Shades, spectres and other ethereal douchbags

[IcosahedronXIII]

Hello again,

 

Is it just me or the ghost in this game totally wreck ass?

More to the point, I have a 6 member party with mostly scripted NPCs as teammates (Durance, Edér, Aloth and Kana) aside from a monk and my cipher; I'm playing this playthrough on hard and I can mostly cruise through every fight without having to rethink my tactics. However, shades and spectres make my life a living nightmare (get it?)
I've tried magical damage (both fire and shock), all kinds of weapon types, buffing my characters with foods and spells, focusing just one shade and moving on to the next... but it's just impossible for my party to bring down the first lighthose encounter without having to pull some shenanigans.

I'll post a few pictures of my party later on, please keep "you suck/your party is weak" responses to a minimum, I'd just like some advice on how to deal with these monsters without a complete do-over.

IcosahedronXIII

[luttenplunder]

I also would like to know what weapons and magic to use aganist Shades?

[SeloPeylo]

I ****ing hate those too.. Those douchebags reproduce themselves every time. Besides that they even teleport themselves away from my tanks to my mage and my damage dealer.. 

[Whosdriving]

one thing if you kill the original it's offspring or summens go with it. also shads and shadows have low hp high deflection so if you buff accuracy and use paralze and stun efects they can go doun fast. also Durance's per encounter ability dose damage to undead as well as healing. but specters are just plain nasty. any ecounter with them and shadows i always try to drop the shadows first because the can teleport and specters cant.

[Isi1dur]

I am of the opinion that it's a balance issue mostly, they seem to be OP currently which will most likely get sorted out in one of the many upcoming patches.

[termokanden]

They do seem to be a bit overpowered compared to other enemies you'll meet at the same points in the game. Well, from what I've seen so far as a level 4 character anyway

[gkathellar]

The Shadows may be a little strong, but the Shades are the real wreckers, and that's sort of the point - the Eothasian Temple is meant to be almost ridiculously difficult for the level you encounter it. Josh Sawyer talked about this in an interview - some dungeons are meant to be way more difficult, with rewards that are likewise a lot better than most of what you're finding at the time.

[vyvexthorne]

They are pretty tough.. There were a few mobs that gave me some trouble. I don't think I've ever made it through an encounter with all characters conscious.  On one occasion all I had left was the fighter but he triumphed - barely. (that's all I need for a win though.)  Chanter chanting, mage blasting spells, cleric blasting spells..  I go all out if a fight seems tough. Lots of pausing, casting, drinking potions. Use every thing at your disposal because you can always rest afterwards. ..

 

Seems like they really like to go for the mage so keep him moving about and far away so he doesn't auto initiate close combat.. (and then get killed when you try to run away.)

[Tigranes]

Most people in early game will use tactics of "engage with fighter, throw my highest damage abilities with everyone else", because that's what seems obvious. Shadows in particular are resistant to this tactic because of their DR / Resistances and teleport. They are super difficult if you persist with the same tactic, but very manageable if you adapt to the situation. 

 

E.g. with a cipher, charm a shadow and hopefully have two shadows duke it out; with high INT charm will often last until one dies and another is almost dead, taking out two in a flash. Durance' anti-undead abilities are extremely powerful. Fire is a good option. 

[geobio]

The Shadows may be a little strong, but the Shades are the real wreckers, and that's sort of the point - the Eothasian Temple is meant to be almost ridiculously difficult for the level you encounter it. Josh Sawyer talked about this in an interview - some dungeons are meant to be way more difficult, with rewards that are likewise a lot better than most of what you're finding at the time.

 

I'm still looking for those rewards after finishing that temple.

 

By the way, go on Blunt weapons with shade and wait for lvl 4 to be at ease, also a rogue with a crossbow help a lot, yes gamplay is totally oriented in this game, yes, that is sad.

[PIP-Clownboy]

Ghost Buster talent best talent

[Wolken3156]

The Shadows may be a little strong, but the Shades are the real wreckers, and that's sort of the point - the Eothasian Temple is meant to be almost ridiculously difficult for the level you encounter it. Josh Sawyer talked about this in an interview - some dungeons are meant to be way more difficult, with rewards that are likewise a lot better than most of what you're finding at the time.

