Hassat Hunter

It's quite odd you have an issue with a consular, seeing how those mercs (and the ones during khoonda's battle) have an inexplainable -20 to their saving throws that I have never have been able to identify the source for or ability to fix. So with some defensive spells like horror or statis, they don't stand a change. Or did you build your guy with purely buff-spells?

It's objective XP. Not sure where people got the idea you only get XP from quests from...

I've already had a friend reply to the thread, so thanks for offering, but hopefully support will read it tomorrow (since the forums one seems the only active ATM). F2P (nope, not even us preferred players who paid them cash) can't post on the forum. F2P and preferred can't post ingame tickets. And as pmp said, using that form I just got the automated reply to call in using VoIP. I'd rather make absolutely sure I have no other solution before doing that (yeah, I really hate making phone calls).

BioWare makes KOTOR1 in 4 years. Obsidian makes KOTOR2 in 1 year. OE is apparently lazy. Logic ain't logical!

I often find even today in 3D engines rotation is required to see your men, unlike BG2 or similar who where made not to obstruct your teammates most of the times. So I have to disagree at that point.

As it may be someone else has the exact same issue; http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=596077 As I can't post there ( ) can somone mention I also have the issue? I really would ask myself, but since I can't. I would appreciate anyone who would help. I just hope support reads it, and if they help us both at the same time instead of just the OP. Account name Hassat-Hunter, char name Jaellan. (asked the same on LucasForums and Deadlystream. I spam, but really want to fix my issue. If only BioWare allowed us to actually properly contact them then I wouldn't need to, but I guess that's too much to ask for)

Who knows what can happen? But atleast with OE, a SW RPG would be in the best hands it can be...

So, with the help of a sub I got an artifact unlock (use purple items) for 1M of the GTN. Should make my life a lot more bearable (and myself more useful in engame ops and flashpoints), I thought. After paying that huge sum (especially for us f2p), I find out... the item wont function. Dammit. So mailing support, get a reply I have to call with VoIP. I hate skype. I hate calling. But I guess I have no choice. Dammit.

Can be many reasons :/ Personally I had that happen if I unlocked the taskbar (at the bottom of your screen, not quite sure if that's what it's really called in english), and it was interfering with the game somehow. Check if maybe that's the case with you too? (right click, then lock taskbar)

Sadly enough, the only "solution" I know is going pretty much all the way back to the Academy (yes, it started there). Sending Atton to the Dxun Tomb (as leader) during Onderon revisit seems to work for some too. Not sure how viable that is. Sadly, we can't fix the Handmaiden fighting issue, so all I can suggest is be careful, save in advance, and if they stop talking, rewind. Also never break the fight by "cheating"...

Nice posts Lephys. @ TRX; If pacifists spend too much skill points in combat or combat people spend all their level up stuff in stealth, it's not the systems fault. And I rather want people to decide what to pick themselves on level up rather than forcing it upon them. Even more so since we use a group. Having one rogue not being able to progress stealth cause I kill everyone would be, well, bad... Most of us here are interested in that. And with the goals set out for PE, and the potential roleplaying kill-XP doesn't fit it. It would balance towards one side, not overall. The systems themselves aren't inferior or superior by themselves. But they have a measure of efficiency for the game discussed. In this case; PE. Not much to it. The XP could be awarded per level, or at the end. Whatever the dev wishes. Combat players would have the difficulty of advancing by combat (but no need to clear the entire surface). Stealth players have the difficulty of sneaking past the zombies in narrow hallways. Both of them not rewarded or penaltied by XP, nor their systems influenced by XP. Diplomacy chars still have to stealth or fight till the necromancer, but no-one really expects every situation to be stealthable, fightable or talkable. That would just be stupid and gamicky. And that's also why you would want a balanced party. And while, sure, your fighter party works great murdering, good luck when you have to flee the immortial god you can't persuade. Just a team of devs? Well, good luck getting to the people you wish to talk to. Stealth supreme? You're going to have a tough time when you sneaked into the enemy camp and the entire camp falls over you as they're around, living and notified of your presence.

