KOTOR III MMO Confirmed?

[Xard]

And after WoW MMORPG has been the "magic word" of the industry

[Tale]

MMO has been a magic word since before WoW. Blizzard was practically bandwagon jumping when they did it.

 

But they did reaffirm for some that THAR BE GOLD IN THEM THAR HILLS!

Edited October 30, 2007 by Tale

[Tale]

This is pretty much confirmation that Bioware wasn't working on KotOR. Not as an MMO, nor as KotOR III.

 

http://kotaku.com/gaming/top/lucasarts-and...m-up-316698.php

 

Basically, the act of announcing the team up is confirmation that they weren't teamed up already. NOW, they might start working on KotOR III.

Edited October 30, 2007 by Tale

[Meshugger]

...Bleh, it will be a KotOR III: The MMORPG after all. Brought to you by the talents of EA.

Edited October 30, 2007 by Meshugger

[Xard]

And yet we see of what worth Bio's word is - "we shall stick with our own IP'S now"

[Guest The Architect]

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, ****ING wait...

 

Please don't tell me my worst nightmares have come true.

 

http://www.lucasartsbioware.com/

 

To me this sounds like incredibly bad and depressing news, because it clearly suggests to me that Obsidian will not get to do KotOR III and that Avellone therefore will not be allowed to finish what he started in TSL, since a LA/Bioware collaboration is likely to mean an MMORPG and so an end to the focused single player experiences of the KotOR games... in which case it also likely means that KotOR is dead to me.

 

****!

 

LA's track record thus far suggests they kill good plot for good sales any day of the week...

 

GOD DAMN IT!

 

I can only hope that BioWare stays the **** away from the KotOR franchise. Let Obsidian do it damn it! Maybe not all is doom and gloom, but I can't help but think that's the way it is.

Edited October 31, 2007 by The Architect

[SilentScope001]

As much as I hate an MMO, other people love it a lot. And, if it does break WoW's back, then why not?

 

Assuming that it will keep the same gameplay as WoW and other MMOs, there is also something you must realize: much MMO content is in fact intended for SP or for a small party (hm... ). It's just that since each player designs his/her avatar in a different way that will make the content pretty generic, and since the dungeons can be repeated by OTHER players...it will lead to a bad storyline.

 

Now, what if Bioware decides to just do GM events? Basically, have lots of Dungeon Masters on each server running the storyline as if all the players are on one team? This will be seen as very unique, but been done lots of times in MUDs, and I think it was done in The Matrix Online as well. Even then, the storyline will STILL be terrible, but not as much, and if Bioware tries for such innovation, well, good for them.

 

The MAIN sticking point is the True Sith. Will it be used as a generic E that the players will butcher endlessly? Then, bah. Can the True Sith be destroyed? Or will the True Sith be basically immortal, used as an excuse to throw more and more powerful military units to the slaughterhouses run by the Players, so that the Players can execute them? What if we actually see a True Sith? Will we laugh at their apperance, and cry at how they are ruined?

 

You have to realize, MMOs last forever. You can't WIN. If you could win an MMO, if you can reach a screen stating, "Congrats, you beat the True Sith. Restart at level 1?" ...well, you know what? Bioware win. Bioware would be the most awesomest game designer ever. There WOULD be an ending, the game would be over, and you would have finally saved the galaxy. You can then restart and access even more hidden content, see even more Star Wars stuff, and maybe play the secret DS endings. But, I doubt that many people would go for that, especially because once you beat the game once, what incentive there is to press "Yes" instead of pressing "No", and leaving the Game forever. At the very least, it would combine the best of MMOs...with the best of SP.

 

I would rather to see your plotline/idea for K3 finished, TA. Since it is unlikely Obisidan will get K3, if you complete your plotline and then accept it as canon, then so be it. But it must be noted that it does not really matter what happened in KOTOR MMO...in the end, the True Sith will lose. The Republic will fall. All humans will bite the dust and die.

Edited October 31, 2007 by SilentScope001

[Guest The Architect]

As much as I hate an MMO, other people love it a lot. And, if it does break WoW's back, then why not?

 

Assuming that it will keep the same gameplay as WoW and other MMOs, there is also something you must realize: much MMO content is in fact intended for SP or for a small party (hm... ). It's just that since each player designs his/her avatar in a different way that will make the content pretty generic, and since the dungeons can be repeated by OTHER players...it will lead to a bad storyline.

