Mass Effect 3

[Calax]

And volo shows that opposite post is in effect.

[Pop]

It's worth noting that one of the more interesting things about ME3 is how it works w/r/t Wrex.

If you kill Wrex in ME1, then Wreav takes over in his stead. Unlike Wrex, Wreav is pretty obviously intent on getting payback against the other races of the galaxy as soon as the war on the Reapers ends. This puts the Genophage dilemma in a pretty intriguingly new place. I think it's the only circumstance under which you can convince Mordin to not cure the Genophage and the only circumstance in which he lives.

Edited March 14, 2012 by Pop

[Tale]

You could not only choose Morinth over Samara, you could let her talk you into sex later on your ship with her claiming that you were so powerful you'd survive.

 

Yeah. Right.

 

Hm, one thing that has me curious, The Rachni Queen issue, and Grunt. Is it possible for him to actually die on that mission or is he always going to survive? Or is there some weird decision/choice you made earlier that effects that?

 

I mean, apparently Mirando only survives the Sanctuary if you mention KL to her during one of the earlier conversations with her.. (Although I haven't tried not mentioning him as an experiment yet...).

 

Thane is dead regardless of your choices, I mean, either quietly off screen or in the process of saving the Salarian Council member..

 

Mordin pretty much pulls a Spock (or..well, other things).

 

Kasumi fakes her death, but Shep realises it. Has anyone managed a different result there?

 

I don't think its possible for Zaeed to die off in his short encounter... And even with everything going on, it seems pretty clear that Jacob is an automatically survive his extraction as well..

 

Explains why Zaeed died in my first playthrough. It was with my character which I basically said...screw you Zaeed, I'm helping the workers!

You can help the workers fine, you just need to do a charm check at the end.

[Nepenthe]

No wonder you guys've been bitching about the lack of CC in the games, you've missed all of it.

 

Just started a second playthrough. Really annoyed that I couldn't get the resolution I wanted for the Quarian missions because Legion had died in my imported game. That only happened because I had done too good a job and no one had died on the suicide mission up to that point, so the game just chose one at random for effect. I had all the loyalty missions etc.

There's nothing random in the suicide mission deaths. The most one often assumed to be "random" are the "hold the line" deaths, which are actually based on a fairly simple mathematic formula, where some crew members are better at holding a fortified positions (Archangel, Grunt, Zaeed), some are bad at it (at least tali, mordin and kasumi). You just have to make sure that the big guns are at the line and preferably send one of the weakest ones to accompany the crew back to the Normandy.

 

Of course, it's possible you ran into some kind of bug I've never heard of, but by design, there are no random elements in the suicide mission deaths.

[Gorth]

No wonder you guys've been bitching about the lack of CC in the games, you've missed all of it.

 

Just started a second playthrough. Really annoyed that I couldn't get the resolution I wanted for the Quarian missions because Legion had died in my imported game. That only happened because I had done too good a job and no one had died on the suicide mission up to that point, so the game just chose one at random for effect. I had all the loyalty missions etc.

There's nothing random in the suicide mission deaths. The most one often assumed to be "random" are the "hold the line" deaths, which are actually based on a fairly simple mathematic formula, where some crew members are better at holding a fortified positions (Archangel, Grunt, Zaeed), some are bad at it (at least tali, mordin and kasumi). You just have to make sure that the big guns are at the line and preferably send one of the weakest ones to accompany the crew back to the Normandy.

 

Of course, it's possible you ran into some kind of bug I've never heard of, but by design, there are no random elements in the suicide mission deaths.

I think some of the confusion stems from not being the "obvious" one that dies from a less than optimal choice.

[Maria Caliban]

Just started a second playthrough. Really annoyed that I couldn't get the resolution I wanted for the Quarian missions because Legion had died in my imported game. That only happened because I had done too good a job and no one had died on the suicide mission up to that point, so the game just chose one at random for effect. I had all the loyalty missions etc.

Not sure what you mean. It's possible to do the suicide mission without a single casualty. I managed it on my first playthrough.

 

Casey Hudson is awesome in the interview.

I find David Silverman and Casey Hudson to both be insufferable. Of course, Casey said that Liara/FemShep weren't really gay, so I'm strongly biased.

