First impressions thread!

[Undecaf]

- Sometimes it is hard to see you're characters 100%, maybe making them stick out a tad more would be good

 

I back this up. I've only tried a few rounds of combat, but the characters (and their interface related accessories) seem to mesh in the background a bit too much, which often makes keeping track of the happenings something of a chore. Especially during night time outdoors - the beetles weren't hard because of difficulty or the rules, but because the whole scene was visually so obscured it was hard to keep track on who was doing what and to whom (and of course the bugs about unresponsiviness and such, that gets mentioned a lot). Also in the zoom function bugs out all the time outside the town, instead of zooming in or out, it begins to only adjust the visibility range moving the edges of fog of war.

[Lioness]

My first impressions are... it's rough. The combat is sort of a hot mess right now, and not just due to my own inexperience with the mechanics at play.

 

I have to second this. I guess there is an ideal configuration of auto-pause setting that allows efficient control over each character, I just have not found it yet. I feel like I am fighting to gain control of my team more than I am fighting the enemies.

[Sammael]

 

This is not really in beta stage. This is alpha, or somewhere between alpha and beta (at best).

Uhm.

 

No? Its beta. Early beta, but Beta.

 

Also how the hell would you make an accurate guess on how much time the game still needs?

 

14 years of experience in software development, 16 years of following Interplay/BIS/Obsidian games. They need more time.

[C2B]

 

 

This is not really in beta stage. This is alpha, or somewhere between alpha and beta (at best).

Uhm.

 

No? Its beta. Early beta, but Beta.

 

Also how the hell would you make an accurate guess on how much time the game still needs?

 

 

14 years of experience in software development, 16 years of following Interplay/BIS/Obsidian games. They need more time.

 

And I still don't get how you can make that statement. It's not like we have enough information over the projects overall situation. Or resources. For all we know their programmers might switch completly to bug-squashing in a week. Everything important seems to mechanically be in the game after all.

 

But, ok. You're the expert.

 

Though.... regarding 16 years of following BIS/Obsidian. You should be aware that Sawyer has a pretty good track record regarding project management (Under tight deadlines especially). I trust him.

[Stun]

Well, fine, I guess, although personally I don't mind rock paper scissors if it's a good game of rock paper scissors.

 

What I still don't get is why you find it offensive in P:E when the IE games were chock full of rock paper scissors. What was combat against golems, beholders, illithids, or high-level undead if not a game of rock paper scissors?

Golems were the only Rock-paper-scissors in Bg2, since some types of their species were immune to everything but blunt weapons. All the others could hardly be called such when there were a bajillion ways for them to be harmed by any class. Edited August 20, 2014 by Stun

[PrimeJunta]

Nonsense. Every mage fight was RPS. Beholders were RPS. High-level undead were RPS. In some of those the RPS wasn't about picking the right weapon; it was about picking the right counters and the right elemental damage or spell(s). Same thing, just applied differently.

 

Are you claiming that there aren't a 'bajillion' ways to do crushing, piercing, or slashing damage in P:E? 'Cuz I'm sure seeing a lot of them.

 

Seriously, Stun. This isn't rocket science.

[frostphoenyx]

Well it's well known that everybody on the Internet is a computer engineer with 20+ years of experience in software development

 

Anyway, after playing some more, here's my 2 cents about combat :

 

-> Combat is a bit too fast paced, a lot is happening at the same time.

-> The range of spells is way too short.

-> I think adding chants, increasing spell casting time, visual impact and damage could help to give a more dynamic feel.

[Sammael]

Well, I'm not "everybody on the internet" so I can't speak for others, but you should be easily able to google me, find my real name, and see my credentials as well as my previous connections to various BIS/Obsidian projects. Been here forever... only slightly less forever than Grommy and Volourn.

 

The problem is not in Josh's management, but it's not always Josh's call.

Edited August 20, 2014 by Sammael

[Elerond]

You should take into account that we don't have access to full beta content, but very limited content, so that it wouldn't spoil game to us before we get our hands on release version.

According to Obsidian (update 80) they use department specific alpha and beta terms to determine how ready each department is, meaning that departments aren't necessary in same readiness level. 

