The main things that bug me so far

[Eurhetemec]

 

 

The biggest joke - might affects your bullets' damage

 

Perhaps might in this instance, signifies a gangsta background ? You know, gold jewelry and a propensity to hold your musket at a jaunty sideways angle.

 

Before popping a cap.

 

 

"Through a variety of techniques (e.g. martial training, meditation, ritualistic evocation, mortification of the flesh), some individuals are able to draw upon the energy of their soul to accomplish extraordinary feats. These abilities range from the mundanely superhuman to the explosively magical. Having a strong soul seems to make this easier, but sometimes even people with fragmented souls are able to accomplish the extraordinary. The individual's body seems to act as a conduit and battery for this power, drawing in replenishment from seemingly omnipresent "fields" of unbound spiritual energy in the world around them."

 

Every single human being in this setting has supernatural magical powers, or at the very least the potential for such. Whether you are shooting a bow or punching a person or casting a spell, specialized training allows you to access the energy of your soul to accomplish superhuman feats. Might increasing damage of ranged weapons makes perfect sense in this setting.

 

 

Pillars of Eternity should have had an option box that came up automatically on a first play-through saying:

 

"Do you think the Baldur's Gate games were the apex of CRPGs?" with a YES/NO selector

 

If you selected yes, the game had special tutorial/explainer stuff which explained, in detail and unskippably, how Might is not Strength (and similarly with other stats), gave an elaborate RP explanation for the stash, told you how Engagement worked (and why), and generally went through the differences from the IE games and really carefully explained them to people.

 

Because I think if that'd happened, there'd be about 1/3rd as many complaint threads, if that, and certainly about 1/3rd as many posters basically bursting through the door to tell us how terribly shocked and appalled they are that not everything is exactly the same as a game made in 1998, which was based on a system from 1988.

[Katarack21]

I play BG2 literally at least once a year. I've beaten it more than I can count. I can type the CLUAConsole commands in my *sleep*.

I do not get this mentality, though. I just don't understand.

Edited April 2, 2015 by Katarack21

[Lightzy]

A wizard in this setting is better off being an idiot who can lift wagons. In fact, wizard, because of almost exclusively friendly-fire AOEs, and because all combat in this game is "moshpit clump", is the class who suffers most from having high INT.

It's much better to have a 20 might 3 int wizard than a balanced one or god forbid high int low might. That's how this system is built.

 

Go on, explain how to your understanding might stat affects gun damage in this setting. Make yourself look intelligent

 

 

Please stop trying to defend a stat system that is so beyond ridiculous that it's funny.

And if it was functional, then fine, but it isn't. It forces you to certain builds just as D&D forces you, but with D&D it's sensible at least, and intuitive.

This system forces you to play a mage who's schwartzenneger and bends steel bars with bare hands. You're forced just the same as you're forced to make your wizard intelligent in D&D to be effective.

 

It's pure ****, and I hope its designer quits from trying to design game mechanics. All other aspects of this game are very good.

[Katarack21]

A wizard in this setting is better off being an idiot who can lift wagons. In fact, wizard, because of almost exclusively friendly-fire AOEs, and because all combat in this game is "moshpit clump", is the class who suffers most from having high INT.

It's much better to have a 20 might 3 int wizard than a balanced one or god forbid high int low might. That's how this system is built.

 

Go on, explain how to your understanding might stat affects gun damage in this setting. Make yourself look intelligent

High Int creates yellow friendly-safe zones on the outer edges of your AoE, so that you can use it safer. So high-Int wizards....kind of a good thing.

 

But go on. Continue regaling me with your knowledge of stats and builds in PoE.

[SeekDWay]

 

The biggest joke - might affects your bullets' damage

 

Perhaps might in this instance, signifies a gangsta background ? You know, gold jewelry and a propensity to hold your musket at a jaunty sideways angle.

 

Before popping a cap.

 

If you want to be in the gang you have to be cool, like daddy! Look how daddy walks! Look how cool it's! Need to keep it gangsta'!

[Flayedawg]

I'd just like to point out that my Wizard has no points in Might, but his spells still seem to hit quite nicely. The "Scion of Flame" utility talent might have something to do with that, tho.

 

My Priest has lots of points in Might, because the game told me that Might affects my Healing prowess.

& that's all I can say.