Edited March 14, 2012 by Maria Caliban

[Nepenthe]

I think some of the confusion stems from not being the "obvious" one that dies from a less than optimal choice.

Good point, I keep assuming it's just the Line that causes confusion, but there are indeed multiple other options (like the tech specialist being killed for a number of reasons not related to using the right tech specialist) that might not be obvious.

 

I find David Silverman and Casey Hudson to both be insufferable. Of course, Casey said that Liara/FemShep weren't really gay, so I'm strongly biased.

Casey seems to channel the X-Files' Chris Carter in a lot of interviews. Should've been prophetic, I guess.

[Humanoid]

There is some notable reactivity in the third game to choices made in the first two. Not as much as in The Witcher or AP, of course, but it's there. The thing is that it almost exclusively relates not to different situations that the player is put in but in which characters are involved in scenes. For example

 

The character of Kai Leng will always attempt, and always fail, to kill the Salarian councilor during Cerberus' siege on the Citadel midway through the game. However, there are different ways that scene can play out.

 

Someone has to die, but who dies depends on Shepard's actions in previous games. "First priority" of sorts is Thane Krios, the Drell assassin from ME2. If he's alive at the end of ME2 and you make contact with him early in ME3, when Kai Leng shows up Thane will intervene and prevent the assassination before being killed. If Thane is dead or (as in my case) alive but contact has not been made, it goes to "second priority" which is Major Kirrahe, the Salarian Commando who assists Shepard in the siege of Saren's base near the end of ME1 (if you do a few things during the fight through the base, he'll survive, otherwise he'll die). If Kirrahe is alive, he serves as a decoy and is killed in the Salarian councilor's stead. If both Thane and Kirrahe are dead, then apparently whichever team member you saved at the end of ME1 - Kaidan or Ashley - dies to protect the councilor.

 

There are other things as well - for example, if you persuaded Jack from ME2 to be more renegade-like in ME2, or you chose the serial killer Asari Morinth over her mother Samara, both will appear in ME3 but will be indoctrinated and turned into monsters by the Reapers. In my ending, Miranda appeared and was killed by Kai Leng, but that apparently doesn't always happen - I think having Thane stop Leng earlier in the game makes a difference.

 

 

I daresay that first instance is a perfect example of C&NC - choice and non-consequence. No matter what you do, an equivalent replacement gets drafted in so the plot direction can proceed with zero effective alteration. A number of other spoilers I've read seem to indicate this is pretty much the most common way of dealing with the living/dead status of all the NPCs in the previous games - though that Wrex one seems a little bit better than the norm.

 

(I've gone into don't-care-about-spoilers mode now and just reading freely since I've decided to just wait it out a while)

[Nepenthe]

There is some notable reactivity in the third game to choices made in the first two. Not as much as in The Witcher or AP, of course, but it's there. The thing is that it almost exclusively relates not to different situations that the player is put in but in which characters are involved in scenes. For example

 

The character of Kai Leng will always attempt, and always fail, to kill the Salarian councilor during Cerberus' siege on the Citadel midway through the game. However, there are different ways that scene can play out.

 

Someone has to die, but who dies depends on Shepard's actions in previous games. "First priority" of sorts is Thane Krios, the Drell assassin from ME2. If he's alive at the end of ME2 and you make contact with him early in ME3, when Kai Leng shows up Thane will intervene and prevent the assassination before being killed. If Thane is dead or (as in my case) alive but contact has not been made, it goes to "second priority" which is Major Kirrahe, the Salarian Commando who assists Shepard in the siege of Saren's base near the end of ME1 (if you do a few things during the fight through the base, he'll survive, otherwise he'll die). If Kirrahe is alive, he serves as a decoy and is killed in the Salarian councilor's stead. If both Thane and Kirrahe are dead, then apparently whichever team member you saved at the end of ME1 - Kaidan or Ashley - dies to protect the councilor.

 

There are other things as well - for example, if you persuaded Jack from ME2 to be more renegade-like in ME2, or you chose the serial killer Asari Morinth over her mother Samara, both will appear in ME3 but will be indoctrinated and turned into monsters by the Reapers. In my ending, Miranda appeared and was killed by Kai Leng, but that apparently doesn't always happen - I think having Thane stop Leng earlier in the game makes a difference.

