Tick Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 My excitement is tempered by all the things we don't know about and likely won't until it is released. Even Mass Effect 3 seemed like it would have been good going by what they were willing to reveal.Mass Effect 3 was good. A bad ending might keep something from being excellent, but it doesn't make the entire game bad. That said, between ME 2, DA 2, and ME 3, I've come to the conclusion that BioWare has forgotten how to do good endings. A BSN guy I saw a while back made a great point about that. They made an exercise of fixing the ending (going off memory): You could only write and change within the last few minutes, either while chasing the teleport beam or just after getting at the Citadel, and you can only use the original elements of the ending and/or whatever elements were built up in the game before that point. The problems of the ending is partly a consequence of the game/series, which kept changing direction in tone and focus and giving itself plot holes. It's pretty impossible for a writer earn a proper ending in ME3. They could have made it less galaxy-destroying and more based on TIM, they could have given the player a medal scene, but it still wouldn't be a good ending in the way it should be. Though, admittedly, I'd take a "Reapers die" button over the buttons given. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PK htiw klaw eriF Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 I disliked Mass Effect 3 because of the incredibly linear level design, the plot was too predictable, and it felt that there was more cinematics than gameplay. I'll wait and see for DAI, but I'm somewhat expecting bad level design and too heavy of a cinematic focus to degrade the game for my tastes. 1 "Akiva Goldsman and Alex Kurtzman run the 21st century version of MK ULTRA." - majestic "you're a damned filthy lying robot and you deserve to die and burn in hell." - Bartimaeus "Without individual thinking you can't notice the plot holes." - InsaneCommander "Just feed off the suffering of gamers." - Malcador "You are calling my taste crap." -Hurlshort "thankfully it seems like the creators like Hungary less this time around." - Sarex "Don't forget the wakame, dumbass" -Keyrock "Are you trolling or just being inadvertently nonsensical?' -Pidesco "we have already been forced to admit you are at least human" - uuuhhii "I refuse to buy from non-woke businesses" - HoonDing "feral camels are now considered a pest" - Gorth "Melkathi is known to be an overly critical grumpy person" - Melkathi "Oddly enough Sanderson was a lot more direct despite being a Mormon" - Zoraptor "I found it greatly disturbing to scroll through my cartoon's halfing selection of genitalias." - Wormerine "I love cheese despite the pain and carnage." - ShadySands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orogun01 Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 Today's video: Exploring the World of Dragon Age: Inquisition. As I speculated previously, it's not Skyrim or Kingdoms of Amalur level 'open world.' It's more like the original BG. I view this as a positive. I'm still holding my breath on their promise that they will allow the player to take fortresses, it's incredible how little these videos actually reveal about the game. That said, the level design seems to be a step up from the previous entries in the series. I'd say the answer to that question is kind of like the answer to "who's the sucker in this poker game?"* *If you can't tell, it's you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maria Caliban Posted August 21, 2013 Author Share Posted August 21, 2013 (edited) @NKKKK You liked the ending of ME 2? I found the idea that the Reapers were liquifying people to make a giant Reaper baby both went against my basic understanding of genetics and didn't fit in with what we learned of Reapers in first game. And the final boss battle didn't do anything for me. If you mean ME 2 as a whole though, I found it very satisfying. The story structure, the building up of your forces to survive the suicide run, the companions themselves, the improvement in areas, the change to more FPS style combat, and it being the 'darker' second part of the trilogy all worked for me. As for Weekes being lead writer, I think he lacks seniority and I think being lead is as much a managerial position as a it is a creative one. I'd also suggest that a number of the problems with the ME 3 ending had to do with the series as a whole. Edited August 21, 2013 by Maria Caliban 1 "When is this out. I can't wait to play it so I can talk at length about how bad it is." - Gorgon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostofAnakin Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 I think the problem with the ME3 ending was they tried to be too smart for their own good, but don't have the talent to pull off the kind of ... philosophical/complex ending they came up