mass shooting in orlando

[Wrath of Dagon]

Wow, I just watched this.  This was just a little over a week ago.

 

 

The part where is says the FBI can identify people to put on the no fly list, but they can't stop them from going into a store and buying unlimited armaments.

Problem is, there's no due process in being put on the no fly list, so legally it's meaningless. If they actually went to a judge and asked someone to be placed on the no gun list, that may be legal, like they do with mentally incompetent.

 

In other news, shooter probably a homosexual himself: http://m.palmbeachpost.com/news/news/orlando-shooter-omar-mateen-was-gay-former-classma/nrfwW/ I thought it might have something to do with self-hatred.

Edited June 14, 2016 by Wrath of Dagon

[Hiro Protagonist]

Reports are saying there was an off duty police officer already there when the gunman arrived.

[Meshugger]

 

Wow, I just watched this.  This was just a little over a week ago.

 

 

The part where is says the FBI can identify people to put on the no fly list, but they can't stop them from going into a store and buying unlimited armaments.

Problem is, there's no due process in being put on the no fly list, so legally it's meaningless. If they actually went to a judge and asked someone to be placed on the no gun list, that may be legal, like they do with mentally incompetent.

 

In other news, shooter probably a homosexual himself: http://m.palmbeachpost.com/news/news/orlando-shooter-omar-mateen-was-gay-former-classma/nrfwW/ I thought it might have something to do with self-hatred.

 

 

If he is, i wonder how many joining ISIS are. Gotta be a whole lot of bum-bum-fun over there.

[Hiro Protagonist]

Orlando shooter was a regular at the gay nightclub he attacked, used multiple gay dating apps

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/report-orlando-nightclub-shooter-visited-222620444.html

[Meshugger]

Orlando shooter was a regular at the gay nightclub he attacked, used multiple gay dating apps

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/report-orlando-nightclub-shooter-visited-222620444.html

 

...and there we have it. The solution is not for banning guns or more survaillence. Rather, it's about Islam accepting the gay. They are clearly not inclusive enough and we as society need to focus on the toxic masculinity which is spread in their mosques.

[BruceVC]

 

Orlando shooter was a regular at the gay nightclub he attacked, used multiple gay dating apps

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/report-orlando-nightclub-shooter-visited-222620444.html

 

...and there we have it. The solution is not for banning guns or more survaillence. Rather, it's about Islam accepting the gay. They are clearly not inclusive enough and we as society need to focus on the toxic masculinity which is spread in their mosques.

 

Homosexuality is rejected by the Muslim world, they must be the most intolerant religion as far as homosexuality is concerned 

 

In the ME many countries have the death penalty for anyone found to be gay

 

If this guy was indeed gay he would have been in this permanent state of confusion and he would  have been conflicted. Sadly when certain people refuse to accept who they are as far as sexual orientation is concerned they sometimes resort to violence as a way to somehow deal with the frustration of not being able to be themselves

 

I have seen this before, sometimes the worst bigots end up being gay themselves 

[Hiro Protagonist]

...and there we have it. The solution is not for banning guns or more survaillence. Rather, it's about Islam accepting the gay. They are clearly not inclusive enough and we as society need to focus on the toxic masculinity which is spread in their mosques.

 

Come to think of it. A gay Muslim terrorist with ISIS support?

 

I bet The Onion are kicking themselves for not thinking of it first.

[Oerwinde]

 

 

Wow, I just watched this.  This was just a little over a week ago.

 

 

The part where is says the FBI can identify people to put on the no fly list, but they can't stop them from going into a store and buying unlimited armaments.

Problem is, there's no due process in being put on the no fly list, so legally it's meaningless. If they actually went to a judge and asked someone to be placed on the no gun list, that may be legal, like they do with mentally incompetent.

 

In other news, shooter probably a homosexual himself: http://m.palmbeachpost.com/news/news/orlando-shooter-omar-mateen-was-gay-former-classma/nrfwW/ I thought it might have something to do with self-hatred.

 

 

If he is, i wonder how many joining ISIS are. Gotta be a whole lot of bum-bum-fun over there.

 

Nah, they only do little boys, if they haven't reached puberty yet they don't count as men so its not gay.

[HoonDing]

Should've gotten himself a goat to deal with the pent up frustration. It's prescribed in the Quran.

