great that cheating is being slowly eradicated. If you cheat in a game like F.E.A.R it completely ruins the experience of the intense firefights that occur. It ruins the game.

 

And don't we all have an immense feeling of satisfaction when we finally get over that big hump?