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Stretch Goals?  

2,052 members have voted

  1. 1. Would you like Obsidian to release new stretch goals to go along with the opening of the Backer Portal?

    • I would love new stretch goals.
      1591
    • No, I would prefer if Obsidian did not introduce new stretch goals.
      458


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I do find the very existance of this thread interesting. Typically, at this point in production Scope Creep is the big impending threat. But here, we apparently have the opposite going on: A developer proposing to expand the already existing scope of the game.

 

Feature Creep is not something that exists only in a publisher-bred game. It exists in all projects: book, game, move, etc.

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I'm a definite 'yes' - I think additional stretch goals for wilderness areas and extra NPCs is a great idea.

 

Some reasons:

  1. I don't care how long it takes. I'm sure I'm just as excited to play PoE as anyone else here, but the whole beauty of the kickstarter funding model is that it should reduce the kinds of pressures and constraints that make developers feel rushed. Take all the time you need. Make it the best game you can. Let us know if there's something specific you need more money for, and we'll see what we can do. 
  2. Additional NPCs would substantially increase the replayability of the game - and that's one of the truly great things about BG2, after all. If a successful stretch goal makes a full campaign replay something appealing, then that stretch goal has essentially doubled the value of the game. Definitely worth it.
  3. I love a good wilderness area. I'm a sucker for BG1 in this sense, and while I adored BG2, I thought it didn't compare to the first game in terms of a sense of exploration and discovery. I know for sure that Obsidian will get wildernesses right - give them themes, little moments of story and context and character, visual interest and atmosphere. 
  4. It will justify me using the backer portal to buy some of the stuff that I really want but can't quite bring myself to spend money on at this stage!

So - yes, go for it!

 

Totally in agreement with this.

 

Absolutely loved the wilderness areas in BG1 so if the game is currently a little under the BG2 level, then it definitely needs more wilderness!

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No, absolutely no more stretch goals. Let's just get the bloody main game out the door ASAP, polished and bug free. After that you do another drive for a proper expansion and/or DLC. But for now I don't want to see this game delayed one second further than it has to be. Next thing this will be Star Citizen with endless feature creep and a 2 year project becomes a 5 year project. Thanks, but no thanks. Just let me get my grubby little mitts on it NOW! Thanks.

 

As much as I would love more stuff, I have to admit Obsidian has a bad rep for releasing some pretty glitchy and bug infested games. If you guys add more stuff, that's a bigger game you have to QA, if in fact you have a decent QA system in place. I need to double check, but I think there was an Alpha and Beta option for us to pledge on which should aid in that area much faster and better so you guys can make a smooth release. I'd prefer a smoother experience and focused project, than a bunch of random stuff that seems halfway thought out. No offense to Tim Cain, but that initial crafting mechanic update #58 we had was really a poor concept for something we put such a large amount of $ into. Luckily you guys were flexible and listened to us and made some tweaks, which hopefully end up being a lot of fun!

 

One idea I would like to have included in the game I think would be a lot of fun that hopefully could be implemented without needing a stretch goal involved would be for when you return your session of playing you get a short narrative explaining the storyline at your last save point or check point. An example of what I'm talking about that I felt did an exceptional job of that was Rogue Galaxy on the Ps2. Basically the loading screen talked about what major story element was happening and your goal or things you were doing the last time you played. This brings you back into the world in a similar way as the narrator did in The Princess Bride. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_Av_1NmQMU#t=122

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While I'd certainly love to see more companions, more wilderness areas, more all sorts of things, I'd rather the dev team focus on delivering on all the existing stretch goals that came up in the Kickstarter campaign then keep adding more on.  Save great ideas for more for expansion packs.

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By the way, will we be able to pledge more money? I came too late and missed the kickstarter, so I couldn't pledge for a physical box (maybe collectors edition). I'd gladly correct this mistake.

I believe logging into the backer site and doing its thing gives folk the option to pledge more/get some of those things as "add-ons."

 

Thank you, I will try this.

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So I've thought about it.  And read this entire thread.  And I think it makes sense.  You're opening the backer portal, and seem to have a plan for limited scope stretch goals.  I think this is reasonable.  I won't be likely to contribute more, but if this incentivizes others to contribute more or new people to do so, thus resulting in more funding and a slightly bigger better game, without a loss of tight polish, it makes sense.

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My attitude is this: Make as many stretch goals as you possibly can. Add as many new areas and quests as you can. Make the game as big and as awesome as possible. I know you won't do this, but I would like you to delay the release for as long as you can get funding. You are creating a work of art. Works of art are never completed, only abandoned.

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I'm more open to the wilderness than the new characters. In PS:T, it was agonizing for me to choose whether or not to drop someone to bring Vhailor or Nordom along. Since there are already more than five companions, any more would just add to the frustration.

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I was hesitant to vote yes for more stretch goals because I don't want more content to interfere with the production for what's already planned. However, if you choose to do this, I would like to see more quality content for things like character progression, class quests and companion quests. This is wishful thinking, but even going as far as creating guilds similar to what the elder scrolls games do for the classes would be neat. My character, my class and my companions have always been the core interest for me in RPG games like this.

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At this point I am far more interested in seeing a finished product.  If 1 new Wilderness area is going to push release back by a month or even 2 weeks I would rather we not bother with it.  There comes a time when you need to look at your product and say "I have done enough" and apply the finishing touches then put it out there.  Even Bob Ross would stop adding happy trees when he realized he had reached the point where putting in more would hurt more than help.

