Cinematics : your opinion ?

[Hiro Protagonist II]

From the "don't waste resources" approach I'm starting to wonder if Obsidian should make entirely text based game.

 

I agree. Obsidian should forget everything that was in the IE games so they 'don't waste time, money and resources' and make the game as plain as possible.

[Jarmo]

 

I also believe that cutscenes shouldn't involve anything which the player could reasonably influence. I shall call this the Phoenix down argument.

 

Oh yea, the way cutscenes are usually (as in bioware usually) used, is as a silly plot-hole-plugging-device.

 

The enemy boss, having just lost the midway-semi-important fight, suddenly stops fighting, proclaims the inevitable doom for the party

and runs away unopposed, the party  – being suspended in cutscene – is unable to give chase and has to watch helplessly.

[Sensuki]

This way please.

 

 

Don't necessarily need the book, just Kaz's artwork.

Edited September 30, 2013 by Sensuki

[Karranthain]

This way please.

 

 

Don't necessarily need the book, just Kaz's artwork.

 

I'd be more than happy with that. A few narrated sequences here and there. In my opinion, a talented voice actor (Sara Kestelman, Rodger Bumpass etc.) can paint a scene much better than any cutscene, no matter how technically marvelous the latter is.

[Nonek]

This way please.

 

 

Don't necessarily need the book, just Kaz's artwork.

 

Heartily agree, still enthralling after repeated playthroughs.

 

Edit: Mr Soule's soundtrack really enhances this cinematic.

Edited September 30, 2013 by Nonek

[Lephys]

As far as handling past stories being told (like the game's intro simply presenting some history/lead-up to the player, etc.), I REALLY like the sort of "events being acted out via living ink on a page" style used by Guild Wars 2 and I THINK Dragon Age 2? It's almost like the page is Mario from Super Mario RPG, and it can't talk to you, so it just acts out the story via charades, but in a really artistic manner... and there's a narrator.

 

But, as far as in-game stuff? There doesn't need to be very much that simple scripted events inside the in-game engine can't handle. Especially since it's not really a 3D game. No need for cinematography. 8P

[Karkarov]

Edit: Oh, look what I found. 

You do know Giantbomb is a wiki created by people, not a valid source of industry standards?  Again a CINEMATIC is a pre rendered movie, typically made using something other than the game engine itself or the standard in game models.  A CUTSCENE happens in game, in engine, using the graphics that are just there and only tools available from the actual game engine.  They take take no more "resources" than creating a combat animation does. 

 

Maybe you don't get it as a player watching it, but trust me, the people who actually make games understand the difference very well.  One is a relatively simple thing to create that just requires "triggers" and maybe some dynamic in game effects.... the other is a full on custom made graphical presentation with hand made models, typically very high quality textures, created in a program like Adobe Premiere, cut, edited, and rendered as a stand alone short movie of typically very high resolution greater than the game itself displays that then simply plays when the "start cinematic X" trigger goes off.

 

By your standards, and those of that crappy inaccurate wiki article, the entire game would be a cinematic.

[Hormalakh]

Hey guys, when you're done figuring out the difference between cinematics and cutscene, let me know what the consensus is on the definition of a RPG. Thanks.

[AGX-17]

This is not the sort of game to have need of such things.

Edited October 1, 2013 by AGX-17

[PrimeJunta]

@Karkarov: I wonder, is there any way at all that could get you to admit you're wrong about this?

Would a standard textbook do, like, say, Introduction to Game Development? Or The Game Localization Handbook (Deming/Chandler)? Or hell, even a major industry site? Over five million Google hits for the terms, or 75000 or so hits for the strict phrase?

 

If not that, what?

 

Show me something like that and I'll happily admit I was wrong. (Okay, maybe not happily but still.)

 

Y'know, evidence instead of just "that's the definition pout stamp."

 

(Also, shuddup Hormalakh. This stuff is important.)

