Darth Nihilus rant

[ToF]

Blah, 1st post scrwed up try again.

 

Before getting the game, I saw the pictures of him, and read the description that he is so powerful, he could lay waste to an entire planet. He was well drawn, his mask and hood just looks great. Really gives a sinister feeling, a death head\'s mask.

 

Even when Marr said that he is so powerful, the party was like insects to him, barely can get his attention. Only planets and stars was large enough to get his

focus. What a build up. They should show a cutscene where he drained Marr\'s planet. Then he falls like a baby to my party in 20 seconds.

 

What a let down. What a loss of potentially making him a fascinating villain. Instead just some bozo with a mask who got killed easily. I wonder what the fuss all the jedi council was complaining about.

 

I was expecting him to be the last boss, just in his presence you should automatically lose health to him because of his power to drain life. Or see him killing Kreia because he saw through her betrayal. After you slain him, you take his mask. If you play the DS you could take his place and power since you both are the \'wound\' in the force. Then show cutscene where you kill a planet yourself. That is what I expecting after the excellent KOTOR1. Obsidian had the talent to do it.

 

I am playing the DS my 2nd time through, but so far, I\'ve little incentive to play it over again, I was so disappointed the 1st time through...

[witchzenka]

I actually liked the way they handled Nihilus, though I seem to be in the minority. I liked that I spent much of the game afraid of him, only to realize I had to be much more wary of Kreia. It was nicely done.

[Darth Sirius]

He was uberpowerful, and could lay waste to planets. He was a wound in the force, but he was a wound of your creation (so I've been led to believe) So I assume the exile was a lopped off limb compared to his paper cut.

[Astatine]

He was uber, fearsome, and completely and totally vacuous! Deliberately! Obviously! Kreia even said as much! Of course they didn't give him much screen time! Sorry, still laughing at that... ~takes his pills~ "

[Blacklotus]

Even when Marr said that he is so powerful, the party was like insects to him, barely can get his attention.  Only planets and stars was large enough to get his

focus.  What a build up.  They should show a cutscene where he drained Marr\'s planet.  Then he falls like a baby to my party in 20 seconds.

/agree

 

I found also pretty disaponting to see how Nihilus was so easily defeated...maybe it's just me, but I've found the main char way too powerful in the end compared to the enemies he's got to fight... On the other side, I found far more fascinating the last battle against Malak in KOTOR1, the fight (in my case) was more balanced...maybe cause I lacked one of the powers needed to kill the prisioner Jedies Malak was feeding upon to regain power, but even so, if I had had it, it would have been a far more interesting final battle. With Nihulus however, has been very easy,..... pause, force enlightment, battle meditation, force inmunity, master power attack, master power attack, ... , master power attack, cut-scene, again the same stuff one last time and you're done. Too easy...and the same goes with Kreia ...they not even did try a "Force breach" on me a single time...

[Kaftan Barlast]

I spent much of the game afraid of him, only to realize I had to be much more wary of Kreia.

 

 

Dead on the nail. I believe that was precisely how the designers intended it. When you ask Visas what she saw under his mask she replies:

 

 

"just a man, nothing more."

 

 

As to underline this.

 

 

 

note: but it was a risk the designers took because it goes against all common practise to hype up a villain and just let him go like that. but obsidian managed to pull through a potential anticlimax, takes both guts and skill.

[DarkLordSkorpion]

Regarding to Nihilus' mask, why can't you actually *wear* the damn thing? Sure, you pick it up and carry it around as it supposidly increases your powers, but both games have lacked good masks to actually wear.

 

I think one of the reasons Nihilus is so pathetic is because, since there's no level cap, it's much easier to destroy him by that time in the game. But still, he should have been much tougher as yes, he would have been one of the tightest Villians in history of SW.

[Helton]

He seemed rather shallow to me, much like Darth Maul.

 

Sure he looked bad, and oh wow, he can kill a planet. The power to kill a planet is nothing in the Star Wars universe. Malak killed many planets, Bao-Dur killed a planet, the Death Star can kill planets, it isn't that big of a deal. Real power is in manipulation. It's a shame you all moan about Nihilus and miss that Kreia is one of the coolest characters in Star Wars, ever. She manipulates everyone throughout the entire game.

 

Nihilus served his purpose, a badass face on the box, and a red herring.

[Zilod]

Nihilus is primal hunger instinct, can't be a real villain, is a sort of natural power of destruction like it can be a storm...

i liked how it was implemented in the game a way that made not him the ultra uber evil guy, but a creature whose power is also his greatest weakness...

 

and about the fact that is killed so easilly... the Nihilus strenght is not in his ability to use his lightsabre or some awesome force knowledge and power, his strenght is his draining technique, whitout it here that he return to be "a man", a powerfull sith, but nothing more.