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I don't care that much one way or the other, though if you come up with a really neat goal, you'll probably drag some extra $$ out of me. Not sure I'm sold on wilderness areas unless they're a chance to just have un-main-story related mini-stories with a neat pay-off at the end (AKA Kangaxx). I'm not against more characters, but I hope all the characters are well done. Trying to turn Viconia not-evil was fun.

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I'll echo those asking for more information before I vote on something.

 

- How do you expect to raise the money?

If you think existing backers upping pledges and/or choosing additional addons will be enough to pay for the goals (though I can't really see that happening myself) I'd be obviously fine with it, but I don't think that would warrant a poll.

Opening the backer website for preorders would be OK I guess. I'm sure there are people that missed the Kickstarter or couldn't afford to pledge then.

I wouldn't want that to go along with a big fundraising campaign or stupidly priced Steam early access (see Planetary Annihilation or the Double fine Adventure).

If you're thinking about a whole new fundraising campaign through Kickstarter then absolutely not.

 

- How much money are we talking about for those stretch goals?

 

- How will it affect the release of the game?

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I voted yes because it appears Obsidian wants this.

 

If they say that some more companions and wilderness areas would greatly flesh out the world, then I really hope we get them. If these are the primary things Obsidian thinks the game would benefit the most from, then doubly so.

 

My reasons;

 

1) I trust their judgement/ability to balance polish with these additions and budget for scope, as I have been impressed with their professionalism so far, and besides I am hardly in a position to make the call myself. I trusted Obsidian’s management expertise when I pledged to their Kickstarter and I have seen nothing so far to suggest that trust was misplaced, to the contrary. And let’s not forget that the last stretch-goal from 3.5M to 4m and beyond (ie more than $500K!) was essentially to enhance and polish the game. So it’s not like they didn't have some significant leeway to begin with, as they stated all previous features and stretch goals were budgeted for, including ample QA. Indeed, Obsidian has declared their determination to shed their buggy reputation, being free from publishers for this project. The stability and polish of Dungeon Siege 3 at release (opinions regarding quality of gameplay aside), was a significant step in this direction. I am happy to give them the further opportunity to prove themselves with Eternity.

 

2) Given the game has two big cities, a stronghold and megadungeon, some additional wilderness areas would really help provide location variety and open up the game to make it feel more like a living world. This also provides the possibility of adding new monster types, secrets and places of interest; exploration, travelling and random encounters could all be greatly enhanced. Josh said they would be aiming for a wilderness scope (and content density) midway between BG1 and BG2... this sounds pretty damn good to me.

 

3) Even a few more companions would greatly enhance replayability, our party options, and would contribute to the world feeling more populated and alive. Eight companions is significantly less than in either Baldur’s Gate games, which Eternity is a spiritual successor to, particularly regarding companions. As it currently stands there are only three companions you can leave on the sidelines (assuming you roll with a full party of six). That is not an overabundance of options for exploring party composition and the many various classes, unless you use generic ‘personality-less’ characters from the Adventurer’s Hall. Not to mention role-playing options for good/evil play-throughs, or if you happen to dislike some of the companions as invariably happens for one reason or another. Some more companions would be greatly welcome.

 

4) There is clearly a lot of interest in having these stretch goals according to this poll & thread. There is also a strong call for more information and clarification, with (I think) the primary issue being the trade-off between adding more funds to enrich & polish the game generally and adding additional content. I too would welcome more information, yet I trust Obsidian’s judgement in this regard. Some people have expressed reservations that the game may suffer or be delayed as a result, however neither of these concern me as I do not think Obsidian would entertain this idea if they thought it would compromise the quality of the game, and a slight delay hardly bothers me.

 

 

 

To sum up, Obsidian is in by far the best position to make decisions regarding their budget & scope, and what the game ‘needs’ most. They have stated how they would like to enrich the game and the reasons for doing so are compelling. I am more than willing to trust Obsidian knows what they're doing and help them make this a better, richer, more complete ‘infinity’ game, and I welcome a slight delay to do so. To me this is the beauty of crowdfunding.

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I am all for more companions! I think having a variety and options in the cast is very important, especially as the game is getting bigger. One of the best things about games like BG and PS:T was the cast, their banters, interactions, special quests and what not. 

 

I would also like to see romancing (done right, not the Sex Scene Mini Game BioWare made it to be) as one of the stretch goals. I think it would help take the interaction with the cast to a much deeper level.

 

WIlderness Areas are nice, but I much prefer cities and such and if I had to choose I'd much rather see more companions.

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Voted no, but it wasn't easy. My first reaction was "More stretch goals? Oh hells no. Spend your money on polish & QA." It does kind of worry me that $4.1M isn't that much to spend on a game like this. Hell they're not even having animated sequences. Not that I can remember more than 4 of them from BG2/ToB anyhow. Maybe 2D rendered ones like the between acts of DA2 (not in the same art style obviously) would be cheaper than 3D rendered? I dunno. I'm rambling. I blame the pain killers.

 

Anyhow, I started reading the thread and particularly Obsidians responses on other sites. Thanks Sensuki, I'm with you, I'd like to know more first.

 

I'll admit I'd love to have MOAR CONTENT. Who doesn't want more content if it's only an option if it doesn't detract from what's there? But then I read that BG had 26 companions and BG2 had 17. I couldn't remember that many so I looked it up and I realised I'd only ever used half a dozen of them between the two games... And while I can see that having a companion for each class makes a certain kind of sense, what if you don't like or worse can't stand the character they made for that class you need? So I'd go more wilderness over companions.

 

I guess the real crux of the matter is, I've already spent more than 3 times what I ordinarily could on a game because I wanted this genre to come back. But... I really don't have more to spend. So I can't really vote yes to more stretch goals when I'll not be contributing to them.

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