 

And what I can evaluate by playing backers' beta, is that they have mostly balancing, polishing and bug fixing to do if other areas of game are on same level as levels in backers' beta, which would mean that game is very much in beta stage even using classic definition of beta.

[Stun]

14 years of experience in software development, 16 years of following Interplay/BIS/Obsidian games. They need more time.

They don't have a choice in the matter. Josh said the game was going to be released in winter of this year because that's when the money runs out.

[Sammael]

 

14 years of experience in software development, 16 years of following Interplay/BIS/Obsidian games. They need more time.

They don't have a choice in the matter. Josh said the game was going to be released in winter of this year because that's when the money runs out.

 

And there we go - as I said, it's not always Josh's call. I hope for Obsidian's sake that they will do all they can to release a polished game, even if it means cutting content in order to ensure other content is complete. 

[Elerond]

 

14 years of experience in software development, 16 years of following Interplay/BIS/Obsidian games. They need more time.

They don't have a choice in the matter. Josh said the game was going to be released in winter of this year because that's when the money runs out.

 

 

They can always put it on early access and get more money if that is only reason to release game this winter, but it seems to not as they very pretty confident that they don't need more money to finish the game, as they said that even if they go with early access route, money would go in expansion pack.

[Stun]

Nonsense. Every mage fight was RPS. Beholders were RPS. High-level undead were RPS. In some of those the RPS wasn't about picking the right weapon; it was about picking the right counters and the right elemental damage or spell(s). Same thing, just applied differently.

 

Are you claiming that there aren't a 'bajillion' ways to do crushing, piercing, or slashing damage in P:E? 'Cuz I'm sure seeing a lot of them.

 

Seriously, Stun. This isn't rocket science.

Second time: I don't care that BG2 has Rock-paper-scissors elements. I care that PoE does because Josh claimed it *wouldn't*. And he claimed it wouldn't after smugly criticizing the IE games for having them...and hard counters. And chance. And kill xp. And death spells. And mechanics that lead to rest spamming and save scumming. And everything else he claims promotes degenerate gameplay.

 

I don't know if it's Irony, or just plain hypocricy on his part that after calling us Grognards and condemning the games we loved for having "bad design", that all it took was a 3-5 hour demo for us to see that PoE will most definitely have at least 3 of the above.

Edited August 20, 2014 by Stun

[C2B]

 

 

14 years of experience in software development, 16 years of following Interplay/BIS/Obsidian games. They need more time.

They don't have a choice in the matter. Josh said the game was going to be released in winter of this year because that's when the money runs out.

 

 

And there we go - as I said, it's not always Josh's call. I hope for Obsidian's sake that they will do all they can to release a polished game, even if it means cutting content in order to ensure other content is complete.

 

thats.... Not really any different than any other project? The money runs out and you (hopefully) prepare for that.

 

Also I'm sure there's enough B-priority *Would like to have* stuff that can just not be done to compensate. I doubt anything vital gets cut that wouldn't have been cut (for whatever reason) anyway.

[PrimeJunta]

Oh, OK, so you're only annoyed because of something Josh said. Thanks for clearing that up, @Stun.

[Sir Davion]

I actually don't think combat is that bad. I felt exactly like most of the people when i played it for the first time. The second time i still had some issues but i all made more sense and now playing it the third time the combat feels actually very rewarding, tactical and i feel like i'm in control and it isn't to fast anymore for me. (Actually i thought the devs already made some adjustments maybe?).

 

Like some other poster said i think it would work better if you start with a lvl 1 character and slowly increase your party size.

 

Stuff that really bothers me (that isn't already in the known issues thread):

- Maybe a little bit better hit/miss feedback

- Looting doesn't work correctly it seems. You always have to move your party again before you can click on the loot.

- An autopause feature where the game pauses when one of your characters has finished casting a spell

[sparklecat]

- An autopause feature where the game pauses when one of your characters has finished casting a spell

Is that not already in the options?

[Osvir]

Like some other poster said i think it would work better if you start with a lvl 1 character and slowly increase your party size.

