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Mishandled development

Obsidian development priorities failure

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#41
Xienzi

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- Too much content, do people really care about so many classes and so many plotline replays, which frankly, only the tiniest portion of people would ever consume?

 

- You focused on the quantity of the content, not quality.

 

- By focusing on the quantity instead of quality, you tricked people into this illusion of false dichotomy, that they will enjoy more content even if it is poorly realized, and in the process rendering yourselves as hardcore old-school developers who care about deep gameplay mechanics and story.

 

- Why not 6 classes instead of 11 ??

Do you really think that gameplay archetypes can be achieved if you shove as many character labels and "unique" spells as possible, instead of just dispersing various pertinent talents and abilities, properly implemented, across 6 classes?

 

- Ask yourselves; what is more enjoyable for the vast majority of people: creating highly polished reactive classes which visually emphasize how you lead and develop them in the gameworld, or shoving as much stuff as possible so you can say that the game has a lot of stuff ?

You actually are trying to put so much stuff in it that if you remove half of it, people would still think it's an epic RPG(of course, if it actually had production values)

 

- You completely failed at game development, this is not an interactive novel! 

It's a video game, put some production values in it like you did with Dungeon Siege 3. It's frankly embarrassing how you let your standards fall to the ground by entertaining this ludicrous notion you got from people when they tell you that they don't care about animations and graphics.

Don't trust them when they tell you this! 

They're confused because they're conflating categories and misinterpreting the nature of the product.

But when they actually start playing the game and everything feels like total crap because of those two foundational components(which most people can't pinpoint anyway) severely lacking, they will cluelessly let everyone know how much they have encouraged you to make it exactly like that!

 

Over 4 million dollars was more than adequate to make an enjoyable, epic, isometric, pseudo 3D RPG with high production values. Just stop listening to the incoherent nostalgia people; focus, polish, and streamline!

 

I agree that blindly listening to a single set of demographic can be a deterent, but the initial pitch for the project was to appeal to those gamers you call "incoherent nostalgia people", as we have so often said in your many posts. This has been stated many times, I imagine.

 

I also agree that by trying to adhere to the standards set by the old Infinity Engine games while concurrently trying to establish a core ruleset they could call their own resulted in a product full of hiccups. But that's why the community is here, no? Even you with your endless, shameless logical fallacies and ****flinging, is just one side of the criticism the game needs. Rather than aggressively latching onto other people's comments, you should probably keep your trolling focused on the game.


Edited by Xienzi, 03 October 2014 - 12:03 PM.


#42
Malignacious

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I also do not need voice-acting. I can read well enough. It might turn off the more ADD gamers but let's face it they weren't playing this anyway nor were AAA title buffs. 

 

I've never talked about this except in the sense that it needs token introductory lines when visiting shops and other NPCs, to set the tone.

So, something like in Hellgate London.


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#43
Sensuki

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obviously you don't understand humor, or the codex, or... something. am not sure what the nazi iconography is s'posed to convey to us. regardless, that kinda thing is, no doubt, exactly what obsidian is trying to promote with their message board community. *insert eye-roll emoticon*


You're sounding a bit sensitive there gromnir.

#44
Lephys

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- Why not 6 classes instead of 11 ??


Why not 1/3 of a class instead of 6? Clearly, more is worse, and fewer is better. That or you, alone, get to decide what's an appropriate number and what isn't. Because.

*thumbs up*

This thread needed starting so badly. Thanks for enriching my forum experience! 8D
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#45
Malignacious

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- Why not 6 classes instead of 11 ??


Why not 1/3 of a class instead of 6? Clearly, more is worse, and fewer is better. That or you, alone, get to decide what's an appropriate number and what isn't. Because.

 

Dungeon Siege 3 had 4 for a reason, disregarding the stupid decison of gender locking.



#46
Malignacious

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Anyway, there is nothing more to talk about on these forums so this will be my last post.

 

See you all in about 6 months.


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#47
Malekith

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- Why not 6 classes instead of 11 ??


Why not 1/3 of a class instead of 6? Clearly, more is worse, and fewer is better. That or you, alone, get to decide what's an appropriate number and what isn't. Because.

 

Dungeon Siege 3 had 4 for a reason, disregarding the stupid decison of gender locking.

 

If the kickstarter pitch was for Dungeon Siege 4, your complains would have merit. As it stands, they have not.

And if the kickstarter was for Dungeon Siege 4, i doubt they would have gather a single million.



#48
Gromnir

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obviously you don't understand humor, or the codex, or... something. am not sure what the nazi iconography is s'posed to convey to us. regardless, that kinda thing is, no doubt, exactly what obsidian is trying to promote with their message board community. *insert eye-roll emoticon*


You're sounding a bit sensitive there gromnir.

 

lord help us. is that your response? we know pre-teens that do better than this. 

 

...

 

no doubt, option 2 was, "i know you are, but what am i?" 

 

yes, you got us. the First Amendment attorney who has been an advocate for gang members, nazis and religious nut-jobs is "sensitive" regarding your... posts. go easy on the narcissism.

 

*snort*

 

and to stay on-topic. am confused by the dungeon siege reference. "Dungeon Siege 3 had 4 for a reason." well, am s'posing that is true. there is always a reason. your axiomatic statement is hardly illuminating. 

