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I don't like that the right way to play this game is: sneak+fast mode


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I only use it on dungeons and related locales, never in town. Yeah I know I'm probably missing on some gear but I don't care.

And I wouldn't mind passive secret detection either. I guess I'm easy to please like that

“Here lies Firedorn, a hero in bed.

“He once was alive, but now he’s dead.

“The last woman he bedded, turned out a man

“And crying in shame, off a cliff he ran.”

 

Firedorn. Bard, transmysogynistic scatlord, skeleton.

 

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He is arguing about the fact that as the game is now, he feels that he needs to be constantly in stealth mode to detect stuff, and at the same time in fast forward mode to not go around at a crawl speed.
 
Personally, I'm very glad that it is possible to use double speed while sneaking, also also while not sneaking.  It's a nice feature that the IE games lacked.  I fail to see how removing double speed, which would slow us down more, or splitting sneak mode into detection and sneak modes, which would not remove the need for or advantage of being in sneak mode, would improve the situation.

 

 

Agreed, double speed and half speed for combat are nice additions to the pause based game model.

 

I think it works, but lets say you take it out, someone will now say the game is being dumbed down, then there are a good 1/2 dozen things that could be more streamlined. Really no win here, I'd say enjoy it the best you can. It's not crazy wrong, to me it works well enough.

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After I found out you can find loot anywere, like extra random crates insides city's, I started stealthing 24/7 but you move SOO SOOOOLW unless you put on fast mode.

its not really a deal breaker, but it does feel kinda...meh.

 

I think the point is. That I feel forced to play like this unless I want to miss something.

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I don't use stealth all the time, even in dungeons.  Most traps have a visual clue on the walls to let you know to turn stealth on, usually a small spout or odd feature on a wall or floor.  I also only go into stealth after clearing a room to quickly find any hidden objects.  Anything that I miss....oh well, plenty of other loot and craft-able/enchantable items in game.

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I like the system as it is. Sure, individual stealth would be great, but I don't particularly miss it. I can still send one guy out to scout ahead. Doesn't matter if the rest of the group goes into sneak mode too. And I don't mind moving slowly when scouting. I mainly use fast mode when back-tracking or scouting out an area I already explored for hidden objects. No one is forcing you to play in fast mode. Not Obsidian's fault you're impatient :)

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Trap and secret detection without also slowing your character down will fail, because people will move past secrets and run into traps before they detect them. 

 

Pause on trap / secret detection exists, you know.

 

uh, the point is, you wouldn't be detecting the trap until AFTER you hit it, so pausing on detect wouldn't really be helping much.

 

that said, pause on detect works perfectly well in this game... provided you're in sneak mode.

 

 

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Yeah, its silly that sneak is even an "option" considering you are always going to be in sneak mode unless you have checked the map everywhere..

 

IE.. If you are going to be in a mode 100% of the time.. why even make it an option, just make it standard.

 

The way it "Should" work.

 

1.  Always "Running"

2.  On Spotting enemy entire party goes auto-sneak until detected/combat.

3.  Spot range should be about 25% further then it currently is.. I mean.. who can only see roughly 30 meters around themselves? 

4.  Traps/Secret should be auto-found regardless of mode.

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I don't mind having to be in stealth mode to notice traps, and I don't mind stealth + fast mode being the kind of baseline exploration/dungeon crawling tactic.

I do mind that I can't just put one person into stealth to position them after my front line engages or is engaged upon. That all-or-nothing part of stealth really just doesn't feel natural to me at the moment.

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i dont overuse sneak+fast mode. tend to just use sneak in dungeons to scout ahead a bit, or in towns where i think secrets might be. basically the same way i played the IE games with 1 thief. sure it's optimal to play with sneak on all the time, but playing the optimal way is boring imo. its an rpg, gotta rp baby - not fuss about having tactical advantage all the time

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You find hidden stuff and traps in such weird places in this game that you really need it always on if you don't want to miss stuff.

Besides, what's the ****ing benefit of having to hit the sneak button in a room full of crates just to know which 2 of the mare trapped? why is this better??

 

Stupid design decision makes any player who doesn't want to miss a bunch of stuff or walk into a trap or ambush have to use sneak+fast mode the whole game through. It's just how it is.

 

FIX THIS CRAP OBSIDIAN

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Autopause for "hidden object found" doesn't work for traps?

 

Yes it does. But it's funny to watch them rage about nothing.