Idea: Start game with 1 character, with the BB Classes standing next to spawn and you can recruit them if you wish. Or a single merchant (like Dengler) standing near spawn and you can make a free 6-man party at Level 5.

[Dray Truoc]

My first impressions...I may need to play it again!

 

I spent a couple hours getting in to it last night...and I must say I was having a really hard time taking the rose-coloured glasses off.  It was difficult for me to focus on bugs/negatives/issues as I was so enthralled to be playing an IE-style game again.  Felt like home (in a gaming sense)!

 

So all that being said, I thought it was fantastic, and Obsidian is delivering EXACTLY what I was after.  I'm sure there's stuff to improve, but if it came out in December (or thereabouts) with bug fixes and no other real changes, I'd be a happy backer.

 

I WILL give it a bit more time, and see if any constructive critique comes to mind, though. )

[MikeTheRed]

I only had about 15min last night to fiddle with the beta build and I found myself saying over and over again:

 

This is JUST like playing an old Infinity Engine game.  I mean, down to the icons, the interactions, the art style, everything.

 

This is what I'd expect from a Baldur's Gate 3, or Icewind Dale 3.

 

So yay nostalgia!

[Stun]

Oh, OK, so you're only annoyed because of something Josh said..

...and did.

[FunGrinder]

Pretty happy. 

 

+ves

• Environments whilst currently quite static (assume this will not be the case for full release) are stunning. 
• music is glorious
• combat is exciting and often challenging. Even repeating certain fights
• lots of customization, though I guess a little more in the way of character models would be nice.
• wonderfully written. Even the minor issues are immersive and fleshed out.
• Fairly good looking 3D models. 

-ves

• combat animations are somewhat lack luster. Especially the monk (I've griped about this already)
• pretty static environments.

 

Honestly I would put more -ve's in however I don't count bugs. The point of the beta is to remove these. As for the overall impression I'm very happy. just sort out the MONK COMBAT ANIMATIONS and i'll be a happy camper. 

[intro42]

First up want to say loving the look and feel, I haven't played through much but just had a crash and decided to make my first post.

 

Technical issues:

1 - In the options menu, when I look at the Game, Graphics, and Sound options the left buttons all lose their labels, Autopause and Controls show all the button labels

2 - In the Controls options it allows you to bind a single key to multiple actions, i.e. I realised this when I set F5 to be both Quicksave and Save, then tested it and bound C to both Character Sheet and to Load

3 - When using the crafting screen the font size changes at some points seemingly at random

4 - After using the crafting screen two large white "W" appeared on the inventory screen, one beneath the feet of my character and the second to the left in line with the first

5 - When viewing the stash names/descriptions of items appear behind the stash window and are therefore unreadable

Became stuck when trying to move an item from stash to a character, stash closed and I was unable to drop item anyware, could not close the inventory screen.

6 - Finding many of the expected pathfinding problems.

7 - Ambient sounds (waterwheel slosh and birdsong) drops out at random

 

How about some positives:

Character creation is great, some may find it confusing that there is a bonus from the default culture applied prior to getting to that point in the creation process however it is a single point that is labelled as such so shouldn't be a big issue.

I have enjoyed the dialog so far and am looking forward to my next character build to see what options I have not been able to access.

As someone who likes pausing a lot during battle I haven't found the combat to be overly confusing, there is a lot going on but that is a good thing for this style of RPG

 

Everyone has done an amazing job and I am so excited to be playing finally

[Longknife]

Honestly, I'm the complete opposite from most of you. The more I play it, the more content I am. Most of the complaints that still hold true are ones that are mere....oddities, rather than flaws. For example someone posted a wonderful thread highlighting how the divided inventory serves no purpose as it stands now and is functionally the same as a united inventory for the party. Is this a flaw that gets in the way of gameplay? Not really. Does he have a point there's no purpose in including a feature that serves no purpose and holds no meaning? Absolutely, and he's right that it should either be given purpose or scrapped. But if the game were to ship tomorrow with the inventory as it is now, it'd do absolutely nothing to hinder the overall experience of the game.

