The New Cinema and Movie Thread

[LadyCrimson]

In 10-15 years or so Thor will be "too old". I wonder who will replace him in the reboot.  

I remember Brent Spiner wanting/happy to kill off Data because he knew he was getting too old and didn't want to be sagging and wrinkled in gold paint.

[Bartimaeus]

25 minutes ago, Amentep said:

Yeah, the German version is supposed to be better, but I had time to watch the short English version.  I wish the French version wasn't lost, as it'd be fun to see all three versions. I was just a victim of time though with respect to the German version.

I don't think there will ever be consensus on Riefenstahl, whose works were acclaimed at the time for their technical skill even if their role as Nazi propaganda (and thus her role as well) makes them notorious.  I thought Brooks had met Riefenstahl when she was in Germany as well?  I know G. W. Pabst (Die Büchse der Pandora, Tagebuch einer Verlorenen) had been the co-director of Die weiße Hölle vom Piz Palü and they all date to 1929.

No idea re: the two of them actually meeting - just know I read that they both worked with G. W. Pabst, and I watched both Pandora's Box and Diary of a Lost Girl not too long ago. Like I said, I don't know nothing about nothing, .

[majestic]

5 minutes ago, LadyCrimson said:

In 10-15 years or so Thor will be "too old". I wonder who will replace him in the reboot.  

I remember Brent Spiner wanting/happy to kill off Data because he knew he was getting too old and didn't want to be sagging and wrinkled in gold paint.

Now he's just playing Dr. Soong in every incarnation of Star Dreck. Ancestors, lost offspring, who knows what else they'll come up with. Eventually he's going to play a Dr. Soong who cosplays as Data.

Edited April 20, 2022 by majestic

[Amentep]

1 hour ago, LadyCrimson said:

In 10-15 years or so Thor will be "too old". I wonder who will replace him in the reboot.  

I remember Brent Spiner wanting/happy to kill off Data because he knew he was getting too old and didn't want to be sagging and wrinkled in gold paint.

They have a few comic based options.

In the comics (and from memory) Thor has been temporarily replaced by Beta-Ray Bill, Erik Masterson and Jane Foster.  Since they're doing Jane Foster now, they could still use Erik later (I doubt we'll see Beta-Ray Bill as the main star, just because he'd be a main character needing major effects work, but I've been wrong before) which would allow for a new Thor without restarting the characters.  Also they've had Thor die along with the remaining Norse gods resulting in the rebirth of the gods in the comics (restarting the cycle of origin-gods-ragnarok) which could allow them to recast him and all of Norse gods if needed (including the villains) whenever they need to.  

There's a few other esoteric replacements they could (but are unlikely to) use as well.  Then again Marvel has a LOT of characters, and could just retire the character and replace with a completely different one as well.

Edited April 20, 2022 by Amentep
Had the wrong Jane

[Gfted1]

I wonder how theyre going to remake Mjolnir? All the dwarves but one are dead, but I guess that doesnt really stop anything since they were able to make Stormbreaker with just one dwarf.

[Amentep]

14 minutes ago, Gfted1 said:

I wonder how theyre going to remake Mjolnir? All the dwarves but one are dead, but I guess that doesnt really stop anything since they were able to make Stormbreaker with just one dwarf.

Its been destroyed in the comics a few times, and has been repaired by the Celestials, by Doctor Strange and Thor (who was channeling the Odin-Force), by Surtur, by Thor again using God Tempest (a galaxy sized galactic storm) and by Angels.  I think once the hammer repaired itself.

[LadyCrimson]

I'm sure they could come up with some reason re: Thor if they really were keen to. It's all magic anyway. I just wonder if they will.
I do like that actor as Thor and would miss him in that role - he fits my notion of the chr. quite well. He's the 2nd reason those Thor films were tolerable/I might want to at least check out the new one. It's kinda like not being able to see anyone but Hugh as Wolverine now, or something.

As for Brent Spiner ... yeah, he's one of those actors that really shone in a single role and really isn't all that (or isn't offered any good roles later) in anything else and then just keeps reprising that one role or something similar forever. I like the man (he's rather funny/snarky and can sing fairly well) but such is the acting life.

[Amentep]

It's funny, I knew Spiner as Bob Wheeler from Night Court (Bob was the head of a rural family that re-occured on the show) so mentally I've always seen him as a comedic actor really.

[LadyCrimson]

I remember that Night Court chr/role but didn't recognize "Data" as being that same actor until it was mentioned in articles.
Those few skits he did for YouTube on his channel were kinda funny.

One time years ago I commented on Twitter that something he said sounded like what my husband would say and he replied that he was my husband. I don't remember exactly, just the "be paranoid who you're really talking to on the 'net" type of snark. I wonder if he still Twitter's.

[Raithe]

It's kind of fun to look back on some things, I still think it was a crying shame Threshold never made it beyond those first 13 episodes back in 2005... 

