Moon Landing

[Sarex]

 

 

There is only one possible reason why I seem to be under that impression to you and it's that you didn't read what I said because that is the core premise of scenario B.

 

 

 

Ah, I misread the B scenario, sorry about that. Well I don't know why it doesn't make sense to you, you seem to be somewhat idolizing the scientist involved in the project, they are not as all knowing as the PR department would have you believe.

[Meshugger]

Ok, so I wondered into /fringe/ for some material about these kinds of conspiracy theories, but here goes (please use the youtube-link below to get into the right mood):

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhwWAciO6F4

 

NASA knew that no human will be able to leave earth outside of the Van Allen belt, but still had pressure from the Nixon administration to do at least something. So when a group of propulsion engineers watched Stanley Kubrick's "2001: A space Odyssey", they instantly knew what to do. They contacted a three letter US agency in order to handle the negotiations as smoothly as possible; after all, they have had succesful operations on conscious and subconscious manipulation from before, which was outside of the expertise of NASA.

 

Stanley was reluctant at first, but he was a smart man. He knew that they knew that his security would not be jeopardized due to his fame, but at the same time he knew that the information they provided him made him a serious security threat. Based on these cards that were on the table, Stanley allowed himself to perfom the task needed: To simulate through clever camera techniques a landing on the moon, which inofficially in the agreement was stated to be used during radio-silence with earth, but both parties knew the true purpose and kept it in silence as open secret between them only. As reward, Stanley was provided two unique lenses in existence, exclusively from NASA. With these, he could successfully shoot his movie "Barry Lyndon" in only natural light, which gave him the result he needed for his project: A movie that looks and feels like the paintings from the era it tried to portray. Thus, eventhough he was bought, he maximized his return of investment in the least obvious way possible.

 

But Stanley got second thoughts when the reality on who he had dealt with came creeping back to him. He quickly moved away from Hollywood, even the US entirely, and settled in the midlands in the UK in order to satiate his growing paranoia. But that was not enough, as an artist, he had to express his anxieties and energies somehow, and if you look very closely, you will find a lot of clues in every movie made since "Barry Lyndon". The truth is there, you just know where to look. Finally at an old age, when his fear of death had been let go and he wanted to show the world on who the true masters of the three letter US agency he originally signed his deal with. He understood how the human subconscious worked more than anyone, except perhaps for his adversaries, so he wanted to go out with a bang: "Eyes wide shut". Even the title itself was a gateway for those who understood the esoteric message that it conveyed. But he didn't care anymore, he wanted to meet his maker with his conscience completely clear and did the movie. He tried to keep the filmprocess as a secret as much as possible, but it got leaked to the wrong kind of people and he was killed through cyanide posioning the eleventh hour. 

 

But the problem was that the movie had been announced as completed, which lead into a problem on what to do with it since it exposed them so clearly. The true rulers of the world had to resort to use their contacts at the movie studios in order to re-edit the movie to hide their true identities as much as possible. The result was 45 minutes missing and the worst edited Kubrick movie to date. But there was still enough for those with vested interest and knowledge into the ancient occult and esoteric societies to immidiately spot who those are, but they are too few to have any major influence and could be easily dismissed as conspiracy whackjobs. The deed was done, and the renegade prince of motion pictures was taken down, but his message stayed....if you dear to look after it.

 

You will never look at a movie by Stanley Kubrick in the same way ever again. You're welcome.

Edited February 7, 2016 by Meshugger

[Blarghagh]

It has nothing to do with how all-knowing they are and everything to do with how many of them there are.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/science/space/12123223/Faked-Moon-landing-would-have-been-exposed-within-four-years-scientist-concludes.html

[kgambit]

 

This makes your argument even less logical.

 

Situation A: It's working. We just decided not to send it up and make a fake video instead.

 

Situation B: It's "working" wink wink and none of the multitudes of massively smart engineers and scientists working on it realize it's a dud despite how much access engineers, mathematicians and scientists would need to have to the plans due to the math and physics required. It's not just "some guy who makes the screws", after all.

 

Situation C: It's "working" wink wink and every single one of those engineers and scientists are in on it, and none of them have ever let the secret slip.

 

None of them make sense.

 

 

Situation D: It's "working" but can't get past the Van Allen belt, though we will tell everyone that it can.

 

Situation E: It's "working" but we know that micrometeorites will make Swiss cheese out of it.

 

Situation n: It's ''working" but we can't get past some problem so will stay quiet about it.

