Update #34: FIRST ART UPDATE

[sirchet]

Can I have a medicine ball flail OF DEATH! Please?

[Jarmo]

The model in the scene is the same model in the image above (with different textures and a different weapon, obviously). We want the level of detail in the game models to be high enough that we can use the same model for the inventory screen "paper dolls" with a slightly magnified view.

 

With character models this detailed, faces will be clearly discernible (unlike, say, in the Infinity Engine games).

----

How will Project Eternity solve this?

Will the character creation screen give users so many customization options for the protagonist's 3D character model, that one could, say, create a 50 year old fighter with a rough and scarred face and steely glance? Or a 19 year old mage with a soft, tri-angular face, narrow eyes, and an appeal of playfulness and irresponsibility?

 

Or will we simply get a few fixed 3D models to choose from?

 

My guess, a couple of standard faces with a choice of hair, beard and the colors of those and skin.

One might hope for body types, but I'd call that a longshot.

[Ieo]

The model in the scene is the same model in the image above (with different textures and a different weapon, obviously). We want the level of detail in the game models to be high enough that we can use the same model for the inventory screen "paper dolls" with a slightly magnified view.

 

With character models this detailed, faces will be clearly discernible (unlike, say, in the Infinity Engine games).

----

How will Project Eternity solve this?

Will the character creation screen give users so many customization options for the protagonist's 3D character model, that one could, say, create a 50 year old fighter with a rough and scarred face and steely glance? Or a 19 year old mage with a soft, tri-angular face, narrow eyes, and an appeal of playfulness and irresponsibility?

 

Or will we simply get a few fixed 3D models to choose from?

 

My guess, a couple of standard faces with a choice of hair, beard and the colors of those and skin.

One might hope for body types, but I'd call that a longshot.

 

I don't mind standardized as long as there are "enough" choices----though another issue is whether the model face will automatically match a painted portrait. Portraits are one of the standard areas of customization, with tons of collections available for importation in the old IE games (except PS:T). So how would that work out...

[J.E. Sawyer]

We have to walk a fine line with how much detail you can see in the face. In the IE games, you could reasonably project anything you imagined onto your "paper doll" because the face was a tinted mass of pixels. We want to allow you to use any portraits you want in PE, but if the paper doll detail clashes significantly with the portrait, there's trouble. We'll have to see what that means in practical terms, but it is certainly in our thoughts.

[Hormalakh]

We have to walk a fine line with how much detail you can see in the face. In the IE games, you could reasonably project anything you imagined onto your "paper doll" because the face was a tinted mass of pixels. We want to allow you to use any portraits you want in PE, but if the paper doll detail clashes significantly with the portrait, there's trouble. We'll have to see what that means in practical terms, but it is certainly in our thoughts.

 

Would definitely appreciate sacrificing some choices in facial customization for other kinds of customization. If we can have less eye/nose/mouth shapes and more body/hair-shapes/colors that would be better.

[Sistergoldring]

Yay, pretty art stuff!

 

Thanks for the awesome update, it all looks great.

 

 

[Shevek]

I am extremely impressed by that character model. That is phenomenal. The level of detail is just right. Much more and one would get little benefit from added polys since the cam is so panned out. If all player and creature models have that level of detail, the battlefield should look absolutely gorgeous.

 

As a side note: I understand that flail is probably oversized for anim testing purposes. Still, oversized blunt weapons are a pet peeve of mine - so I wanted to share an observation. I absolutely hate the ways flails, maces, etc are typically done in games. The ends of these weapons should be small but they usually end up the size of a melon. I remember for NWN1, I actually made replacement mace heads because the stock ones bothered me so much. Anywho, I just hope weapons (especially blunt ones) are not dramatically oversized just so players can see the details from a panned out perspective.

Edited December 6, 2012 by Shevek

[Gizmo]

the properties of the camera that is used to render the background are provided to the game engine and matched perfectly. There is no perspective. This in-game camera will be fixed on a general target location around the center of the party and dolly with them as they move around the world on an invisible collision plane that is coincident with the visible terrain. the in-game camera will never rotate around this target nor is it intended to zoom in or out.

Thanks for the reply Rob; that's good to hear, and more or less what I was expecting... in my case I wasn't suggesting a zoom or rotation of any kind. I was asking whether the engine would scale the 3d character in relation to it's position on screen [relative to other characters]; very much in the way the older 2D graphic adventures would.

 

It's a moot point as you've already said "no"; so PE will basically play like a hi-res BG2 ~and that's wonderful.

[sirchet]

We have to walk a fine line with how much detail you can see in the face. In the IE games, you could reasonably project anything you imagined onto your "paper doll" because the face was a tinted mass of pixels. We want to allow you to use any portraits you want in PE, but if the paper doll detail clashes significantly with the portrait, there's trouble. We'll have to see what that means in practical terms, but it is certainly in our thoughts.

 

You guys are simply fantastic!

 

I can't help but feel like we the players are the first thing you think about when designing something.

 

Thanks

Edited December 6, 2012 by sirchet

[Wench]

High triangle counts on the characters shouldn't be that much of a problem. Normally games need to split the rendering budget, for example, between characters, clutter, decals and the environment. With the environments being prerendered in PE it will free up a lot of resources for other things, such as high quality character models.

[DungeonKeeps]

Not bad, not bad at all. Keep up the good work!

