Commercial success

[HoonDing]

DS sold more than FO, it just didn't have a lasting fanbase in the same way.

If lasting fanbase translates to "a handful of nerds on a messageboard", then DS certainly has one.

[MakeMOTB2pls]

I'd say it translates to "fans supporting the game with mods and custom content long past its shelf life" which is something both franchises had.

[Volourn]

FO3 did not sell as well as did becuase of the old FO fanbase. It sold so well because of Bethesda's fanbase. FO's fanbase was not 'longlasting'. The hardecore FO fanboy on the net probably numbers 1000 if your lucky.

 

DS fans supported it huge. Someone even used DS to recreate an Ultima game. Stop trying to claim that if DS3 fails it's DS1 and DS2's fualt. That's bogus.

[LadyCrimson]

DS sold more than FO, it just didn't have a lasting fanbase in the same way.

If lasting fanbase translates to "a handful of nerds on a messageboard", then DS certainly has one.

I prefer the term "geek" instead.

[Flouride]

DS fans supported it huge. Someone even used DS to recreate an Ultima game. Stop trying to claim that if DS3 fails it's DS1 and DS2's fualt. That's bogus.

 

Yea, and Fallout never had any mods / total conversions etc. come out... Oh wait they did have those and people are still making them.

[Renevent]

DS fans supported it huge. Someone even used DS to recreate an Ultima game. Stop trying to claim that if DS3 fails it's DS1 and DS2's fualt. That's bogus.

 

Yea, and Fallout never had any mods / total conversions etc. come out... Oh wait they did have those and people are still making them.

 

I didn't see anyone claim otherwise...the point is DS has tons of fans and tons of mods/maps/conversions/ect were made for it and the support has lasted a very long time. The games also have high scores from reviewers as well as high player aggregate scores. These are facts.

Edited July 4, 2011 by Renevent

[MonkeyLungs]

Yeah but people here like to claim that DS1 and 2 have no fans, or that if there are fans there aren't many, or that if maybe there are quite a bit they don't matter.

[Volourn]

"Yea, and Fallout never had any mods / total conversions etc. come out... Oh wait they did have those and people are still making them."

 

Who claimed otherwise?

 

 

FACT: FO1 and FO2 didn't sell more than a million copies when released (they probably have now coutning the $3 GOG version). Outside of the habndful of hardcore fans, the public did not give a crap about the FO series until Betehsda made FO3 and it was Beth's fans that amde FO3 a hit.

 

FACT: DS1 and DS2 were very successful games which sold millions of copies and were bonafide hits.

 

To try to claim that FO3/FO3.5:LV had a huge built in fanbase and DS3 doesn't is just beyond silliness.

[Flouride]

"Yea, and Fallout never had any mods / total conversions etc. come out... Oh wait they did have those and people are still making them."

 

Who claimed otherwise?

 

 

FACT: FO1 and FO2 didn't sell more than a million copies when released (they probably have now coutning the $3 GOG version). Outside of the habndful of hardcore fans, the public did not give a crap about the FO series until Betehsda made FO3 and it was Beth's fans that amde FO3 a hit.

 

FACT: DS1 and DS2 were very successful games which sold millions of copies and were bonafide hits.

 

To try to claim that FO3/FO3.5:LV had a huge built in fanbase and DS3 doesn't is just beyond silliness.

 

Just saying, there's a huge support for Fallout by it's fans as well.

 

FACT: I doubt you read and understand multiple languages and know exactly what the "public's" opinion about FO series was. And as I said on some other post of mine Fallout series suffered heavily from the rampant piracy that really started to show it's ugly head. There was no DRM nor multiplayer to "force" kids actually to buy the game. True, this is based on my own experience in small town, but I bet kids had CD-R drives elsewhere as well...

 

Could you even play DS as multiplayer with a pirated version?

 

And how about giving some actual FACTS about the sales instead of just going "FACT". All I found was some random site that claimed DS1 sold 1,7 million units, never heard of the site before. So I personally don't consider that all that reliable as a source.

 

Both games have their own built fanbases. Never claimed DS didn't have a fanbase, just because game sells X number of copies doesn't mean the fanbase will be all that active and ready to buy a sequel by some other company. This goes for both Fallout and DS. It's pretty hard to compare fanbases by the sheer amount of sold copies 5-15 years ago, since people who played those games back in the day move on with their lives, start families etc.

 

The whole argument is pretty ******** ridicilous since there's no way anyone can really give any actual info on the fanbases of either game series. Unless you go and monitor every damn fan site and see how many different people post on those monthly. And even after that you still got all those fans who don't go on forums to shoot **** and are "dormant" just waiting....

[Volourn]

FACT: The first two DS games were far more successful than the first two FO games and they are also more recent. It's undisputable.

