Leferd Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 I stand corrected. "Things are funny...are comedic, because they mix the real with the absurd." - Buzz Aldrin."P-O-T-A-T-O-E" - Dan Quayle
Endrosz Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 ... I hate to sound so cynical, I want this game to be a huge success, but I'm not really interested in struggling through broken game after broken game the throwing "bug reports" down a forum black-hole. I would be spending almost as much time documenting problems as I would playing. I didn't back this game for the "insider" honor to be a primary playtester and bug reporter. .... Medical advice: Some people have been found to susceptible to "Early Access", "Backer Beta", and other pathogens. Typical symptoms include bug bite marks, hallucinations, aggressive episodes, mood swings. These people shouldn't enter any such program UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES. Treatment: Completely ignore the game while it is in the making, live a happy, content, successful life until the game comes out, then enjoy it. 11 The Seven Blunders/Roots of Violence: Wealth without work. Pleasure without conscience. Knowledge without character. Commerce without morality. Science without humanity. Worship without sacrifice. Politics without principle. (Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi) Let's Play the Pools Saga (SSI Gold Box Classics) Pillows of Enamored Warfare -- The Zen of Nodding
Mayama Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Everyone here seems to forget the most important thing, this game has guns but where is my high noon showdown!!! 1
Luridis Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 (edited) Just an FYI: The build we're testing is probably a month old, maybe two... So, I'll tell you what I expect: The first patch will probably address about half the concerns raised, and it's most likely the fixes are not the result of feedback. That is to say, they have likely already been working on the biggest hiccups for at least a month, possibly two. Give them a chance man, don't worry so much. If 60% of the issues aren't cleaned up by the second patch, that's the point at which I would start to worry. Edited August 28, 2014 by Luridis 5 Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt. - Julius Caesar #define TRUE (!FALSE) I ran across an article where the above statement was found in a release tarball. LOL! Who does something like this? Predictably, this oddity was found when the article's author tried to build said tarball and the compiler promptly went into cardiac arrest. If you're not a developer, imagine telling someone the literal meaning of up is "not down". Such nonsense makes computers, and developers... angry.
InsaneCommander Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 @Luridis I'll wait for the second update too. They already had their hands full when the Beta was released. I think they will leave some of the problems we noticed to fix after the first update.
Quadrone Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Just an FYI: The build we're testing is probably a month old, maybe two... So, I'll tell you what I expect: The first patch will probably address about half the concerns raised, and it's most likely the fixes are not the result of feedback. That is to say, they have likely already been working on the biggest hiccups for at least a month, possibly two. Give them a chance man, don't worry so much. If 60% of the issues aren't cleaned up by the second patch, that's the point at which I would start to worry. I was thinking along the same lines as you. While a lot of the criticism in this forum is very much understandable considering the state of the beta, I still feel that there is a lot of doomsaying going on as well. Currently we just can't gauge at what speed Obsidian is able to implement missing assets and fix bugs. At least wait until one patch is released, if that doesn't fix enough stuff to make a difference then everyone can start lamenting to their hearts content.
Shadenuat Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 The expectations for this one are just too high. Obsidian are partly to blame for that since they used supahtrueIE iwdcombatPstwritingBGworld to promote the game. It's still a 4 mln game, not a 40 one. I think it is expected that they just want to get the basics right first. That's why system is so streamlined imo. And inventory and UI is probably just a quick mishmash to make game presentable and playable. I remember Arcanum inventory when game was in beta, a few screenshots, it looked completely different than it was on release. Same goes for gameplay really.Still there are some things in core design that people don't like and pointed out, I think devs would change them eventually. 1
BruceVC Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Guys no need to stress, I can guarantee you the game will have very few bugs in the next 24 months and all of this concern will just be a bad memory "Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss” John Milton "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” - George Bernard Shaw "What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela
Malekith Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Guys no need to stress, I can guarantee you the game will have very few bugs in the next 24 months and all of this concern will just be a bad memory True dat
Osvir Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 (edited) @Title: This does not release in December. Pillars of Eternity has been said to be released in December, but I wouldn't mind it if an Early Access was opened publically as soon as we, the first testers, can make sure that it is reasonably stable. This way it releases onto Steam as a playable product (unlike many Early Access' releases) and Obsidian can generate more revenue and create more content into Pillars of Eternity... til maybe Early (Jan-Mar) 2015~ just saying I wouldn't mind it as it would give Obsidian more resources, if they feel up to it @OP: Very fair points can't disagree, the Beta is in a state of instability, clearly. Be here when the "flow" begins again (next update) and you'll read on better I think. There's also "Known Issues" (sig). Becomes like a combat log almost I don't want Pillars of Eternity to be released in the state it is in either. I am overjoyed to play it, as I have been waiting and discussing for now almost 2 years. I know that it is a W.I.P (Work In Progress) prototype. Prototype. I do see where the design is sort of heading, the general direction of it, and I'm loving it <3 Edited August 28, 2014 by Osvir 1
