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Backer Beta Patch Coming Soon

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#41
Marceror

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Thanks for the news. Will there be elaborate patch notes?

It won't be extremely elaborate, but we will try to list out the major fixes that we targeted and what are some of the big issues that we are still working on.

 

No rush on this. I started a new run through of Planescape Torment over the weekend, and am enjoying it immensely (with some key mods installed, of course).

 

I should be tied up with this for a while, so feel free to make that update as close to perfect as you can manage!

 

Strongly recommend that folks go back and enjoy an IE run through during the wait time!

 

We would like to keep the patch releases fairly consistent. Every week or two, at least. We might even discuss putting out more frequent patches after the first few.

 

That's totally fine, of course. I'm sure the vast majority of backers want to throw a rock at me for making my previous post anyway. :p


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#42
lightblade75

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Nice to know that you devs keep us in the loop.

 

For me - as I want to play with German language - the first new build that shows the texts everywhere when you click on a "magnifying glass spot" will be interesting.  I know this thread is not the one used for reporting bugs, but with missing texts in German at every "magnifying glas spot" in the game it is much less fun to me.

 

Of course a better (fixed)  AI / fighting/combat will also be highly appreciated.

 

For the future of this beta and of this game I would appreciate if dev feedback is more frequently.

 

So thanks for all your hard work and for keeping us updated.



#43
Freshock

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For some reason I can't do anything productive while waiting for the patch, it's understandable if there's a game release or when the PoE beta first dropped, but a bit stupid that it get's like this for a patch!


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#44
Quantics

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I'd say that this depends on what you mean by "elaborate" patch notes. There should be some patch notes, even it's just a list of all the bugs that've been fixed and all of the changes that have been made as this is hugely helpful for testers (as I can attest from my day job!). One of the devs on here has already mentioned that they're using a bug tracker and most (if not all of those) are capable of a report showing what's been resolved in a particular period so I wouldn't be surprised if that's basically what we'll get...

 

It isn't exactly that easy, but we will send out notes that list some of the major fixes and some of the stuff we are still working on.

 

 

Why don't you just use a bug tracker? 

 

That would allow you to almost completely bypass the patch notes, wouldn't it?



#45
PrimeJunta

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@Quantics ... only in a perfect world.

 

Problem with an issue tracker is that if it's used right, a LOT of stuff goes in, and gets processed fast. There will be invalid issues, duplicates, "could not reproduce" stuff, feature requests filed as bugs, and what have you. Even if you have really good discipline with that stuff, in a project of this scope just taking a dump of all issues between build A and build B, with a list of known unresolved issues, will produce something that's really big and really chaotic. 

 

Some companies have balls of steel and put the whole thing in public, but I understand and sympathize with not wanting to do that.

 

(We don't do that, as a matter of fact. We have internal release notes which do contain a list of everything that's been addressed, pulled directly from the issue tracker, but that only makes sense after the product lead has gone through everything and made sure they're marked with correct "Affects version" and "Fix version" fields, and then only if you're familiar with the architecture of our products. Then we prepare—manually—public release notes which explain the same stuff in terms understandable by the customers. This process takes easily a couple of days for a big release. We do not do this when iterating rapidly e.g. in a beta, because it would add a lot of friction to the process.)

 

Short version: I don't think we can handle the truth. There's enough bellyaching as it is.


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#46
IndiraLightfoot

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It can't come soon enough! Any updated info on when the patch may drop?

We are looking to release it tomorrow. We have a build that looks like a good candidate (but main menu music stopped working). We are going to do a few fixes tonight and we will either push out tomorrow's build or, if tomorrow's build has problems, we will push out tonight's build.

 

Wonderful! If I understood this correctly, we'll get a new build today, and knowing Steam, possibly around 19:00 CET. I wonder which class I'll roll up this time. Perhaps a cipher.


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#47
Sensuki

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@Quantics ... only in a perfect world.
 
Problem with an issue tracker is that if it's used right, a LOT of stuff goes in, and gets processed fast. There will be invalid issues, duplicates, "could not reproduce" stuff, feature requests filed as bugs, and what have you. Even if you have really good discipline with that stuff, in a project of this scope just taking a dump of all issues between build A and build B, with a list of known unresolved issues, will produce something that's really big and really chaotic. 
 
Some companies have balls of steel and put the whole thing in public, but I understand and sympathize with not wanting to do that.
 
(We don't do that, as a matter of fact. We have internal release notes which do contain a list of everything that's been addressed, pulled directly from the issue tracker, but that only makes sense after the product lead has gone through everything and made sure they're marked with correct "Affects version" and "Fix version" fields, and then only if you're familiar with the architecture of our products. Then we prepare—manually—public release notes which explain the same stuff in terms understandable by the customers. This process takes easily a couple of days for a big release. We do not do this when iterating rapidly e.g. in a beta, because it would add a lot of friction to the process.)
 
Short version: I don't think we can handle the truth. There's enough bellyaching as it is.


I personally like how the DotA 2 Dev forums are run, they have comprehensive known bug lists - http://dev.dota2.com...ad.php?t=127919

That said, I believe that requires manpower.
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#48
Quantics

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@PrimeJunta

 

Makes total sense. Thanks for clarifying this :)

 

@Sensuki

 

I can barely imagine the time it takes to keep such an elaborate bug list up-to-date. Tbh I'd rather the devs used their time fixing the bugs, rather than wasting hours listing and describing them.

