New Game +

[Kevin Lynch]

I wouldn't use it, but I don't care if it's included as long as there is no extra content in the subsequent gameplays (i.e. everything has to be available the first go round).

[Continuum]

I don't really see the New Game + mode being very applicable to the type of game I'm expecting from P:E.

 

An action game with RPG elements of gaining skills/stats/equipment (e.g., Batman Arkham Asylym/City) benefits from New Game +

 

A hybrid RPG/shooter like Mass Effect 2/3 benefits somewhat from it.

 

A party-based tactical RPG? Doesn't fit. It just imbalances the low levels too much, or party balance, or... just a PITA to implement in a useful way.

[Osvir]

I don't really see the New Game + mode being very applicable to the type of game I'm expecting from P:E.

 

An action game with RPG elements of gaining skills/stats/equipment (e.g., Batman Arkham Asylym/City) benefits from New Game +

 

A hybrid RPG/shooter like Mass Effect 2/3 benefits somewhat from it.

 

A party-based tactical RPG? Doesn't fit. It just imbalances the low levels too much, or party balance, or... just a PITA to implement in a useful way.

 

Oh so much could be done with New Game+ if handled properly and with care. Not merely "My end-game character was level 12 and now I can start over from the beginning and crush all opposition with it mwahaha!" but a New Game+ which kicks you straight back to level 1 and the only thing it presents you with is Items that you couldn't access the first game, areas that wasn't available, story and lore that develops into something more.

 

P:E has the right story and setting for it and they've explained that Souls "travel from being to being". What if at the end game your character die, and New Game+ would equal your characters soul inhabiting a new being, take you back to the beginning in the form of someone else who has to go through all trials you passed. It could be used in the story even in a way where time has passed and you are now a new character and you have different trials and adventure ahead of you.

 

Planescape: Torment uses this, where you wake up in the slab of the Mortuary if you die (Which in a sense is the same sort of "New Game+" I am suggesting).

[mstark]

I still disagree with the idea that the PE team should spend any resources on building content that isn't available until you've played the game through once. Let's say we're talking about a total number of 50 hours of unique adventures (gameplay) here. I say, make all this content available on your first play through, it'll make the world feel richer. If you don't discover everything the first time you play, you can simply take a different route on your second play-through.

 

Designing the game around having to be played at least twice in order to experience all its content would be a strange move for an immersive, party based, top-down combat, 50-ish hours long cRPG. Should they move 10 hours of unique content to NG+? 5? 25?

 

Let's pretend BG2 had NG+, and places like, say, the Fish City weren't accessible until your second play-through, because it would only be accessible through some obscure reference to what your original character did the first time you played the game. The idea may sound cool, but remember we're taking maybe 2-3 hours of content away from the part of the game most people will play, just to give a nod to the few people who will keep playing it over and over. You'd still have to get through a lot of the same content as in your first playthrough, just to experience these few hours of new content.

 

"our game is 40 hours long, but if you play it two times, it's 40+40+5 hours of unlocked content!".

 

In an ARPG it makes sense because, usually, the entire end-game is about replaying small portions of the same content over and over, and introducing differentiated gameplay in repeated content improves the replayability value for that genre. For a story driven cRPG? No, I don't think having to experience the same content twice, in order to see small bits of content unlocked on your second play through, worth it.

 

But that's just my opinion.

 

Edit,

It's even been said by the developers that no one is likely to experience all the content on the first playthrough, which, in my opinion, is more than enough incentive to replay it for a new experience . A game designed in this way doesn't benefit from hiding any content from the player until they've finished the game at least once. What about catering for the really hardcore players, and only unlocking extra content on the fifth playthrough?

Edited November 3, 2012 by mstark

[Sacred_Path]

I don't mind the idea, but I personally wouldn't use it. Too much challenge is lost that way. Then you could ramp up the difficulty, but that creates other balance problems (like damage spells being almost useless, etc.)

[Night Stalker]

I would rather not see a New Game+ in this kind of game unless there is a good reason why.

 

I rarely use the New Game+ feature, and for these kinds of games I would rather roll a new character to experience the game from another perspective.

[jethro]

Oh so much could be done with New Game+ if handled properly and with care. Not merely "My end-game character was level 12 and now I can start over from the beginning and crush all opposition with it mwahaha!" but a New Game+ which kicks you straight back to level 1 and the only thing it presents you with is Items that you couldn't access the first game, areas that wasn't available, story and lore that develops into something more.