[Flayedawg]

 

A wizard in this setting is better off being an idiot who can lift wagons. In fact, wizard, because of almost exclusively friendly-fire AOEs, and because all combat in this game is "moshpit clump", is the class who suffers most from having high INT.

It's much better to have a 20 might 3 int wizard than a balanced one or god forbid high int low might. That's how this system is built.

 

Go on, explain how to your understanding might stat affects gun damage in this setting. Make yourself look intelligent

High Int creates yellow friendly-safe zones on the outer edges of your AoE, so that you can use it safer. So high-Int wizards....kind of a good thing.

 

But go on. Continue regaling me with your knowledge of stats and builds in PoE.

 

I thought the "safety zone" aspect of the AoE was just a feature of AoE spells ... I had no idea that INT affects it.

[Spivo]

I think the stat system is slightly bonkers, but no clue why people gets so worked up about it.

 

If you min/max anyway, chances are you don't play for the rpg value,

and if you play for the rpg value make characters according to how you think your character should be like and disregard game mechanics.

 

A low might wizard is not going to be bad, you just need to focus more on duration type spells.

[grumbold99]

All my casters pump int to get larger effect zones on their spells and larger safe zones. Why debuff half the enemy group when you can debuff all of them? Like in D&D, if you're using your wizard as a nuker he's generally less effective than if you use him to scramble the enemy and give the rest of the party an easier time dispatching them. If you really want a nuker then feat choice has a lot more impact than a few extra points of might.

 

Obsidian have definitely streamlined some of the old systems to make gameplay easier. That is what a lot of people wanted. I'm delighted there's no need to prebuff your team while standing just outside the door to the next fight (that you know is there because you blundered into it and had to reload) or micromanage your inventory or all of that tedious stuff. Refining what the stats mean is a part of that. I'm sure mods will be along to tweak the gameplay for those who don't like some of the compromises, but this feels like a pretty good balance to strike to make the game accessible to as many people as possible. I'll be looking forward to a mod that allows you to wait until daytime or rest until morning, but it's minor stuff.

 

Once you're buying 6000cp armour from the stores and scheduling many expensive upgrades to your stronghold you'll reailse that looting 5cp weapons and 40cp armour is pretty trivial. Selling those 200/400 cp items and quest/bounty rewards will provide the bulk of your income.  Do it or not, it's up to you.

Edited April 2, 2015 by grumbold99

[Hiro Protagonist II]

Some of this stuff I've mentioned before, and is my confirmed worries from before the release. Other is something that's made an impression on me while playing the full game.

• Economy - getting too rich too soon is a thing. I'm intentionally not using the Stash and this has allowed me to avoid picking up merely somewhere around 1000cp worth of loot. I'm being mostly thorough with looting, as much as my characters' inventories allow, and I refrain from stealing from those containers which are not marked by a red mouse pointer, yet it wouldn't make sense in a roleplay sense to steal from them. And still I've got a bit over 5000cp for 15hrs of playing (not taken the stronghold yet)
• Stash/Item weight/Encumbrance - needs added complexity to feel less like a vacuum-cleaner sim. The Stash is a mess functionality- and design-wise, among many exmaples - it's completely possible to accidentally send stuff you want to use into your stash while in the wilderness, and then be unable to get it out of the stash until you return to town. This is dumb as heck. Before someone comes and tries to be smart - no I can't turn stash accessible everywhere because 1) I play on Expert and 2) it defeats the purpose of restricting stash in the first place if you have to enable it because of technical reasons born out of a bad design decision.
• UI
  • markers on map, it's important guise
  • Make tab key highlight the destination markers when you've sent your characters to a location, in addition to displaying markers for selected party memebers
• Stealth on party member level
• Separated stealth and trap-detecting stance
• Crafting/enchanting - shouldn't be possible everywhere, at specific smiths and for a price would be nice
• Might cannot designate both mental and physical strength. It's too hurtful to the very roleplay aspect to have a good wizard whose side-talent is breaking iron bars with his bare hands.
• Stronghold - can't comment on this one yet, but from what I read about it, it will come up soon.

 

 

Don't worry. You'll be spending money on your stronghold in no time and you'll probably be poor if you're leaving loot with your play style.

