Politics Thread: 13 Ghosts

[smjjames]

I don't know about the UK (though I've heard the mail system is owned by the queen or something), but the post office here is federally owned, which technically makes it not a monopoly. However, it's still a monopoly in the sense that they're the only ones allowed to deliver letters and stuff. UPS, FedEx, and other package carriers get around this by delivering packages instead.

[Bartimaeus]

You either have monopolies and regulation to stop them ripping people off, or you have no regulation and proper competition. No regulation and monopolies is always a recipe for both a rip off cost and a qualitatively bad service.

 

That's a pretty good summary for describing regulations vs. competition. Unfortunately, we're stuck with the final situation in a lot of industries, especially internet.

[Zoraptor]

I'm starting to think that Muhhamed bin Salman is reverse Midas. Ali Abdullah Saleh was the power broker in Yemen for the best part of 4 decades and it took MbS 2 entire days to get him killed. Same day that Hariri fully withdrew his resignation in Lebanon and the GCC imploded.

 

And it looks pretty definite that Trump is going to move the US embassy in Israel, which will no doubt please his son in law and apocalyptic born agains but pretty much no one else.

[Gfted1]

Why is it a big deal if the embassy is moved from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem? That's where our consulate is.

[Malcador]

Why is it a big deal if the embassy is moved from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem? That's where our consulate is.

 

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/12/05/why-trumps-promise-to-move-us-embassy-to-jerusalem-is-so-controversial.html

 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/dec/05/jerusalem-embassy-move-can-the-saudis-stay-trumps-hand

[Ben No.3]

Regarding the selling guns/ropes thing...

 

Wouldn’t the difference be that a rope can be used to kill and a gun is designed to kill?

[Ben No.3]

 

Regarding the selling guns/ropes thing...

 

Wouldn’t the difference be that a rope can be used to kill and a gun is designed to kill?

Gun is designed to defend and protect.

 

Trump 2020!

by threatening to kill.

[Pidesco]

 

Regarding the selling guns/ropes thing...

 

Wouldn’t the difference be that a rope can be used to kill and a gun is designed to kill?

 

Gun is designed to defend and protect.

 

Trump 2020!

 

 

Like cannons. Or mustard gas.

[Guard Dog]

I started to write what was growing into a lengthy response to  some the the ideas being discussed. But about 200 words in it seemed like such a hassle. Some days tilting at windmills takes too much effort.

[redneckdevil]

Regarding the selling guns/ropes thing...

 

Wouldn’t the difference be that a rope can be used to kill and a gun is designed to kill?

Since they are both tools, the design doesn't really matter to much. It maybe weird outside the country, but here most Americans view guns design in the same way as a kitchen knife. They both tools that have a purpose (guns-hunting/protection, kitchen knife-cut and Pierce flesh) but can easily end a life thru purpose or accident.

[Pidesco]

 

Regarding the selling guns/ropes thing...

 

Wouldn’t the difference be that a rope can be used to kill and a gun is designed to kill?

Since they are both tools, the design doesn't really matter to much. It maybe weird outside the country, but here most Americans view guns design in the same way as a kitchen knife. They both tools that have a purpose (guns-hunting/protection, kitchen knife-cut and Pierce flesh) but can easily end a life thru purpose or accident.

 

 

I have to disagree. Guns are your cultural fetish, I'd argue. A sizeable percentage of Americans doesn't spend an inordinate amount of time at knife ranges, or have special knife cabinets, or make a ritual out of cleaning knives or hold huge knife conventions. Also, a National Knife Association with 5 million members does not exist.

 

All the talk about how guns are for protection, or that they are useful tools, or even that they are an inalienable right is all just a rationalization. It's not even about the killing. The simple truth is that you love owning, looking at, and using guns. A lot. They are a cultural staple for many. In and of itself, individually, there's not much wrong with this. People should love doing whatever they want and most people that love guns are responsible about it.

 

The problem is that this cultural status ends up being the reason why there are so many gun deaths in the US. That so many people have an emotional relationship with guns means that, statistically, some guns will inevitably end up in the hands of those that are careless, dumb, incompetent or mentally ill in some way. This inevitably gets people killed.

[redneckdevil]

 

 

Regarding the selling guns/ropes thing...

 

Wouldn’t the difference be that a rope can be used to kill and a gun is designed to kill?

Since they are both tools, the design doesn't really matter to much. It maybe weird outside the country, but here most Americans view guns design in the same way as a kitchen knife. They both tools that have a purpose (guns-hunting/protection, kitchen knife-cut and Pierce flesh) but can easily end a life thru purpose or accident.

I have to disagree. Guns are your cultural fetish, I'd argue. A sizeable percentage of Americans doesn't spend an inordinate amount of time at knife ranges, or have special knife cabinets, or make a ritual out of cleaning knives or hold huge knife knife conventions. Also, a National Knife Association, with 5 million members does not exist.

 

All the talk about how guns are for protection, or that they are useful tools, or even that they are an inalienable right is all just a rationalization. It's not even about the killing. The simple truth is that you love owning, looking at, and using guns. A lot. They are a cultural staple for many. In and of itself, individually, there's not much wrong with this. People should love doing whatever they want and most people that love guns are responsible about it.

 

The problem is that this cultural status ends up being the reason why there are so many gun deaths in the US. That so many people have an emotional relationship with guns means that, statistically, some guns will inevitably end up in the hands of those that are careless, dumb, incompetent or mentally ill in some way. This inevitably gets people killed.

