Dungeon Siege 3 is not a real Dungeon Siege game...

[Lucasla]

Sorry if I seem rude, but my goal is not to speak ill of the company, just to defend a series I always liked, and I hope someone agrees with me. And sorry for bad english at times in my text as well.

 

Obsidian, in trying to make a game more extensive to also include players from the consoles in Dungeon Siege series, made ​​a poor game and (worst) damaged PC gamers, launching the worst version of the game to this plataform. It is a great lack of respect with the fans of the series, mainly 'cause the game was born on the PC, and the entire base of fans of the series are on the PC, and it should be the main platform of the game.

 

It can be seen easily that all the simplifications that have occurred in the game are given by the fact that they decided to launch the game on the consoles - probably in an attempt to make more money.

There are games that are simply not possible to do on consoles. Strategy games for example, do not work well. RPG games like Dungeon Siege, where you have to control a certain amount of units, each with their inventory, items, settings, magic, etc, either. But why? Because consoles has no keyboard or mouse...

 

So what Obsidian decided to do? It's simple, we will reshape the game! Let's remove the possibility to form and control teams (the biggest crime) - and bye to the mule too - let's change the way the character and camera are controlled, we decrease the amount and complexity of the loot in the game, we completely remove the possibility of making a new character, even the name cannot be changed, let's do characters who have little variety of skills, in fact, we reformulate the whole scheme of skills to the powers become less complex to organize in the joysticks of the consoles, we will make it extremely linear and we still will do a history full of uninteresting characters. Blood and mana potions? Forget, too many buttons... You also dont evolve your habilities as you use wome weapon or magic (another big crime)...

 

Soundtrack? Where is the exciting theme song that plays at the beginning of Dungeon Siege 1 and 2? The game has no exciting song. Graphics? They are beautiful, but the scenarios are a bit generic...

 

So they basically changed all the series had, and made a completely different game, but they put the title Dungeon Siege 3, although the game is more closer to the game Lara Croft and the Guardian of Light that some game of the Dungeon Siege series. Except that Lara Croft is a great game and Dungeon Siege 3 is not. In fact, it seems that tried to do a Lara Croft more focused on RPG but in the end did not work.

 

So they made the game focused in the public of the consoles, with their limitations of controls, and then when the game was being converted to PC they made ​​another mess. Rather than adapt the controls and facilitate the movement of the character, not ... movement was very bad. How could complicate something as simple as walking and control the camera in a hack-and-slash RPG? We have to rotate the camera all the time, moving the character with the mouse is bad and with the directional (WASD) is just terrible. And yet, instead of just having to click in a item on the ground for the character to go and pick it up, no, we have to walk to the item and press a button on the keyboard to get him to take the item, something extremely uncomfortable.

 

Dungeon Siege 3 is a total disappointment. I leave here my dissatisfaction with what the company did with the series. I hoped that Dungeon Siege 3 was a good competitor for Diablo 3, but it have no chance, unfortunately. You changed the game soo much that it cannot be called of Dungeon Siege. Please, if you will do another sequel, go back to the style of previous games - or give it back to Gas Powered Games. It can have innovation, but can not be a different game. And focus on the PC, 'cause this game should never have left for the consoles as the main plataform.

 

in short: You simply removed much of the game that formed his identity, just removed - without justification for PC gamers - , and changed the format of the fighting and added bad controls.

 

oh yeah, and where the game could be saved, which is the co-op multiplayer, get disappointed again because the characters are just temporary for that match.

Edited June 22, 2011 by Lucasla

[glenn3e]

If I had a dollar for every thread poster who thinks they're special that they require themselves to post a new thread about a overly debated topic rather than one of the existing threads I'd be 3948934893 dollars richer.

[Matt-C]

If I had a dollar for every thread poster who thinks they're special that they require themselves to post a new thread about a overly debated topic rather than one of the existing threads I'd be 3948934893 dollars richer.

You're not very good at math are you?

[MonkeyLungs]

The OP took his time to write out a response based on his opinions of the game. His post is infinitely more valuable than yours.

[GreasyDogMeat]

snip

I didn't play Dungeon Siege 'back in the day', but I've been playing the first game and its expansion to prepare for this game's release.

-Game coming out on consoles: How have you not gotten used to it yet? EVERY developer under the sun has gone to multi-platform release. Every franchise except RTS games have gone this route. 'Dumbing down' isn't always a bad thing.