 

Any powerfull jedi that can't be drained like the Exile, Kreia (after she was drained the first time), and maybe even a strong Visas should be able to handle him.

[Zilod]

He seemed rather shallow to me, much like Darth Maul.

 

Sure he looked bad, and oh wow, he can kill a planet. The power to kill a planet is nothing in the Star Wars universe. Malak killed many planets, Bao-Dur killed a planet, the Death Star can kill planets, it isn't that big of a deal. Real power is in manipulation. It's a shame you all moan about Nihilus and miss that Kreia is one of the coolest characters in Star Wars, ever. She manipulates everyone throughout the entire game.

 

Nihilus served his purpose, a badass face on the box, and a red herring.

 

i 100% agree, Kreia is quite underrated in my opinion... she have knowledge, power, she manipulate everyone (poor Nihilus included), she is so great that her enemy is the force itself.

 

Probably her ability to hide from the force and to keep a low profile worked even on many players

[ToF]

He seemed rather shallow to me, much like Darth Maul.

 

Sure he looked bad, and oh wow, he can kill a planet. The power to kill a planet is nothing in the Star Wars universe. Malak killed many planets, Bao-Dur killed a planet, the Death Star can kill planets, it isn't that big of a deal. Real power is in manipulation. It's a shame you all moan about Nihilus and miss that Kreia is one of the coolest characters in Star Wars, ever. She manipulates everyone throughout the entire game.

 

Nihilus served his purpose, a badass face on the box, and a red herring.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I see your point, like Palpatine manipulating everyone. But Kreia is one of the most annoying characters, I never used her in my party except the times when I was forced to. Even just by reading her dialogue its pretty obvious shes not to be trusted, and if my player jedi has half a brain, he would realize that too.

 

But this is a game, the climax of it should be the ultimate battle against a great power. Malak, Bao-Dur, Death Star used/are machines. Nihilus did it using his power. Thats on a completely different scale. The Scion and Kreia battles are anti-clamatic afterwards, because most people are saying WTF with Nihilus.

 

>Nihilus served his purpose, a badass face on the box, and a red herring.

Thats why alot of people feel cheated. You advertise one thing, and something completely different happened, and not in a good way.

[KotOR_rules2004]

I also think that Obsidian Ent. handled Darth Nihilus quite well. I personally hoped the battle would have lasted a little bit longer, but I also didn't expect Darth Nihilus to be a major physical combat threat. One other think I wanted out of Darth Nihilus is a back-story. Sure in the movies Darth Maul had no back-story, but there was a book written about him. I have seen a few video game based books, even a Star Wars video game based book (a book about Star Wars Galaxies), so maybe a Darth Nihilus back-story book isn't too far out of the question.

 

Kreia/Darth Traya is the one to be weary of, and Obsidian used Nihilus to great affect. Kreia is a major bad-ass and we should be scared of her.

[dufflover]

Who, with all the pre-release media, mainly the fading between Nihilus and Atris, would've expected (or liked) to have Atris (or your player who starts with a neutral non-jedi Atris look), to end up DS/Nihilus look or LS/Atris look? or Atris goes evil and changes clothes but that would be too much like K1 Bastila.

[Alcoholic]

I think it was kinda neat. I kept hearing througout the game stuff like "If you take the greatest jedi/sith and take away the force, do you have a real jedi/sith or is it just a man? woman? child?" Then when visas takes off Nihilus' mask all she sees is 'just a man'.

[OneWithStrange]

Obsidian certainly handled Kreia very well. Just imagine: Nihilus and Sion were both very powerful individually, but if their power could be combined and manipulated towards one's goal, wouldn't that be more threatening?

 

Sheesh, I too was disappointed when I couldn't wear Nihilus' mask.

 

-Ben

[Naso]

I suppose looking at Nihlus as a red herring does make it better, but it didn't work because of other inconsistencies in the ending. If the surrounding material were polished, or complete even, his role would make sense, but as it is, you don't know if he's that way by design or deadline.

 

Personally, I wanted a little more of Atris. She looked like a really interesting character, but didn't get enough development, it was more like a quick cut to Bates up in the hotel talking to his mom.....

[Zach Morris]

Darth Nihilus was botched. Plain and simple. No getting around it.

[Barzarel]

Think Darth Nihilus was originally meant to have been the main bad guy, if you look at some of the screen wallpapers or some of the concept arts youll see Atris fighting Nihilus which never actually happen in the game, so i surspect that he was cut from being main bad guy or at least remove as a to big influence.