Monte Carlo Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Q1 2015 makes more sense. I'd be cool with that. 8
Yonjuro Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 ... Bugs, giant, glaring, basic gameplay bugs are everywhere... A lot of the wonkiness of the beta can be due to a very small number of bugs. There is an inventory bug that looks like it is corrupting memory. Once that happens, all bets are off. Essentially, a piece of code that is supposed to be writing in one place in memory ends up writing in another, unrelated, place and hilarity ensues. If you have the beta, double click on an inventory item enough times and you get two of them - repeat as desired - sell one of the items and all of them go away. I haven't seen the code, but this looks like there is a race condition (two threads modifying the inventory; finishing out of order due to process scheduling) causing a corruption of the game state (two different pieces of data pointing at the same physical memory). That is only a guess based on what I see on the screen - but if it's anything like that - that one bug can cause a lot of the instability that you can see in the beta. So, it may not be that 'bugs are everywhere' it may be that 'one bug is everywhere'. If you play without saving/loading very often, always quit and restart before you load and are careful not to double click anything or stack and unstack things in inventory, the game is actually pretty stable. You can complete all 4 of the quests in multiple ways. 5
Mayama Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 If you play without saving/loading very often, always quit and restart before you load and are careful not to double click anything or stack and unstack things in inventory, the game is actually pretty stable. You can complete all 4 of the quests in multiple ways. Yeah visiting the bug forum bevor whining would help alot
Helm Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 I have experience in beta testing numerous other RPGs, Wasteland 2, D:OS, Blackgaurds, Might & Magic X, Dead State, and so on (yeah, i'm an RPG freak). This game is by far the worst of the bunch that I have playtested and is obviously still in a pre-alpha state, I wouldn't be surprised if what we are playing is the first playable build. There is a lot of fixing that needs to be done, even a lot of the assets are missing; in my opinion the mechanics and systems design is also very (very, very) underwhelming. People who think that this could still be released in Q4/2015 or even Q1/2015 are being wildly optimistic IMO. 1 Pillars of Eternity Josh Sawyer's Quest: The Quest for Quests - an isometric fantasy stealth RPG with optional combat and no pesky XP rewards for combat, skill usage or exploration. PoE is supposed to be a spiritual successor to Baldur's Gate - Josh Sawyer doesn't like the Baldur's Gate series (more) - PoE is supposed to reward us for our achievements ~~~~~~~~~~~ "Josh Sawyer created an RPG where always avoiding combat and never picking locks makes you a powerful warrior and a master lockpicker." -Helm, very critcal and super awesome RPG fan "I like XP for things other than just objectives. When there is no rewards for combat or other activities, I think it lessens the reward for being successful at them." -Feargus Urquhart, OE CEO "Didn’t like the fact that I don’t get XP for combat [...] the lack of rewards for killing creatures [in PoE] makes me want to avoid combat (the core activity of the game)" -George Ziets, Game Dev.
Quadrone Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 There is a lot of fixing that needs to be done, even a lot of the assets are missing; in my opinion the mechanics and systems design is also very (very, very) underwhelming. People who think that this could still be released in Q4/2015 or even Q1/2015 are being wildly optimistic IMO. I guess we're **** outta luck then, because there is no way Obsidian will pay for continued development out of their own pockets past Q1 2015. If even past December at all. 1
Lasweetlife Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 There is a lot of fixing that needs to be done, even a lot of the assets are missing; in my opinion the mechanics and systems design is also very (very, very) underwhelming. People who think that this could still be released in Q4/2015 or even Q1/2015 are being wildly optimistic IMO. I guess we're **** outta luck then, because there is no way Obsidian will pay for continued development out of their own pockets past Q1 2015. If even past December at all. 3
Helm Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Who knows, Inxile scratched together enough funds to develop Wasteland 2 for one more year. Pillars of Eternity Josh Sawyer's Quest: The Quest for Quests - an isometric fantasy stealth RPG with optional combat and no pesky XP rewards for combat, skill usage or exploration. PoE is supposed to be a spiritual successor to Baldur's Gate - Josh Sawyer doesn't like the Baldur's Gate series (more) - PoE is supposed to reward us for our achievements ~~~~~~~~~~~ "Josh Sawyer created an RPG where always avoiding combat and never picking locks makes you a powerful warrior and a master lockpicker." -Helm, very critcal and super awesome RPG fan "I like XP for things other than just objectives. When there is no rewards for combat or other activities, I think it lessens the reward for being successful at them." -Feargus Urquhart, OE CEO "Didn’t like the fact that I don’t get XP for combat [...] the lack of rewards for killing creatures [in PoE] makes me want to avoid combat (the core activity of the game)" -George Ziets, Game Dev.
khermann Posted August 28, 2014 Author Posted August 28, 2014 Some people have been found to susceptible to "Early Access", "Backer Beta", and other pathogens. Typical symptoms include bug bite marks, hallucinations, aggressive episodes, mood swings. These people shouldn't enter any such program UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES. Treatment: Completely ignore the game while it is in the making, live a happy, content, successful life until the game comes out, then enjoy it. This guy..... i like this guy.