[213374U]

Well, I was being a bit facetious. Of course I too think a 9 year old outdated article doesn't represent todays real world capabilities but you cant really argue with math. I don't know who the dude is who wrote the article but maybe those deficiencies can be overcome with todays algorithms and computational horsepower?

 

People don't like PRISM because "waaaaa, me privacy is invaded." I for one feel it should be in use in all places of US interest and at all times. Let the computer weed out the garbage and act on what seems plausible. Works for me.

 

No, it very much does not work for you, the NSA, or anyone. You cannot solve the problem with today's (or tomorrow's) algorithms, and the article touches on this:

 

Suppose that NSA’s system is really, really, really good, really, really good, with an accuracy rate of .90, and a misidentification rate of .00001, which means that only 3,000 innocent people are misidentified as terrorists. With these suppositions, then the probability that people are terrorists given that NSA’s system of surveillance identifies them as terrorists is only p=0.2308, which is far from one and well below flipping a coin.

 

But the numbers aren't quite right because the population of the US is closer to 323 million. Let's assume that only adults aged 15-64 can be terrorists (roughly two thirds of the population). Assuming there are 1,000 terrorists, this means the probability of a randomly picked person in the US being one of them is about one in 213,000. Let's take it to 99% accuracy rate, deeply in the realm of science-fiction. This is not a system that reads your e-mails anymore, it now reads your ****ing mind. With these figures, the probability of Skynet successfully finding a terrorist is an unimpressive 32%, still below a coin toss. The problem is not how good the algorithm is, but how very few terrorists there are compared to the size of the general population, and how many false positives it's going to return.

 

Unless new math has appeared in these past ten years that better allows to calculate probability in this fashion, the date of the article is irrelevant, and Bayes' theorem is as valid today as it was in the 18th century when it was posited. Computer science is not magic.

[Hiro Protagonist]

To go off a tangent, technology has been used to track down dead people, technology-illiterate grandmothers, homes without computers and university laser printers for downloading movies. We've had years to get gud with computers now. What could possibly go wrong with computers tracking down suspected terrorists?
 

[Gfted1]

What could possibly go wrong with computers tracking down suspected terrorists?

Skynet and automated AI are bogeymen that nobody was talking about. The PRISM would handle the bulk numbers and pass "viable" hits to real humans to investigate. The "all or nothing" mentality baffles me.

[Hiro Protagonist]

Skynet and automated AI are bogeymen that nobody was talking about. The PRISM would handle the bulk numbers and pass "viable" hits to real humans to investigate. The "all or nothing" mentality baffles me.

 

That's what happened with downloading movies. To go through the process of data handed to real humans, the legal process and legal action initiated, only to find out many months later that the culprit was either a dead person, or a house with no computers, or a printer.

[Gorgon]

Orlando shooter was a regular at the gay nightclub he attacked, used multiple gay dating apps

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/report-orlando-nightclub-shooter-visited-222620444.html

I wonder how that's going to go down with Isis. Will be kicked out of paradise now for being a conflicted gay man. 

[Enoch]

 

 

Orlando shooter was a regular at the gay nightclub he attacked, used multiple gay dating apps

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/report-orlando-nightclub-shooter-visited-222620444.html

 

...and there we have it. The solution is not for banning guns or more survaillence. Rather, it's about Islam accepting the gay. They are clearly not inclusive enough and we as society need to focus on the toxic masculinity which is spread in their mosques.

 

Homosexuality is rejected by the Muslim world, they must be the most intolerant religion as far as homosexuality is concerned 

 

In the ME many countries have the death penalty for anyone found to be gay

 

If this guy was indeed gay he would have been in this permanent state of confusion and he would  have been conflicted. Sadly when certain people refuse to accept who they are as far as sexual orientation is concerned they sometimes resort to violence as a way to somehow deal with the frustration of not being able to be themselves

 

I have seen this before, sometimes the worst bigots end up being gay themselves 

 

 

Keep in mind the message that ISIS puts out:  First, it is the duty of the faithful to come to Syria/Iraq and join the fight to re-establish the grandeur of the Caliphate.  But, if you can't do that for whatever reason, it'd be great if you could kill as many infidels as you can where you are. 

 

This offers a way for unstable folks with violent tendencies to feel justified-- even holy-- in acting out their fantasies of bloodshed.  ISIS bears no cost, and gets the benefit of looking scarier to the outside world ("Lone Wolf" attacks are by nature more difficult to prevent than ones involving central coordination), as well as inspiring nativist and anti-Muslim reactions that feed the cycle of recruiting.  Thus, "ISIS-inspired" attacks like Orlando (guy who might well have been a self-hating homosexual kills lots of gay folks) and San Bernardino (terrorist attack that just happened to target the perpetrator's co-workers) where religion appears to have been the final justifying factor for violence that already-unhinged perpetrators really wanted to inflict for other reasons. 

