Update #58: Crafting with Tim Cain!

[TheUnoNameless]

I think you can distill that "trends" bullet point to one:

* Don't like time sinks for the sake of time sinks

 

Actually the "I don't want to buy artifacts/nothing to spend gold on" bit got me thinking. Isn't the whole gold economy thing kinda unnecessary in an story-based adventure game? I don't mean open-ended sandboxes like F:NV or Skyrim, I mean games like KOTOR or Baldur's Gate. Shopping was never really heroic or interesting. It distracts from a story and introduces the whole bunch of issues into the game:

How to make gold valuable? How to make sure it's not more valuable than actual Dragon Hoard? How to avoid the infamous D&D syndrome where magic items cost more than castles, yet are sold in every other store, and adventurers carry wealth of nations in their pockets? Looting gold from corpses is probably the most un-heroic thing RPG characters do, yet the genre convention clings to it like *cough* to Velcro.

 

I think the underlying question should be "What purpose does gold economy serve in my story/game"? I know it's a major genre convention, like inventory, so I can see how players might be reluctant to step away from it.

Edited July 3, 2013 by TheUnoNameless

[Tale]

I like the idea of an economy. Of the player's gold going towards something.

 

I am not remotely used to that. In every game I've played that wasn't an MMO, it always went to hoarding. I think other people, like me, may simply be used to that. We're used to stockpiling 99 megalixers and 4 billion megabux for the final confrontation, then not using it for anything. Then pondering later about how our character can decimate any in-game economy and how strange it all seems. But being used to that, we come to like it.

 

That said, I think we can come to like tighter economics. Ones where our hero ends up with only a bottlecap and a nickle wafer that he swore was 30 pence when he stuck his hand in his pocket, but really shiny armor. Some people will never get used to that. I'm willing to try.

[Gfted1]

My understanding of the complaints Ive read are not that you can craft a Common Barrel Sword but that the crafted weapon will eventually outpace found weapons, enchantment wise, and obviate found equipment.

 

For me, durability is just another schlep back to the shop. Nothing actually breaks until reaching zero so maybe it wont be so bad.

 

Consumables are probably where most of my money will go. Hook a brother up with a Health potion recipe and Ill stay broke just on that one consumable.

[Tigranes]

I like super-expensive items in stores, and I liked them in IWD2. It gives a tangible destination point for the loot collecting and becomes something else to look forward to. The only problem is that this usually means either you have less cool stuff in dungeons, or you have too much cool stuff.

 

Stronghold/home/etc moneysinks are cool in theory, but especially for completionists, you still get so much money that in the end you just click-spam every single upgrade just for the sake of it (then you get the best outcome in the stronghold invasion or whatnot). I think SOZ was one of the better ones at controlling this until very late game, though the small scope made it easier to predict for designers.

 

Trained as a packrat by RPGs I used to never use consumables, then one day geared an entire playthrough to use them centrally and was delighted; now I use them rather liberally and enjoy it. I would appreciate an economy where equip-and-forget items are much more scarce (+2 sword, woohoo) but players are (somehow) encouraged to make use of consumables and also limited-use items (say, crafted low-tier items for specific enemies or purposes), which, together with crafting goals, alleviate the 'not enough monty haul' disappointment. A good inventory UI is critical to this, of course, because in BG2, (1) you would rarely need more than 2 or 3 bows in a party, but there were at least 6 or 7 'cool' bows, and you rarely needed reason to switch bows; (2) changing equipped items was a hassle. 

[Undecaf]

I don't really care whether or not item degradation is there or not, but if it is going to be, I would like it to be a feature I care about. Not needing to be overly punitive or annoingly fast, but something whose possible benefits I want to consider when picking my fights or trekking into the unknown.

 

Also, no other opinion on moneysink gear than there could be a balance between found and bought. Some things could be made by an exceptionally talented smith/enchater, or be one of a kind items kept as decoratives before being bought, some things can be just artifacts of different power found in the nature. Maybe the best bow in the realm is hanging on some rich guys wall; maybe the best armor is yet to be created; maybe the best sword is laying at the 15th floor of the megadungeon under the feet of a vaporform troglodyte that can not be killed by usual means (or at all). Or something.