 

I don't know how the moon landing program worked but it wouldn't be a stretch to say that it was compartmentalized, going by previous operations done by the US. Everyone would do their part and know about their part only.

 

 

I thought we had put the radiation exposure from the Van Allen belt to rest already.   *sigh*  

 

With reference only to the micrometeorite impacts:  Explain to me how the International Space station has survived for 15 years (and counting) but the Apollo missions lasting less than 12d and 13 hrs were doomed?  Or how the New Horizon spacecraft has managed to survive for nine years after launching in 2006 and take pictures of Pluto?  Or any other of the myriad of space probes launched in the last 50 years.

 

Surely all of those space probes should have been utterly destroyed by micrometeorites by now, right?     

 

Edit:  And that would mean that the Chinese, Indian, Russian and Japanese lunar probes would be destroyed as well.  

Edited February 7, 2016 by kgambit

[Elerond]

I would say that moon landing conspiracies would have much more credibility if people were able to explain how such faking is possible

 

Like for example what kind camera and film techniques gave them ability make such long videos with out any film artifacts etc. that plagued other movie productions at the time

What technologies they used in low motion scenes, who invented it who produced equipment for it etc.

They launched rocket in space in 1969 and in other moon landing missions and those rockets had people in them that come back. Or there needs to be explanation how thousands people that witness both launching of rocket and its crew coming back to Earth in real life were fooled. 

Where they hide that rocket during time they claimed that it was dark side of the moon (as those people in that rocket would have died according to conspiracies if it actually did go to dark side of the moon), as that rocket could not be seen from Earth at that time and it was possible to see to go behind the moon by telescopes (how they did manage to do that trick?)

How they produced that moon rock, what technologies were used, who invented those technologies, why such technologies aren't used in anything else than producing that rock.

 

So as long as moon landing side has feasible explanation how they did their trip to moon and evidence, math equipment, inventors of those equipment, manufactures of those equipment, etc. which all support their claims and conspiracies have lots of big holes in their theories, I don't see any reason to believe conspiracies at all.

[Gromnir]

 

 

This makes your argument even less logical.

 

Situation A: It's working. We just decided not to send it up and make a fake video instead.

 

Situation B: It's "working" wink wink and none of the multitudes of massively smart engineers and scientists working on it realize it's a dud despite how much access engineers, mathematicians and scientists would need to have to the plans due to the math and physics required. It's not just "some guy who makes the screws", after all.

 

Situation C: It's "working" wink wink and every single one of those engineers and scientists are in on it, and none of them have ever let the secret slip.

 

None of them make sense.

 

 

Situation D: It's "working" but can't get past the Van Allen belt, though we will tell everyone that it can.

 

Situation E: It's "working" but we know that micrometeorites will make Swiss cheese out of it.

 

Situation n: It's ''working" but we can't get past some problem so will stay quiet about it.

 

I don't know how the moon landing program worked but it wouldn't be a stretch to say that it was compartmentalized, going by previous operations done by the US. Everyone would do their part and know about their part only.

 

 

I thought we had put the radiation exposure from the Van Allen belt to rest already.   *sigh*  

 

Explain to me how the International Space station has survived for 15 years (and counting) but the Apollo missions lasting less than 12d and 13 hrs were doomed?  Or how the New Horizon spacecraft has managed to survive for nine years after launching in 2006 and take pictures of Pluto?  Or any other of the myriad of space probes launched in the last 50 years.

 

Surely all of those space probes should have been utterly destroyed by now, right?     

 

Edit:  And that would mean that the Chinese, Indian, Russian and Japanese lunar probes would be destroyed as well.  

 

'cause the conspiracy theory videos claimed otherwise.

 

all conspiracy theories tend towards weird, but the moon stuff is the strangest from our pov.  videos and blogs makes largely unsubstantiated claims that some small handful o' folks find believable 'cause they don't have the science to be rightfully dismissive regarding such theories.  is ok to not understand the science, 'cause so few folks do... which we suspect is why this utter ridiculous conspiracy theory has lasted so long.  the conspiracy theory appeals to the folks that already have a firm held belief that the government would lie about a moon landing if they could get away with it.  'course, continuing to believe the theory ignores the actual scientists who near universal disagree with the conspiracy... 'cause they is either government puppets, or they were simple tricked by sleight o' hand? 

 

is the litmus test.  this is one o' the easiest conspiracy theories to refute given the mountains o' evidence that the conspiracy theorists cannot hope to explain. it persist nonetheless.  