 

 

Oh. Okay. Sorry. I went looking for "trap" in the auto-pause options, and was greatly disappointed. Thank you for informing me that I was simply scanning for the wrong word.

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Autopause for "hidden object found" doesn't work for traps?

 

Yes it does. But it's funny to watch them rage about nothing.

 

 

Oh. Okay. Sorry. I went looking for "trap" in the auto-pause options, and was greatly disappointed. Thank you for informing me that I was simply scanning for the wrong word.

 

 

Apology accepted. Now, don't let it happen again, or I'll have to inform your parents!

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I do not think secret-finding should be enabled outside of "stealth mode." It makes sense that if you spirit through things, you'd miss them.

 

The problem is that "stealth mode" is the functional default, and should be treated as such. The movement speed while in it is something the devs should have known would be a near-constant player experience and made it a much more bearable, normal speed. Outside of "stealth mode" should have been given a fast movement speed which makes it feel special.

 

Really, it shouldn't be that you move normal then toggle on secret-finding by moving slow; it should be that you move normal then toggle off secret-finding to move fast. Sprint Mode, not Stealth Mode.

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I don't feel like this is the right way to play at all. I find I use stealth once in awhile outside of dungeons but not that often. Dungeons is where I would have it on a good deal.

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I do think it makes sense from a sim point of view, that you'd be mostly sneaking cautiously through a dungeon, I don't think it's a problem at all that that's mandatory for dungeons.

 

But I think they could have taken a bit more care with placement of purple items out in the world.  They're in enough totally random places that the completionist is going to be tempted to fast-sneak throughout the game, whereas if it were clear that such items would only be in places that logically made sense (e.g. abandoned campsites), then you'd only go into "hunt the purple" mode in places where it made sense to do so.

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I actually liked the treasure hunt aspect in the game, little nuggets of purple happiness everywhere :)

 

To find hidden traps and objects, you move slowly and carefully to have enough time to analyze your surroundings. Doesn't have to be sneaking, a slow walk would also fit. But running around, no.

Edited by pstone
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My only real objection to the sneak thing is that it has to be the whole party at once, or nobody. I want to be able to sneak someone into the back of a room, aggro some spawns and then run the sneaker up behind them. But since sneak breaks on combat start, that's doesn't work at all, since it means every monster will immediately wheel around and gobsmack the person who was hiding.

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I think it's great as is. Makes sense to me that if you're taking extra care then you move more slowly. As for 'right' way to play the game, that's nonsense: The right way to play it is whatever's fun for you - for me my characters move at their normal speed most of the time and only slow down to search if they're looking for something in particular or being wary of traps.

 

I could have agreed with this sentiment if the secrets in the game at least tried to stick with a certain formula of logic. As it stands now most of the secrets are arbitrarily placed in hallways or in randomly placed cupboards. You'd expect to find a secret in a vault room, a puzzle or as a secret compartment in a suspiciously looking wall.

 

Secrets are never where you expect to find them by definition. I like the system that forces you to take time to look for stuff. Makes absolutely no sense to find stuff as you run by just because you have high mechanics. To do that would be totally anti-immersion.

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The problem is that "stealth mode" is the functional default, and should be treated as such. The movement speed while in it is something the devs should have known would be a near-constant player experience and made it a much more bearable, normal speed. Outside of "stealth mode" should have been given a fast movement speed which makes it feel special.

 

Really, it shouldn't be that you move normal then toggle on secret-finding by moving slow; it should be that you move normal then toggle off secret-finding to move fast. Sprint Mode, not Stealth Mode.

 

That's exactly how it works, if you adjust your definition of what constitutes the "normal speed" to be "the speed you move with sneak turned on".  Look at it that way, and with sneak on you move normal speed and with sneak off you move faster.

 

(To clarify, I'm trying to point out that your suggestion would not solve the problem that others are complaining about.  They want to be able to move around at the fastest speed available and still find all the traps and secret things.  So making sneak and not-sneak both faster than they are, or making the current sneak mode to "normal" and changing the current "normal" to be sprint mode, wouldn't satisfy them because they would still be "forced" to move slower than the maximum movement speed available to find things.)

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@Emptiness: what I was trying to say is that, as the default movement speed in practice if not in name, Stealth Mode in this game is intolerably slow. I'm not saying Stealth Mode should be as fast as non-Stealth (emphatically the opposite), but having Stealth as slow as it is now is borderline sadistic.

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