[Nixl]

I'd like a sincere answer to this question, though I know not all of you are of the same mind: what do you want to spend (in-game) money on?

Personally, I like the idea of gold going towards crafting, pimping my stronghold, and bribes.  I would also like to buy mercencaries, ships, and company/merchant guild, but that is probably going into crazy territory. 

 

I would also argue that some of the complaints are in part due to weak balance of gold and other materials in other games.  By weak balance, I mean an over abundance to the point of trivializing the mechanic.  I think System Shock 2 had it correct.  Repair and weapon choice took a role in picking and choosing fights.   

Edited July 3, 2013 by Nixl

[Sensuki]

 

 

Contrast this to games like The Witcher where crafting exists in its own space. What you gain by crafting is only attainable by crafting, and hence crafting is neither worthless nor a substitute for anything.

 

That was a good point that Grunker made on RPGCodex, I thought.

 

Buying items should be expensive IMO, like really expensive. Also selling mundane equipment should have a really small rate of return, such as 1gp or so.

 

Want a suit of plate mail? Pay a FFFFFFFFF load of gold to buy one or get one made, or wait until later in the game when you encounter a foe with some or gain the pre-reqs to craft one yourself.

[SerRodrik]

I don't know what I want to spend gold on, since I tend to hoard it like crazy, and by the end of the game I have tens of thousands of gold and nothing to spend it on. I will say that I really enjoy crafting when done well, and depending on how consumables are implemented I will either use them a lot or hoard them like gold and end the game with half my inventory taken up by scrolls and potions that I never really felt the need to use, but didn't want to sell because they might be useful.

 

It seems to depend at least partially on the difficulty of the game. If the game is easy enough to get by without using things like potions, scrolls, or traps, or without spending money on better equipment, then I will sit on those resources instead.

Edited July 3, 2013 by SerRodrik

[Jotra]

I'd like a sincere answer to this question, though I know not all of you are of the same mind: what do you want to spend (in-game) money on?

 

My sincerere answer is this; I don't really care if I end up with 100, or 100k gold in the end. Definitely not if means implementing a system like item degradation and forcing crafting on everyone.

 

To give more elaborate answer though here are some things I'd see as fun money sinks:

-Buyng and upgrading your stronghold.

-Paying some mastercrafter for forging items from parts you have collected while adventuring.

-Things I'd like to see on NPC shopkeerpers include basic weapons/armor, common spellscrolls and recipies, etc.

-Quests, eg. bribes, fees, etc.

-Gambling.

-Travel.

-Crafting recipies could require ingridients that you need that would be only(or almost only) available from NPC merchants.

-Inn rooms/food.

 

In the end though people will still end with varying amounts of cash, even with item degradation, and I think that is something you just need to accept as not being some huge issue.

[End of the Road]

If the stronghold serves as a money sink and you give us enough valuables to maintain and upgrade it then obviously people who choose to ignore the whole stronghold feature will end up with more money. It's not like adding item durability as another money sink would change anything about that.

 

As for me, I'm actually just replaying IWD2 and I really enjoy not having enough money to buy everything I'd like and having to choose. I understand some people don't like buying items in stores, but I think it's just about finding the right balance between the number of powerful items in stores/in dungeons/crafted by player. BG2 would've had this right if the items in stores were more expensive.

 

Also I like the idea of having less consumables in the world and having to craft them yourselves. That's the right way of making the crafting skill interesting IMO.

[J.E. Sawyer]

I'd like to tune standard, at-level encounters on normal difficulty to not require the use of consumables.  However, efficiency will be a bigger deal both on higher levels of difficulty and if you're under-leveled for a specific encounter.  In those cases, consumable use will likely be, if not mandatory, extremely helpful.

[Fearabbit]

I'd like a sincere answer to this question, though I know not all of you are of the same mind: what do you want to spend (in-game) money on?