 

For me, I use the giant vacuum cleaner that is the stash to strip mine every map with sucking up every bit of scrap I come across. The money sink that is the stronghold won't make you poor if you pick up everything. I still have a lot of coin despite throwing money at the stronghold at every chance I get.

 

Stealth has been talked about and the dev's are looking at it. They want to have individual stealth as well. With regards to Might. Welcome to the 2 year old debate.

Edited April 2, 2015 by Hiro Protagonist II

[Hatred]

 Got to say none of these things are problems for me. To be honest I wouldn't really enjoy the shops shutting at night. I like the loot system the way it is. Having to worry about who is carrying what and is it heavy enough .... The loot system is kind of BS in DnD ruleset. There are a few things in these kind of games where you need to suspend disbelief. I prefer convenience over fiddly roleplaying everytime. I want to enjoy a good story and good combat. Not micromanage like a nutjob with items. I like the fact that I can carry around every single magic sword I find in the game. Its not like a bag of holding isnt ridiculous. Personally I would count time spent making the game less convenient in order to satisfy some pretty esoteric and random roleplaying desire to be wasted. Its not an open world game. Your characters don't have to sleep (well not everyday). 

 Lets think about a realistic way of dealing with items. Each character can carry what that character can carry. So 1 sidearm maybe 2. One weapon in your hands. No shields bigger than a buckler. No one has armour heavier than chain (because all of these things are ridiculous in a real life context). So your character could have a bow and a sword as a sidearm. A spear with a sword as a sidearm. For that matter spears would totally trump swords in combat. Who would be happy if you made spears the go to weapon for everyone not using a bow ? Who would be happy if you couldnt carry loot but could only swap out the weapons or armour you already had for stuff you found ? My guess is nobody. 

 This is not a simulation game. Its a fantasy game. I'm ok with that. If it was a simulation game then a lot of people would be unhappy. The IE games were not simulation games either.

[Hiro Protagonist II]

 

Well, I want to make a wizard who is physically weak but whose spells hit hard. And I can't.

 

You can't? Is there a particular reason...? I'm planning to play a clumsy physically weak Wizard with hard hitting spells.

 

She'll have reasonably high might, which will unlock might related conversation options... But I don't intend to use them, because she's not a physically strong or menacing person. Is there something that is automatically going to make her appear strong and brutish? I know a lot of the scripted interactions can involve might, but I also know that they can involve tools (which I used with my Cipher who had low might) and given she isn't going to have the physical strength to deal with things, she's probably going to use her brains and a lot of luck to get by....

 

But is there something in the game that is going to make that impossible? Is there something that is automatically going to make my physically weak Wizard as strong as an ox? I'm genuinely curious...

 

Welcome to Pillars of Eternity. Where your female body building Wizard with 18 Might will be able to literally pick up guys and intimidate them.

 

 

 

This does actually happen with an option for a high might character in one of the quests/tasks in Gilded Vale

 

 

[syarulax]

We got Magic Bottomless Crate of Holding from the start.. don't like it, don't throw stuff in it. Jarlaxle in Forgotten Realm's got such thing with his hat. Why frown when we got 1 in PoE?

Edited April 2, 2015 by syarulax

[crabe]

This system forces you to play a mage who's schwartzenneger and bends steel bars with bare hands. 

 

It's crazy... No. Just no.  Bending bars depends of athletic skill, not might. That's how it works in the game.  That's how it is. Crazy...

 

The common sense says that you have to understand the purpose of a thing before deciding that thing does not work. Just try for once.

 

 

 

 

 

Welcome to Pillars of Eternity. Where your female body building Wizard with 18 Might will be able to literally pick up guys and intimidate them.

 

 

Wimp with 18 Might :  

 

Edited April 2, 2015 by crabe

[jigoro]

So barring any built-in melee adjustments based on class....

 

A wizard with 18 str and a great sword will do more damage than a 12 str fighter, yes?  And with higher Perception, will hit with greater %?

 

I don't necessarily hate it.  There are some spells that allow for wizard melee-ing.  Even Gandalf wielded a sword sometimes...  But with interrupts as they are, probably not the best idea.

 

I would rather that than any sneaky built-in code that let certain classes hit more or with higher damages.

[Hiro Protagonist II]

Wimp with 18 Might :  

 

 

No idea what you're talking about. Joe Pesci attacks the guy from behind, he didn't pick him up as I pointed out in my spoiler. Also, the spoiler example I gave is in the game.