[Hurlshort]

FACT: The first two DS games were far more successful than the first two FO games and they are also more recent. It's undisputable.

 

FACT: Independence Day was more successful than Star Wars and it also was more recent. It's indisputable.

[Volourn]

Great. So.. what does your off topic fact about two movies have to do with DS3?

[XxTaLoNxX]

This entire thread has spun off into disputable and off-topic waters. Volourn claims facts that can't be proven, Hurlshot is throwing false movie data (sorry but ID4 is not/will not/ and cannot be more successful than Star Wars).

 

What the heck is wrong with you people?

[Hurlshort]

This entire thread has spun off into disputable and off-topic waters. Volourn claims facts that can't be proven, Hurlshot is throwing false movie data (sorry but ID4 is not/will not/ and cannot be more successful than Star Wars).

 

What the heck is wrong with you people?

 

It's a fact! Check the box office numbers! This whole courtroom is out of order!

Edited July 4, 2011 by Hurlshot

[Purkake]

FACT: The first two DS games were far more successful than the first two FO games and they are also more recent. It's undisputable.

 

FACT: Independence Day was more successful than Star Wars and it also was more recent. It's indisputable.

Taking inflation into account?

[greylord]

"Yea, and Fallout never had any mods / total conversions etc. come out... Oh wait they did have those and people are still making them."

 

Who claimed otherwise?

 

 

FACT: FO1 and FO2 didn't sell more than a million copies when released (they probably have now coutning the $3 GOG version). Outside of the habndful of hardcore fans, the public did not give a crap about the FO series until Betehsda made FO3 and it was Beth's fans that amde FO3 a hit.

 

FACT: DS1 and DS2 were very successful games which sold millions of copies and were bonafide hits.

 

To try to claim that FO3/FO3.5:LV had a huge built in fanbase and DS3 doesn't is just beyond silliness.

 

Just saying, there's a huge support for Fallout by it's fans as well.

 

FACT: I doubt you read and understand multiple languages and know exactly what the "public's" opinion about FO series was. And as I said on some other post of mine Fallout series suffered heavily from the rampant piracy that really started to show it's ugly head. There was no DRM nor multiplayer to "force" kids actually to buy the game. True, this is based on my own experience in small town, but I bet kids had CD-R drives elsewhere as well...

 

Could you even play DS as multiplayer with a pirated version?

 

And how about giving some actual FACTS about the sales instead of just going "FACT". All I found was some random site that claimed DS1 sold 1,7 million units, never heard of the site before. So I personally don't consider that all that reliable as a source.

 

Both games have their own built fanbases. Never claimed DS didn't have a fanbase, just because game sells X number of copies doesn't mean the fanbase will be all that active and ready to buy a sequel by some other company. This goes for both Fallout and DS. It's pretty hard to compare fanbases by the sheer amount of sold copies 5-15 years ago, since people who played those games back in the day move on with their lives, start families etc.

 

The whole argument is pretty ******** ridicilous since there's no way anyone can really give any actual info on the fanbases of either game series. Unless you go and monitor every damn fan site and see how many different people post on those monthly. And even after that you still got all those fans who don't go on forums to shoot **** and are "dormant" just waiting....

 

 

I'd actually say it's pretty obvious that the DS series outsold the FO series up until FO3 came out. Piracy is actually bigger and easier today via the internet then it was during the FO years. DRM has actually been one of the biggest pushes FOR piracy I've ever seen. Due to it's ugly head Piracy is probably bigger now than anything people have ever seen previously.

 

Kind of ironic if you think about it though.

 

The biggest difference is the ability of the internet for big downloads once the game is cracked...something that wasn't as available during the FO years on the scale it is today. big difference on d/l ing something via cable internet than on a snails paced modem.

 

I think FO was a success though, and is one of the lines that Black Isle was involved with, along with other legendary franchises such as BG and IWD.

[Labadal]

I tried talk to the president of Sqaure Enix. When I asked him about Dungeon Siege III sales, three hidden ninjas came out of nowhere and attacked me. I had to run for my life. The last thing I heard him say while I was running away was: I will tell you when I when it pleases me, and no one else but me, peasant! Then he started laughing like a madman.

[greylord]

This entire thread has spun off into disputable and off-topic waters. Volourn claims facts that can't be proven, Hurlshot is throwing false movie data (sorry but ID4 is not/will not/ and cannot be more successful than Star Wars).

 

What the heck is wrong with you people?

 

I think he was mocking other supposed facts posted above. AKA...he wasn't serious about the ID4/Star Wars thing.

[XxTaLoNxX]

It's a fact! Check the box office numbers! This whole courtroom is out of order!

 

No need. And here is why. Box office number do not take into account Television showings which are paid licenses. How many times do you think Star Wars has been shown on TV? How many games have been made under the Star Wars license? Books? Toys?