 

I want to spend money on:

• Crafting. I liked spending money on ingredients and parts in Arcanum, for example.
• Repairs. (I like the durability feature.)
• Standard equipment. If most of my equipment is unique, the game has a completely different problem than a lack of money sinks!
• Companions? I kind of like the idea of paying my companions for their services in addition to giving them equipment.

 

I do not want to spend money on:

• Unique items. I want to craft them myself or find them instead.
• Player Fortress. (I mean I will do it, but I don't think that's a great money sink)

 

I do not want to be able to sell:

• Equipment found on monsters (for example rusty swords with bits of rotten flesh still dangling from them or centuries-old armor - what kind of merchant would buy that?)
• Some crafted stuff - basically Crafting should not be a money source, it should be a money sink
• Recipes, herbs, ingredients in general except maybe the rare ones

 

 

And I think that's it. Give me enough reason to buy standard equipment, and limit the ways how I can make money mostly to quests. In recent playthroughs of old RPGs I restricted myself to similar rules, and found that I often ran out of money (and yet I always had enough).

[iLurk]

I like crafting, I use it almost in every game that has crafting in it but I don't want it as a skill if at all possible. There's not many levels and I would rather not waste my fighter's skill on crafting. But since there are generic NPC that can be recruited I guess I can make them into crafters.

 

For money I like managing things. In NWN2 OC I really liked how I can upgrade the Keep. I didn't like how it was necessary to survive later but I still liked how I had a place of my own I can upgrade. So if possible I really want more upgradable locations I can get a hold of.

 

Also lets say a village got attacked and a lot of its buildings got ruined. It will be cool if I can donate to the village so they can rebuild and in exchange I get extra services and discounts and other extras.

 

For unique equipments I don't mind crafting some items different from items that can be bought will be great but I would rather have the best equipments gotten thru a dungeon, a master craftsman.

[ImNotCreative]

I'd like a sincere answer to this question, though I know not all of you are of the same mind: what do you want to spend (in-game) money on?

 

I worked on IWD, HoW, TotL, and IWD2.  In virtually all of these games, I heard these two complaints over and over and over:

 

When unique items were in stores:

* I don't want to buy unique items in stores.

 

When unique items were in dungeons:

* I have nothing to spend my money on.

 

In all of these games, items you found on adventures were almost always one of the following: a) directly usable (i.e. gear or consumables) b) wealth items or c) quest items.  If something wasn't usable, it was usually a wealth item (gold, gem, etc.).  A wealth item only existed to give you gold, but for gold to have some sort of value, there needs to be something you want that costs x gold.  If high-value items aren't what you spend your gold on, what do you spend your gold on?  In PE, you may spend gold on your stronghold, but there's no guarantee of that.  And according to a lot of you, you don't use consumables, so if consumables aren't used, they're just wealth items -- not something you would want to spend gold on.

 

Part of the reason for having a crafting system was to make consumables less common in the world.  Only people who want to make/use them would see a relatively large quantity of them.  Since crafting ingredients are stored and sorted separately from other items, their presence subtracts nothing from the carrying capabilities of players who ignore the system entirely.

 

There are recurring trends I'm seeing:

 

* Don't like crafting.

* Don't like durability.

* Don't like consumables.

 

Combining those with with the two points at the top, it's hard for me to figure out where the gold is going to go.  There is also the possibility that players don't actually want a long-term gold economy in a SP game, that gold in the mid- and late-game is ultimately something to accumulate and that most/all forms of gear upgrading simply happens through quests and exploration.  That's not an invalid way to go, but I'd like to hear thoughts on it if you have the time.