-Simplifications: Lots of things have been simplified, I'll give you that. THE MOST IMPORTANT aspect of one of these types of action RPGs has been ENHANCED though! The COMBAT! It was mindless repetition in the first game. Hell, you could set the party to 'engage', click near a group of enemies take your hand off the keyboard and watch them destroy the enemies. Try that in Dungeon Siege 3. This has been one of my biggest peeves about these action RPGs, from Diablo to Titan Quest, mindless click fests with a health potion thrown in from time to time. This game FIXES that problem!

-Generic Scenario: I haven't played Dungeon Siege 2 yet, but what was so outstanding about the first game? Its as generic as it gets and the story is near non-existent. The outstanding aspect of the old Dungeon Sieges was the seamless environments that let you go from a forest to a swamp with no loading.

 

I guess I have my biases, this genre isn't my favorite style of RPG. That is part of the reason I'm enjoying it so far. Dialogue, an interesting story and a combat system that doesn't boil down to clicking the mouse a billion times on an enemy.

[Wombat]

Yea, the story is pretty old and I don't believe someone could add to the circulated posting anymore.

 

Actually, Obsidian is not Blizzard. Their size is between an AAA company and an indie. Also, considering their resources, I don't think they are able to make an online-heavy game and various character models on modern character graphics. In fact, they don't seem to afford the character models for NPCs in DSIII. So, rather than trying to do what they cannot do, they did what they could do.

 

Also, some older members of Obsidian is from Black Isle Studios, a division of Interplay, which ended up like that mostly because they failed to adapt themselves to the industry shift from PC to consoles. Actually, quite many Diablo clones, too, ended up with more or less similar fate, which is why we don't see many of them anymore. If Blizzard is not able to make Diablo III as a hit, I cannot think of any other company which can make it. In fact, even Gas Powered Games doesn't seem to have been asked to make DSIII from any publisher, which comes to the commercial aspect.

 

Commercially, DSIII appears to be born as an attempt for Square Enix to get into north American market while offering something "new" to Japanese console players. This is probably why Obsidian was chosen since they are known for story-focused games, to which Japanese players are accustomed. Then again, I have no idea about if this game will find its place in Japan, where the market is quite complex.

 

So, my question would be, what could Obsidian do considering these circumstances? I, myself, cannot find even a possible answer to the question.

[Tigranes]

Whatever you feel about the game guys, stick to discussing it. This forum is here so we can all share our opinions and discuss, but it is not here so you can force your opinions down other people's throats or call each other monkeys.

[Lucasla]

snip

I didn't play Dungeon Siege 'back in the day', but I've been playing the first game and its expansion to prepare for this game's release.

-Game coming out on consoles: How have you not gotten used to it yet? EVERY developer under the sun has gone to multi-platform release. Every franchise except RTS games have gone this route. 'Dumbing down' isn't always a bad thing.

-Simplifications: Lots of things have been simplified, I'll give you that. THE MOST IMPORTANT aspect of one of these types of action RPGs has been ENHANCED though! The COMBAT! It was mindless repetition in the first game. Hell, you could set the party to 'engage', click near a group of enemies take your hand off the keyboard and watch them destroy the enemies. Try that in Dungeon Siege 3. This has been one of my biggest peeves about these action RPGs, from Diablo to Titan Quest, mindless click fests with a health potion thrown in from time to time. This game FIXES that problem!

-Generic Scenario: I haven't played Dungeon Siege 2 yet, but what was so outstanding about the first game? Its as generic as it gets and the story is near non-existent. The outstanding aspect of the old Dungeon Sieges was the seamless environments that let you go from a forest to a swamp with no loading.

 

I guess I have my biases, this genre isn't my favorite style of RPG. That is part of the reason I'm enjoying it so far. Dialogue, an interesting story and a combat system that doesn't boil down to clicking the mouse a billion times on an enemy.

 

I dont care the game is going to other plataforms, since it has quality. But lets face that the game style of Dungeon Siege is not good to be played in joysticks... control several units in joysticks is not a good thing.

I like dungeon siege not just because of the combat. I like to form my team of diverse heroes, control each one, evolve each one, find loot to each one of them, etc.... this is not possible in the SEQUEL of Dungeon Siege.

And the combat is not soo good too, its relative. Somethings are good, others not.

I think the scenario of the others dungeon siege were good to the time they were lauched. More impressive then the scenarios of this game are for now.

