How much $$$ would you like to see spent on voice acting in the sequel?

[Matt516]

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/78825-the-reason-why-a-lot-of-va-isnt-voiced/?p=1680668

 

After I made the post linked above, and observed the conversation that ensued for a while, I started thinking... VO is quite expensive. Like... really expensive. And if we assume that a game development studio has a given amount of money allocated to a game, say X dollars... then it follows that any money spent on VO is by necessity money that can't be spent elsewhere. That's how money works.

 

My own personal preference is that games like this have some VO, but not a huge amount. Think "original BG and Torment" levels of VO, not "BG:EE or modern RPGs" levels. I think a small amount of VO adds a huge amount of characterization and immersion to the world - but that any more than that isn't worth the money it costs. Again, any money spent on VO is money that isn't spent on more talents, areas, quests, characters, QA... etc. So I'd prefer that a PoE expansion or PoE 2 have some VO, but not quite as much as PoE and certainly not more. I'd prefer to see that development money spent elsewhere.

 

That's just my personal preference. And although we could (and probably will, knowing this forum ) have a protracted discussion about the pros and cons of VO, that's not my main purpose in making this post. I just want to see what the community thinks.

 

Because although it's entirely possible that most people want more VO or Obsidian has their own strategy/design goals/marketing research and doesn't really care what a forum poll says... it's also possible that most people don't want more VO and Obsidian doesn't actually realize that. So... although the chances of that second scenario are probably pretty small, I figured I might as well check. Why not? All this can do is give Obsidian more information, which is good for everyone.

 

In the post I linked above, it seemed like the vast majority of public opinion was on the "nah, don't spend more money on VO" side - but then again the people who actually post on the forum are a small subset of the people who read it, so I'm curious what the poll will say. So tell us - what do you think Obsidian should prioritize in the future? More money on VO, or no?

Edited May 2, 2015 by Matt516

[barakav]

I'll post again ,they probably made enough money for a sequel so they can pull a Divinity Original Sin and create a Kickstarter only to improve the game even more.

 

In that case better voice acting can be part of the new stretch goals as the game will already have enough substance.

 

Also it's one of those things that can improve sales ,though it creates a problem with all the multi-language translation...

Edited May 3, 2015 by barakav

[luzarius]

Obsidian, if you want cheap, but high quality voice acting, then go to a local college or university. Stand outside the actors advanced classroom and just cold question the students or put up flyers on the board.  I remember talking with many talented actors and actresses at colleges who were starving for any money just to get through school.

 

Offer them $50.00 and a free lunch in exchange for eight hours of grueling, emotionally draining voice acting. Pitch to them the idea of having their name published on a major game title.

Edited May 2, 2015 by luzarius

[Raven Darkholme]

I hate VO, since I read way faster than dialogue is spoken.

[barakav]

Offer them $50.00 and a free lunch in exchange for eight hours of grueling, emotionally draining voice acting. Pitch to them the idea of having their name published on a major game title.

A.You are an evil evil man!

B.They won't agree for that.

C.The VO quality won't necessarily be as good as with professionals...

[Noin]

I'd rather prefer having no VO at all, while putting the saved money in improved mechanics, more varied encounters, more special weapons and bigger locations.

[b0rsuk]

Only for companions, maybe their banters as well. I can count on fingers of my hand the NPCs that have memorable voices.

 

 

To fully voice everything we would have needed about four times the original budget. To do that we would have needed to reduce scope in other areas to make up the cost.

 

That said, in the future we will probably try to do what we can to get more voice acting budget.

Edited May 2, 2015 by b0rsuk

[Sensuki]

This game is going in the opposite direction of my preferences but I thought the amount of VO in the game as a total number of lines was fine, but the distribution of that VO was geared more towards feeling AAA than replicating the VO style of the Infinity Engine games.

 

Personally I thought there was too much companion VO and too much plot-critical NPC VO. There could have been more/better opening lines for other NPCs and way better/more companion voice sets, which were extremely disappointing / not even good.

 

I also think less VO with better actors would have also been preferable.

[LadyCrimson]

I liked Eder/Aloth and wouldn't have minded more fully voiced for them. But that's just personal vocal sound preference. The rest were ok/neutral for me.