 

I assume that complaints come from the fact that unique items should come from "unique" places, ie Sword of Awesome shouldn't be sold by a common blacksmith (because that way it is available to everybody with enough money) but be a weapon of legends that you found in the belly of a dragon. If that is the case I think that The Witcher 2 had a good solution for this, most unique weapons were crafted from the ingredients that you found by killing strong monsters (mainly bosses) but in order to craft them you had to pay a blacksmith to do it for you. I think that it takes best of both worlds, unique weapons became product of your adventures (they wouldn't be available to everybody who has money but only to heroes as yourself who can slay a dragon) and at the same time you have to save money for them and couldn't get them for free. Considering that crafting is going to be character skill in PE maybe the solution is that you buy expensive, but not legendary rare, crafting ingredients from merchants, for example a rare metal. So a good number of unique items will only be available through crafting by using unique ingredients that you find on your adventures mixed with expensive ingredients that you buy.

[J.E. Sawyer]

Also, no other opinion on moneysink gear than there could be a balance between found and bought. Some things could be made by an exceptionally talented smith/enchater, or be one of a kind items kept as decoratives before being bought, some things can be just artifacts of different power found in the nature. Maybe the best bow in the realm is hanging on some rich guys wall; maybe the best armor is yet to be created; maybe the best sword is laying at the 15th floor of the megadungeon under the feet of a vaporform troglodyte that can not be killed by usual means (or at all). Or something.

 

Arguably one good thing in this regard is that we're going to have a boatload of unique items thanks to our backers.  For the sake of sanity, we may very well need to put many unique items in stores to prevent barrels from overflowing with them (slight exaggeration).

[Ieo]

Thanks for the transparency.

 

I'd like a sincere answer to this question, though I know not all of you are of the same mind: what do you want to spend (in-game) money on?

 

I worked on IWD, HoW, TotL, and IWD2.  In virtually all of these games, I heard these two complaints over and over and over:

 

When unique items were in stores:

* I don't want to buy unique items in stores.

 

When unique items were in dungeons:

* I have nothing to spend my money on.

 

In all of these games, items you found on adventures were almost always one of the following: a) directly usable (i.e. gear or consumables) b) wealth items or c) quest items.  If something wasn't usable, it was usually a wealth item (gold, gem, etc.).  A wealth item only existed to give you gold, but for gold to have some sort of value, there needs to be something you want that costs x gold.  If high-value items aren't what you spend your gold on, what do you spend your gold on?  In PE, you may spend gold on your stronghold, but there's no guarantee of that.  And according to a lot of you, you don't use consumables, so if consumables aren't used, they're just wealth items -- not something you would want to spend gold on.

 

Part of the reason for having a crafting system was to make consumables less common in the world.  Only people who want to make/use them would see a relatively large quantity of them.  Since crafting ingredients are stored and sorted separately from other items, their presence subtracts nothing from the carrying capabilities of players who ignore the system entirely.

 

There are recurring trends I'm seeing:

 

* Don't like crafting.

* Don't like durability.

* Don't like consumables.

 

Combining those with with the two points at the top, it's hard for me to figure out where the gold is going to go.  There is also the possibility that players don't actually want a long-term gold economy in a SP game, that gold in the mid- and late-game is ultimately something to accumulate and that most/all forms of gear upgrading simply happens through quests and exploration.  That's not an invalid way to go, but I'd like to hear thoughts on it if you have the time.

 

I remember finding basic stuff in a BG1 vendor like plate mail and getting all excited that I needed to save my gold. Same thing in BG2, the collector's edition vendor with Vecna's Robe and the like. So I don't mind spending off vendors for stuff like that. There's nothing wrong with the loot path either (indeed, that's the classic approach--I was really excited to slay a dragon in BG2 and ran to loot it). Thus I suggested that there may be multiple ways to get shinies that are essentially equal in quality but with some variation: highest faction reputation, a super long and difficult quest chain, crafting, dungeon loot. I personally do not see these paths to shinies being mutually exclusive, so long as they are indeed somewhat different in nuance and cosmetics but equally useful in combat.

 

For consumables... potions were a problem in BG1/BG2. There was a separate thread about this and I don't remember the gist now, but what tends to happen with having diverse combat potions is that many players simply hoard them "just in case," and then hedge their bets at the end such that they don't even use the vast majority of potions in their inventory when the game is done. What other consumables are there? I rather like basic "cheap bonuses" like adding 1 point fire damage as a temporarily oil to my mace or something. I'm much less likely to hoard something like that and will craft/spend for it quite freely.