Edited June 14, 2016 by Enoch

[Meshugger]

 

 

 

Orlando shooter was a regular at the gay nightclub he attacked, used multiple gay dating apps

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/report-orlando-nightclub-shooter-visited-222620444.html

 

...and there we have it. The solution is not for banning guns or more survaillence. Rather, it's about Islam accepting the gay. They are clearly not inclusive enough and we as society need to focus on the toxic masculinity which is spread in their mosques.

 

Homosexuality is rejected by the Muslim world, they must be the most intolerant religion as far as homosexuality is concerned 

 

In the ME many countries have the death penalty for anyone found to be gay

 

If this guy was indeed gay he would have been in this permanent state of confusion and he would  have been conflicted. Sadly when certain people refuse to accept who they are as far as sexual orientation is concerned they sometimes resort to violence as a way to somehow deal with the frustration of not being able to be themselves

 

I have seen this before, sometimes the worst bigots end up being gay themselves 

 

 

Keep in mind the message that ISIS puts out:  First, it is the duty of the faithful to come to Syria/Iraq and join the fight to re-establish the grandeur of the Caliphate.  But, if you can't do that for whatever reason, it'd be great if you could kill as many infidels as you can where you are. 

 

This offers a way for unstable folks with violent tendencies to feel justified-- even holy-- in acting out their fantasies of bloodshed.  ISIS bears no cost, and gets the benefit of looking scarier to the outside world ("Lone Wolf" attacks are by nature more difficult to prevent than ones involving central coordination), as well as inspiring nativist and anti-Muslim reactions that feed the cycle of recruiting.  Thus, "ISIS-inspired" attacks like Orlando (guy who might well have been a self-hating homosexual kills lots of gay folks) and San Bernardino (terrorist attack that just happened to target the perpetrator's co-workers) where religion appears to have been the final justifying factor for violence that already-unhinged perpetrators really wanted to inflict for other reasons. 

 

 

It's the key difference between Islam and Christianity really. In Christianity salvation is inward where no matter what you have done previously, confessing ones sins, regretting them and asking for forgiveness is the path to salvation (Just look at all those gay pastors asking for forgiveness after getting caught). In Islam it is outward, namely you can commit murder in the name of Jihad and the sins are washed away and salvation is given.

[Hurlshort]

 

 

It's the key difference between Islam and Christianity really. In Christianity salvation is inward where no matter what you have done previously, confessing ones sins, regretting them and asking for forgiveness is the path to salvation (Just look at all those gay pastors asking for forgiveness after getting caught). In Islam it is outward, namely you can commit murder in the name of Jihad and the sins are washed away and salvation is given.

 

 

You are comparing the modern version of Christian salvation to the extremist version of the lesser Jihad in Islam.  

[aluminiumtrioxid]

 

 

 

 

Orlando shooter was a regular at the gay nightclub he attacked, used multiple gay dating apps

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/report-orlando-nightclub-shooter-visited-222620444.html

 

...and there we have it. The solution is not for banning guns or more survaillence. Rather, it's about Islam accepting the gay. They are clearly not inclusive enough and we as society need to focus on the toxic masculinity which is spread in their mosques.

 

Homosexuality is rejected by the Muslim world, they must be the most intolerant religion as far as homosexuality is concerned 

 

In the ME many countries have the death penalty for anyone found to be gay

 

If this guy was indeed gay he would have been in this permanent state of confusion and he would  have been conflicted. Sadly when certain people refuse to accept who they are as far as sexual orientation is concerned they sometimes resort to violence as a way to somehow deal with the frustration of not being able to be themselves

 

I have seen this before, sometimes the worst bigots end up being gay themselves 

 

 

Keep in mind the message that ISIS puts out:  First, it is the duty of the faithful to come to Syria/Iraq and join the fight to re-establish the grandeur of the Caliphate.  But, if you can't do that for whatever reason, it'd be great if you could kill as many infidels as you can where you are. 