 

But i thought he was okay, little dissappointed i never got his identity curiousity satisfied, thought getting to learn who he really was would have proven a fun detective job

 

However he was a dissappointing fighting makes you wonder why the jedi hid from him, seeing as both Kavan and Vrook was much stronger than nihilus in fighting.

 

But Darth Traya makes up i think for whatever dissappointments there were with nihilus character.

[witchzenka]

Darth Nihilus was botched.  Plain and simple.  No getting around it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't think so.

[dufflover]

Darth Nihilus was botched.  Plain and simple.  No getting around it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

He and Atris weren't used well but I don't think it's was a failure as that.

 

Think Darth Nihilus was originally meant to have been the main bad guy, if you look at some of the screen wallpapers or some of the concept arts youll see Atris fighting Nihilus which never actually happen in the game, so i surspect that he was cut from being main bad guy or at least remove as a to big influence.

 

With the way the ending was changed, and the game generally seeming rushed (bugs and stuff), this might've been another plot change during development, but early enough to not leave things like dialog and sound files.

[Lord_Nihilus]

kreia said it in one conversatoin (when you ask her about the sith that persued you) that he has no real power, only his hunger.

 

i was kind of disappointed to after i defeted him so easyly in my first game (gardian/wapponmaster). second time he was more of a challange (counselor/sith lord) it all depends on your char - he doesn

[Janson]

Now my character has high enough intelligence, it was really interesting to see Nihilus present when Sion beat the crap out of Kreia in the cut scene she shows you when telling you of her past.

[Hilikus]

Yeah, I guess he was a bit too easy to beat. Sad though. But for some reason, I get the feeling that we won't be seeing the last of Nihilus...

Not sure whether I'm wrong (probably am), but maybe he might be back in KotOR III?...

[The Great Phantom]

I spent much of the game afraid of him, only to realize I had to be much more wary of Kreia.

 

 

Dead on the nail. I believe that was precisely how the designers intended it. When you ask Visas what she saw under his mask she replies:

 

 

"just a man, nothing more."

 

 

As to underline this.

 

 

 

note: but it was a risk the designers took because it goes against all common practise to hype up a villain and just let him go like that. but obsidian managed to pull through a potential anticlimax, takes both guts and skill.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Not sure if someone pointed this out already, but if you ask for his mask, then he his MUCH more than 'just a man.' He turns out to be 'Death Incarnate', which is what Visas sees when she looks at you.

 

There is many plausible reasons why he fell so easily. For one, he tries to feed on the Exile, which is not smart. Notice how after he does this, he caves over in agony. It must be pretty hard to only notice planets, all of a sudden finding yourself digesting absolutly nothing. The shock of this alone is enough to make most people weak.

 

Just pointing it out.

[KungFuFerret]

Nihilus was handled exactly how they intended.

 

Kreia tells you one thing, but the Jedi Masters tell you another. And when you reunite them, the answer is right there. Sifting through Kreia's lies and truths can be difficult, but the Jedi never lie to you.

 

A vacuum cannot simply leach from a vacuum. And that is what the whole Nihilus scene was meant to convey. Kreia KNEW this would happen, which is why she lured you both there.

 

When you nullify someone's greatest strength while maintaining your own, it's simply no contest. And this was the case when the showdown happened. Nihilus had absolutely NO clue that you were a threat. And he paid the price for it.

 

While they could have done more with Nihilus, they really didn't need to. You take away his ability to drain the force essence from things, and what is he? Nothing.

 

If anything, I'm surprised what minimal control he had over the Ravager didn't collapse right then and there, causing everyone on board to perish, provided Tobin hadn't been lying about it.

 

 

As for Atris, I think they handled her quite well. You can really push her buttons if you argue with her about the Mandalorian war and learn right then and there, that she's fallen to the Dark Side. With all the Handmaidens about, and some of the dialog options, it quickly becomes obvious what she's up to. IF you have Kreia in your party when you speak to them, this just further confirms that something underhanded is going on.

 

After leaving Telos and seeing the holo-recording, you know beyond a doubt that she's been consumed by her hatred.

 

For some, she might not have been overly obvious, but she does help fill in a lot of backstory. Both the 1st time, as well as the 2nd time you see her.

 

 

This is from a LS Female point of view, not sure how it is with the others. I'm still working through the DS Male point of view. It seems in some cases, what they say to you in certain situations is entirely dependant upon things you have done, as well as whether you are light side, or dark side.

 

 

What I am curious about is if there are any "grey" options per se. Actual dialog options and responses that you can only see if you decide to remain a grey Jedi. I haven't tried it because you give up having a prestige class to do so, otherwise you could potentially skew the game into thinking your LS or DS. It also takes Visas completely out of the picture, and possibly both Hanharr and Mira.