Serious Sam 3:BFE still... Gameplay got more samlike, but still hate the environments. So many levels with the same look? Village I am in now is an improvement, but can't wait for the cityscape to stop...

The 3 things THX seem to fall upon; 1) Objective-XP is only meant to remove degenerate gameplay. Answer: No, it's not only for that purpose. It's to refine balance, reward actually progressing the game, allowing choices and pathways. It is to allow combat encounters to be buffed upper for higher difficulties and not give more XP. It's for not nerfing easy players on lower difficulties. It's to make stealth good. To make diplomacy good. To make combat good. That's why it is chosen. Not solely to not give XP for killing questgivers, as somehow most actually think... somehow. 2) Lets not change system A. Instead of fixining issues with A, we devise B. B is supposed to augment A to modify the result in a good fashion. Which then causes system C to reward appropriately. Answer: Wouldn't it be easier and better to just augment A to work properly? The reputation system can be used for much much more than simply filling gaps in the XP-system. A system where every kill modifies reputation in some way would only lead to more degenerate gameplay (let's kill all those enemies to adjust my reputation. While that may work in Freelancer, it's not so good here). It would lead to extra balance worries (how many can we place not to turn the reputation system to hell). It would create issues with generating quests (slaying corrupted beasts for the Druids, or inner-clan traitors anyone). And so we can go on. Instead of making a potential perfect reputation system ruined by that, let's just use it for it's designated function, okay? Not saying that I wont agree, as stated before, that killing key opponents can indeed affect it. 3) Evil = Murdering everyone. If OE can only make evil that, that would be a massive FAIL on their account. Personally I don't think that would be evil players only option and so desperately need to add XP to killing to make that viable instead of choosing out of the many MANY options presented to you being truly evil. Hopefully more in a manipulative way than a pure "I kill you lolly and murder you baby" kind of evil. Personally, I am not that worried this will happen just fine...

Yeah, the Utraen map was best. You can still solo it using LAN and just not adding anyone. Had crazy stuff like the cave of solitude which was a real maze, the secret chicken level etc. Also I do like the variety of spells. Many games these days have far less. DS2 too. You have to to fill in earth/fire/ice etc. with resistances we have these days, and some just... don't match that system. I remember a DS1 match where someone asked me "You're a fighter. Why do you have Mana Recharge cast"... "Mana Shield" "Ohh..." Good days...

You know, using ANOTHER system (in this case reputation) to make up for a failing XP-system seems... inefficient? Making things harder to balance? And to overview? It's adding layers to the issue. It's what some designers indeed do, work on adding more problems on the existing problems instead of just fixing them. And all you get is a weak pyramid of cards that collapses when you touch it. So, I would personally say, they should fix the XP before adding reputation affecting it. Since it's only getting downhill if 2 systems affect something, and the underlying system is proven to be very unstable and not working properly. And fixing 2 systems, as a programmer like you should know, similtaniously will be a lot easier than to have a working foundation and fix the one system on top.

Someone didn't check the BG/BG2 (especially this one)/PS:T/KOTOR unofficial patch notes to see how many XP issues where resolved. And TSLRCM can't even fix the engine-bound "place mine, go other area, return, disarm mine, XP" mechanic KOTOR2 has. Yeah, the current XP systems where *just fine*... Except for the dozens and dozens of times it horribly failed. And these games didn't even try to make non-combat viable in a lot of scenario's, as per PE's design goal. Why does evil being murder everyone? Wouldn't it be more evil to do a goal to gather food for the orphanage, and instead of giving it to them, selling it for your own personal profit. Or is evil only evil if you kill the orphanage for XP? I'd personally say I rather want evil to be the first evil than the second evil. And yes, Objective XP can fit that concept and goal perfectly.

True. If that was the "only" problem, and not one out of a dozen or 2 that are tackled using Objective-XP instead. While I am certain all could be fixed while still giving XP-per-kill, the entire system would be ultra-hacky at best. Leading to bugs, difficulty for modders and developers and confused players. If it even works proper at all times (which is extremely unlikely, even after a few patches). Which would be best?