with. The BioWare games with the most satisfying conclusions are the ones that tended to be more straightforward. They didn't tend to try and blow peoples minds. ME3's ending was an attempt to show the world they could be "deep" like the top authors in the sci-fi/fantasy genre, but the problem is Bio's writers have the talent that's the equivalent of young adult novel writers. "Console exclusive is such a harsh word." - Darque"Console exclusive is two words Darque." - Nartwak (in response to Darque's observation) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lobotomy42 Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 I disliked Mass Effect 3 because of the incredibly linear level design, the plot was too predictable, and it felt that there was more cinematics than gameplay. I'll wait and see for DAI, but I'm somewhat expecting bad level design and too heavy of a cinematic focus to degrade the game for my tastes. But you felt okay with these things in Mass Effect 2? ME2/3 are very similar in this regard: lots of one-off, linear levels, with some limited choice in what order to approach them, and lots and lots of special movies. It was a step back from ME1, IMO, but I didn't feel a significant difference between 2 and 3. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PK htiw klaw eriF Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 I disliked Mass Effect 3 because of the incredibly linear level design, the plot was too predictable, and it felt that there was more cinematics than gameplay. I'll wait and see for DAI, but I'm somewhat expecting bad level design and too heavy of a cinematic focus to degrade the game for my tastes. But you felt okay with these things in Mass Effect 2? No. ME2 was much less enjoyable for me than ME. 1 "Akiva Goldsman and Alex Kurtzman run the 21st century version of MK ULTRA." - majestic "you're a damned filthy lying robot and you deserve to die and burn in hell." - Bartimaeus "Without individual thinking you can't notice the plot holes." - InsaneCommander "Just feed off the suffering of gamers." - Malcador "You are calling my taste crap." -Hurlshort "thankfully it seems like the creators like Hungary less this time around." - Sarex "Don't forget the wakame, dumbass" -Keyrock "Are you trolling or just being inadvertently nonsensical?' -Pidesco "we have already been forced to admit you are at least human" - uuuhhii "I refuse to buy from non-woke businesses" - HoonDing "feral camels are now considered a pest" - Gorth "Melkathi is known to be an overly critical grumpy person" - Melkathi "Oddly enough Sanderson was a lot more direct despite being a Mormon" - Zoraptor "I found it greatly disturbing to scroll through my cartoon's halfing selection of genitalias." - Wormerine "I love cheese despite the pain and carnage." - ShadySands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOK222 Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 I think the problem with the ME3 ending was they tried to be too smart for their own good, but don't have the talent to pull off the kind of ... philosophical/complex ending they came up with. The BioWare games with the most satisfying conclusions are the ones that tended to be more straightforward. They didn't tend to try and blow peoples minds. ME3's ending was an attempt to show the world they could be "deep" like the top authors in the sci-fi/fantasy genre, but the problem is Bio's writers have the talent that's the equivalent of young adult novel writers. But-but LGBT issues! Ka-ka-ka-ka-Cocaine! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azarkon Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 (edited) Bioware games never deal in depth with LGBT issues. This is rather irritating when you think about the Dark Ages setting they have for DA, complete with religious orthodoxy, persecution of other races and beliefs, etc. But when it comes to gender and sexuality, it's downtown SF. Edited August 21, 2013 by Azarkon There are doors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOK222 Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 (edited) Well. Let's break this down. Andraste never said anything about Homosexuality, she was more about "Hey, these mages are being ****". the Chantry forms in Orlais, Orlais is about as sexually deviant as the old romans were IRL. The Chantry is in Orlais. The Chantry never outlawed homosexuality. In Orlais homosexuality is accepted. In Fereldan, it's not outlawed, but people see sodomites as "odd". No, they don't go in depth, and they shouldn't. Edited August 21, 2013 by NKKKK Ka-ka-ka-ka-Cocaine! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PK htiw klaw eriF Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 I like my sodomy to have plenty of depth. 