Minus the generalization, what ur saying is that because people have guns, there will be deaths by guns....of course, just like having swimming pools causes more people to die from drowning. If ur okay with a small amount of victims drowning then ur okay owning and supporting having swimming pools. It's one of those accepted factors like how there are 4-5 times more deaths and 20 times more injuries with knives but we ain't going bananas Everytime one happens, it's the same idea with guns here.

 

The thing is think of how the Muslims are viewed as extremists and apply that to "gun nuts" as far as the numbers of them. There's far far far less than people think lol.

Edited December 7, 2017 by redneckdevil

[Pidesco]

Yes, basically it's a question of quantity. The US has an incredibly large number of guns in circulation, in comparison to other developed countries. Statistically, that means people are going to die from them, especially as guns are really, really, really, really dangerous. Really.

 

 

Having a small percentage of people that are irresponsible with rifles leads to a lot more deaths, than a small percentage of people that are irresponsible with swimming pools.

[ShadySands]

I guess I'm the only person here who has been to a knife and cutlery show

[Gfted1]

Maybe we just need more......TRIGGER warnings! AAAAAAHAHHHAHAHAHAHAHA! 

[Malcador]

I guess I'm the only person here who has been to a knife and cutlery show

What kind of stuff goes on there?

[redneckdevil]

I guess I'm the only person here who has been to a knife and cutlery show

Ur not, I love those!

[ShadySands]

 

I guess I'm the only person here who has been to a knife and cutlery show

What kind of stuff goes on there?

It's like a gun show or a job fair... but with knives

 

[Malcador]

Just knives ? No forks ? Bah, forget that noise.

[injurai]

I'm always fascinated by the variety and tastes in knife designs.

 

So many of them are just so garish to me.

[ShadySands]

Just knives ? No forks ? Bah, forget that noise.

Most of the ones I've been to had the full kitchen setup occasionally for sale. I very nearly bought a collection of hand forged eating utensils but in the end I just couldn't justify the price to myself

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

 

 

 

Regarding the selling guns/ropes thing...

Wouldn’t the difference be that a rope can be used to kill and a gun is designed to kill?

Since they are both tools, the design doesn't really matter to much. It maybe weird outside the country, but here most Americans view guns design in the same way as a kitchen knife. They both tools that have a purpose (guns-hunting/protection, kitchen knife-cut and Pierce flesh) but can easily end a life thru purpose or accident.

I have to disagree. Guns are your cultural fetish, I'd argue. A sizeable percentage of Americans doesn't spend an inordinate amount of time at knife ranges, or have special knife cabinets, or make a ritual out of cleaning knives or hold huge knife knife conventions. Also, a National Knife Association, with 5 million members does not exist.

All the talk about how guns are for protection, or that they are useful tools, or even that they are an inalienable right is all just a rationalization. It's not even about the killing. The simple truth is that you love owning, looking at, and using guns. A lot. They are a cultural staple for many. In and of itself, individually, there's not much wrong with this. People should love doing whatever they want and most people that love guns are responsible about it.

The problem is that this cultural status ends up being the reason why there are so many gun deaths in the US. That so many people have an emotional relationship with guns means that, statistically, some guns will inevitably end up in the hands of those that are careless, dumb, incompetent or mentally ill in some way. This inevitably gets people killed.

Minus the generalization, what ur saying is that because people have guns, there will be deaths by guns....of course, just like having swimming pools causes more people to die from drowning. If ur okay with a small amount of victims drowning then ur okay owning and supporting having swimming pools. It's one of those accepted factors like how there are 4-5 times more deaths and 20 times more injuries with knives but we ain't going bananas Everytime one happens, it's the same idea with guns here.

The thing is think of how the Muslims are viewed as extremists and apply that to "gun nuts" as far as the numbers of them. There's far far far less than people think lol.

And in response to drowning there are several "swimming pool control" laws like Virgina Graham Baker and if a kid drowned in a pool I am willing to bet you will see regulations about warning signs or child proof fences around the pool or SVRS pumps being required. For guns some dude can check into a hotel room and gun down country music fans and no laws will pass concerning guns. Whatever your feelings are on the matter, that guns receieve special treatment is a fact.

[Gfted1]

If only there were already gun control laws in place....what a missed opportunity.

[Ben No.3]

In Germany, we distinguish between ownership and property. Ownership means that you are the legal owner of something, property means you can also use it.

 

Why am I telling you this? There are two articles regarding property in the German constitution. The first one, the one I want to look at right now, is article 14, which states that 1) the state grants property within certain limits and 2) that “[owning] property bears responsibility. It should always be used in a way that also serves the common good.”

Because of this rationale, only hunters and sportsmen can own guns in the sense of property around here, and those are strictly regulated. Anyone else, including police, soldiers etc can only own guns in the sense of ownership, not property (at least this is how I remember it). So, if you have a gun, you’ll perhaps give it to the police to store it there. You can sell it, but you can’t use it. Police and soldiers can’t take their weapons home either. So the most dangerous weapon I could buy and use around here would probably be a crossbow.

 

This discussion probably won’t lead anywhere. I’m guessing the cultural barriers are too high. It always seemed to me, that America assumes a very positive idea of human nature.... trusting anyone with guns. Perhaps because, aside from the civil war and the partial ethnic cleansing of the indigenous population, you didn’t have much war in your homeland. Europe of course is marked by centuries of warfare; I guess a rather cynical attitude towards human nature comes with that.

[Amentep]

I guess I'm the only person here who has been to a knife and cutlery show

 

Besides the knife shows, I think there are two different organizations - one for knife collectors (National Knife Collectors Association) and one more geared towards ownership and legislation (American Knife and Tool Institute) - that are knife related.