 

This offers a way for unstable folks with violent tendencies to feel justified-- even holy-- in acting out their fantasies of bloodshed.  ISIS bears no cost, and gets the benefit of looking scarier to the outside world ("Lone Wolf" attacks are by nature more difficult to prevent than ones involving central coordination), as well as inspiring nativist and anti-Muslim reactions that feed the cycle of recruiting.  Thus, "ISIS-inspired" attacks like Orlando (guy who might well have been a self-hating homosexual kills lots of gay folks) and San Bernardino (terrorist attack that just happened to target the perpetrator's co-workers) where religion appears to have been the final justifying factor for violence that already-unhinged perpetrators really wanted to inflict for other reasons. 

 

 

It's the key difference between Islam and Christianity really. In Christianity salvation is inward where no matter what you have done previously, confessing ones sins, regretting them and asking for forgiveness is the path to salvation (Just look at all those gay pastors asking for forgiveness after getting caught). In Islam it is outward, namely you can commit murder in the name of Jihad and the sins are washed away and salvation is given.

 

 

This is all well and good, but actually there's no lack of Christian congregations spewing hateful rhetoric and downplaying that whole salvation and redemption angle, so I'm understandably sceptical of its inherent superiority.

[Meshugger]

 

 

 

It's the key difference between Islam and Christianity really. In Christianity salvation is inward where no matter what you have done previously, confessing ones sins, regretting them and asking for forgiveness is the path to salvation (Just look at all those gay pastors asking for forgiveness after getting caught). In Islam it is outward, namely you can commit murder in the name of Jihad and the sins are washed away and salvation is given.

 

 

You are comparing the modern version of Christian salvation to the extremist version of the lesser Jihad in Islam.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Orlando shooter was a regular at the gay nightclub he attacked, used multiple gay dating apps

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/report-orlando-nightclub-shooter-visited-222620444.html

 

...and there we have it. The solution is not for banning guns or more survaillence. Rather, it's about Islam accepting the gay. They are clearly not inclusive enough and we as society need to focus on the toxic masculinity which is spread in their mosques.

 

Homosexuality is rejected by the Muslim world, they must be the most intolerant religion as far as homosexuality is concerned 

 

In the ME many countries have the death penalty for anyone found to be gay

 

If this guy was indeed gay he would have been in this permanent state of confusion and he would  have been conflicted. Sadly when certain people refuse to accept who they are as far as sexual orientation is concerned they sometimes resort to violence as a way to somehow deal with the frustration of not being able to be themselves

 

I have seen this before, sometimes the worst bigots end up being gay themselves 

 

 

Keep in mind the message that ISIS puts out:  First, it is the duty of the faithful to come to Syria/Iraq and join the fight to re-establish the grandeur of the Caliphate.  But, if you can't do that for whatever reason, it'd be great if you could kill as many infidels as you can where you are. 

 

This offers a way for unstable folks with violent tendencies to feel justified-- even holy-- in acting out their fantasies of bloodshed.  ISIS bears no cost, and gets the benefit of looking scarier to the outside world ("Lone Wolf" attacks are by nature more difficult to prevent than ones involving central coordination), as well as inspiring nativist and anti-Muslim reactions that feed the cycle of recruiting.  Thus, "ISIS-inspired" attacks like Orlando (guy who might well have been a self-hating homosexual kills lots of gay folks) and San Bernardino (terrorist attack that just happened to target the perpetrator's co-workers) where religion appears to have been the final justifying factor for violence that already-unhinged perpetrators really wanted to inflict for other reasons. 

 

 

It's the key difference between Islam and Christianity really. In Christianity salvation is inward where no matter what you have done previously, confessing ones sins, regretting them and asking for forgiveness is the path to salvation (Just look at all those gay pastors asking for forgiveness after getting caught). In Islam it is outward, namely you can commit murder in the name of Jihad and the sins are washed away and salvation is given.

 

 

This is all well and good, but actually there's no lack of Christian congregations spewing hateful rhetoric and downplaying that whole salvation and redemption angle, so I'm understandably sceptical of its inherent superiority.

 

 

Oh, i am not saying that there aren't hateful groups within Christianity. What i am saying is that you have it easier to find theological justification for murder in order achieve salvation in Islam than in Christianity.

Edited June 14, 2016 by Meshugger

[Elerond]

 

Orlando shooter was a regular at the gay nightclub he attacked, used multiple gay dating apps

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/report-orlando-nightclub-shooter-visited-222620444.html

I wonder how that's going to go down with Isis. Will be kicked out of paradise now for being a conflicted gay man. 

