The US Election 2016, Part VII

[Gfted1]

 

My god is Clinton ferociously unattractive. I wanted to punch her directly in her sneering, eye rolling face and I only watched about 10 minutes.

Ladies and Gentlemen, the double-standard!

 

('Cause, you know, the obese toupee'd septuagenarian who uses Cheeto dust as a skin-care treatment was lookin' hot!)

 

Still not as bad as Clinton. Woof

[Pidesco]

That's something that shouldn't matter one iota.

[Gfted1]

And yet here I am. Just looking into her condescending face makes me not care at all about what shes saying.

[Malcador]

 

 

 

 

My god is Clinton ferociously unattractive. I wanted to punch her directly in her sneering, eye rolling face and I only watched about 10 minutes.

Ladies and Gentlemen, the double-standard!

 

('Cause, you know, the obese toupee'd septuagenarian who uses Cheeto dust as a skin-care treatment was lookin' hot!)

Well to be fair to Gfted, he didn't say Trump was handsome.

[BruceVC]

And yet here I am. Just looking into her condescending face makes me not care at all about what shes saying.

You shouldn't be judging Hilary Clinton on her looks. I appreciate your honesty but your opinion, which probably is not intentional,  highlights the constant levels of bias she faces from many of her detractors  that a male presidential candidate wouldn't have to face.

 

No male candidate would get this type of criticism in this way ...."  I dont like what she says because she is aesthetically displeasing to me " 

 

Anyway for the record I thought she looked fine, she also was more presidential than Trump because you can see she really studied the issues and worked hard to prepare for this debate. It was obvious Trump had put no effort into understanding the core issues and he used his usual tactics of hyperbole, theatre and unsubstantiated comments in most of the debate 

 

Also when you watch the debate with the twin camera view you can see he starts looking visibly annoyed and frustrated as the debate continues, she remains phlegmatic and reserved most of the time. She has a much better control of her emotions than Trump

Edited September 27, 2016 by BruceVC

[Wrath of Dagon]

 

No what I was specifically referring to is Hillary Clinton seems to either not understand or is choosing to ignore WHY businesses leave the country. There is only one reason: it costs more to operate a business in the United States than it does wherever the hell they are moving. So to fix this her solution is to increase taxes and regulatory compliance costs and make it even MORE expensive to stay. That is like using gasoline to put out a fire.

Over-regulation is mostly a red herring in the off-shoring argument.  It can be a factor (mostly in heavily polluting industries that no American really wants to live near), but for most businesses it pales in comparison to the fact that Americans are expensive to employ.  And no amount of tax reduction and deregulation is going to make American labor rates comparable to those in Bangladesh.

 

Anyhow, the biggest driver in the loss of American manufacturing jobs isn't firms going overseas-- it's mechanization.  American manufacturing output has actually been recovering in recent years, but it's doing so with the kind of factories that employ 5 engineers and lots of robots instead of 50 union workers on an assembly line.

 

Over-regulation is one of the things that drives up costs. You can't just say it's one thing and not the other. Also the workers in Bangladesh don't necessarily have the same capabilities that American workers have. You can't just do a straight comparison of wages. Edit: Disparity in wages isn't something we can do much about, but the regulatory and tax environment is in our control. So it's valid to try to come up with the best environment to make us globally competitive. Edited September 27, 2016 by Wrath of Dagon

[Gfted1]

Weird. I'm pretty sure I subconsciously initially judge and categorize everyone based on their look. I can not like you from across the room just because I don't like your face. Also, if your eyes aren't level with each other, you're probably a shady mug.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

You don't need much qualifications to do the factory jobs. We're living in a global economic system, if you think the vast majority of manufacturers are going to take a more expensive option over a cheaper one, you're an idealist who doesn't understand self-interest. The fact is western(Yuropoor and Amerifat) workers can not compete with third world workers in terms of wages, even factoring in deregulation and costs of shipping. The manufacturing jobs are being decimated by automation as well, they ain't coming back no matter what laws get passed or what trade deals get signed.

[Wrath of Dagon]

Your other costs in third world countries could be a lot higher though, transportation, energy, corruption, political instability. As manufacturing jobs become more automated, an educated worker becomes more valuable than a cheap worker.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

And yet here we are with all those factors and it's still cheaper to pay those workers less in a day than western minimum wage and ship products than it would be to produce them paying whatever the standard is for workers to make them in the west.

If you think these companies are incapable of training a smaller workforce in the third-world to maintain the automation of factories who will still work for less than a western counterpart, you're badly mistaken.

 

Face it, this is what our global economic system is. It ain't going back no matter what policies are passed or what candidate is elected.

[Pidesco]

Generally, labor costs trump everything, as Trump will probably tell you.

[Longknife]

 

And yet here I am. Just looking into her condescending face makes me not care at all about what shes saying.

 

No male candidate would get this type of criticism in this way ...."  I dont like what she says because she is aesthetically displeasing to me "

 

 

I'm sorry, didn't we spend a little under a decade comparing George Dubya Bush to a monkey and suggesting that's another tip-off he's just not that bright...?

[Raithe]

[Volourn]

"No male candidate would get this type of criticism in this way ...."  

 

That's a lie.

 

I noticed alkso how Bruce posted the CNN poll  cause it fits his agenda but ignores the polls that have Trump winning.

