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I always want to get into WoW but the graphics and the players always turn me off by level 20 or so

 

I've recieved roughly 80 text messages today from my RL friends trying to get me back into the game, that's the real danger in that game. Not that you get hooked yourself, but that you either drag your friends into it with you or they drag you into it.

 

I've never had problems with the graphics or art-style of vanilla WoW, I actually loved Eastern Kingdoms style. What really got to me was the ridiculously ugly and silly gear that came later on in the expansions, and to a small extent in the late vanilla times when Ahn'Quiraj and Zul'Gurub with it's semi-organic stuff came along.

 

The players really can be an annoyance though, can't argue with that. The memories that are flooding back are... interesting to say the least, especially when my friends and I decided to start on a new server... where it seemed all the rejects had gathered.

Civilization, in fact, grows more and more maudlin and hysterical; especially under democracy it tends to degenerate into a mere combat of crazes; the whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, most of them imaginary. - H.L. Mencken

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Subscriptions are slowly drying up and they ran out of new ideas so they're rehashing the plots of Warcraft 1-3.

 

*yawn*

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It will be interesting to see what they do.  All the articles I've read, the developers keep going on about "No Shepard" and about not even including anything about the events from the Shepard trilogy.

 

The first part, I have no issue with.  In fact, I think it would be stupid if they did bring Shepard back as a protagonist.  The second part, I'm not sure how they can completely and totally ignore/gloss over the events that took place during the trilogy.

 

Prequels are the hip thing now. Or was that reboots?

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Subscriptions are slowly drying up and they ran out of new ideas so they're rehashing the plots of Warcraft 1-3.

 

*yawn*

 

Like Caverns of Time was'nt enough. ;)

Civilization, in fact, grows more and more maudlin and hysterical; especially under democracy it tends to degenerate into a mere combat of crazes; the whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, most of them imaginary. - H.L. Mencken

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Lots to comment on today, heh.

 

On Torment combat - whatever, I want it to be the combatless RPG I've been craving for the past decade plus. Not in a literal sense, but in the sense it's something you need to actively pursue as your preferred approach to a particular issue, as opposed to it being foisted onto you by matter of course. Besides, I don't know anything about Numenera's mechanics (despite having received the sourcebooks as a backer reward), so I have no idea what's suitable. But if I were to generalise, I'd say I prefer turn-based for solo and small-party content, with that preference gradually drifting towards RTwP the larger the party gets. Mainly because I'm too lazy to micromanage large parties (say, 4-6).

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I haven't been subbed to WoW for a year-and-a-half now, but I don't really mind the concept of the new expansion. Time travel is cheesy sure, but it's following up on nine-plus years of cheese anyway. With Burning Crusade back in the day, they tried to incorporate some other design elements into their world, most notably cyberpunk, which they seem to have dropped like a hot potato, but I admit I was one who actually liked that direction - as opposed to the various degrees of conventional fantasy with varying levels of bleakness it's been since (despite a few tangents like Canadian lumberjacks or Indiana Jones).

 

Not that it's any chance of bringing me back. Just that Blizzard is at its worst when trying to be dark, edgy, and well, serious.

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The thing is, TToN is not a direct sequel to PT.  It aims to be thematically similar, but it's a completely new game in a new world with new characters.  It doesn't need to carbon copy everything that PT did.  Besides, the combat mechanics in PT were arguably the weakest part of the game, hence why I have no qualms whatsoever to them being completely different in TToN.  Not to mention, as someone who owns the Numenera tabletop game, the mechanics of that system lend themselves to turn-based a lot better than RTwP, particularly the system of assigning effort to actions.  Translating the effort system into real-time would require considerably hacking the system and/or constant pausing and micromanaging on the part of the player, which would essentially turn it into a turn-based game anyway, just a lot less gracefully executed one.

So basically, Torment in name only?

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The ending of the words is ALMSIVI.

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The thing is, TToN is not a direct sequel to PT.  It aims to be thematically similar, but it's a completely new game in a new world with new characters.  It doesn't need to carbon copy everything that PT did.  Besides, the combat mechanics in PT were arguably the weakest part of the game, hence why I have no qualms whatsoever to them being completely different in TToN.  Not to mention, as someone who owns the Numenera tabletop game, the mechanics of that system lend themselves to turn-based a lot better than RTwP, particularly the system of assigning effort to actions.  Translating the effort system into real-time would require considerably hacking the system and/or constant pausing and micromanaging on the part of the player, which would essentially turn it into a turn-based game anyway, just a lot less gracefully executed one.