Edited April 2, 2015 by Hiro Protagonist II

[anameforobsidian]

I still think might and intellect should basically switch place, since larger and more impressive goes better with mighty than smaller, more precise, and more damaging.  That said, I'm having way too much fun to care.  (Especially with my max int / might cypher).

[crabe]

 

No idea what you're talking about. 

 

yes, apparently.

[Hiro Protagonist II]

yes, apparently.

 

I don't understand gibberish.

[Anelor]

 

"This is not a simulation game. Its a fantasy game. I'm ok with that. If it was a simulation game then a lot of people would be unhappy. The IE games were not simulation games either."

Than i prefer D&D encumbrance ruleset, where the simulation is taken into account. Every fantasy game, virtual or table game, should include as much as possible simulation aspects. When you play Dungeon and Dragons or Pathfinder, your party hardly carries a big coffer everywhere, at most each member has his own bag. For istance, why do they put the need of resting? Isn't it a simulation of a real aspect? 

Edited April 2, 2015 by Anelor

[Sylvanpyxie]

 

 

This does actually happen with an option for a high might character in one of the quests/tasks in Gilded Vale

Right, I get that I'm going to have the option, but I can ignore options with minimal effort. If I'm trying to play a weakling I'm not going to suddenly get up and throw people around out of choice. The choice element is what I've been asking about and no one has actually given me a helpful answer.

 

I decided to play it anyway and have yet to encounter anything that could negate my role-play choice.

[Hellraiser789]

 

 

"This is not a simulation game. Its a fantasy game. I'm ok with that. If it was a simulation game then a lot of people would be unhappy. The IE games were not simulation games either."

Than i prefer D&D encumbrance ruleset, where the simulation is taken into account. Every fantasy game, virtual or table game, should include as much as possible simulation aspects. When you play Dungeon and Dragons or Pathfinder, your party hardly carries a big coffer everywhere, at most each member has his own bag. For istance, why do they put the need of resting? Isn't it a simulation of a real aspect? 

 

 

Yeah but this ​isn't D&D! And if you are going to simulate encumbrance, why even have an inventory system? As @hatred mentioned, you'd be able to carry what? 1 or two weapons tops? plus armor and stuff? Have you tried hiking around with a 100 lbs in a pack? That gets real heavy, real fast. So yeah, you could have a bag, with what? some food and potions, maybe some cash and small-scale loot? Certainly you wouldn't be carrying more weapons than you need and you certainly wouldn't want anything bulky or anything like that.

 

Yeah this sounds like a cool gameplay concept (and Im sure theres some awesome simulator games that do this type of thing) but for implementation its just impractical and not inline with the IE gameplay. Sure, itd be cool if they added (or someone modded it in) a simulator version/option/toggle/etc that greatly limited inventory and carry capacity and required food and water and sleep, etc. I'd play it, but its not what these games are about. But if you want to mod it - go for it! I'd gladly play PoE:PotD Survival Sim and that'd be pretty cool - but I wouldn't want to force others into that kind of game when it is so different from the IE experience.

[Gairnulf]

It's crazy how many features was left out of the game. Disclaimer - I don't read old dev diaries before posting what I want in the game. It really is a coincidence.

 

Update by Tim Cain, Senior Programmer and Designer

 

 

 

 

I have been working on a lot of different gameplay mechanics since my last update about monks (Update #52). All of the classes are in the game now, along with their abilities and spells up to level 5. This should give us a good basis to test encounters in the game's early maps. So I have turned my attention to some of the non-combat skills, including crafting.

 

Crafting Basics

Crafting is the skill that you use to make equippable items like armor and weapons, and consumable items like potions and food. To begin crafting, you must find an appropriate crafting location.

• Forges – these blacksmithing locations can be used to make all of the equippable gear. From helmets to armor to boots, if you can wear it, then you can make it here.
• Labs – these alchemical tables are used to make any enchantments, as well as all alchemical consumables like potions, scrolls or figurines (which let you summon a creature that will fight for you). If you want to improve your gear or brew a potion, you need to find one of these labs.
• Hearths – these cooking spots are used to make food and drink that can give you long-term benefits when you ingest them. Many rest areas will have hearths, so crafting of this sort can often be done “in the field”.