[Theobeau]

I especially liked the cameos from the character artists: the hard core Russian and his Chinese indentured servant.

 

Hopefully we'll get more of the Dimitri and James show next time!

[Wilhelm3891]

I really like what i'm seeing here. The house model looks really great and the character model is just fantastic. Keep up the good work !

Edited December 6, 2012 by Wilhelm3891

[J.E. Sawyer]

As a side note: I understand that flail is probably oversized for anim testing purposes. Still, oversized blunt weapons are a pet peeve of mine - so I wanted to share an observation. I absolutely hate the ways flails, maces, etc are typically done in games. The ends of these weapons should be small but they usually end up the size of a melon. I remember for NWN1, I actually made replacement mace heads because the stock ones bothered me so much. Anywho, I just hope weapons (especially blunt ones) are not dramatically oversized just so players can see the details from a panned out perspective.

We actually had a meeting about this yesterday. PE's weapons will be close to historical weapons in proportions with slight exaggeration to help distinguish them. E.g. a "proper" cut and thrust sword blade will be toward the thicker side to distinguish it from a rapier. War hammers will be similar to historical war hammers though their heads might be enlarged just a bit to help you see what the heck they are. We will not have melon-sized mace heads.

[alanschu]

Just to put in my "vote," I have always considered it to be some level of abstraction, so "oversized" weapons never bothered me (and the farther you go from close up perspectives of games like Dragon Age and the like the less important scaling becomes IMO).

 

As such, I'm glad that you're not strictly adhering to realism.

[entrerix]

great update, tons of information, very excited!

[rjshae]

We actually had a meeting about this yesterday. PE's weapons will be close to historical weapons in proportions with slight exaggeration to help distinguish them. E.g. a "proper" cut and thrust sword blade will be toward the thicker side to distinguish it from a rapier. War hammers will be similar to historical war hammers though their heads might be enlarged just a bit to help you see what the heck they are. We will not have melon-sized mace heads.

Thank you for that update. Just out of curiosity, and assuming that there will be giant-sized creatures, if we take the mace from, say, a Storm Giant, will it scale down to the party proportions when we equip it? (Say, a two-handed mace-like weapon.) Or will it simply be unusable?

[Ieo]

We actually had a meeting about this yesterday. PE's weapons will be close to historical weapons in proportions with slight exaggeration to help distinguish them. E.g. a "proper" cut and thrust sword blade will be toward the thicker side to distinguish it from a rapier. War hammers will be similar to historical war hammers though their heads might be enlarged just a bit to help you see what the heck they are. We will not have melon-sized mace heads.

Thank you for that update. Just out of curiosity, and assuming that there will be giant-sized creatures, if we take the mace from, say, a Storm Giant, will it scale down to the party proportions when we equip it? (Say, a two-handed mace-like weapon.) Or will it simply be unusable?

 

I wonder if that racial size difference could be more easily implemented as hammer of giant-uses-2H-as-1H --> we use giant hammer as 2H. (Edit: Which I guess is what you suggested in the parenthetical, ha. When you said "scale down," just assumed 1H -> 1H.)

 

I believe I saw somewhere that armor from different sized races would auto-magically fit our characters, though.

Edited December 6, 2012 by Ieo

[Damkyan]

Seems to be as good as I'd like game to be ! ^^

[sirchet]

Awwwww, but I really wanted a melon headed mace OF DEATH!

[norolim]

Great update. Thanks. I like the idea of detailed character models.

[Kurumi Morishita]

Yeah.. looks really good even though it's just wip.. and I'm especially very happy to see flails in P:E *^__^* - hope you can dual wield them?

[Hormalakh]

As a side note: I understand that flail is probably oversized for anim testing purposes. Still, oversized blunt weapons are a pet peeve of mine - so I wanted to share an observation. I absolutely hate the ways flails, maces, etc are typically done in games. The ends of these weapons should be small but they usually end up the size of a melon. I remember for NWN1, I actually made replacement mace heads because the stock ones bothered me so much. Anywho, I just hope weapons (especially blunt ones) are not dramatically oversized just so players can see the details from a panned out perspective.

We actually had a meeting about this yesterday. PE's weapons will be close to historical weapons in proportions with slight exaggeration to help distinguish them. E.g. a "proper" cut and thrust sword blade will be toward the thicker side to distinguish it from a rapier. War hammers will be similar to historical war hammers though their heads might be enlarged just a bit to help you see what the heck they are. We will not have melon-sized mace heads.

YAY FOR HISTORICAL FICTION WOOOOOOO :aiee: Seriously, I keep loving the thoughts that come out of your mind. It's freaking crazy.

[Falkon Swiftblade]

So I'm curious if everything is going the route of historical accuracy, how are you guys planning on showcasing magic? Will magic missile shoot straight like an arrow, or shoot like a heat seeking missile? Any plans on meteor type of spells that drop a nuclear whammy? Maybe another way of asking my question is will magic be more fire based or are ya going the route of fantasy colors and particles? Although, I guess I remember reading this will be more of a low level game ala BG 1 right? I hope you guys have cool magic and fx.

Edited December 6, 2012 by Falkon Swiftblade

[StrangeCat]

Hey thanks for the update even if it is completely and totally unimpresive. I like to see where your are direction is going for the world and creatures.

Cool to see the very basics but really there is no need.

It's like me posting a mix with out any of the FX on it.