 

I like crafting in general, but crafting systems tend to have more dubious functionality in SP games compared to MMOs. It's important, I think, to ensure that crafting remains optional but there are still cool things you can do with it, like custom enchantments. I actually enjoyed the crafting in Dragon Knight Saga. Minus the durability thing, I'll end up trying PE's crafting anyway. Perhaps Obsidian can implement discrete quest-based/discovery "crafting" the way BG2 has it on top of the proposed crafting system, as I expect that system has the fewest naysayers given the IE homage. 

 

(Durability... I think I'm pretty clear in my thoughts about that.)

 

Where else can the gold go? How does travel work? Road tolls? More storage or mobile storage for the campsite mechanic? Rentals? Real estate investments based on faction that unlocks side quests? Faction donations? NPC bribery? Durability isn't a great way to do it, especially tied to another mechanic as an "excuse," though buying crafting items is perfectly fine to me in itself. 

 

In an SP game, I'm not particularly concerned about how the gold economy works, I suppose, but I haven't read the academic discussions about it either.

[SerRodrik]

One game that strikes me as always having very useful things to spend money on is Dark Souls, but that's really a special case, since everything in the game, from leveling up stats to buying equipment and consumables to repairing gear comes out of the same resource. The fact that it's very easy to lose all of your souls if you don't spend them quickly, coupled with the fact that the game is very difficult and consumables or new items or powerups can give you an edge you need, encourages you to always be spending them on something.

 

I don't know how much of that would be useful for this game though, since it'll probably be using a more traditional form of currency.

[rjshae]

There are recurring trends I'm seeing:

 

* Don't like crafting.

* Don't like durability.

* Don't like consumables.

 

Combining those with with the two points at the top, it's hard for me to figure out where the gold is going to go.  There is also the possibility that players don't actually want a long-term gold economy in a SP game, that gold in the mid- and late-game is ultimately something to accumulate and that most/all forms of gear upgrading simply happens through quests and exploration.  That's not an invalid way to go, but I'd like to hear thoughts on it if you have the time.

 

In many games, crafting just felt like a non-essential add-on that I basically ignored because it wasn't part of the mission. It's not that I was opposed to it, but I never felt motivated to use it until it became essential. The games where it did feel needed were Witcher, where potion making felt kind of cool, and the DA series, where expendables were in annoyingly short supply and were often needed to avoid frequent reloads.

 

Durability was really nice in the Fallout series as it added an element to the survival. Otherwise, it's usually just a maintenance chore. Rather than having degradation, an alternative approach would be a capability to hone your gear with your crafting skills or by visiting an artisan. That is, your weapon and gear is given an extra boost that wears off with combat. That may satisfy both those who like the maintenance aspects and those who can do without it.

 

Consumables are nice, but in the heat of combat they can be forgotten; a reload is then needed and the consumables put to use. I'd like to see a 'subscription' service for some consumables so that the item can be reused but has a cool-down. You essentially pay a large chunk up front for a lifetime of benefit, with the expectation being that you'd want to spend more later for an upgrade.

Edited July 3, 2013 by rjshae

[TheUnoNameless]

I don't know what I want to spend gold on, since I tend to hoard it like crazy, and by the end of the game I have tens of thousands of gold and nothing to spend it on. I will say that I really enjoy crafting when done well, and depending on how consumables are implemented I will either use them a lot or hoard them like gold and end the game with half my inventory taken up by scrolls and potions that I never really felt the need to use, but didn't want to sell because they might be useful.

 

It seems to depend at least partially on the difficulty of the game. If the game is easy enough to get by without using things like potions, scrolls, or traps, or without spending money on better equipment, then I will sit on those resources instead.

This seems to be overwhelming statement so far. "I like getting gold, but I don't like spending it, especially on consumables". Again, let's try to put genre conventions aside and seriously think WHY do we need gold in game to begin with? Could it be replaced with some less distracting and more intuitive gameplay system?

