Police arrest, attack reporters; order reporters NOT to cover protest. IN UNITED STATES.

[Hurlshort]

They got spooked when he moved and they should have been able to realise that they held every advantage and that there was time  for another play. He wasn't going to run at them faster than a bullet. Missing leadership, experience ?. 

 

 

Dude there are six cops there. Surely one or two could have attempted a non lethal shot. What's the downside.

 

How do you make that decision in real time?  It's not a turn based strategy game.  They aren't trained to take shots like that. 

 

I'm not defending them either.  It looks like a poorly handled situation.  To me it doesn't matter whether 1 shot or 48 were fired, they should have tried to de-escalate the situation and they failed.  Is this situation better if he's killed by 2 cops instead of 6?  

 

How do you make that decision in real time ?. By not getting spooked. Experience, leadership by someone in the group. He's not going to run at them faster than a bullet. There was time for another play besides yelling at him which with the dog and everything obviously had no effect. 

 

Isn't that exactly what I just said?

[Gorgon]

So it was one of them rhetorical questions then. 

[Stun]

The guy was a 49 year old homeless man.

Oops, you're right. My bad.

 

If they sick the dog on him and the dog gets stabbed, is that a good outcome?

Are you seriously comparing a man's life to that of a friggin DOG's?

 

Let me answer your question, It's not a good or bad outcome. It's not an outcome at all. It's a process. The dog charges toward the man. Maybe he gets stabbed.... Or maybe he knocks the man down and chews off his arm while getting stabbed, allowing the 8 cops to take over without having to fire their guns.

 

There is NO WAY to spin this in the cops favor. They f*cked up epically.

Edited October 31, 2014 by Stun

[Hurlshort]

Any scenario where the dog gets stabbed is unacceptable.  Police dogs are not cannon fodder.  The dog should have been put away as soon as the knife came out so they could de-escalate the situation.

 

Who is spinning this in the cops favor?  I'm just pointing out that a lot of these alternative you folks are throwing out are bad.  Sacrifice the dog?  Coordinate a marksmanship lesson and clip the guy in the leg?  These aren't realistic.

 

The taser is a decent idea, but there are a lot of issues with how they operate.  It should have been attempted at the least, but as I said, I'd think a bean bag shotgun would be the best choice to disable the guy.  But really, they should have never been in this situation, they should have backed up and avoided escalation.  How is what I am saying defending the cops in any way?

[Orogun01]

Any scenario where the dog gets stabbed is unacceptable.  Police dogs are not cannon fodder.  The dog should have been put away as soon as the knife came out so they could de-escalate the situation.

 

Who is spinning this in the cops favor?  I'm just pointing out that a lot of these alternative you folks are throwing out are bad.  Sacrifice the dog?  Coordinate a marksmanship lesson and clip the guy in the leg?  These aren't realistic.

 

The taser is a decent idea, but there are a lot of issues with how they operate.  It should have been attempted at the least, but as I said, I'd think a bean bag shotgun would be the best choice to disable the guy.  But really, they should have never been in this situation, they should have backed up and avoided escalation.  How is what I am saying defending the cops in any way?

There are so many "mishandled" incidents that there reasonable cause to believe that thanks to the militarization of police **** will hit the fan.

[Valsuelm]

 

Are you seriously comparing a man's life to that of a friggin DOG's?

 

I hold the value of the life of dogs I've had in my life above those of many people I have met, and most I haven't met. As do a great many others who have dogs.

 

That said, the police dog should not have been there, the guns should not have been out, and so on.

 

It was murder. It happens very often. In the couple days this has been discussed police have probably killed a couple of people in cold blood somewhere in the US, and assaulted countless others. The local DA almost never prosecutes, even when there's mountains of evidence against the offending officer.

 

There are some good cops out there, but they really are rare in most police departments. Serpico rare. While most cops might not commit murder, a great many do assault people, and most do look the other way when their co-workers kill, assault, steal, blackmail, frame, etc. Corruption is rampant in militarized police department X, pretty much everywhere.

 

A lot of people are bamboozled by decades of pro police propaganda though. On the news, on TV, in the movies. The police are the good guys, there to protect and serve! I once thought they were the good guys too. Until I saw with my own eyes how they weren't many many times over.

Edited October 31, 2014 by Valsuelm

[ShadySands]

The cops made a lot of mistakes with this but not having the dog attack the guy was not one of them

 

Speaking of Serpico, he just recently put this out there

 

and here is the rebuttal

[Hurlshort]

 

There are so many "mishandled" incidents that there reasonable cause to believe that thanks to the militarization of police **** will hit the fan.

 

 

It's interesting that you brought that up, since I had just read this article: http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2014/09/08/how-many-police-shootings-a-year-no-one-knows/

 

I used to be quicker to state the whole rarity argument, that most officers will never even fire their gun in the line of duty over their entire career.  Part of me still thinks that the advent of technology is holding officers more accountable than in the past, since we have so many different ways to track what they are doing on the job.  

 

But there really isn't any reason for us not to have the hard facts as to how many police shootings there are in a year.  That should be something the State and Federal government is completely on top of, and they are clearly failing us here.  How can we even fully understand the problem without the data?  

 

So write your congressman and get him or her to push a mandate forward to collect this data.  Then we can tackle how to lower these tragic situations using real information.

[Gfted1]

If only we had pepper spray drones, this tragedy could have been avoided.

[Orogun01]

 

 

There are so many "mishandled" incidents that there reasonable cause to believe that thanks to the militarization of police **** will hit the fan.

 

 

It's interesting that you brought that up, since I had just read this article: http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2014/09/08/how-many-police-shootings-a-year-no-one-knows/

 

I used to be quicker to state the whole rarity argument, that most officers will never even fire their gun in the line of duty over their entire career.  Part of me still thinks that the advent of technology is holding officers more accountable than in the past, since we have so many different ways to track what they are doing on the job.  