When you use the central object at these locations, such as the anvil at the forge, you will enter a crafting interface that displays all of your forge recipes, broken down into categories such as armor, weapons, boots, helmets, rings, etc. You pick a category and can see all of the recipes you know for that category. Each recipe has a set of ingredients needed to make its item (or items, as some recipes will make batches of items). Some recipes will have additional prerequisites, including requiring you or a companion to have a certain talent or ability or even skill at an appropriate level. Higher level recipes have more prerequisites and need rarer ingredients.

 

You may be wondering where you get recipes. You get a few automatically when you level up your crafting skill, and you can also buy them from vendors. Sometimes you will find recipes in the world, as loot on creatures or as rewards for finishing quests. There will be a lot of recipes in Project Eternity for you to find, so make sure you explore every nook and cranny of this world, especially the crannies.

 

Crafting doesn’t take any time. If you have everything the recipe needs and are at the appropriate crafting location, then you can make the item instantly. Usually the ingredients are used up, but sometimes they are reusable. And for recipes like enchantments, the main ingredient is not used up but is instead improved by the addition of a new bonus. For example, you might have a sword with high accuracy and a Flaming Sword recipe that adds fire damage to any sword. If you use that sword with that recipe, you will have the same sword with a high accuracy bonus but also with additional fire damage! Win win!

 

Crafting can also be used to repair items, but first we should talk about item durability in Project Eternity.

 

Item Durability

Most items don’t degrade over time. This means that boots, rings, helmets, gloves, amulets, cloaks, and belts are not worn down by use. However, weapons, shields, and armor (that is, chest armor) do have durability values and are worn down by use. Specifically, every attack with a weapon degrades that weapon by one unit, and armor and shields are similarly degraded when the wearer is attacked.

 

Items have lots of units of durability, and they do not suffer any negative effects until those units are completely gone. When an item has reached 25% of its maximum durability, it will become “worn” and appear that way in your inventory, but it will not behave any differently until the last unit of durability is lost. At that point, the item is “damaged” and the following effects will happen:

• Weapons – damaged weapons do less damage and have less accuracy
• Armor – damaged armor has lower damage thresholds and the wearer’s attack speed is slower
• Shields – damaged shields lose part of their defense bonuses

Items can never become worse than “damaged”. They will not break or become more damaged. They just stay damaged until you have them fixed.

 

Vendors can repair items for money, so that’s a fast and easy way to keep all of your items in top notch condition. The cost of the repair is proportional to the percentage of the durability lost and the cost of the item, so expensive items tend to be more costly to repair than cheaper ones, especially if you let them lose a lot of their durability before repairing them.

 

However, let’s see how you can save your precious hard-earned money by bringing this discussion back to crafting.

 

A typical Hearth where you can craft food and drink.

Durability and Crafting

You or any companion can repair items by using the crafting skill at a forge. More importantly, you can use materials instead of money, if you have the right ones. The higher your crafting skill or the more materials you have, the less money it costs to repair an item. Some items might even repair for free!

 

But wait...there’s more!

 

The crafting skill also decreases the rate of degradation on items used by a character. So if you have the crafting skill, when you hit someone, your weapon doesn’t lose a whole point of durability. Instead it loses a fraction of a point. And when you are hit, your armor and shield don’t lose a whole point each either. And the higher your crafting skill, the less durability you lose. We are assuming that if you know how to make an item, you also know how to use and take care of it.

 

So a high crafting skill means your weapons, armor, and shields degrade more slowly and you can repair those items (and those of your companions) more cheaply than a vendor. That is such a win-win situation, how can you afford to NOT take the crafting skill?!

 

I’ll answer that question in a future update about the other skills in Project Eternity.

 

[PrimeJunta]

Durability was dropped because people didn't like it. That happened very, very early in the process.

 

They did drop the location requirement though which is kind of a shame IMO. It just doesn't feel right to go "Oh right, I'll add a corrosive lash to my saber right now deep in this dungeon."

[Katarack21]

I hate durability. Always have. It annoys me to have to replace my level one gun ever ten minutes when I'm already strapped on cash, it pisses me off when my item breaks in the middle of a dungeon, I'm angered when I loot a nice item that's in broken condition so I have an extra cost to use it, etc. I'm glad they left it out.

Edited April 2, 2015 by Katarack21