7 "Akiva Goldsman and Alex Kurtzman run the 21st century version of MK ULTRA." - majestic "you're a damned filthy lying robot and you deserve to die and burn in hell." - Bartimaeus "Without individual thinking you can't notice the plot holes." - InsaneCommander "Just feed off the suffering of gamers." - Malcador "You are calling my taste crap." -Hurlshort "thankfully it seems like the creators like Hungary less this time around." - Sarex "Don't forget the wakame, dumbass" -Keyrock "Are you trolling or just being inadvertently nonsensical?' -Pidesco "we have already been forced to admit you are at least human" - uuuhhii "I refuse to buy from non-woke businesses" - HoonDing "feral camels are now considered a pest" - Gorth "Melkathi is known to be an overly critical grumpy person" - Melkathi "Oddly enough Sanderson was a lot more direct despite being a Mormon" - Zoraptor "I found it greatly disturbing to scroll through my cartoon's halfing selection of genitalias." - Wormerine "I love cheese despite the pain and carnage." - ShadySands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AGX-17 Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 (edited) http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/08/21/so-i-am-feeling-cautiously-optimistic-about-dragon-age/#more-165514 Guys sorry if this video in the article has been posted before but if you haven't seen it you really need to watch it. I will be really surprised if anyone isn't really excited after watching it Because of the possible prospect of torture? I like my sodomy to have plenty of depth. Edited August 21, 2013 by AGX-17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoonDing Posted August 22, 2013 Share Posted August 22, 2013 Careful, calling homosexuality sodomy is no longer politically correct. 1 The ending of the words is ALMSIVI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azarkon Posted August 22, 2013 Share Posted August 22, 2013 (edited) Well. Let's break this down. Andraste never said anything about Homosexuality, she was more about "Hey, these mages are being ****". the Chantry forms in Orlais, Orlais is about as sexually deviant as the old romans were IRL. The Chantry is in Orlais. The Chantry never outlawed homosexuality. In Orlais homosexuality is accepted. In Fereldan, it's not outlawed, but people see sodomites as "odd". No, they don't go in depth, and they shouldn't. That's just game lore designed to justify a higher level design decision - to not explore gender/sexuality issues at all. Saying Bioware explores LGBT issues is equivalent to saying Gears of War explores the effects of violence. Edited August 22, 2013 by Azarkon 1 There are doors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sargallath Abraxium Posted August 22, 2013 Share Posted August 22, 2013 ...feels like I's gonna git turned inta a pillar o' salt jus' fer readin' these last two pages...What would Jebus do??... ...WHO LUVS YA, BABY!!... A long, long time ago, but I can still remember, How the Trolling used to make me smile. And I knew if I had my chance, I could egg on a few Trolls to "dance", And maybe we'd be happy for a while. But then Krackhead left and so did Klown; Volo and Turnip were banned, Mystake got run out o' town. Bad news on the Front Page, BIOweenia said goodbye in a heated rage. I can't remember if I cried When I heard that TORN was recently fried, But sadness touched me deep inside, The day...Black Isle died. For tarna, Visc, an' the rest o' the ol' Islanders that fell along the way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orogun01 Posted August 22, 2013 Share Posted August 22, 2013 Careful, calling homosexuality sodomy is no longer politically correct. But being politically correct is no longer cool, so it all evens out. I'd say the answer to that question is kind of like the answer to "who's the sucker in this poker game?"* *If you can't tell, it's you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elerond Posted August 22, 2013 Share Posted August 22, 2013 Careful, calling homosexuality sodomy is no longer politically correct. Sodomy means all sexual acts that don't aim to procreation. Which is thing that many people forget when they shout their bible references. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tick Posted August 22, 2013 Share Posted August 22, 2013 (edited) Careful, calling homosexuality sodomy is no longer politically correct. Sodomy means all sexual acts that don't aim to procreation. Which is thing that many people forget when they shout their bible references. I'm pretty sure some people had the intent to procreate when committing sodomy laws, however... Humans and elves, asari and everything else. Edited August 22, 2013 by Tick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOK222 Posted August 22, 2013 Share Posted August 22, 2013 Careful, calling homosexuality sodomy is no longer politically correct. I was being cheeky. Although this is a serious issue in a county in the U.S. where a crazed sheriff was recently arresting people for "sodomy". Now then. Here's another pic. Ka-ka-ka-ka-Cocaine! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volourn Posted August 22, 2013 Share Posted August 22, 2013 "That said, between ME 2, DA 2, and ME 3, I've come to the conclusion that BioWare has forgotten how to do good endings." ME2's ending was fantastic. DA2's ending could have been way better. No doubt about it. This so called BIO 'fanboy' hasn't even finished ME3 so haven't perosnally experienced ME3 ending but what I've seen from the whining is the whining is over the top stupidity. DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orogun01 Posted August 22, 2013 Share Posted August 22, 2013 Careful, calling homosexuality sodomy is no longer politically correct. Sodomy means all sexual acts that don't aim to procreation. Which is thing that many people forget when they shout their bible references. I'm pretty sure some people had the intent to procreate when committing sodomy laws, however... Humans and elves, asari and everything else. I don't know how much biology they knew back in the Middle Ages but babies don't come out of a poop chute no matter what you shove in there. At some point it must have become evident. Unless you're Irish sodomy meant unnatural sex for pleasure. I'd say the answer to that question is kind of like the answer to "who's the sucker in this poker game?"* *If you can't tell, it's you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hurlshort Posted August 22, 2013 Share Posted August 22, 2013 I just finished the 3rd DA book, Asunder. I think it was the best one yet, it was a nice mix of some new characters and some old, and it had a good pace. Gaider has improved as a writer as he's gone along. It is still pretty standard fantasy, but there were a few decent surprises mixed in. Also it seems to be a pretty big stage setter for the 3rd game. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhamnetin Posted August 22, 2013 Share Posted August 22, 2013 (edited) "That said, between ME 2, DA 2, and ME 3, I've come to the conclusion that BioWare has forgotten how to do good endings." ME2's ending was fantastic. DA2's ending could have been way better. No doubt about it. This so called BIO 'fanboy' hasn't even finished ME3 so haven't perosnally experienced ME3 ending but what I've seen from the whining is the whining is over the top stupidity. Agreed, ME2 had a cool ending and the last mission of the game was just one of the best things ever. Except for that boss fight of course. That's where Bioware started to devolve. ME3 didn't have any dumb boss fights thankfully, but ME2 and DA2... I see where most of the hate comes from about ME3's ending, but I find it to be really exaggerated. Most people don't like how the choices provided to you at the end are unaffected by all of the choices you've made throughout all three games (which isn't 100% true but close enough). I for one saw this coming. Edited August 22, 2013 by Rhamnetin Save RPGs Saying Dragon Age 2 is the worst recent Bioware RPG is like saying the Ferrari California is the worst Ferrari. It's still a Ferrari; an elite, top-tier, without much competition in today's industry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
licketysplit Posted August 22, 2013 Share Posted August 22, 2013 (edited) "That said, between ME 2, DA 2, and ME 3, I've come to the conclusion that BioWare has forgotten how to do good endings." ME2's ending was fantastic. No it wasn't. It leapt with reckless abandon into camp territory with the Franken-Reaper and Collectors. The entire plot was an an unfortunate diversion from the main premise set up in ME1. ME2 was all about characters, and it was very good on that level. But it's where **** started to go downhill. Edited August 22, 2013 by licketysplit 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceVC Posted August 22, 2013 Share Posted August 22, 2013 "That said, between ME 2, DA 2, and ME 3, I've come to the conclusion that BioWare has forgotten how to do good endings." ME2's ending was fantastic. DA2's ending could have been way better. No doubt about it. This so called BIO 'fanboy' hasn't even finished ME3 so haven't perosnally experienced ME3 ending but what I've seen from the whining is the whining is over the top stupidity. Agreed, ME2 had a cool ending and the last mission of the game was just one of the best things ever. I see where most of the hate comes from about ME3's ending, but I find it to be really exaggerated. Most people don't like how the choices provided to you at the end are unaffected by all of the choices you've made throughout all three games (which isn't 100% true but close enough). I for one saw this coming. I'm confused? Are you saying that the choices in the previous ME didn't make a difference in the final outcome of the last game? "Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss” John Milton "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” - George Bernard Shaw "What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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