 

 

I daresay that first instance is a perfect example of C&NC - choice and non-consequence. No matter what you do, an equivalent replacement gets drafted in so the plot direction can proceed with zero effective alteration. A number of other spoilers I've read seem to indicate this is pretty much the most common way of dealing with the living/dead status of all the NPCs in the previous games - though that Wrex one seems a little bit better than the norm.

 

(I've gone into don't-care-about-spoilers mode now and just reading freely since I've decided to just wait it out a while)

The personnel changes also result in different outcomes, but, yes, I don't think there is radical branching at any point, and the ending zeroes any choices you've made, in any case. Talking with people will bring out a ton of minor differences though (like which doctor you recruit onto your ship, who lives and who dies of your former companions, occasional cases of a third door being present when all the right people are in the right place etc.)

[Humanoid]

The implication being that there's just the one path throughout, but choices just add or subtract a bit of scenery outside the train window as you steam past. (Then taking the analogy to its logical conclusion, the train runs off the wrecked wooden bridge at the end )

[Nepenthe]

The implication being that there's just the one path throughout, but choices just add or subtract a bit of scenery outside the train window as you steam past. (Then taking the analogy to its logical conclusion, the train runs off the wrecked wooden bridge at the end )

Or the train stops at different stations on the same track, depending on the ticket you've bought.

 

But yes, it does run off a bridge at the end, no disagreement there.

[BobSmith101]

It was very much a game of ups and downs. I think had I owned the 360 version and hard to do the disk swapping some people mentioned I'd just have given up on it. Where the pacing is good the game flows nicely, then you get bogged down in that pointless fed ex/scan stuff. Which you have to do because it impacts on the endings.

That takes up half of the game time and I'm not going through that again just for a different colour ending. Quite how Bioware can defend something that they so blatently "borrowed" from Deus Ex is beyond belief.

 

I managed to get everyone to show up except the Salarians who only sent a token force of 200 points. That put me a little under 4000 with no MP.

Quarian/Geth depends quite a bit on what you did in ME2 as does Krogan/Salarian. You have to do quite a bit of meta gaming to get them all by the look of things.

[HoonDing]

I'm playing with my Paragon now and every moment with that stupid kid is painful to go through again.

 

As bad as the last 5 minutes of the ending were, what bothers me most about the entire London mission is

how the Citadel suddenly shows up at Earth. What's the explanation for that? All I can think of is the Star Child moving it there. But if Star Child is capable of such a feat, why then didn't it send in the Reapers during ME1 when the Keeper signal failed?

 

 

[BobSmith101]

I'm playing with my Paragon now and every moment with that stupid kid is painful to go through again.

 

As bad as the last 5 minutes of the ending were, what bothers me most about the entire London mission is

how the Citadel suddenly shows up at Earth. What's the explanation for that? All I can think of is the Star Child moving it there. But if Star Child is capable of such a feat, why then didn't it send in the Reapers during ME1 when the Keeper signal failed?

 

 

 

I had a game breaking bug on the first visit to the Citadel second time around. I took that as a sign I should not play the game again.

[Nepenthe]

It was very much a game of ups and downs. I think had I owned the 360 version and hard to do the disk swapping some people mentioned I'd just have given up on it. Where the pacing is good the game flows nicely, then you get bogged down in that pointless fed ex/scan stuff. Which you have to do because it impacts on the endings.

That takes up half of the game time and I'm not going through that again just for a different colour ending. Quite how Bioware can defend something that they so blatently "borrowed" from Deus Ex is beyond belief.

 

I managed to get everyone to show up except the Salarians who only sent a token force of 200 points. That put me a little under 4000 with no MP.

Quarian/Geth depends quite a bit on what you did in ME2 as does Krogan/Salarian. You have to do quite a bit of meta gaming to get them all by the look of things.

I find the problem with the ending to be less the fact that it was last seen in DXHR, but the fact that it SUCKED there, as well. And they were better endings.

 

I think the 200 point thing is actually the whole Salarian navy. Their advanced espionage capabilities are of very limited use towards the reapers. IIRC I got a separate STG unit, as well.

 

+ they used to eat flies...

[Majek]

I'm playing with my Paragon now and every moment with that stupid kid is painful to go through again.