The temple is nothing compared to the Lighthouse later in the game... which also has Shades, Shadows and Phantoms, but in much greater numbers.

 

At any rate, magic is usually the way to go with them. Prayer against Fear is very handy since Spectres and Phantoms can cause characters to become Frightened. If you have a Cipher, Mental Binding works wonders on them since Paralyse also disables their DR. Without it, they tend to drop fairly quickly.

[PrimeJunta]

Aloth's Fan of Flames works really well as an opening. If you can get two of them off, that's basically all she wrote. Don't waste your time trying to engage and defend, just hit them hard with everything you've got and they'll go down pretty nicely. (That's actually pretty good advice a lot of the time...)

 

The tougher incorporeals like specters and Cêan Gûla need softening up with a debuff (Fetid Caress, Curse of Blackened Sight, or if you have level 3, Reveal Vulnerabilities). The shades, shadows, and phantoms are fairly easy.

[Odd Hermit]

They're high deflection and fairly high damage, something the PC/companions can't pull off at the same time. And there are limited ways to increase accuracy to counter high deflection which not all parties will have access too.

 

They're pretty much cheaters.

 

They do have low health though.

 

 

Most people in early game will use tactics of "engage with fighter, throw my highest damage abilities with everyone else", because that's what seems obvious. Shadows in particular are resistant to this tactic because of their DR / Resistances and teleport. They are super difficult if you persist with the same tactic, but very manageable if you adapt to the situation. 

 

E.g. with a cipher, charm a shadow and hopefully have two shadows duke it out; with high INT charm will often last until one dies and another is almost dead, taking out two in a flash. Durance' anti-undead abilities are extremely powerful. Fire is a good option.

 

Tenuous Grasp is how I do it w/my Cipher - can be used while not in combat unlike Whisper of Treason/Puppet Master

[gkathellar]

@geobio - Pretty sure it's the stat-boosting helm, in this case.

[Rafkos]

 

 

Most people in early game will use tactics of "engage with fighter, throw my highest damage abilities with everyone else", because that's what seems obvious. Shadows in particular are resistant to this tactic because of their DR / Resistances and teleport. They are super difficult if you persist with the same tactic, but very manageable if you adapt to the situation. 

But how to use different one when your party dies after 2 secs of combat? It's so damn annoying to fight them, really, it makes me rage quit everytime I have to reload 20 times

[IcosahedronXIII]

They are pretty tough.. There were a few mobs that gave me some trouble. I don't think I've ever made it through an encounter with all characters conscious.  On one occasion all I had left was the fighter but he triumphed - barely. (that's all I need for a win though.)  Chanter chanting, mage blasting spells, cleric blasting spells..  I go all out if a fight seems tough. Lots of pausing, casting, drinking potions. Use every thing at your disposal because you can always rest afterwards. ..

 

Seems like they really like to go for the mage so keep him moving about and far away so he doesn't auto initiate close combat.. (and then get killed when you try to run away.)

The problem with moving around the lighthouse is mainly the furniture. it's tough to get in range for some AoE spells with so many broken tables lying around.

 

Most people in early game will use tactics of "engage with fighter, throw my highest damage abilities with everyone else", because that's what seems obvious. Shadows in particular are resistant to this tactic because of their DR / Resistances and teleport. They are super difficult if you persist with the same tactic, but very manageable if you adapt to the situation. 

 

E.g. with a cipher, charm a shadow and hopefully have two shadows duke it out; with high INT charm will often last until one dies and another is almost dead, taking out two in a flash. Durance' anti-undead abilities are extremely powerful. Fire is a good option. 

I've tried other approaches too, buddy, it's just that with my current setup (not a fan of power gaming, relally) I can´t really seem to hit it off before my DPS heroes go unconcious. Puppet Master proves helpful on my 20 INT Cipher, but most of the time they cancel my cast or I'm left with no spells for a very big chunk of the encounter. Both blunt melee and pistols seem fairly ineficient at hitting them.

I haven't really tried all of Durance's spells, I mostly go for DR, Accuracy and Defence. Will watch out for the aforementioned anti-undead next time I give it a go.

Thanks for all the replies!

 

IcosahedronXIII.

[Slimjimjohnson]

I had trouble with them when I first started. The scripted party members suck.