 

You just answered your own question. Plus, MMORPG's are crap. I mean, just running around killing other people on the Internet is lame. Among whatever other things you do. And wouldn't you have to pay monthly or something to play? Isn't that what you have to do to play WoW? I mean come on, what a load of crap. What the hell was LA thinking?

 

Now, what if Bioware decides to just do GM events? Basically, have lots of Dungeon Masters on each server running the storyline as if all the players are on one team? This will be seen as very unique, but been done lots of times in MUDs, and I think it was done in The Matrix Online as well. Even then, the storyline will STILL be terrible, but not as much, and if Bioware tries for such innovation, well, good for them.

 

The MAIN sticking point is the True Sith. Will it be used as a generic E that the players will butcher endlessly? Then, bah. Can the True Sith be destroyed? Or will the True Sith be basically immortal, used as an excuse to throw more and more powerful military units to the slaughterhouses run by the Players, so that the Players can execute them? What if we actually see a True Sith? Will we laugh at their apperance, and cry at how they are ruined?

 

You have to realize, MMOs last forever. You can't WIN. If you could win an MMO, if you can reach a screen stating, "Congrats, you beat the True Sith. Restart at level 1?" ...well, you know what? Bioware win. Bioware would be the most awesomest game designer ever. There WOULD be an ending, the game would be over, and you would have finally saved the galaxy. You can then restart and access even more hidden content, see even more Star Wars stuff, and maybe play the secret DS endings. But, I doubt that many people would go for that, especially because once you beat the game once, what incentive there is to press "Yes" instead of pressing "No", and leaving the Game forever. At the very least, it would combine the best of MMOs...with the best of SP.

 

Put it this way, whatever they come up with, it will be crap. Or, it won't be nearly as good as what Avellone and Obsidian could come up with in a SPCRPG KotOR III game. Either way, I'm not going to play a MMORPG, even if you don't have to pay to play it, which won't be the case. I'm not going to support this ****.

 

Then again, maybe they won't even do anything KotOR associated {which I hope is the case}. Nevertheless, this sucks because it either kills the dream of Obsidian making KotOR III or pushes it back even more. It's not that I'm an annoying and impatient fanboy or anything. It's just that Obs K3> BioWare KotOR MMORPG any day. In other words, the former should come first, and the latter... well, should never be made.

 

I would rather to see your plotline/idea for K3 finished, TA. Since it is unlikely Obisidan will get K3, if you complete your plotline and then accept it as canon, then so be it. But it must be noted that it does not really matter what happened in KOTOR MMO...in the end, the True Sith will lose. The Republic will fall. All humans will bite the dust and die.

 

I wouldn't accept my K3 plot as canon simply because it wouldn't be. Besides, I've decided not to continue on with it anyway. I always end up not liking it or finding something wrong with it then ditching it, or, just not finding the motivation to go on with it, so yeah.

[SilentScope001]

You just answered your own question.

 

Not really. MMORPGs has other allures. I'm not going to talk about the benefits of a community, you know how hogwash that is. But I do talk about the treadmill (100% possiblity of success if you put your nose to the grindstone), the ability to grow much more powerful (and being able to show that power to other people), the possibility of matching skills against other players, and, of course, the whole "I'm affecting the mythos of Star Wars!" belief. And bashing other players online? Heh, I see that as the only legit reason to play MMORPGs.

 

It's the battle between Obisidan's TSL and Bioware's K1. What game you prefer tells more about you, the player, than it does about the merits of the actual game itself. I'm a fan of TSL, but the fans of K1 are fans all the same.

 

I was playing Devil's Advocate really. Besides, regardless of what they would do, I wouldn't play it. But just because KOTOR is dead to me doesn't mean that what LA did was bad, per se. It's just different, not my taste.

 

As for the possibility of K3 coming before an MMO or that K3 will be released soon...I'm going to reject that. The True Sith is the ultimate weapon, and if K3 ends the trilogy by destroying the True Sith race for the MMO...then what? You need to make a new villain to replace the earlier villian of the True Sith. You got a plot hook right here, don't just throw it away in a SP game. Well, you could try a SP game, but you can't have the True Sith be destroyed fully.