 

As bad as the last 5 minutes of the ending were, what bothers me most about the entire London mission is

how the Citadel suddenly shows up at Earth. What's the explanation for that? All I can think of is the Star Child moving it there. But if Star Child is capable of such a feat, why then didn't it send in the Reapers during ME1 when the Keeper signal failed?

 

 

Because the lead writer wasn't an idiot back then. :D

 

And poor Joker's sister. ;_;

Edited March 14, 2012 by Majek

[Deraldin]

I'm playing with my Paragon now and every moment with that stupid kid is painful to go through again.

 

As bad as the last 5 minutes of the ending were, what bothers me most about the entire London mission is

how the Citadel suddenly shows up at Earth. What's the explanation for that? All I can think of is the Star Child moving it there. But if Star Child is capable of such a feat, why then didn't it send in the Reapers during ME1 when the Keeper signal failed?

 

 

 

The Reapers moved the Citadel. TIM told them it was the Catalyst that was required for the use of the Crucible so they brought it to Earth to keep it under guard.

 

[HoonDing]

They... towed it?

[Raithe]

Nepenthe, I think the c&c through the majority of the game is damn good. And the way it carries from the previous games. I can say I really enjoyed seeing all the variations as you play through it.

 

My problem is that the ending invalidates every choice you've made. It's like there's a sudden switch and no follow through on anything you've done.

 

The whole assault through London is okay, you get fallout from what war assets you managed to develop, and that final line of communication with characters/squad mates who've survived that far. But the moment they suddenly inflict the Harbringer assault, and go into slow motion, and lengthy cutscenes and every single choice you've made has no meaning from that point on. Also, the ending (regardless of which 3 buttons you press) pretty much throws all growth you've fostered in people out of the window. And there's no freaking closure to the story.

 

If they'd only given some vague "over the next decade - this happened, so and so did this" in regards to people you went paragon/renegade etc with.. it would have had more meaning regardless of how silly the "Star Child" was.

[BobSmith101]

They... towed it?

 

It probably got there the same way as the squad on Earth got to the Normandy. "Space Magic".

[Gorth]

+ they used to eat flies...

I did guffaw when Javik told they used to lick their eyes

 

[Malcador]

 

Actually Kai Leng can kill the councilor he did for me. I think this is due to my not seeing Thane fast enough and Kirrahe dying on Surkesh. She tries to cloak and he kills her with some biotic attack I'm guessing, later Udina tries to frame me for it.  Was satisfying to kill Udina, too.

 

 

They really like the "One squad member must unlock/hack/disable this console, cover him!" mechanic.

Edited March 14, 2012 by Malcador

[Gorgon]

You couldn't actually chose Samara's daugther over Samara in Me2. I tired, Samara won anyway and didn't seem bothered by the experience.

 

Yes, you could.

You just needed a truck load of renegade points to pull it off.

 

I forget about the whole retarded light side/dark side point thing that forces you to chose whatever option is red or blue instead of what makes sense. If you want these special options that is. Legion died at the second checkpoint. After the swarms and biotich barrier thing. Hadn't picked him for anything at all.

Edited March 14, 2012 by Gorgon

[Raithe]

I forget about the whole retarded light side/dark side point thing that forces you to chose whatever option is red or blue instead of what makes sense. If you want these special options that is. Legion died at the first checkpoint, hadn't picked him for anything. The only choice I had made previously was sending Tali down that tube thing.

 

I wouldn't say light side/ dark side thing. It was more if you consistently played Shep one way rather then bounce between the two approaches..

 

Seriously, it wasn't that hard to have everyone survive. You did the loyalty missions, you picked up the ship upgrades. And you made a couple of common sense choices in regards to a> who can hack/deal with tech - ie: Tali, Legion or Kasumi, b> which characters have experience in leading teams (Garrus or Miranda pretty much, possibly Jacob), and c>who actually has serious biotic powers (either Samara or Jack)..

[Malcador]

Was funny on my first playthrough, I chose Jacob for the vent role. He ended up dying but at least I got a laugh out of the black guy dying first. But yes, it's more work to get the team members killed off than not. I did have Thane die if I took Legion with me after one stage, both were loyal - I guess there's some hidden formula.