 

After watching a few of sensukis videos and playing the game for about 13 hrs I got a better handle on the mechanics and strategy.

 

I play on hard and I took the temple of eothis with my pc at lvl3 and my mad party members at lvl2.

 

Basically rogue with arbalest and a monk destroys shades. Get that sneak attack on a shade and throw the monk at them. Tie everything else up with tanks and destroy them with mage arcane encounter ability.

 

Kill shades first they are priority number one!

[revial]

Well, it's kind of crazy what even one level does in terms of power, despite not much seemingly having changed on one's character screen. I was level 5, I think, when I initially tried the top of the lighthouse, and got creamed. Went back at level 7 and did it almost on auto pilot. 

 

High damage, slow weapons on every character helps (to the point where I honestly can't fathom what the point of fast, low damage weapons are).

[Fen(rir)tastic]

Debuff deflection, paralyse or flank them and don't use ice spells. I also had success with crush weapons from memory.

 

Ps. Phantom perma stun when I was level 3 lol.

[IcosahedronXIII]

I had trouble with them when I first started. The scripted party members suck.

 

After watching a few of sensukis videos and playing the game for about 13 hrs I got a better handle on the mechanics and strategy.

 

I play on hard and I took the temple of eothis with my pc at lvl3 and my mad party members at lvl2.

 

Basically rogue with arbalest and a monk destroys shades. Get that sneak attack on a shade and throw the monk at them. Tie everything else up with tanks and destroy them with mage arcane encounter ability.

 

Kill shades first they are priority number one!

I play scripted NPCs on this run mostly for flavour purposes, as soon as I'm done with the playthrough I'll make my own party

I think fast weapons are far better on cyphers during low levels (if you have the right accuracy) because it lets you recharge your spells that much quicker. My arbalest does regen a big chunk of it in just one slow blow, but if it fails I'm stuck for another 4-5 seconds without spells.

IcosahedronXIII.

[Phyriel]

On Path of the Damned there is no way to fight ghosts at party level 3 of without using environment, I keep my hard CC spells when they teleport to my casters, when they do that I drop my CC on them so i can get distance, but its a dangerous situation because if you get scared and rush your melee to help your casters and stop blocking other ghosts in narrow door pass or corridor you end up in a world of pain, you get flanked, you try to focus teleporting target but he teleport away again, you're forced to move again but you're flanked so you get disengage hits = dead in 4 seconds. I learned that on hardest difficulty there are no easy encounters, I learned the hard way how different fight ends if I charge in mindlessly vs 10 spiders and how it looks if I block doorway with my tanks to fight 2-3 spiders at a time, debuff with wizard and cipher, buff myself with chanter all the time and summon skeletons to soak some damage. In first scenario I end up dead, in second scenario i barely loose endurance, its a world of difference, tactics means everything in this game but yea I agree ghosts are a tad bit hard. I first learned how hard they are when I went to Caer and tried to fight them in open field... yea it was a masacre.

[TheUsernamelessOne]

Am I crazy or did they used to inflict stun with every attack at launch (which made the Chanter summon phantom totally busted, by the by)? Either I'm insane or they snuck in a patch and downgraded it to daze.

 

They're still right bastards and they definitely feel overpowered, considering how they show up pretty much everywhere in large numbers and they all have a wide array of powerful abilities that can't be easily countered (well, except by using the exact same strategy as you do against everything else in the game, positioning yourself so they have to funnel through a chokepoint to get to you and then dropping all your encounter abilities on them).

[Sensuki]

For the record - even though Shadows etc do have a teleport ability, there is actually a bug with them causing them to teleport to your units (I think it's a pathfinding bug) - you can tell because they don't play the short animation when they teleport and land.

[Mercbeast]

Shadows and Shades nearly made me abandon playing POTD. I went into the temple without Durance (so I had 5 PC's) and 5 hours later I was at a fight with 2 shades that I had been wiping on for about 3 hours!

 

I went and played hard for awhile, then decided to go back to POTD with a better couple of hired adventurers to augment and breezed through. They are still the worst encounters I've seen so far on POTD. It is a total crap shoot, almost 100% RNG if you can win or lose these fights. If too many teleport to your squishies you get wiped in a matter of seconds.