Carla Gugino as the lead, Brent Spiner as the slightly hippy medical doctor, and Peter Dinklage as a womanising, gambling, mathematician and linguist, Rob Benedict as the nervous astrophysicist, Brian Van Holt as the solider type, and Charles S. Dutton as the gruff government agent type... 

All wrapped up in something a little bit X-Files, a little bit Fringe, a little bit V...

[Zoraptor]

Named after a bad Voyager episode and run by Brannon Braga. No thanks. Honestly though, I remember liking Threshold a fair bit, and far worse ideas/ series lasted a lot longer.

About the only thing I can remember Spiner being in apart from TNG was that fairly recent Robert Kirkman series ?The Outsider? (actually 'Outcast', after checking). I even watched that Dreadful Penny Dreadful spin off series and only realised/ remembered he was in it when I was checking the name of Outcast.

[Lexx]

Watched The Batman yesterday. Truth told, I'm not sure what to think of it. The style and atmosphere was pretty good, imo. I liked that a lot. But it also felt really long ... when I thought it is about to be done, suddenly it kept going for almost another hour.

Also there is a bit of a weird dissonance in style, because on the one side they are trying to show a more "down to earth" Batman, who doesn't have the kind of super powers he has in other movies -- he doesn't fly around the city, he travels with a motorcycle and civilian clothes, his mask looks very self-made out of generic leather, etc. -- But then they keep blasting machine gun bursts into him and he doesn't even care about it (nor does the suit, there is never even a scratch in it).

I'm also curious where the hell he has hidden his suit all the time. If he is in "civilian mode", he has a backpack, but I highly doubt he can store it in there ... also, how is he able to swap the clothes so fast? Doesn't look like one can jump in and out of the batsuit that quickly.

Still, people were right when they said it does feel a lot like the old 90s cartoon. Even though I'm undecided about this movie, I wouldn't mind seeing a followup.

Edited April 21, 2022 by Lexx

[Raithe]

And just for the historical epic-ness of it:

 

[Amentep]

13 hours ago, LadyCrimson said:

I remember that Night Court chr/role but didn't recognize "Data" as being that same actor until it was mentioned in articles.
Those few skits he did for YouTube on his channel were kinda funny.

One time years ago I commented on Twitter that something he said sounded like what my husband would say and he replied that he was my husband. I don't remember exactly, just the "be paranoid who you're really talking to on the 'net" type of snark. I wonder if he still Twitter's.

He's still on Twitter.  Don't think he tweets as much as he once did, perhaps.

12 hours ago, Raithe said:

It's kind of fun to look back on some things, I still think it was a crying shame Threshold never made it beyond those first 13 episodes back in 2005... 

Carla Gugino as the lead, Brent Spiner as the slightly hippy medical doctor, and Peter Dinklage as a womanising, gambling, mathematician and linguist, Rob Benedict as the nervous astrophysicist, Brian Van Holt as the solider type, and Charles S. Dutton as the gruff government agent type... 

All wrapped up in something a little bit X-Files, a little bit Fringe, a little bit V...

I remember Threshold, vaguely.  I know I watched it (my memory is that either they moved the time it aired, or I changed the days I worked and anyhow never saw the whole thing).  Remember almost nothing else about it.  Wouldn't mind revisiting.

[Raithe]

7 minutes ago, Amentep said:

I remember Threshold, vaguely.  I know I watched it (my memory is that either they moved the time it aired, or I changed the days I worked and anyhow never saw the whole thing).  Remember almost nothing else about it.  Wouldn't mind revisiting.

I picked up the DVD set back then, because they didn't air all 13 episodes. Think only 11 got shown before it was cancelled.

[LadyCrimson]

Is it just me, or was there that period of time in the 80's and 90's where almost all villains/"bad guys" ended the movie falling from some great height in an overly dramatic fashion? Usually a skyscraper, but cliff, plane/helicopter, whatever worked. I mean, I'm sure they still fall like that sometimes/often (past, present and in the future) but it felt like it was almost a literal requirement back then.

So that makes me wonder ... what is the appeal of the villain dying like that to audiences? Or why do studio's think audiences like/want it?

 

[Gromnir]

1

2

and from 2000s there were no shortage o' such

3

' course gollum goes out similar. we used death o' saruman in rotk 'cause is homage to christopher lee's death scene from sins of dracula (1970). peter jackson is a serious horror film nerd, so no accident.

regardless, is a whole lotta disney films which do the villain falling to death starting from seven dwarfs and continuing through the decades and is no shortage o' imitators.... though admitted, pretty much every hunchback of notre dame film is gonna have such a scene, and there has been at least ten going back to 1911(?).

HA! Good Fun!

ps (edit): obvious king kong (33,76, 05) will be the most famous use o' the literal fall o' the antagonist, but we tend to not put kong in the villain role 'though  "bad guys" works.