So basically, Torment in name only?

 

How Is Torment: Tides of Numenera Similar to Planescape: Torment?
 
We’re crafting Torment with the goal of creating a gameplay experience like that evoked by Planescape: Torment (or PS:T). We want Torment to challenge, reward, surprise, and entertain you in ways that PS:T did. To do that, we examined PS:T carefully, and took these four pillars as our foundation:
 
  • A Deep, Thematically Satisfying Story. The philosophical underpinnings of Torment drive the game, both mechanically and narratively. Your words, choices, and actions will be your primary weapons.
  • A World Unlike Any Other. The game has a fantastic, original setting, with awe-inspiring painterly visuals, imaginative locations, truly offbeat items, and massive feats of magic. In Numenera, however, “magic” is actually something surprisingly different.
  • A Rich, Personal Narrative. The story is thoughtful and character-driven—epic in feel but a deeply personal narrative, with nontraditional characters and companions who have their own motivations and desires that drive them throughout the game.
  • Reactivity, Choice, and Real Consequences. The game emphasizes replayability and reactivity, and your choices will make a real difference. You can play the game with a different approach and discover entirely new pathways. Most important, we won’t tell you how to play. The best ending is the one you choose, flowing naturally from your actions throughout the game.
These pillars reach through all aspects of the game design, including characters and dialogue, the overarching story, gameplay systems and combat, and aesthetics.
 
Team. If you were looking for team continuity, you’ve got it. Many key members who played a role in the Planescape setting and Planescape: Torment are involved in Torment: Tides of Numenera. Colin McComb and Monte Cook were two of the three primary writers for TSR’s Planescape setting. Colin was also a key designer on PS:T, where he worked closely with lead designer Chris Avellone. For Torment: Tides of Numenera, Colin is leading the creative vision in the setting that Monte has crafted. The two are also joined by their long-time partner Ray Vallese, who edited and wrote for the Planescape setting and who’ll be editing Torment content. (That’s right – the quality of writing for Torment is so important that we have a professional editor on the team.) Our Project Director, Kevin Saunders, wasn’t on PS:T, but was the lead designer and producer for Mask of the Betrayer, regarded by many fans as the game closest to being a PS:T successor (until now!).
 
We have the honor to work again with Mark Morgan, who composed PS:T’s music. You can hear his first piece in our Kickstarter launch video and in the concept art montage above. Other contributors to Torment in this preproduction period have included Adam Heine (a scripter on PS:T) and Aaron Meyers (an artist on PS:T). And, of course, it was Brian Fargo who originally saw the potential of Planescape: Torment at Interplay and who greenlit the project so that it could be made in the first place. And we’re going to bring on a lot more people-some of the Wasteland 2 team, or course, and other high-profile writers who can provide their own inimitable voice to the game.  We’re excited to be working with them.
 
Details. While we aren’t focusing on a direct story or setting connection between the PS:T story and Torment, we’ll include elements reminiscent of PS:T. That’s not to say thatTorment will be overflowing with inside jokes, but players familiar with PS:T will notice some nods to the original. But just as PS:T strove to defy RPG tropes, so too will Torment– including some tropes that were established by PS:T. So expect a lot of surprises.
 
 
 
How Is Torment Different From Planescape: Torment?
 
  • Torment is not a sequel to PS:T. It does not continue the stories of PS:T or its characters.
  • Torment is set in Numenera’s Ninth World, a new tabletop RPG setting created by renowned designer Monte Cook (he and Colin wrote much of the material for the Planescape tabletop setting).
  • Torment will use a new rules system that’s based on the Numenera system but adapted specifically for a computer RPG.
  • We’ll strive to make Torment’s combat system and encounters an engaging and entertaining part of the gameplay. We’ll connect them narratively to the overall story. And, continuing the Torment tradition, we’ll make most if not all combat avoidable.
 
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I'm playing Scribblenauts and am finding it very addictive.

 

also, a friend suggested I played Sword & Sworcery, so I did. and my god the game is amazingly beautiful (music in it deserves special mentioning, it's very good, the audio design in general is fantastic). if you like adventure games, pixel art, or Jim Guthrie, or all three - definitely give it a try. 

 

edit: oops, wrong thread!  :facepalm:

I guess, we could consider me playing something other than Arma 3 video game news...