 

This is already in the game. Restart the game. Select the same character build and just by doing the quests differently you will be presented with different items and maybe even see a different area. Select different companions this second time through and you already have your style of NewGame+. The advantage: Everyone is able to see the adittional stuff, not only the diablo players among us.

 

P:E has the right story and setting for it and they've explained that Souls "travel from being to being". What if at the end game your character die, and New Game+ would equal your characters soul inhabiting a new being, take you back to the beginning in the form of someone else who has to go through all trials you passed. It could be used in the story even in a way where time has passed and you are now a new character and you have different trials and adventure ahead of you.

I've heard nothing about souls transfering to parallel universes (where the previous character is not doing the quests already) AND at the same time doing time travel (to get back to a time where the story begins). No problem if this were an over-the-top silly RPG like South Park.

 

Planescape: Torment uses this, where you wake up in the slab of the Mortuary if you die (Which in a sense is the same sort of "New Game+" I am suggesting).

 

The difference being that in PS:T time has progressed instead of being reset. Quests you have finished stay finished, people that know you still know you instead of feigning ignorance. Lets not forget that MMOs are not very convincing in portraying laws of physics ;-)

[PsychoBlonde]

For those that don't know New Game plus mode is when you get to restart again upon completion with all the items and experience acquired in the original play through.

 

I would much rather that you get perks for a new character every time you complete the game, but I like to start new characters.

[True_Spike]

How about making the actual game (as in the very first playthrough) as good and as memorable as possible instead of enhancing supposed "replay value" by implementing features most people won't get (or bother to) experience? Not to mention I can't see New Game+ not breaking the game. Use cheat codes / cheat console if you want to, I see no point in having a mode like New Game + though.

Edited November 3, 2012 by True_Spike

[JayDGee]

This is a much more contentious issue than I thought it would be.

 

The old infinity games basically had the feature through character import export and I know a lot of people used it that way.

Repeated playthroughs is how I finally managed to defeat Sarevok. Although then done it with a very different character setup.

 

New game + is a feature that really wasn't used in games back then and was just curious. I'm happier with export import than New Game plus if I'm honest.

I like any feature that promotes replay-ability The first mass effect done this well IMHO with the character unlocking abilities that would give an advantage to new characters, its also one of the only games to make achievements work for the same reason.

 

Apparently some of you really hate it and associate the feature only with genre's you seem to despise. Features are rarely genre specific any more and if something works well can be used in many genres. RPG elements have been creeping there way into FPS games for years now and in the past that would have been unthinkable.

 

In the end I want this game to be the best game it can and I want a reason to come back to once I've reached the end.

I will more than likely have multiple characters made but every now and then it is fun to stomp around overpowered and show those rats in the basement what a fireball is.

[Hassat Hunter]

Point is, the game is meant to be replayed *with different builds*... NG+ is generally designed to do the whole thing over again with the same character.

 

These 2 concepts... they don't work together.

 

Slight bonusses or small easter eggs the second time (and beyond), regardless of using a new character or old would be much better suited for PE.

[ogrezilla]

I wouldn't use a ng+ mode if it just let me steamroll the game or something. But if it balanced the game around being high level the entire game by putting you against high level enemies the entire game, I would probably have fun with that. Not just higher damage and hp though; like actually harder enemies that are using higher level abilities and stuff. I certainly don't think its a necessary thing, but if it was there I'd play it.

[Magnum Opus]

Voted "No" for this poll, but in retrospect, I think I did that just because of the way games have implemented such things recently. I don't like having across-the-board bonuses for NEW characters being applied based on what I did with my OLD character. ME2 did it that way, and it simply ticked me off. Yeah, I ran through the game with my imported ME1 Shep at first and it was good, but then I wanted a NEW Shep starting in ME2, but ended up getting all this extra crap that I didn't want because I'd already been through the game once already.

 

A user-initiated run of Heart of Fury mode? I enjoyed that for IWD immensely.

 

Can only conclude that it's not the very notion of NG+ that I dislike so much, but the arbitrary and ham-fisted way it's been implemented.

 

Import an old character into a new game? Cool. I know what I'm getting with that scenario. Having the game unlock achievements for me and then apply bonuses to all characters I create after that? No. Nonononono.

 

No.

[wanderon]

I don't really want this type of mode. If I want to replay the game again, I'll do so with a new concept/build, play differently.