Of course, for limitations of the time in what the past games were launched, the games have problems, but at this time, a Dungeon Siege 3 game should be epic... Take all the things that the other DS games have and make better, and not just forget everything and make a game completely different that should have another name.

Well, its what I think.

 

and sorry for having created another topic of unsatisfaction with the game. I was in such a hurry to write that neither saw the other topics. But apparently most of the people is really complaining about the game. Well, that means something...

Edited June 22, 2011 by Lucasla

[greylord]

Actually, quite many Diablo clones, too, ended up with more or less similar fate, which is why we don't see many of them anymore. If Blizzard is not able to make Diablo III as a hit, I cannot think of any other company which can make it. In fact, even Gas Powered Games doesn't seem to have been asked to make DSIII from any publisher, which comes to the commercial aspect.

 

I have high hopes for Runic.

[Flouride]

Actually, quite many Diablo clones, too, ended up with more or less similar fate, which is why we don't see many of them anymore. If Blizzard is not able to make Diablo III as a hit, I cannot think of any other company which can make it. In fact, even Gas Powered Games doesn't seem to have been asked to make DSIII from any publisher, which comes to the commercial aspect.

 

I have high hopes for Runic.

 

I found Torchlight pretty damn boring after few hours. But then again normal h&s games aren't for me...

[sorophx]

DeathSpank was better than Torchlight

[Unreal Warfare]

I got this from another post but it's relevant here.

 

Is Fallout 3 a proper Fallout game?

 

Is Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel a proper Fallout game?

 

Define a proper game within a franchise.

 

Games evolve and change, different developers have different visions.

 

Stop living in the past.

[Sannom]

Is Fallout 3 a proper Fallout game?

 

Is Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel a proper Fallout game?

The first one has its fans. The second one is universally loathed.

[Bendu]

Define a proper game within a franchise.

A game, which is true to the lore.

[sorophx]

Fallout 3 wasn't a proper Fallout game. but that's because Fallout 1 and 2 were out of this world, and following up on those two was a pretty tough task. DS 1 and 2, on the other hand, were really light on the lore, so making a "proper" game in that universe was easy

[athlondude]

Sorry if I seem rude, but my goal is not to speak ill of the company, just to defend a series I always liked, and I hope someone agrees with me. And sorry for bad english at times in my text as well.

 

Obsidian, in trying to make a game more extensive to also include players from the consoles in Dungeon Siege series, made ​​a poor game and (worst) damaged PC gamers, launching the worst version of the game to this plataform. It is a great lack of respect with the fans of the series, mainly 'cause the game was born on the PC, and the entire base of fans of the series are on the PC, and it should be the main platform of the game.

 

It can be seen easily that all the simplifications that have occurred in the game are given by the fact that they decided to launch the game on the consoles - probably in an attempt to make more money.

There are games that are simply not possible to do on consoles. Strategy games for example, do not work well. RPG games like Dungeon Siege, where you have to control a certain amount of units, each with their inventory, items, settings, magic, etc, either. But why? Because consoles has no keyboard or mouse...

 

So what Obsidian decided to do? It's simple, we will reshape the game! Let's remove the possibility to form and control teams (the biggest crime) - and bye to the mule too - let's change the way the character and camera are controlled, we decrease the amount and complexity of the loot in the game, we completely remove the possibility of making a new character, even the name cannot be changed, let's do characters who have little variety of skills, in fact, we reformulate the whole scheme of skills to the powers become less complex to organize in the joysticks of the consoles, we will make it extremely linear and we still will do a history full of uninteresting characters. Blood and mana potions? Forget, too many buttons... You also dont evolve your habilities as you use wome weapon or magic (another big crime)...

 

Soundtrack? Where is the exciting theme song that plays at the beginning of Dungeon Siege 1 and 2? The game has no exciting song. Graphics? They are beautiful, but the scenarios are a bit generic...

 

So they basically changed all the series had, and made a completely different game, but they put the title Dungeon Siege 3, although the game is more closer to the game Lara Croft and the Guardian of Light that some game of the Dungeon Siege series. Except that Lara Croft is a great game and Dungeon Siege 3 is not. In fact, it seems that tried to do a Lara Croft more focused on RPG but in the end did not work.

 

So they made the game focused in the public of the consoles, with their limitations of controls, and then when the game was being converted to PC they made ​​another mess. Rather than adapt the controls and facilitate the movement of the character, not ... movement was very bad. How could complicate something as simple as walking and control the camera in a hack-and-slash RPG? We have to rotate the camera all the time, moving the character with the mouse is bad and with the directional (WASD) is just terrible. And yet, instead of just having to click in a item on the ground for the character to go and pick it up, no, we have to walk to the item and press a button on the keyboard to get him to take the item, something extremely uncomfortable.