 

I just wish it was easier for beta-testers to organise bug reports. And I'm sure it takes Obsidian a lot of time to go through these forums as well.


Edited by Quantics, 03 September 2014 - 01:29 AM.


#49
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@Quantics ... only in a perfect world.
 
Problem with an issue tracker is that if it's used right, a LOT of stuff goes in, and gets processed fast. There will be invalid issues, duplicates, "could not reproduce" stuff, feature requests filed as bugs, and what have you. Even if you have really good discipline with that stuff, in a project of this scope just taking a dump of all issues between build A and build B, with a list of known unresolved issues, will produce something that's really big and really chaotic. 
 
Some companies have balls of steel and put the whole thing in public, but I understand and sympathize with not wanting to do that.
 
(We don't do that, as a matter of fact. We have internal release notes which do contain a list of everything that's been addressed, pulled directly from the issue tracker, but that only makes sense after the product lead has gone through everything and made sure they're marked with correct "Affects version" and "Fix version" fields, and then only if you're familiar with the architecture of our products. Then we prepare—manually—public release notes which explain the same stuff in terms understandable by the customers. This process takes easily a couple of days for a big release. We do not do this when iterating rapidly e.g. in a beta, because it would add a lot of friction to the process.)
 
Short version: I don't think we can handle the truth. There's enough bellyaching as it is.

 
And as backer beta is alternate branch to actual game, meaning that bug/issue tracker will have lots of stuff that has little to do with backer beta that can spoil lot of stuff about the game, which Obsidian wanted to avoid by creating backer beta instead of giving access to full beta version of the game.


Edited by Elerond, 03 September 2014 - 01:35 AM.

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#50
PrimeJunta

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If I was running the beta, I'd set up a separate instance of an issue tracker only for that, with the possibility to file anonymous reports. Then assign a QA dude or two to trawl through it, resolving the duplicates, invalid reports, and known issues, and zapping the new ones over to the internal system the devs see. It would save a lot of work over having the trawl through the forums for the same info, and we would get at least some idea of what's going on.



#51
DnaCowboy

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Are we there yet?



#52
PrimeJunta

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I need to pee.


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#53
philby

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thanks very much for the comments badler, looking forward to it :)



#54
Tempus

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Whats the old build number... v257?



#55
Elerond

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Whats the old build number... v257?

 yes  v257 bb


Edited by Elerond, 03 September 2014 - 05:20 AM.


#56
BAdler

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I'd say that this depends on what you mean by "elaborate" patch notes. There should be some patch notes, even it's just a list of all the bugs that've been fixed and all of the changes that have been made as this is hugely helpful for testers (as I can attest from my day job!). One of the devs on here has already mentioned that they're using a bug tracker and most (if not all of those) are capable of a report showing what's been resolved in a particular period so I wouldn't be surprised if that's basically what we'll get...

 

It isn't exactly that easy, but we will send out notes that list some of the major fixes and some of the stuff we are still working on.

 

 

Why don't you just use a bug tracker? 

 

That would allow you to almost completely bypass the patch notes, wouldn't it?

 

We do use a bug tracker, but there are tons of fixes that go into the build everyday. We would have to go through and strip out the majority of fixes which may not be applicable to the beta. We are going to do that, but it won't be a comprehensive list, just the changes that we feel are most important for you guys to know.


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#57
BAdler

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It can't come soon enough! Any updated info on when the patch may drop?

We are looking to release it tomorrow. We have a build that looks like a good candidate (but main menu music stopped working). We are going to do a few fixes tonight and we will either push out tomorrow's build or, if tomorrow's build has problems, we will push out tonight's build.

 

Wonderful! If I understood this correctly, we'll get a new build today, and knowing Steam, possibly around 19:00 CET. I wonder which class I'll roll up this time. Perhaps a cipher.

 

 

We will most likely release it this afternoon. There is a bug we thought we had fixed in regards to modal abilities doubling after a save/load, but we found another set of steps that can trigger the problem. We want to fix that before we put out the next patch. I will keep you guys informed as to when I am ready to toss the build on Steam for you guys.


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#58
vril

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I'd say that this depends on what you mean by "elaborate" patch notes. There should be some patch notes, even it's just a list of all the bugs that've been fixed and all of the changes that have been made as this is hugely helpful for testers (as I can attest from my day job!). One of the devs on here has already mentioned that they're using a bug tracker and most (if not all of those) are capable of a report showing what's been resolved in a particular period so I wouldn't be surprised if that's basically what we'll get...

 

It isn't exactly that easy, but we will send out notes that list some of the major fixes and some of the stuff we are still working on.

 

 

Why don't you just use a bug tracker? 

 

That would allow you to almost completely bypass the patch notes, wouldn't it?

 

We do use a bug tracker, but there are tons of fixes that go into the build everyday. We would have to go through and strip out the majority of fixes which may not be applicable to the beta. We are going to do that, but it won't be a comprehensive list, just the changes that we feel are most important for you guys to know.

 

 

I can only imagine the time that would be wasted with having a producer wordsmith the changes that a programmer has written up for every ticket in the bug tracker.  :banghead:



#59
BlueLion

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What time could we expect the patch UK time? Are you guys 6 hours behind?



#60
vril

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What time could we expect the patch UK time? Are you guys 6 hours behind?

 

I believe they're 8 hours behind UK time.







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