@ TRX850 Sounds good to me. Of course if you get a choice in a quest, kill X or Y, it should affect reputation. And the kill-quest giver is good too. Just not every single member in the organisation gives you a hit, even if no-one even knows who they are (like you when you start working for the, )

I also thought of Gothic III as "Oblivion, but then fun and not sucking"... That I played them in rapid succession and hated one and liked the other might have something to do with it too...

The funny thing being I'm an atheist I just dont want OE to cave in to the voice of loudness in certain cases where the system thought about is a definite improvement to the system the voice wants. XP-per-kill being one example. I don't want them to make one system inherently better than the rest. Even when I am going to use the system (probably wont do sneaking, it's not my way. Talking's good though). Also, considering the time provided, the budget, I want a behind-the-scenes system for developers (and modmakers) that's easy to implement, control and debug. That makes balancing easier. That functionally allows those different pathways. When looking at it from both player-and-developer perspective, I think, there's no reason to use XP-per-kill above Objective-XP. Atleast for the type of game OE makes (it works fine in MMO's or Diablo's or Borderlands). True. But while it works in Freelancer, I rather also stay away from reputation requiring you to slaughter bunches of people to get the desired result. Except for those key-kills (leaders, massacaring hideouts, not just one single low-key member affecting it already). I know. But that isn't going to mean I agree with everything you apply as "problem solved"... what for discussion would there even be if I did? Just because it hasn't been done on an IE-type game makes it unproven. However that doesn't automatically makes it bad. AS some people in other threads where prone to point out ("It works in Bloodlines, doesn't mean it can work on IE"). That's just a lack of vision. Yes, one is 3D and 1 person, other 2D isometric and with a group of 6. So what? Doesn't still mean there are quests, objectives, areas and enemies to overcome. Easy can be good. Easy for the developers to add, for players to understand. All nothing wrong with that as long as it doesn't compromise gameplay. Making convoluted hard-to-understand systems can be fun for some gamers, but most generally want clarity. Well, I don't have that. I just got my experiences as gamer and noob-mod maker. Seeing what was horrbily broken (mine and lock XP in KOTOR2/BG2, the entire XP-system in general in DX:HR etc.) I'm pretty sure most of us (a few exclusions) do read between the lines and think broader than a single encounter, and how it would impact the entire game. How the systems other produce works fine for their example, but not the whole game as a whole. And work together to overcome said problems. Which actually was the point of the thread. To not go "Stealth is easiest path. End of story" ad continuem but to solve a fix for a problem perceived, without immediately opening the can of pandora upon the game just so someone gets "Hope". Most of us look from different standpoints. Diplomacy, stealth, combat (again, a few exceptions) and want to make some sort of balance between them. Not overpowering one or the other. Light or Dark could also be a good distinction there, I agree. I read them. But you're difficult to percieve sometimes. I pretty much go on a post-to-post basis, otherwise I completely lose track 0_o

I still prefer to use the top left corner icon besides the current quoting system. Only annoyance is how all the text becomes greyed out and hard to read (until you click it, so it's not that bad, still).

I somehow figure objective XP is easier, clearer for all parties, and making each battle affect some reputation is just silly. I agree with Lephys. You're so prone on the "100XP to level up" and "threat removal"... But with about 12-15 levels and the expected gametime the first will be pretty rare and spread out, and as for the second... there is still a threat as long as all orcs live. So I don't think it stands water that you should be rewarded for 'removing threat' when you're just thinning it instead.

That's pretty awesome. Whoever did it, great gesture man (or woman )!

Orcs Must Die! 2 to gather skulls and update traps for a potential future co-op match. Serious Sam 3: BFE first few levels. Doesn't feel like Serious Sam at all yet. Maybe it'll change, but so far, it's rather meh. Next up; Spec Ops. No opinion yet due to not yet booted yet .

Using said process still doesn't allow "random-generated" maps like you want for 'tiles'. Not that I see why anyone wants that above beautifully handcrafted terrains still...