 

Dungeon Siege 3 is a total disappointment. I leave here my dissatisfaction with what the company did with the series. I hoped that Dungeon Siege 3 was a good competitor for Diablo 3, but it have no chance, unfortunately. You changed the game soo much that it cannot be called of Dungeon Siege. Please, if you will do another sequel, go back to the style of previous games - or give it back to Gas Powered Games. It can have innovation, but can not be a different game. And focus on the PC, 'cause this game should never have left for the consoles as the main plataform.

 

in short: You simply removed much of the game that formed his identity, just removed - without justification for PC gamers - , and changed the format of the fighting and added bad controls.

 

oh yeah, and where the game could be saved, which is the co-op multiplayer, get disappointed again because the characters are just temporary for that match.

 

Amen brother! Unfortunately I posted a thread very similar to this and apparently most of the foks here like the water down lame ass chocolate covered crap that is dungeon siege 3.

[Vilhelm]

Amen brother! Unfortunately I posted a thread very similar to this and apparently most of the foks here like the water down lame ass chocolate covered crap that is dungeon siege 3.

 

I'm sorry if you feel that way, but the truth is people don't necessarily share the same opinion.

[toastification]

Amen brother! Unfortunately I posted a thread very similar to this and apparently most of the foks here like the water down lame ass chocolate covered crap that is dungeon siege 3.

You should get a job at the U.N. as the universal arbitrator of quality.

[Bakercompany86]

I guess i'm one of those "console guys" with a whole boatload of I Disagree here.

 

While I never played previous Dungeon Siege games which is perhaps my biggest offense, I was a long time PC gamer and hardcore Diablo/D2 player for a much longer period than i've been a console guy.

 

I love Dungeon Siege 3. With the exception of the issues I posted in my other thread, I think this game is marvelous.

 

I have no complaints about gameplay, graphics, sound, story, or anything else. This game is gorgeous, has absolutely zero bugs that i've seen, and is a blast to play.

 

I'm sorry that the PC version isn't what you expected. If you got exactly what i'm playing on the Xbox except better looking (usually the case) then its really hard for me to see the angle of which your complaints originated.

 

However re-reading the OP's statements, I see a bunch of PC elitest crap that i'm very much sick of seeing on every single message board I join.

[Jubileet]

All they did was by out the Dungeon Siege name and create a game of their own. They used the name & story and created a completely different game. Its like McDonalds buying a Gym, its advertised as Micky D's but then when you go inside to eat all you get is fat chicks on treadmills... disappointing. Nothing about this game is Dungeon Siege - like, oh well.

 

The only good thing about this game is that it got me into an original DS1 and DS2 mode, go back and play those games with the Hotfix mod (for DS2 anyway) and run it in 1920x1080 and you will love it all over again more than DS3!

[toastification]

The only good thing about this game is that it got me into an original DS1 and DS2 mode, go back and play those games with the Hotfix mod (for DS2 anyway) and run it in 1920x1080 and you will love it all over again more than DS3!

DS2 is the only game in my memory that I quit half-way through simply because I got bored to tears. And I played tons and tons of Diablo/Titan Quest/etc.

 

Something about this situation is suspicious.

[Jubileet]

The only good thing about this game is that it got me into an original DS1 and DS2 mode, go back and play those games with the Hotfix mod (for DS2 anyway) and run it in 1920x1080 and you will love it all over again more than DS3!

DS2 is the only game in my memory that I quit half-way through simply because I got bored to tears. And I played tons and tons of Diablo/Titan Quest/etc.

 

Something about this situation is suspicious.

 

Well, I don't think I ever beat it, actually I probably quit halfway through too. But, with higher reso + patch, its a little better. You can respec / change game speed / new graphics spells, etc you get the idea. Fun if you have friends you can LAN it with.

[sorophx]

I'd rather LAN in Diablo 2 for the millionth time than play DS2, that game was utter crap

[athlondude]

I'd rather LAN in Diablo 2 for the millionth time than play DS2, that game was utter crap

 

Couldnt disagree more, DS2 was a great game, I loved it. The only thing better than DS2 was DS1.

[sorophx]

let me guess, DS1 is the greatest game ever, right?