Player-character voices, I can really only take the "stoic" one. If I ever get around to making a full 6-party hired adventurer team, it's going to be All Stoic, All The Time.

 

But in terms of the game as a whole - the amount of VO Pillars had was about right for me - my nitpick comes largely from when VO was "missing" - like in a (single) conversation with a companion and they'd be voiced for several bits then suddenly there was none for a couple bits, then the voice would come back. That's always jarring. So either better planning re: writing the lines and the VO recording session/s or less VO I guess.

 

I'd hate missing out on NPC/companions being voiced (at least, if I was used to them being voiced before, eg if chrs. were brought back in expansions), but if it's always going to feel inconsistent, then I'd probably rather have none.

[barakav]

 

Only for companions, maybe their banters as well. I can count on fingers of my hand the NPCs that have memorable voices.

 

 

To fully voice everything we would have needed about four times the original budget. To do that we would have needed to reduce scope in other areas to make up the cost.

 

That said, in the future we will probably try to do what we can to get more voice acting budget.

 

only the budget for the VOs not the total budget. It is expensive but not that expensive..

 

Can @BAdler care to clarify?

 

[Silent Winter]

I agree with Sensuki here - there was a little too much VO on some characters, and none at all on others.  It'd be better to get the intro-lines voiced for flavour, and then leave the rest to us to read.

(I read way faster than they speak, too - not speed-reading, not losing any emotional impact, just faster).

[Starwars]

I think I'd prefer it to be slightly less than what we see in PoE, and then focus on getting those performances really good/unique. As an example, I can understand why they'd want the opening of the game to be voiced but the VO for the caravan master is just... not particularly impressive.

 

Then again, I'd probably also be the first to admit that I would miss it if lines were taken away from Edér or Durance for example.

 

But generally speaking, I'd prefer it if the opening "node" for a dialogue was voiced and then mostly silent after that, except for the bits where it's really important for the character.

[Concordance]

I think PioE had too much VO and could have gotten away with less.

 

Odema and Calisca's intermittent VO was helpful to ease the player into the text-only dialogue he'd be dealing with most of the game. Thaos had just the right amount of VO to convey his aura of authority and conviction. Maerwald had just enough VO to convey that he is a good-natured, kindly man fighting violent personalities. I don't think they could have cut on VO for these characters without compromising the experience.

 

Everyone else along the critical path could have had only a few voiced lines, or none at all. The voice acting contributed nothing to the animancy hearing or Lady Webb. Noone in Twin Elms benefitted from VO, not even the Gods (their sequences desperately needed pictures, not VO).

 

I felt that the companions had both too much voice acting, and too little - their lines and party banter seemed to alternate from voiced to not voiced with no consistency or logic to it. Dialogue that carried no consequence was voiced, yet moments where the companions were having emotional struggles sometimes weren't. I think companion VO should have been limited to their first interaction, party banter and key revelations during their quests, where it is difficult to convey their emotional state via quests.

 

I think Planescape still stands as the best example of carefully limited, yet sufficient VO. VO was limited to companions and a couple critical NPCs, and only to their first lines (to establish their character) and key emotional moments (to augment the text). VO is not what makes a character memorable - the character's concept, history and your interactions with it are what makes a character stick. Some of the most memorable characters in the game had no voice whatsoever (Pharod, Lothar, Coaxmetal, Many-as-One, Pillar of Skulls, etc).

Edited May 2, 2015 by Concordance

[Awathorn]

A little less VO. Just the basic stuff. 

 

People need to read, not listen mediocre VO, especially on-off one. 

 

Use that money for more music and ambient sounds, making cool transitions between combat and peaceful tracks etc.

[NathanH]

I'm not sure what I'd prefer corresponds to in the voting, but I'd say:

 

1) Companions ought to be fully voiced, and this is the most important thing

2) The main villain should probably be fully voiced, or something close

3) I like it when you initiate a conversation with an NPC and they say a line, like in the IE games, but this isn't a big deal and the same lines can be repeated across NPCs.

4) I don't think any other voicing is necessary. If there is spare money, then villain sidekicks and plot-critical NPCs should be prioitized, obviously.