 

Edited April 22, 2022 by Gromnir

[LadyCrimson]

^ I knew someone was likely to do that, and not surprisingly it's Gromnir. 
I think I tried to imply I'm aware falling deaths in movies have been around a while/still are. Probably since the dawn of the first silent films.

But it felt so over used in the 80's/90s action movies to me I guess. Die Hard, Robocop, "did he sound something like that?" Untouchables type silliness.

Anyway, even good or neutral guys have falling deaths (Lion King). Which makes me think:

1: it's some kind of human thing re: fear of falling and knowing what type of emotion that brings (either cathartic "yay" or horrified "ohnoes").
2: it's sometimes a way to kill off characters with a tiny bit less overt violence/action on the heroes part - eg, not a direct, violent or "truly deliberate" killing blow that has to be shown.

Edited April 22, 2022 by LadyCrimson

[Lexx]

2 hours ago, LadyCrimson said:

So that makes me wonder ... what is the appeal of the villain dying like that to audiences? Or why do studio's think audiences like/want it?

I think it's cheaper to kill them like that. Also no need to show gore, etc. which gives a better age rating. Basically the bad guy just disappears and it's done.

[Gromnir]

nothing really 'bout the 80s (or 90s) which set it apart. coulda' added jack nicholson's joker and sean bean from his bond film for 80s and 90s, but if we get 70s and 00s you are gonna have a similar list o' notables. 

however, am suspecting the obvious answer as to why is 'cause it is a common nightmare scenario.  only 'bout a bazillion links, yes? show dramatic falling is a straight shot to the id or somesuch. director is gonna get an emotional response which resonates with many in spite o' fact nobody in the audience has actual experienced such a death themselves. 

HA! Good Fun! 

 

 

[Chairchucker]

I think falling to death also makes sense in kids' movies where you're trying to maintain the moral purity of your hero so you have the villain die to their own hubris, and falling to your death is a pretty good way of doing that.

[Gromnir]

41 minutes ago, Chairchucker said:

I think falling to death also makes sense in kids' movies where you're trying to maintain the moral purity of your hero so you have the villain die to their own hubris, and falling to your death is a pretty good way of doing that.

along with absence o' gore, the most oft offered explanations for why falling deaths o' villains is so common in disney movies is as you describe. as such the hero's hands remain clean while the villain falls to death due to pride/hubris/whatever.

compare the aforementioned hunchback of notre dame climax from disney to source material or most film versions.

in the novel, and not disney, quasimodo hurls frollo to his death. 

ff to 37:15

HA! Good Fun!

 

Edited April 22, 2022 by Gromnir

[Keyrock]

The Hidden Fortress (1958) - Tahei and Matashichi, a pair of bumbling peasants, unwittingly get caught up in a great adventure as a general of a fallen kingdom tries to smuggle the hunted princess of his land through enemy territory.

While this doesn't quite reach the incredible heights of Akira Kurosawa's masterpieces, it is nevertheless a thoroughly entertaining and enjoyable adventure movie. This is also an incredibly important movie. The influence this had on George Lucas is crystal clear. Princess Leia was very obviously modeled after the feisty Princess Yuki, General Rokurota Makabe uses a Jedi mind trick to get past an enemy checkpoint, and the two bumbling and bickering peasants surely influenced R2D2 and C3PO. Speaking of the peasants, they steal the show here. It's not often that Toshihiro Mifune gets overshadowed in a movie, but Minoru Chiaki and Kamatari Fujiwara are absolutely fantastic as the greedy and bumbling Tahei and Matashichi. There is also a fantastic spear duel in the movie that's a hundred times more tense and exciting than Jedi twirling laser swords while doing quadruple flips over lava.

The blu-ray I got of this classic is a gorgeous 2K transfer, as I would expect from the Criterion Collection. I still have a number of Kurosawa films I haven't seen, which is shameful, I know. In my defense, the man was quite prolific. I have blu-rays of Yojimbo (seen it, love it) and Sanjuro (haven't seen it) that will get a watchin' fairly soon.

Edited April 23, 2022 by Keyrock

[Amentep]

I haven't seen Hidden Fortress since VHS days. I really should rewatch it.

[Keyrock]

1 hour ago, Amentep said:

I haven't seen Hidden Fortress since VHS days. I really should rewatch it.

You absolutely should, it's such an easy watch, despite being well over 2 hours long. This is Kurosawa's mainstream crowd-pleaser, like a Michael Bay movie, except it's still good and not absolute garbage if you dedicate more than 2 brain cells to thinking about it.

As an aside, my Kurosawa top 5:

1) Yojimbo

2) Rashomon

3) Ran

4) The Seven Samurai 

5) Stray Dog

Edited April 23, 2022 by Keyrock