 

Let's say we need to track character's wealth to allow for an option of bribing - sure, sounds cool, but this doesn't require building up entire gold economy! You can just make a parameter "Wealth" that goes +1 when you find a treasure and -1 when you have a major expense. Cap it at, say, 5 (can't carry around more wealth), mission accomplished. No accounting, no gold sinks, no loot, clean and simple.

[Phanox]

Yes, what is the point of an economy in this type of game? Again, I'll point towards BG2 as early it served as a plot gathering the sum to continue the story, but besides that you had a couple of stores with selective powerful desirable items which also costs a lot, but at some point you were just filthy rich, and I think that's okay. It no longer servers a purpose and it doesn't have to, because at that state in the adventure there were more pressing concerns than worrying about your party-gold. And it did actually serve one purpose, which brings us back to crafting, which BG2 did so well compared to the MMO-model "gather 3 wood-planks"-kind of crafting. It could cost half your collected fortune to craft all those special artifact-items, but man, they were worth it, both because you knew the story behind each item, you knew you had accomplished great feats to gather the ingredients and parts, so you felt worthy. And it wasn't set up like a chore, rather, like a nice surprise. You didn't have a check-list of silly items you needed to gather, it was more fluid and roleplayed into the conversations with the NPC's.

 

Also, having to "sacrifice" an NPC to be the craftman doesn't sound like fun.

 

An economy, with moneysinks and all, should serve the core gameplay I think. From what I hear, they are added for the wrong reasons. In BG2 money served a purpose and then became just something you had enough of, and that was totally okay, because if you're a demigod chasing after your lost soul, you don't want to worry about money. Early game, it's great because it's about getting on your feet and learning how to survive and fight, and money can be part of that too, but like I said, I think it's okay if it becomes arbitrary at some point. You don't need a moneysink to make sure money goes out of the hands of the player, because what purpose does it serve?

[Sensuki]

Arguably one good thing in this regard is that we're going to have a boatload of unique items thanks to our backers.  For the sake of sanity, we may very well need to put many unique items in stores to prevent barrels from overflowing with them (slight exaggeration).

Some could also be artifacts (that require crafting) like The Equalizer albeit not as powerful of course.

 

For consumables you might want to take a look at The Witcher games (which I think you've played).

Edited July 3, 2013 by Sensuki

[Labadal]

I'd like a sincere answer to this question, though I know not all of you are of the same mind: what do you want to spend (in-game) money on?

 

I worked on IWD, HoW, TotL, and IWD2.  In virtually all of these games, I heard these two complaints over and over and over:

 

When unique items were in stores:

* I don't want to buy unique items in stores.

 

When unique items were in dungeons:

* I have nothing to spend my money on.

 

In all of these games, items you found on adventures were almost always one of the following: a) directly usable (i.e. gear or consumables) b) wealth items or c) quest items.  If something wasn't usable, it was usually a wealth item (gold, gem, etc.).  A wealth item only existed to give you gold, but for gold to have some sort of value, there needs to be something you want that costs x gold.  If high-value items aren't what you spend your gold on, what do you spend your gold on?  In PE, you may spend gold on your stronghold, but there's no guarantee of that.  And according to a lot of you, you don't use consumables, so if consumables aren't used, they're just wealth items -- not something you would want to spend gold on.

 

Part of the reason for having a crafting system was to make consumables less common in the world.  Only people who want to make/use them would see a relatively large quantity of them.  Since crafting ingredients are stored and sorted separately from other items, their presence subtracts nothing from the carrying capabilities of players who ignore the system entirely.

 

There are recurring trends I'm seeing:

 

* Don't like crafting.

* Don't like durability.

* Don't like consumables.

 

Combining those with with the two points at the top, it's hard for me to figure out where the gold is going to go.  There is also the possibility that players don't actually want a long-term gold economy in a SP game, that gold in the mid- and late-game is ultimately something to accumulate and that most/all forms of gear upgrading simply happens through quests and exploration.  That's not an invalid way to go, but I'd like to hear thoughts on it if you have the time.