TrueMenace Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 I think when the next update comes out, playing through the Beta will be a different experience in a really good way. Just give them time iron out the bugs! Calibrating...
Qiushui Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Obsidian are known for making buggy games, even on release. It's a monkey on their back I wish they would shake off someday. That said, I still love (most of) their games.
Osvir Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Divinity: Original Sin lived off of Early Access, and Wasteland 2 is soon to exit it.The reason to their well polish and extended duration of development is thanks to Early Access. No denying it.Obsidian could get 6 months extra+expansions. When they are finished with the basic "frame" of the code they should be able to move stuff around freely as they please without errors, and in 6 months they could develop a lot of content. They are also talking about potential sequels and expanding the world into other perspectives into the future (First person RP? Maybe RTS? Maybe more RPG?). IIRC, Feargus mentioned something about an idea for an open world first person RPG for the Eternity/Eora-verse.
Helm Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 (edited) Some people have been found to susceptible to "Early Access", "Backer Beta", and other pathogens. Typical symptoms include bug bite marks, hallucinations, aggressive episodes, mood swings. These people shouldn't enter any such program UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES. Treatment: Completely ignore the game while it is in the making, live a happy, content, successful life until the game comes out, then enjoy it. This guy..... i like this guy. He is wrong though, the developers want criticism, because it is constructive and helps them improve the game. The developers are (well, should be) very capable of extrapolating based on the feedback they receive. Anybody who thinks otherwise is an idiot. Obsidian actually asked us to lay it on them - so we did. Keep on criticizing what you don't like and watch the magic happen. Just don't throw any fits and call the developers retarded **** or something, that is not constructive. I do admit though that there is a disproportionately high amount of controversy surrounding this game, but that is their own fault. If you promise something, then you better make it happen. Edited August 28, 2014 by Helm 3 Pillars of Eternity Josh Sawyer's Quest: The Quest for Quests - an isometric fantasy stealth RPG with optional combat and no pesky XP rewards for combat, skill usage or exploration. PoE is supposed to be a spiritual successor to Baldur's Gate - Josh Sawyer doesn't like the Baldur's Gate series (more) - PoE is supposed to reward us for our achievements ~~~~~~~~~~~ "Josh Sawyer created an RPG where always avoiding combat and never picking locks makes you a powerful warrior and a master lockpicker." -Helm, very critcal and super awesome RPG fan "I like XP for things other than just objectives. When there is no rewards for combat or other activities, I think it lessens the reward for being successful at them." -Feargus Urquhart, OE CEO "Didn’t like the fact that I don’t get XP for combat [...] the lack of rewards for killing creatures [in PoE] makes me want to avoid combat (the core activity of the game)" -George Ziets, Game Dev.
Panteleimon Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Just don't throw any fits and call the developers retarded **** or something, that is not constructive. I do admit though that there is a disproportionately high amount of controversy surrounding this game, but that is their own fault. If you promise something, then you better make it happen. That's really rich coming from you. All this time I thought "retarded" was one of your favorite pejoratives.
Endrosz Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 (edited) He is wrong though, the developers want criticism, because it is constructive and helps them improve the game. The developers are (well, should be) very capable of extrapolating based on the feedback they receive. Anybody who thinks otherwise is an idiot. Obsidian actually asked us to lay it on them - so we did. If somebody were to say everyone should leave alone betas, then yes, he would be an idiot. I didn't say that, however. You missed the part that says "some people". I truly, honestly believe that some people are just unable to deal properly with a beta process and should leave it alone for their own sake and for everyone else's sake. Everyone else is welcome provide feedback, no matter how harsh it is. Based on what the OP wrote, I gave him the genuine advice of staying away from the PoE beta. I don't say this to anyone who criticizes the game. Edited August 28, 2014 by Endrosz 3 The Seven Blunders/Roots of Violence: Wealth without work. Pleasure without conscience. Knowledge without character. Commerce without morality. Science without humanity. Worship without sacrifice. Politics without principle. (Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi) Let's Play the Pools Saga (SSI Gold Box Classics) Pillows of Enamored Warfare -- The Zen of Nodding
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