This. Character creation and toying with different builds is one of the big attractions of CRPGs for me. To replay the game with the same character all over again would be rather dull.

 

Me too - in fact by the time I finish the game the first time I will no doubt have a dozen or mother other characters sitting at different spots in the game waiting patiently for me to return to them...

[Aoha]

For those of you that are against it, know that game+ or some other implementation of it does not prevent you from starting game with completely new characters, it only adds option for those of us that like playing character to "godlike" status.

[wanderon]

For those of you that are against it, know that game+ or some other implementation of it does not prevent you from starting game with completely new characters, it only adds option for those of us that like playing character to "godlike" status.

 

Really? Who knew?

 

Only the second page (oops 5th page I guess) and we already have the "if you don't like it don't use it" argument?

 

Seriously tho are you suggesting that if you don't like it you should still either vote for it or vote ambivalent so others can use it?

Edited November 4, 2012 by wanderon

[Aoha]

For those of you that are against it, know that game+ or some other implementation of it does not prevent you from starting game with completely new characters, it only adds option for those of us that like playing character to "godlike" status.

 

Really? Who knew?

 

Only the second page (oops 5th page I guess) and we already have the "if you don't like it don't use it" argument?

 

Seriously tho are you suggesting that if you don't like it you should still either vote for it or vote ambivalent so others can use it?

 

Just pointing out the silliness of those that are strictly opposed to it as if it is a must have in console games, when games are designed to give both options to players in order to please all.

 

Furthermore it wasn't necessarily aimed at you guys but I wrote it with hope that devs will see it and take the best approach.

[Pipyui]

I voted ambivilence. I wouldn't use a NG+ feature myself, nor see much use for one, unless it was well implemented in the game. Touger enemies and all that, maybe some dialogue quirks to recognise you've played before, but even that's not enough to justify it. Unless Obsidian can come up with something really cool, I see no need for a NG+ option, but can't argue against those who would appreciate having it.

[Hassat Hunter]

It does however require developers to balance the game twice, instead of once. And balancing can be a hard task to do.

 

I rather they spend it in more important areas. Especially with the limited funds and resource at their disposal.

[wanderon]

Or they could just allow it and NOT balance it (like BG1 & 2) - after all I'm pretty sure the folks who play NG+ are not looking for a challenge anyway right?

[Corvus Metus]

Considering the point of P:E is to do a throwback to the IE games, I'm pretty sure they'll have an import/export feature.

 

Likewise, they're going to have a "Heart of Fury"-type mode. That's been confirmed.

 

So whether or not you want a "New Game +" it seems like we're getting at least one.

[Rink]

Haven't read every post here. But like many here I think New Game + makes sense in games where there is no difficulty selection and thus you are able to play the game later with different difficulty. Some games make it easier (import character with all his stuff), some make it harder (harder bosses, no items or stuff imported) and usually those games do not offer any other character you can play with anyway, so replayability would be low otherwise.

 

In P:E we have different difficulty levels AND we can just make a different character that would play differently. Plus there will be expansions where you probably can import you characters (so there has to be level-cap in main game, what makes game+ to develop your character useless).

If you make a game + where you can also take your items, then some quests may break if those items can be questrelated or mainquest related.

 

That's why I think game+ isn't needed, an import of a character from different savegame of course is ok, but with level-cap still active to avoid ruining expansion and without items to avoid problems with them in quests and main quests and the testing for that.

[ogrezilla]

Or they could just allow it and NOT balance it (like BG1 & 2) - after all I'm pretty sure the folks who play NG+ are not looking for a challenge anyway right?

not all of us. I like the Diablo style NG+ where you start over with all of your levels and items, but the game is harder to match it. Instead of being a cakewalk through the game, its a different feel to playing the game because both your party and the enemies have higher level abilities from start to finish.

[BSoda]

I don't feel the devs should waste resources on what is essentially an implementation of cheating. If you want to break the game, that's fine -but please do it on your own clock.

[wanderon]

Or they could just allow it and NOT balance it (like BG1 & 2) - after all I'm pretty sure the folks who play NG+ are not looking for a challenge anyway right?

not all of us. I like the Diablo style NG+ where you start over with all of your levels and items, but the game is harder to match it. Instead of being a cakewalk through the game, its a different feel to playing the game because both your party and the enemies have higher level abilities from start to finish.

 

I don't see PE going in this direction - it may have a mega dungeon but it is a story driven game not a dungeon crawl/combat simulation.