 

I love finding unique items in dungeons or fallen enemies. I also like to find new unique items in stores. I want to spend that gold. One could balance that in some way. There are lots of games where you have a crap ton of money by the end simply because you didn't actually have to buy new equipment from stores. In a lot of rpgs, I've been disappointed that the stores sell stuff, but I might buy only a few items for the entire game because they don't offer interesting enough items.

 

Not using consumables? I use them a lot. I sometimes have a party without a healer or sometimes one healer but he/she isn't enough. Potions are invaluable in those cases.

 

Durability just adds a not so fun component to the game. I don't want to keep up with repairs and stuff for eight different characters. I could accept it in New Vegas, only controlling one character, but even in that game, I could happily have lived without item durability.

 

 

Maybe use money to bribe people? Pay fines if you get yourself in trouble?

 

If you decide to have a respec option, make it very expensive.

[Nixl]

Not necessarily advocating this, but we always use gold to buy components in RPGs, but has there ever been an RPG where gold is an actual component? In other words, using gold in ways other than buying.  Such a concept is more humorous to me, but I cannot think of a single game playing around with gold outside of buying.  (probably for good reason).

Edited July 3, 2013 by Nixl

[Monte Carlo]

I'd like a sincere answer to this question, though I know not all of you are of the same mind: what do you want to spend (in-game) money on?

 

Well, not repairing stuff for starters. I'm cool with crafting as long as (a) it's easy to do, (b) I'm not penalised for doing it and © it doesn't end up with inventory clutter that looks like the contents of Boo Radley's garage.

 

So I'm only answering fifty per cent of your question, as I personally crafting is such a big thing for so many folks that it's one of those things you try and see the bright side of. FWIW I like the find bit's one, two and three, add some gems or whatnot and give it to the Caledonian dwarf to McGuyver into something awesome *shrugs*

 

So that leaves the rest of my dough. Stuff that would amuse me to do with my money:

 

1. Bribe people and make awesome stuff happen in the story

2. Pay NPCs to do stuff they otherwise wouldn't do

3. Buy craftsmen to move into my lair / tower / castle and do cool stuff for me

4. Be able to re-skin my character in a unique way by paying for more awesome stuff

5. Be able to be ludicrously altruistic and have people lurve me and want my babies

6. Be able to undermine economies with my generosity

7. Buy a small army to cause havoc

8. Buy and sell slaves

9. Set up a merchant caravan like that cool NWN SoZ minigame

10. Go to an exclusive tavern where you can only get in for silly amounts of money. Then blow it up.

11. Be able to pay a mysterious man on top of a mountain oodles of gold to unlock a whole easter-egg of different potions

12. Be able to pay a beguiling witch to put curses on folks I don't like AND SHE DOESN'T TAKE MASTERCARD

13. I want to be able to Always Pay My Debts

14. Like at the end of BG2, there's a secret phat lewt shoppe only for the mega-rich uber-adventurer

15. I'd like a ship. My own ship. This would cost me a shed-load of money to buy, maintain and keep looking nice

16. I want cannons on my ship, and golden filigree in my wardroom

17. I want to pay crappy low-level adventurers to do s**t for me

18. Enjoy silly drinking games like BG1/2 where impossibly expensive and exotic drinks earn you rumours and maybe reputation or titles (the boozy version of that sitting-in-the-ice-cold-bath game from NWN2 MotB

19. Etc.

 

I know a lot of this looks quest related, but by injecting some honest-to-god capitalism into Project Eternity I'm sure there's loads of stuff we can do with our extra loot.

[SerRodrik]

Not necessarily advocating this, but we always use gold to buy components in RPGs, but has there ever been an RPG where gold is an actual component? In other words, using gold in ways other than buying. 

 

I think gold/currency is one mechanic that I have not seen played around with ever (exception may be Dark Souls). 

Well, there was the bottlecap mine in Fallout 3 and New Vegas.

 

Edit: And the 12 gauge coin shot from New Vegas that used legion denarii.

Edited July 3, 2013 by SerRodrik