Edited October 31, 2007 by SilentScope001

[Rycal]

WoW ruined Warcraft Mythos. Kotor MMO would do same thing to SW (although EU has already done severe damage to it)

 

I fail to see how WoW ruined the Warcraft 'mythos'. Quite the contrary, the story developed even more.

 

Okay. So the Draenei were a horrible thing. I'd prefer Blood/High elves playable for alliance and Goblins for Horde -.o but ok

 

Edit: Totally agree with The Architect in his previous post.

Edited October 31, 2007 by Rycal

[Dark Wastl]

Actually, if you follow this link: http://www.bioware.com/games/

 

You will see that there is a MMO and a "new next gen game" listed. Now, such a list doesn't prove much, and it can be twisted in pretty much every direction, but the most obvious conclusion would be that the LucasArts game is not a MMO.

 

Unless they are developing two at the same time, both games are actually the same or the LucasArts game is the MMO and they have another next gen game.

[Xard]

Dude, they've been there for what, 2 years for now?

[Guest The Architect]

Actually, if you follow this link: http://www.bioware.com/games/

 

You will see that there is a MMO and a "new next gen game" listed. Now, such a list doesn't prove much, and it can be twisted in pretty much every direction, but the most obvious conclusion would be that the LucasArts game is not a MMO.

 

Unless they are developing two at the same time, both games are actually the same or the LucasArts game is the MMO and they have another next gen game.

 

I see...

 

Yeah, having seen that, this changes... much. You'd have to think that the "new next gen game" is the LucasArts one and it's not an MMORPG simply because BioWare wouldn't develop two at the same time, would they? And having heard that BioWare said back in the day they weren't going to make any more KotOR's, and given that LA has produced some non-Star Wars games, maybe BioWare's "next gen LA game" will be something completely new and different, or it will be a Star Wars game, but not KotOR related.

 

Either way, I hope BioWare isn't doing KotOR III, single-player RPG or not.

[DAWUSS]

One thing I would like about a KOTOR MMORPG is the chance to be a minor impact character in the storyline, and not some all-important hero who gets to decide the fate of the galaxy, like Revan, the Exile, Anakin, Luke, and others.

 

 

Another thing that would be necessary in a KOTOR III MMORPG is storyline and time advancement. The only time Star Wars: Galaxies had such was the Battle of Restuss (face it, KOTOR III the MMO will be constantly compared to Galaxies, just because they share two themes, "Star Wars" and "MMORPG"). Also, there should be nonrepeatable quests (sorry, only one person should successfully destroy that Trandoshan thug harassing the cantina patrons) and a bit of interdependency even in the need for storyline advancement.

 

 

 

 

.... and don't get me started on OOC names

[Tale]

With SWG I was able to incite the hatred of player Jedi. I take full credit for it, even if it seems unreasonable and I have no evidence to back up my claim.

 

I'm not sure how I would repeat that performance in a KotOR MMO...

[Kalfear]

As much as I hate an MMO, other people love it a lot. And, if it does break WoW's back, then why not?

 

Assuming that it will keep the same gameplay as WoW and other MMOs, there is also something you must realize: much MMO content is in fact intended for SP or for a small party (hm... ). It's just that since each player designs his/her avatar in a different way that will make the content pretty generic, and since the dungeons can be repeated by OTHER players...it will lead to a bad storyline.

 

Now, what if Bioware decides to just do GM events? Basically, have lots of Dungeon Masters on each server running the storyline as if all the players are on one team? This will be seen as very unique, but been done lots of times in MUDs, and I think it was done in The Matrix Online as well. Even then, the storyline will STILL be terrible, but not as much, and if Bioware tries for such innovation, well, good for them.

 

The MAIN sticking point is the True Sith. Will it be used as a generic E that the players will butcher endlessly? Then, bah. Can the True Sith be destroyed? Or will the True Sith be basically immortal, used as an excuse to throw more and more powerful military units to the slaughterhouses run by the Players, so that the Players can execute them? What if we actually see a True Sith? Will we laugh at their apperance, and cry at how they are ruined?