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

ps edit: we never actual defended gang members, nazis and/or religious nut-jobs. we hasn't done criminal for a long time, and we were prosecution side back then. we "defended" constitutional rights, but not criminal defense. apologies for possible confusion.


Edited by Gromnir, 03 October 2014 - 12:43 PM.

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#49
Skie Nightfall

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I have to say I did get alarmed with all of those stretch goals back in the Kickstarter. More classes are more complexity. I just hope OE know what they are doing, and made the budgeting correct. I do want quality.

 

A game that's suppose to be a spiritual successor to amazing games, and got 400% funding, should be on par with those games if not better. Period.



#50
Namutree

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Anyway, there is nothing more to talk about on these forums so this will be my last post.

 

See you all in about 6 months.

Good-bye! 

 

We get it Malignacious; you want poe to be like that living embodiment of mediocrity, Dungeon Siege 3. That game almost no one liked, and had no market appeal at all. Your idea that Obsidian should avoid the IE formula that guarantees success in favor of an approach that failed miserably already is beyond foolish.



#51
FireExit

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Anyway, there is nothing more to talk about on these forums so this will be my last post.

 

See you all in about 6 months.

Woohoo!



#52
FireExit

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Anyway, there is nothing more to talk about on these forums so this will be my last post.

 

See you all in about 6 months.

Good-bye! 

 

We get it Malignacious; you want poe to be like that living embodiment of mediocrity, Dungeon Siege 3. That game almost no one liked, and had no market appeal at all. Your idea that Obsidian should avoid the IE formula that guarantees success in favor of an approach that failed miserably already is beyond foolish.

 

This - I actually just reinstalled and played a bit of DS3 just in case my original thoughts of the game were jaded....

 

Nope, it's still a bad Diablo2 clone, nothing like the original DS

 

I will admit it's graphically pretty, but it lacks game play substance - Keep clicking til the mobs die, no tactics to speak of...

 

I am personally very much looking forward to POE, and while I was looking forward to playing it over the Christmas period, im just as happy to wait for extra polish :)



#53
Gromnir

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I have to say I did get alarmed with all of those stretch goals back in the Kickstarter. More classes are more complexity. I just hope OE know what they are doing, and made the budgeting correct. I do want quality.

 

A game that's suppose to be a spiritual successor to amazing games, and got 400% funding, should be on par with those games if not better. Period.

am not certain we agree that more classes is inherently more complex. obsidian is devoted to a notion o' balance, so more classes likely does make more complex in that sense, but the addition o' more classes is not inherently more complex than a zero, two, or eleven class system. a classless system that relies on perks, feats or whatever, can result in as much complexity as an eleven class system if the feats and perks is numerous and diverse. in point o' fact, virtually any class we see in PoE can be recreated with a classless system. those unique class abilities is made available through feats n' such. 

 

with eleven classes you do not necessarily get more complex-- you get more limited. ironic, no? each class needs necessarily become more focused or at least more unique, otherwise there ain't a point to having the class. considering that an obsidian goal were to be allowing greater customization and freedom o' character development than we saw in the ie games, we saw eleven classes as unnecessary. in fact, we suggested that eleven classes were working at cross purposes with their stated goals. as we said, more classes equal less freedom as each class need necessarily fill a more limited role.  nevertheless, we believe obsidian has done an admirable job o' making the classes unique... particularly the casters.

 

even so, more classes don't equal more complexity.  however, with more anything, you does make increasingly difficult to balance.

 

HA! Good Fun!


Edited by Gromnir, 03 October 2014 - 01:04 PM.

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#54
AGX-17

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Baww.jpg


Edited by AGX-17, 03 October 2014 - 01:12 PM.

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#55
Hiro Protagonist II

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I really don't understand why people are calling for bans on people. There's a really easy solution for these threads to be buried and fall off the front page, don't engage in them. I don't want to see the Obsidian forums turn into a heavily moderated forum where some forum posters get so upset by a forum post like the one in the OP (really, that upset you?) and they want to see people banned. I also find it humorous that some of the people calling for bans are people from the Codex. Are the Codex really trolling the Obsidian forum calling for people to be banned? LOL. Oh god. that's hysterical.

 

The OP's post doesn't upset me and I don't go crying to a mod. I have thick skin and can withstand any of Malignacious' threads by not responding in them. I only responded to this thread because so many people are calling for a ban. Really? LOL. Get a grip. If you don't like Malignacious' troll threads, don't respond. Ignore them. Easy isn't it? Apparently not for some people.


Edited by Hiro Protagonist II, 03 October 2014 - 04:59 PM.

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#56
constantine

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Plz people, don't feed Malignacious the troll.


PoE is not your kind of game, Malignacious, please move to some Bioware-DA3 forum and leave us at peace.
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#57
Hiro Protagonist II

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Just don't respond to his threads and let them drop off the front page. But seeing this is on top, I may as well respond too. :p


Edited by Hiro Protagonist II, 03 October 2014 - 05:04 PM.


#58
constantine

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I'll do that.

#59
Lephys

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I actually think the best way to deal with threads like this is to "derail" them into actual discussion. Hmm... maybe that'd just be called "railing" a thread? :)
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#60
Didier2

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I agree with quality over quantity, but I don't consider the number of classes quantity.

I only really consider the length of the campaign.

Wasteland 2 for instance should have focussed more on quality of combat and character system than length of the campaign and number of skills.

 

But I am curious to know what u base your assumption on that the quality of PoE will be lacking?


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