Edited by sorophx

Let's Play The Temple of Elemental Evil (Complete)
Let's Play Neverwinter Nights and Hordes of the Underdark

Let's Play Baldur's Gate II: Shadows of Amn

I was struggling to understand ths until I noticed you are from Finland. And having been educated solely by mkreku in this respect I am convinced that Finland essentially IS the wh40k universe.

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Looks like more people are for the turn based combat in Torment. Ridiculous.

combat was not PST's strong point. I'd rather not have any combat at all and instead have the party solve various complicated puzzles, puzzles that have multiple ways of solving depending on party composition and character development

 

If someone wants to kickstart a combat-free RPG, I wouldn't be able to throw my money at them fast enough.  TToN should at least come close to that as they're aiming to make the vast majority (if not all) of the combat avoidable.  I'll likely go pacifist of my first playthrough.

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The thing is, TToN is not a direct sequel to PT.  It aims to be thematically similar, but it's a completely new game in a new world with new characters.  It doesn't need to carbon copy everything that PT did.  Besides, the combat mechanics in PT were arguably the weakest part of the game, hence why I have no qualms whatsoever to them being completely different in TToN.  Not to mention, as someone who owns the Numenera tabletop game, the mechanics of that system lend themselves to turn-based a lot better than RTwP, particularly the system of assigning effort to actions.  Translating the effort system into real-time would require considerably hacking the system and/or constant pausing and micromanaging on the part of the player, which would essentially turn it into a turn-based game anyway, just a lot less gracefully executed one.

So basically, Torment in name only?

 

 
Snip

 

The problem is that all of that can be summarized as "we're going to try and give it a good story." Hell, using their definition the Witcher series is a spiritual successor to Torment.

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The thing is, TToN is not a direct sequel to PT.  It aims to be thematically similar, but it's a completely new game in a new world with new characters.  It doesn't need to carbon copy everything that PT did.  Besides, the combat mechanics in PT were arguably the weakest part of the game, hence why I have no qualms whatsoever to them being completely different in TToN.  Not to mention, as someone who owns the Numenera tabletop game, the mechanics of that system lend themselves to turn-based a lot better than RTwP, particularly the system of assigning effort to actions.  Translating the effort system into real-time would require considerably hacking the system and/or constant pausing and micromanaging on the part of the player, which would essentially turn it into a turn-based game anyway, just a lot less gracefully executed one.

So basically, Torment in name only?

 

 

I hear it is basically Wasteland with swords.

 

Or maybe Wasteland is going to be Torment with guns.

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The thing is, TToN is not a direct sequel to PT.  It aims to be thematically similar, but it's a completely new game in a new world with new characters.  It doesn't need to carbon copy everything that PT did.  Besides, the combat mechanics in PT were arguably the weakest part of the game, hence why I have no qualms whatsoever to them being completely different in TToN.  Not to mention, as someone who owns the Numenera tabletop game, the mechanics of that system lend themselves to turn-based a lot better than RTwP, particularly the system of assigning effort to actions.  Translating the effort system into real-time would require considerably hacking the system and/or constant pausing and micromanaging on the part of the player, which would essentially turn it into a turn-based game anyway, just a lot less gracefully executed one.

So basically, Torment in name only?

 

 
Snip

 

The problem is that all of that can be summarized as "we're going to try and give it a good story." Hell, using their definition the Witcher series is a spiritual successor to Torment.

 

 

That is quite simplifying and misleading statement. As they promise much more than good story, like philosophical approach to thematic topics, unique world with unseen wonders and places, character driven story arc, emphasis on different approaches to things. All things that made PS:T to be the game what it was. PS:T's combat system was least defining attribute in whole game.

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That is quite simplifying and misleading statement. As they promise much more than good story, like philosophical approach to thematic topics, unique world with unseen wonders and places, character driven story arc, emphasis on different approaches to things. All things that made PS:T to be the game what it was. PS:T's combat system was least defining attribute in whole game.

 

 

Not really, I'm sure everyone wants their story to be deep, original, with a rich personal narrative and lots of player choice.

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That is quite simplifying and misleading statement. As they promise much more than good story, like philosophical approach to thematic topics, unique world with unseen wonders and places, character driven story arc, emphasis on different approaches to things. All things that made PS:T to be the game what it was. PS:T's combat system was least defining attribute in whole game.