  Most other complaints I'm seeing are things like "The Godlike need more appearance options" or "the Godlike look like a butt." Or "animations seem limited." While that may be dislikes for some people, the core functionality of the game isn't hindered by this kind of stuff. For me, I'm happy that I'm seeing a game with writing, with RPG mechanics and with a functioning combat system. It definitely was a little odd picking it up at first and yes I would say the combat rate might be a little off-putting for any "casual gamer" who picks up this game not knowing what to expect, but once you know how to manage it it works fine.

 

 

As for bug issues, none of us can truly say if they can or cannot address all bugs before release. That's just something we need to cross our fingers on.

[WebShaman]

I am stumped.

 

I always assumed (I know, I shouldn't have, but I did, go figure) that peeps playing a beta would first look at all the available options first, key binds, yadda yadda yadda.

 

Apparently not.

 

For combat, I have found the S and D keys to be PARAMOUNT for good tactics.  With these keys (and, of course, the space bar), one can speed up and slow down the movement, actions, etc!  Need some extra time?  Hit S.  Everything instantly S-L-O-W-S down.  Now you can see what is happening, and plan accordingly.  When you are done, hit D for lightspeed mode to finish things up.

 

BTW - if you hit the same key again, it "reverts" back to normal speed.

 

Why are these not being used by those criticizing the combat system?  By using these methods, combat is sooooo easy!  I love it!

 

So much better than anything else I have ever seen! 

 

I often go into Scouting mode, hit D, and fast movement, yeah!  Come to a creature, hit S, and attack, then run back to the group (hit S again, or D, dependingly), lead the enemies to them.  Hit S again, and pummel the enemy to their knees!

 

So my take on the game so far :

 

I like the graphics, they match how the game is made.  It reminds me a lot of The Temple of Elemental Evil - which is a good thing IMHO.  

 

The animations are fine, I have no problems with them.

 

I like the dialog system (still figuring out how it works, though). 

 

I have played a Godlike Ranger with a Bear companion.  And I can tell you that we tore up everything.  That bear (Bruno in my game) was whacking things apart!  It is a bit slow to attack, but the hits do HUUUGE damage to everything!

 

I really liked the little "dialoge shows" included when one moved the Statue (for the Crypt run) and the rope across the cavern.  Really cool!

 

So, now to the negatives :

 

As has been criticized, the inventory is a horror.  It is just sooo clunky, unwieldly, and horrid.  I don't know what is what, everything is very small, and there are limited spaces (besides the Loot chest) to put stuff.  I soon lose track of everything.  I have no idea which weapons are better than the others, and only a bit of info for armor.  It is very difficult for me to tell which armor is what, being that the icon is so small, meaning I have to constantly right click to see what stats it has.  No comparison function, no "equip best" or any other type of helpful stuff.  I can't even sort according to condition X (or type or whatever).  It is painful drag-n-click, again and again.

 

Don't even get me started with accessories,  trading, etc.  The whole inventory system is negative IMHO.  I would suggest scrapping it and going with something else.

 

Doing spellcasting in combat is very confusing for me at the moment (perhaps this will change?).  I do not know what most of the spells do (familiarity, but also pretty much a total lack of description on how magic works, etc).  Damage spells seem pretty self-explanitory, but some of the status stuff, and special abilities are like...WHA?!

 

There is as mentioned very little in the way of informative feedback in combat (I see some graphic effects, I see some red, etc, but I don't really know what it MEANS).  What I would prefer are indicators that immediately inform me of what is happening (did I hit, miss, or what?  That strange graphic effect on my peeps, what is it doing?  Is it good, bad, what?).  I do like the little blue dots (HPs, I think) that reduce when taking damage, but they are really small.  Thankfully I can slow things down with the S key to see them.

 

Looting (picking stuff up) seems to have a problem near Icons (like doors, map edges, etc).  It is impossible (for me, anyway) to pick stuff up that falls in such places!  Either I end up closing/opening the doors, or exiting/entering a map area!  The same problem with targeting enemies by such icons - it is impossible!  I once had a Wolf attacking my party that I could not directly target because it was at a map edge under the icon.  I had to move the entire party away (and take hits) so that it would follow to a place where I could target it.

 

That about rounds up my Pros/Cons.  All in all, I really like PoE.  Keep up the good work!