Edited October 1, 2013 by PrimeJunta

[PrimeJunta]

Oh, and about the topic? I'm hoping no cinematics and no cutscenes. I like the intertitles with Kaz's ink art, and hope that's they way they're going to go all through.

 

Of course I'd be happy to see their concept art used elsewhere too. It gives the game a really nice hand-crafted look and feel.

[Sacred_Path]

party enters map - cutscene, camera showing off gorgeous background, banter - game resumes, dialogue popup

 

 

 

yes please

[WorstUsernameEver]

I wouldn't mind a few tone-setting cinematics a-là Baldur's Gate 1 and Icewind Dale, to be honest, though I'd also be okay if they were done via animated illustrations rather than 3d models (because, let's be honest, those just age better).

[teknoman2]

there will obviously be some intro and ending sequence to the game, however i do not care either way for cinematics during the game. however, some sort of character animation during dialogs would be welcome. it doesnt have to be that detailed either, just a pose or something that indicates the mood, like shaking a fist when angry, putting a hand on the chin when thinking, scratching head when confused and such

[PrimeJunta]

Vailians should definitely gesticulate wildly whenever in conversation.

[Pidesco]

[Karkarov]

"nope"

See, now that's a cinematic.

 

Again, as for my personal opinion...  Depends 100% on how well they are made.  As for no cutscenes?  Uh really.... No I definitely think there should be cut scenes or "scripted events" if you prefer.  The infinity engine games used them out the wazoo, why shouldn't PE?

Edited October 1, 2013 by Karkarov

[PrimeJunta]

Because there are better, more atmospheric, cheaper, and less annoying ways of accomplishing the same thing?

 

Personally, I go to the movies if I want to watch a movie. If I play a game, I like to be in control. I dislike it when the game suddenly locks my controls and forces me to watch something. I didn't like it in the IE games, and I won't like it in PE if they do it. At least most IE games newer than Baldur's Gate had skippable cutscenes and cinematics, thank goodness.

[Hormalakh]

I must agree. I would be willing to go for a handful of IWD cinemacut-screens.

[Lephys]

Vailians should definitely gesticulate wildly whenever in conversation.

Agreed. There should be a new class, like the Cipher, only using interpretive dance as the source of their powers rather than audible chanting. The Vailians would be masters of this class, and then would have all the best custscenes. 8P

[bonarbill]

You know, it's funny.  You got economic majors in this topic saying that a cinematic is too expensive, yet you got indie companies like Klei and Wayfoward who can make animated cutscenes on a limited budget.

 

While I don't care either way, I personally don't think it would be a waste a resources to do provided the art team is finished with everything else.

Edited October 2, 2013 by bonarbill

[Oner]

If I could choose, I'd pick the stuff that was in IWD1. Still drawing with the narrator explaining stuff, and/or the short in-engine cutscenes. Like the cleric person's death toward the end of the game, when they fuse into a gate.

[cyberarmy]

Only something like IWD or The Witcher 1.

[PrimeJunta]

You know, it's funny.  You got economic majors in this topic saying that a cinematic is too expensive, yet you got indie companies like Klei and Wayfoward who can make animated cutscenes on a limited budget.

 

While I don't care either way, I personally don't think it would be a waste a resources to do provided the art team is finished with everything else.

 

If you're working in an engine that's suited for cinematics, then of course it's easy and cheap to make them. If you're not, you have to use some other engine for them, which immediately adds overhead. 

 

In any case, it's not a question of absolute cost; it's a matter of bang for the buck. If you already have groovy concept art, why not just make an IWD-style slideshow with voiceover? That serves the same purpose, is just as atmospheric, and a lot easier and cheaper to make than creating an animated cinematic from scratch.

 

So yeah, I'm all for IWD-style slideshows with narration plus Darklands-style intertitles. No mini-movies TYVM.

[Night Stalker]

I wouldn't mind prerendered cinematics if they were used sparingly and didn't take up too much of the budget, but due to the smallish budget Obsidian is working with, I would prefer narrated slideshows.