 

 

Not really, I'm sure everyone wants their story to be deep, original, with a rich personal narrative and lots of player choice.

 

 

No they don't (actually most of the games don't want to do such things) and your summary does too much generalization that it would do any justice to towards inXile's goals with Torment. Because their aim isn't "deep" story (what that ever means), but instead they want explore philosophical question "what one life matters", by giving player as much freedom as possible to go their own way and game works as soundboard that reacts to pc's actions. And they want to do this in universe (or multiverse) that is different than your typical game settings, as they want to be chained by players exceptions and they want to make players want to explore and learn how world works (similar plan as with Planescape setting). Typically in games story's focus is in event or conflict that moves story forward, but in Torment they want to make story about pc and what s/he does in world, so world/country/etc isn't in danger or something similar. Usually developers want to keep number of game paths slow for economic reason and because most players don't see more than one or two paths, which are reasons why games have usually only variations of same critical path, but in Torment they want every player to have unique path that is their own, which is reason why they have so many writers to do their story arcs.

 

So they don't have some generic goals but very specific goals that they feel are the things that make game a Torment™ game.

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but in Torment they want every player to have unique path that is their own, which is reason why they have so many writers to do their story arcs.

 

Oh?

 

 

That is misstatement from me, as it is not stated in their goals but is more my own interpretation from things that Fargo has said in interviews concerning Wasteland 2 and Torment.

 

Like this statement from one of his Wasteland 2 interviews

“It’s not real reactivity unless we do that stuff. Otherwise it’s just a magician’s trick. You’re getting the same thing. It’s not that. It’s a virtual impossibility for two people to have the exact same experience of the game.”

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/07/30/wasteland-2s-delay-all-about-making-choice-matter/

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Because their aim isn't "deep" story (what that ever means)

 

  • A Deep, Thematically Satisfying Story

You don't say.

 

Also it's worthwhile to remember this. If that's Brian Fargo's idea of bringing classic gameplay back to the modern audience then you'll forgive me if I don't take everything he says at face value. 

 

 

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Hunted was a case of a game where inXile was being pushed by the publisher to make it a certain way, as is their right, hence why Brian Fargo is championing Kickstarter so much.  Whether the creative control that Kickstarter has allowed Fargo and Co. results in a superior game is yet to be seen.  We have a few more months to go and then we'll have an answer one way or the other, in the form of Wasteland 2.

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Because their aim isn't "deep" story (what that ever means)

 

  • A Deep, Thematically Satisfying Story

You don't say.

 

Also it's worthwhile to remember this. If that's Brian Fargo's idea of bringing classic gameplay back to the modern audience then you'll forgive me if I don't take everything he says at face value. 

 

 

 You dropped that part of where they tell what they mean with deep;  "The philosophical underpinnings of Torment drive the game, both mechanically and narratively. Your words, choices, and actions will be your primary weapons."

 

Because if you don't specify what you mean with deep story, it becomes absolute meaningless phrase as it can mean any story that has subsurface meanings, which is about every story that uses metaphors, political, cultural, sociological , etc. references.

 

Hunted was modern take of classic dungeon crawlers (meaning that you go in dungeon and kill punch of monster with flimsy excuse) as Fargo says in that interview, it had better than average story (although character were quite bad), they had ok mechanics that where somewhat ripoff from Gears of War and cheesy character design. As typical modernization it had tunnel like level design and as typical Bethesda game it has tons of bugs (it don't seems to matter which developer makes the game, when Bethesda is publisher it is very high probability that game will have tons of bugs). And it should probably be noted that Hunted was the game that drove Fargo to seek self publishing options for inXile's games, so one could think that he wasn't very happy at end with the game and Bethesda's demands as publisher.

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 You dropped that part of where they tell what they mean with deep;  "The philosophical underpinnings of Torment drive the game, both mechanically and narratively. Your words, choices, and actions will be your primary weapons."

 

Because if you don't specify what you mean with deep story, it becomes absolute meaningless phrase as it can mean any story that has subsurface meanings, which is about every story that uses metaphors, political, cultural, sociological , etc. references.

 

 

And how exactly does their definition of "deep" not apply to Mass Effect, Witcher, or even Skyrim (really any RPG with C&C ever made)? My point is that the things inXile promised were so vague that they could end up making an FPS and still technically be right.
 

As for Hunted: I liked Gears' SP so I liked that game too, but to claim it's anything other than Gears with swords is to be either disingenuous or blind.

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