Edited May 2, 2015 by NathanH

[Luckmann]

At least 5 people should be euthanised for the good of the game and the project's future.

 

Also, I've said it before and I'm saying it again; if the goal is to convey feels, focus on a more uniform art style (Calisca's portrait still looks like a placeholder, and is essentially just a variation of other, also old-placeholder-art, player portraits) and add more portraits for important NPC:s.

Raedric, Lady Webb, The Duc, the three representatives on the Animancy hearing, the statue in the Sanatorium and the patient Thaos inhabits, all the heads of the three factions in Defiance Bay, and many others comes immediately to mind. Really should've had their own portraits.

 

Edited May 2, 2015 by Luckmann

[Sabotin]

I wouldn't fully voice anything, especially when there's those description things going on in the middle of conversations and the VO clashes with your reading THAT often.

 

First line of conversation for the "main plot" characters, with an extra line strategicaly placed at that big centerpiece dialogue/reveal/combat initiation etc. to accentuate it.

 

I do believe though that everything should have that generic "greeting" line, I think it added some extra flavour and life to the world. You know the commoners' simple "hello?", nobles afraid of you touching them, thieves threatning you, barkeeps and their elven arses... Maybe even some custom greeting for those characters that you wouldn't put full lines on, but that have their own importance in the world.

[endruwiggin]

For me VO isn't hight priority as good story and game mechanics

[luzarius]

I know a fair compromise.

 

1. In Pillars of Eternity 2, make every NPC dialogue response have a unique ID.

2. When you choose that dialogue, have it automatically play a wav file with the unique id as a filename.

3. Modders can then turn on a flag in the console menu that shows a dialogue's unique id at the end of the sentence, so modders know what to name the voice file for that response.

 

This will allow modders to add custom voice acting and those who want it can download it. 

 

 

Edited May 2, 2015 by luzarius

[Luckmann]

I wouldn't fully voice anything, especially when there's those description things going on in the middle of conversations and the VO clashes with your reading THAT often.

 

First line of conversation for the "main plot" characters, with an extra line strategicaly placed at that big centerpiece dialogue/reveal/combat initiation etc. to accentuate it.

 

I do believe though that everything should have that generic "greeting" line, I think it added some extra flavour and life to the world. You know the commoners' simple "hello?", nobles afraid of you touching them, thieves threatning you, barkeeps and their elven arses... Maybe even some custom greeting for those characters that you wouldn't put full lines on, but that have their own importance in the world.

 

This. I think it's funny that in PoE, the general greetings are so few and far between that they feel almost out of place when they pop up, despite the fact that a lot of other dialogue is almost fully voiced. I would really have preferred a few more good lines of general exclamations from "chaff NPC:s" whether it's barkeeps dippin' into their own ale or whatever, determined by subgroup.

[ddillon]

I'm more concerned with Obsidian's poor use of voice acting than the amount of voice acting.

 

The problem:

 

Text description. "Voiced dialogue."

where the voice acting starts before you've had a chance to read the text description.

 

It should follow this format:

 

Text description.

 

(press Continue)

 

"Voiced dialogue."

where the text description is used only to convey what well-written dialogue alone cannot.

 

Also, some of the voice acting is awful.  The hanged dwarf animancer in particular.  It turned what could have been a very creepy, atmospheric scene into something out of a C-grade movie. Mostly I blame the director for not asking the voice actor to speak like a normal person and considering the use of a filter or effect to give the lines an otherworldy feel.

[sucinum]

I didn't even hear half of the voice acting since I read faster than they talk. Unless there is a scripted scene with actual acting, I don't need voice acting at all or only the most important dialogues.

[Sensuki]

It's also the same two or three one word greetings for each sex over and over again.

 

Some of the VO was very poorly recorded as well (GM for example) - I have not seen that in a game of this caliber before.

Edited May 2, 2015 by Sensuki

[dorkboy]

I think it makes sense to voice act the banter/barks/comments taking place outside of the conversation window. 

[Luckmann]

For a quick reference, out of the 41 people that have voted so far, 87,7% have voted for the same level of voiceovers as in PoE or less.

A mere 12,2% desires more, while almost 61% have specifically requested less.

We need a larger sample size, though.