 

But there really isn't any reason for us not to have the hard facts as to how many police shootings there are in a year.  That should be something the State and Federal government is completely on top of, and they are clearly failing us here.  How can we even fully understand the problem without the data?  

 

So write your congressman and get him or her to push a mandate forward to collect this data.  Then we can tackle how to lower these tragic situations using real information.

 

The article only speaks of shootings I would actually like to have them track any use of "justifiable force" in an arrest as some of those end up with a man cuffed and an officer breaking his limbs.

[Gfted1]

Oooooh, how about a pepper spray drone that also has a net gun. Just imagine the day when we can simply fly a drone over to a mook, blast them in the mug with pepper spray and then bundle them up in a net. Glorious. Patrol huge areas at once with a fleet of these bad boys!

[BruceVC]

There obviously needs to be an investigation here, and that is standard procedure in any shooting.  But really the way the police handled the protests is the real problem here, and it is very telling that the Governor turned that over to the Highway Patrol and suddenly the protests went back to being calm and uneventful.  I'm guessing the County Police Department is going to get raked over the coals quite a bit.

 

I am leaning towards Hurlshot perspective on this debate, its not as easy to resolve these types of events as you guys are suggesting. We must remember the context

[Elerond]

Optimally police would have acted like London's police in this incident

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7firDaaFVgo

 

Here is example from Chinese police how group of police can take knife away from mentally disrupted person without lethal force. 

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=d3d_1389243834&selected_view_mode=desktop

 

Police in the video may have not break the law, but their decision and acts are far from what they should have been, which will decrease public trust towards police as institution which usually means that public is less inclined to ask police's help and offer help for them in future, which will make police's job harder and more dangerous and also which will decrease general safety of public. 

 

I would say that generally police should not only follow the law but enforce it in way that looks and feels good for public, because that will increase public trust and general obedience towards police.  

 

EDIT: Fixed url in video about London police

Edited October 31, 2014 by Elerond

[ShadySands]

Give it a taser and/or electrify the net and I'm sold

 

 

Ooh ooh add one of those anti-riot heat guns too and a optional beanbag shotgun module to cover all your bases

[HoonDing]

Sounds too complicated. Just use a regular MQ-9 Reaper. Collateral be damned.

 

[Volourn]

Cops are heroes and should be obeyed and taken at face value no matter what: http://countercurrentnews.com/2014/11/woman-sues-lapd/

[Gfted1]

Sounds too complicated. Just use a regular MQ-9 Reaper. Collateral be damned.

 

 

Nah, we already have a bunch of ways to kill people. Im looking for non-lethal solutions. We should develop a gas (deployed by drone of course) that causes people to immediately evacuate their bowels. The crowds would instantly disperse and it would be hilarious. Win / win.

[HoonDing]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0xEIEXk4Nc

 

Children are fair game too, it seems.

 

I love the look of those cop cars, though. Reminds me of Saints Row.

Edited November 24, 2014 by HoonDing

[JadedWolf]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0xEIEXk4Nc

 

Children are fair game too, it seems.

 

I love the look of those cop cars, though. Reminds me of Saints Row.

 

I don't know what to think of this one. Apparently the person who called the police about the kid already told the dispatcher he thought the gun was probably a fake. The gun did look very realistic however, and according to the police the kid refused to put his hands up and instead reached out for the gun. I'm waiting this one out to pass judgement, but I am certainly wondering what the parents of the kid were doing and why the kid was allowed to have a BB gun like that. I'm not saying there's anything that can make it right to shoot 12 year olds, but if I was waving around something like that when I was a kid my parents certainly would have taken it from me and punished me for my stupidity. And this is in a country where the police isn't known for shooting first and asking questions later.

 

Edit: apparently, even though the caller actually told the dispatcher that he thought the gun was probably a fake, this was not told to the police officers who were sent to take a look. That sounds like a massive blunder to me.

Edited November 24, 2014 by JadedWolf

[Volourn]

Police at it again. Shoot without thinking.  Horrible evil scumbag nazis.

[Lexx]

Could have used a taser or w/e. I thought american policel oves it so much to tase people.

 

 

Honestly, with all the reports coming up (and probably because I've read all the stuff about the pennsylvania police stuff like this), it makes me feel as if american police isn't there to secure the people, but to oppress them.

Edited November 24, 2014 by Lexx

[ShadySands]

The fat lady scream "police killed a black boy" well how often white kids run ariund with guns (real or not) pointing them at cops?

 

 

Just off the top of my head, around this time last year

[Valsuelm]

 

well how often white kids run ariund with guns (real or not) pointing them at cops?

 

 

He didn't point it at the cops....

[Valsuelm]

Could have used a taser or w/e. I thought american policel oves it so much to tase people.

 

 

Honestly, with all the reports coming up (and probably because I've read all the stuff about the pennsylvania police stuff like this), it makes me feel as if american police isn't there to secure the people, but to oppress them.

 

A taser would have been overkill too...

 

And yes, in general the police are here to oppress and steal... errrr raise revenue.

[Namutree]

 

Could have used a taser or w/e. I thought american policel oves it so much to tase people.

 

 

Honestly, with all the reports coming up (and probably because I've read all the stuff about the pennsylvania police stuff like this), it makes me feel as if american police isn't there to secure the people, but to oppress them.

 

A taser would have been overkill too...

 

And yes, in general the police are here to oppress and steal... errrr raise revenue.

 

The best part about how they "raise revenue" is that they spend our money in order to do so. Hundreds of millions of dollars worth of property has been stolen thanks to the drug war, and about a trillion dollars has been spent in order to steal it.