 

PS. they both lost last night but not as much as people who watched it. I'd personally give Trump the edge on his goals and Hillary an edge on performance. She came across as more 'presidential' and 'political'. But,  her stupid use of feels failed. But, as other shave mentioned, she has no idea how to keep jobs in the country.   Taking business owners  upwards of 60% of their earnings isn't going to make them stay. On top of that, she will waste taxes.  And, he often came across as mumbling nonsense when he went on a tangent.

Edited September 27, 2016 by Volourn

[Enoch]

 

 

And yet here I am. Just looking into her condescending face makes me not care at all about what shes saying.

 

No male candidate would get this type of criticism in this way ...."  I dont like what she says because she is aesthetically displeasing to me "

 

 

I'm sorry, didn't we spend a little under a decade comparing George Dubya Bush to a monkey and suggesting that's another tip-off he's just not that bright...?

 

Um, no, we didn't? 

 

I mean, sure, political cartoonists and the like have always caricatured prominent politicians for laughs, in ways that play into their perceived weaknesses.  But nobody was looking at W and saying out loud that "he's so unattractive, I can't bear to listen to him." 

 

Anyhow, Bruce missed the worst part of Gfted's post.  It was the .  So, not only is he judging a female candidate based on her appearance, while considering a male candidate's appearance (correctly) irrelevant to his qualifications, he is also demonstrating that, although he's aware of this judgmental double-standard, he doesn't care that he's perpetuating it.  That's institutional sexism in a nutshell right there.

[Volourn]

That has nothing to do with 'institutional sexism'. It has to do with one person. Male cnadiates have also been attacked or praised for their looks. Look at both Trudeau and Obama. People **** over their 'good looks'.

[Wrath of Dagon]

I didn't know Gifted is an institution. I know he's a mod and all but that's quite a promotion.

[Bokishi]

 

 

 

 

And yet here I am. Just looking into her condescending face makes me not care at all about what shes saying.

No male candidate would get this type of criticism in this way ...." I dont like what she says because she is aesthetically displeasing to me "

 

I'm sorry, didn't we spend a little under a decade comparing George Dubya Bush to a monkey and suggesting that's another tip-off he's just not that bright...?

Being smug and condescending is not exclusive to one gender though. There are plenty of women in politics who are more likable

[Gfted1]

Rofl. If it makes the internet warriors feel better, I form opinions and judgements on either sex based on appearance. But while Enoch was busy rending his shirt he may have inadvertently hit on the answer, I should only pay attention to the debates via radio!

[Amentep]

 

It seems that establishment is claiming Clinton won, but people chose Trump in all polls.

No surprises there.

 

http://www.infowars.com/poll-who-won-the-first-presidential-debate/

 

Online polls? Really? They might as well include our little presidential election thread.

 

 

Why not? It's a valuable public record!

 

Well except we didn't appear to run a poll in 2012.

[BruceVC]

 

 

 

And yet here I am. Just looking into her condescending face makes me not care at all about what shes saying.

 

No male candidate would get this type of criticism in this way ...."  I dont like what she says because she is aesthetically displeasing to me "

 

 

I'm sorry, didn't we spend a little under a decade comparing George Dubya Bush to a monkey and suggesting that's another tip-off he's just not that bright...?

 

Um, no, we didn't? 

 

I mean, sure, political cartoonists and the like have always caricatured prominent politicians for laughs, in ways that play into their perceived weaknesses.  But nobody was looking at W and saying out loud that "he's so unattractive, I can't bear to listen to him." 

 

Anyhow, Bruce missed the worst part of Gfted's post.  It was the .  So, not only is he judging a female candidate based on her appearance, while considering a male candidate's appearance (correctly) irrelevant to his qualifications, he is also demonstrating that, although he's aware of this judgmental double-standard, he doesn't care that he's perpetuating it.  That's institutional sexism in a nutshell right there.

 

But guys on a serious note Enoch is right about institutional sexism and part of it does manifest itself in  the  unusual way we seem to criticize Hilary. Yes its not that everyone does this and of course reasonable criticism is normal and expected but there is something far too extreme in some of the issues some people have with Hilary

 

I am of the opinion most people dont realize they are actually judging Hilary on a gender bias perspective but it is real. I guess the best way to determine if you are being unfair is to ask yourself the honest question " would I say the exact same thing about my candidate  " ?

[Volourn]

Is this Bruce? White man Hillary supporter vs black woman Trump supporter: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJ-Obo4Sigk

 

I've only watched less than a minute so far but that's all it took to show how white democrats view blacks. That is some  interesting stuff. Goes back to watching the rest.

[Amentep]

To be fair, everyone seems to have missed where Gfted1 said he thought Hillary looked worse than Trump (implying he thought Trump looked bad too) and then said that he judged everyone on looks.  So he's not applying a double-standard to Hillary (judging Hillary by looks but Trump by some other standard), he's applying a standard you don't agree with (judging primarily by looks).

[Volourn]

As a fellow ugly person, I judge them both to be physically ugly. But, at least THEY have an excuse of being super old geezers. I'm just mildly old. L0L

[BruceVC]

Is this Bruce? White man Hillary supporter vs black woman Trump supporter: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJ-Obo4Sigk

 

I've only watched less than a minute so far but that's all it took to show how white democrats view blacks. That is some  interesting stuff. Goes back to watching the rest.

 

 

No thats not me, 

 

volo Trump has done terribly amongst African Americans, he has offended them on numerous opportunities 

 

Clinton has over 90 % of the AA vote. It is strange if AA support Trump considering his racist attitude, like the birther scandal, but people are of course entitled to vote for who they want