 

Again, I say that ID4 can never reach the acclaim or success of the Star Wars franchise. It's actually impossible at this point.

[Purkake]

ID4 isn't a franchise, so it would be unfair to compare it to the whole SW franchise, no?

[Volourn]

"Again, I say that ID4 can never reach the acclaim or success of the Star Wars franchise. It's actually impossible at this point. "

 

ID4 is played a lot of tv. Obviiously, it doesn't have the cross over or as genre defefining appeal as SW does but film vs film it is easy toa rgue that ID4 holds its own. Obviously, again, hard for anything to touch the entire SW phenomen which has crossed over successfully to books and games (not so successfully tv wise though). Then again, the creators of ID4 never had attention to hawk ID4 forever like a certain SW creator did with it since SW was always about selling toys to little kiddies.

 

 

"ID4 isn't a franchise, so it would be unfair to compare it to the whole SW franchise, no?"

 

This. ID4 was an action moved about fighting aliens in honour of an Amerikan holiday. Nothing more nothing less. That said, there has been talk about a potential sequel... P.S. ID4 is a betetr movie than ANY SW movies with better acting, writing, and actions. Not to mention much flaisher explosions.

 

"Volourn claims facts that can't be proven"

 

Sorry, dude, but the fact that DS1 and DS2 outsold FO1 and FO2 can and has been proven. It's undisputable and you only make yourself look silly trying to argue otherwise. The basis of this argument of course is the nonsense point some foolish person claimed that the DS fanbase is somehow magically smaller than the FO fanbase which is just plain bogus (not counting FO3 of course which set a whole new bar) but FO3's fanbase is basiclaly Bethesda's anyways and FO3's overall success is 100% because of Bethesda.

 

If DS3 fails it's not ebcause the DS brand doesn't have any fans but ebcause Obsidian/SS didn't deliver the game gamers wanted. Period. DS has a built in potential audience that is very sizeable - mroe than the original two FO games.

 

This is just pure fact.

Edited July 4, 2011 by Volourn

[Flouride]

This entire thread has spun off into disputable and off-topic waters. Volourn claims facts that can't be proven, Hurlshot is throwing false movie data (sorry but ID4 is not/will not/ and cannot be more successful than Star Wars).

 

What the heck is wrong with you people?

 

It's a fact! Check the box office numbers! This whole courtroom is out of order!

 

Objection your honour!!

[Flouride]

The biggest difference is the ability of the internet for big downloads once the game is cracked...something that wasn't as available during the FO years on the scale it is today. big difference on d/l ing something via cable internet than on a snails paced modem.

 

I think FO was a success though, and is one of the lines that Black Isle was involved with, along with other legendary franchises such as BG and IWD.

 

Yes, it's definately easier and bigger thesedays especially since pretty much everyone who follows the news knows few of the sites that allow you to download stuff. There's way more people playing computer/console games if you compare it to the late 90's

 

But even back in the day it only took one or two guys to get the games and they had a bloody business running.

[Oner]

Objection your honour!!

You've gotta say this with STYLE!

[XxTaLoNxX]

"Volourn claims facts that can't be proven"

 

Sorry, dude, but the fact that DS1 and DS2 outsold FO1 and FO2 can and has been proven. It's undisputable and you only make yourself look silly trying to argue otherwise. The basis of this argument of course is the nonsense point some foolish person claimed that the DS fanbase is somehow magically smaller than the FO fanbase which is just plain bogus (not counting FO3 of course which set a whole new bar) but FO3's fanbase is basiclaly Bethesda's anyways and FO3's overall success is 100% because of Bethesda.

 

If DS3 fails it's not ebcause the DS brand doesn't have any fans but ebcause Obsidian/SS didn't deliver the game gamers wanted. Period. DS has a built in potential audience that is very sizeable - mroe than the original two FO games.

 

This is just pure fact.

 

The part where you claim it as pure fact has me a bit "space bound". See I have actually looked for a copy or DS1/DS2 for purchase and what I did find was games that cost $100+.... yet when I go to my local WalMart, guess what I find for $10? Fallout 1 and 2 double feature. See I can digitally purchase Fallout 1 and 2 to this day, go ahead and try to digitally purchase DS1 and DS2. You can't.

 

It's in this realm of bargain bins and digital purchases where you can NOT claim this as pure fact, simply because any numbers you could show are years old and completely out of date. Whereas Fallout 1 & 2 have CONTINUED to sell for years, but you can't find a copy of the old DS games unless you want to fork over $100 dollars.

 

I can claim that my cat is able to defy gravity and fly around the house as BatCat without any outside assistance. I can then go on to say that anyone who disputes this is "insert insulting term here". I can then say it is an undeniable and indisputable fact. But that doesn't make it so. At least not without proof. Which none has been provided.