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Leferd]

Denying to believe that some of my favorite wallpapers were faked:

 

EARTHRISE  from Apollo 8 

 

 

Sea of Tranquility  from Apollo 11

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Rostere]

I thought we had put the radiation exposure from the Van Allen belt to rest already.   *sigh*  

 

Explain to me how the International Space station has survived for 15 years (and counting) but the Apollo missions lasting less than 12d and 13 hrs were doomed?  Or how the New Horizon spacecraft has managed to survive for nine years after launching in 2006 and take pictures of Pluto?  Or any other of the myriad of space probes launched in the last 50 years.

 

Surely all of those space probes should have been utterly destroyed by now, right?     

 

Edit:  And that would mean that the Chinese, Indian, Russian and Japanese lunar probes would be destroyed as well.

I don't want to give any credence to the theory that nothing could survive crossing the Van Allen belts, but

1. The ISS is obviously below the Van Allen belts.
2. The New Horizon probe has obviously crossed over the Van Allen belts in a shorter time span than nine years (considering where it is located...).
3. I think the idea of the conspiracy theory is that passing the Van Allen belts would greatly damage health of the astronauts, not that it would destroy all equipment.

But settling this is really only matter of measuring or estimating the equivalent dose the astronauts would receive. Not a very interesting conspiracy theory.

[Keyrock]

 

 

But as I said it really didn't need to be thousand of people that were in on it, they just needed the astronauts (who after the landing gave very few interviews), the people who helped fake it and the people who ordered it. The guy who made the screws for the Lunar module would believe that they were going to the moon, as would the guys who worked on everything else.

 

We've been through this before in this thread.  All the people from all the independent nations that monitored the flight and tracked the trajectory would have to be in on it too.  You don't set a trajectory that takes you to the moon then halfway through the flight take a hard left and go into orbit instead, that's not how spacecraft from that era, or even spacecraft today, work.

[Guard Dog]

The catch all line of every conspiracy ever: "Don't you see? They are ALL in on it!".

 

 Nine words that form the ultimate rhetorical garbage disposal for logic, facts, and evidence!

[kgambit]

 

I thought we had put the radiation exposure from the Van Allen belt to rest already.   *sigh*  

 

With reference only to the micrometeorite impacts:  Explain to me how the International Space station has survived for 15 years (and counting) but the Apollo missions lasting less than 12d and 13 hrs were doomed?  Or how the New Horizon spacecraft has managed to survive for nine years after launching in 2006 and take pictures of Pluto?  Or any other of the myriad of space probes launched in the last 50 years.

 

Surely all of those space probes should have been utterly destroyed by micrometeorites by now, right?

   

 

Edit:  And that would mean that the Chinese, Indian, Russian and Japanese lunar probes would be destroyed as well.

I don't want to give any credence to the theory that nothing could survive crossing the Van Allen belts, but

1. The ISS is obviously below the Van Allen belts.
2. The New Horizon probe has obviously crossed over the Van Allen belts in a shorter time span than nine years (considering where it is located...).
3. I think the idea of the conspiracy theory is that passing the Van Allen belts would greatly damage health of the astronauts, not that it would destroy all equipment.

But settling this is really only matter of measuring or estimating the equivalent dose the astronauts would receive. Not a very interesting conspiracy theory.

 

 

Rostere, you misunderstood.  The references to the New Horizon and ISS were in response to the micrometeorite issue not the van allen belt.    I thought that evident with the inclusion of references to both manned and unmanned missions, but sorry that it wasn't clearer.  I have edited the post.

Edited February 7, 2016 by kgambit

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

The moon is actually a potato farm. You know who runs the potato farm?

 

 

 

[HoonDing]

All I remember from the "spaceflight is fake" nutter that used to hang around university is the following: π²=g

[Calax]

We did staple mirrors to the moon to provide hyper accurate readings of the place.

[Valsuelm]

Now, now, let's watch the videos. Keep an open mind, I always say.

You're asking for a real lot from the forum dwellers here. For them to watch a video to inform themselves about a topic they've always just taken as granted is far too great an undertaking for most here.

 

That said, for the few who are capable of such undertakings, here's the press conference with the astronauts from Apollo 11. What is said, isn't said, and probably most importantly how it's said, speaks volumes...

 

[Hurlshort]

Oh good, Val is back.  

[Gromnir]

Oh good, Val is back.  

more validation o' how belief in this conspiracy is a meaningful litmus test.

 

HA! Good Fun!