 

 

It isn't uncommon that homophobic people go in gay clubs and look people from dating apps and sites that are meant for gays. And it isn't also uncommon that this behavior eventually leads escalation where said people start assault and even kill gays. And it is also common that in these cases people believe that these criminals just could not handle fact that they are gay, but usually there isn't no other evidence than their fascination towards thing that they clearly hate that there is anything gay in them. Usually people that show behavior where they become more and more fascinated with target of their hate and eventually escalating to violence towards target is called stalking  but in cases like this people often jump in conclusion that person just could not handle being gay. Which may be because they think that it is insulting towards said homophobic criminals or because it works as easy explanation for that person's violent behavior, but this both things are quite problematic for people that were targeted by these criminals hatred.

[WDeranged]

 

Orlando shooter was a regular at the gay nightclub he attacked, used multiple gay dating apps

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/report-orlando-nightclub-shooter-visited-222620444.html

I wonder how that's going to go down with Isis. Will be kicked out of paradise now for being a conflicted gay man. 

 

 

I'm thinking real ISIS involvement is negligible.  ISIS and previously Al Qaeda would claim responsibility for a dustbin fire if it raised public awareness of them.

[Gorgon]

I know, it's funny that he was simultaneously one of 'the brothers' in the struggle according to Isis propaganda and a gay man. They won't be milking it anymore. 

[Gorgon]

 

 

Orlando shooter was a regular at the gay nightclub he attacked, used multiple gay dating apps

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/report-orlando-nightclub-shooter-visited-222620444.html

I wonder how that's going to go down with Isis. Will be kicked out of paradise now for being a conflicted gay man. 

 

 

It isn't uncommon that homophobic people go in gay clubs and look people from dating apps and sites that are meant for gays. And it isn't also uncommon that this behavior eventually leads escalation where said people start assault and even kill gays. And it is also common that in these cases people believe that these criminals just could not handle fact that they are gay, but usually there isn't no other evidence than their fascination towards thing that they clearly hate that there is anything gay in them. Usually people that show behavior where they become more and more fascinated with target of their hate and eventually escalating to violence towards target is called stalking  but in cases like this people often jump in conclusion that person just could not handle being gay. Which may be because they think that it is insulting towards said homophobic criminals or because it works as easy explanation for that person's violent behavior, but this both things are quite problematic for people that were targeted by these criminals hatred.

 

That's possible I guess. But he was on several gay social media. I took that to mean he had a profile. If you have a profile, I mean ods are you are gay. 

[Meshugger]

http://www.fireandreamitchell.com/2016/06/13/noor-zahi-salman-second-wife-of-orlando-terrorist/

 

Interesting. His wife has erased her social media history and he sold his house to his sister for 10$. If one were to ask "did they know?", these circumstances might turn out to be quite incriminating.

 

The source is dubious though (reddit, lol)

Edited June 14, 2016 by Meshugger

[Elerond]

 

 

 

Orlando shooter was a regular at the gay nightclub he attacked, used multiple gay dating apps

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/report-orlando-nightclub-shooter-visited-222620444.html

I wonder how that's going to go down with Isis. Will be kicked out of paradise now for being a conflicted gay man. 

 

 

It isn't uncommon that homophobic people go in gay clubs and look people from dating apps and sites that are meant for gays. And it isn't also uncommon that this behavior eventually leads escalation where said people start assault and even kill gays. And it is also common that in these cases people believe that these criminals just could not handle fact that they are gay, but usually there isn't no other evidence than their fascination towards thing that they clearly hate that there is anything gay in them. Usually people that show behavior where they become more and more fascinated with target of their hate and eventually escalating to violence towards target is called stalking  but in cases like this people often jump in conclusion that person just could not handle being gay. Which may be because they think that it is insulting towards said homophobic criminals or because it works as easy explanation for that person's violent behavior, but this both things are quite problematic for people that were targeted by these criminals hatred.

 

That's possible I guess. But he was on several gay social media. I took that to mean he had a profile. If you have a profile, I mean ods are you are gay. 

 

 

But having wife and child and no known male partners lowers odds to be gay somewhat especially for millennial who has grown in USA. And even being in denial becomes quite questionable if he really has have been visiting Pulse and other gay nightclubs for years and seeking male company (at least I haven't heard about one) from dating apps and sites, because that is quite lot time to be in denial about yourself but still constantly seeking environment with people that you deny being part of.  This aren't behaviors that you commonly see in people that are in denial.