 

You have to realize, MMOs last forever. You can't WIN. If you could win an MMO, if you can reach a screen stating, "Congrats, you beat the True Sith. Restart at level 1?" ...well, you know what? Bioware win. Bioware would be the most awesomest game designer ever. There WOULD be an ending, the game would be over, and you would have finally saved the galaxy. You can then restart and access even more hidden content, see even more Star Wars stuff, and maybe play the secret DS endings. But, I doubt that many people would go for that, especially because once you beat the game once, what incentive there is to press "Yes" instead of pressing "No", and leaving the Game forever. At the very least, it would combine the best of MMOs...with the best of SP.

 

I would rather to see your plotline/idea for K3 finished, TA. Since it is unlikely Obisidan will get K3, if you complete your plotline and then accept it as canon, then so be it. But it must be noted that it does not really matter what happened in KOTOR MMO...in the end, the True Sith will lose. The Republic will fall. All humans will bite the dust and die.

 

Online GM events was done in NWN (original on AOL) and the Realms (seirra) MMORPGames. Its a great concept but because of size of MMORPGS now adays Its wouldnt have the same flare or effect.

 

Back then you could only get, upto 200 players online at one time, now adays you have 1000s and 1000s online at one time, there is no way a GM could run a event the same way of have the same effect in modern games.

 

A couple of guild mates (in old guild I founded then cancelled) got GM items from events in EQ2, sfter learning how they obtained them it was more like GM just picked them outta the blue then them doing anything special to get item (all you had to do was appear at said spot).

 

GM run events a nice idea but not truely feasible anymore because of numbers of players.

[Tale]

EVE Online does GM run events. Number of players becomes an issue in that game, sometimes, too.

[SilentScope001]

GM run events a nice idea but not truely feasible anymore because of numbers of players.

 

Bwah? You just have the 10 people who are able to show up to an important GM-run event become very important and heroic within the MMO. The whole allure of playing in an MMO is being famous within the game, so obivously, if you were lucky to head over to a GM-run event, then you deserve to become more famous and grand. The more people on the MMO server, the more likely that the few people that actually attended the events become seen as great and grand and mighty.

 

You don't need all of the playerbase to attend an event. Just a small devoted high-level minority. After all, in Star Wars, it is always the minority that has the most effect. To have a mighty Hero, you need the 'lesser beings' too, you know.

 

And before you argue about balance issues, I'm not calling for items to be handed out. I'm calling for plot-events that relate to the True Sith, mostly including them getting genocided. And I think the GM-run events, while a good idea, does little more than distract from the mains problems of MMOs, and probraly won't be done well.

Edited October 31, 2007 by SilentScope001

[Calax]

City of Heroes runs events every so often where the devs suit up in their personal character and go bezerk on the players.

[Brdavs]

Well this is just me going through the denial phases... but since Bioware went on and on about not touching another IP for a while I reckon it`s more plausible they`ll get cought with their hand in the cookie jar just one time with a K3 sp game as opposed to commiting to a LA IP SW MMO game for years on end...

 

Weak, I know, but leave me my dreams and KIII lifeline...

[Bass-GameMaster]

The only thing I would allow with online access is 1.Downloadable Content and for 2.CO-OP campaign, maybe like a GOW but not the MMORPG part, I dont thing KOTOR is that kind of game.

[Deadly_Nightshade]

As long as they bring the KOTOR story arc to some satisfying conclusion, I'll be happy.

 

Well, to say the least, I feel differently about the aforementioned game. A MMORPG version of Knights of the Old Republic (Kot0R) would lack almost everything that made the series enjoyable, and thus I would never buy into it while there is still a change that a good, single-player Kot0R III was under consideration. In fact, even if they never manufactured the third installment, I would still not buy the MMORPG - as it would quickly turn into an underage "n0ob" cesspit. Not only would it likely feature real-time combat, as opposed to the masterfully done turn-based system in Kot0R I and The Sith Lords (TSL), but it would also have to surrender, or mutilate, the plot to make it into an endless story-arc reminiscent of the horrendous World of Warcraft (WoW). I would never buy WoW, and I will probably never buy a MMORPG that requires a monthly fee - something that rules out everything except Guild Wars and, possibly, Hellgate London. BioWare spokesman Matt Atwood has already said "...what you're seeing on the net is purely that, rumor and speculation," so I am not sure that Bioware owns the rights to Kot0R, for I believe they sold the development of the franchise to Obsidian Entertainment.

[Volourn]

"Basically, the act of announcing the team up is confirmation that they weren't teamed up already."

 

Nah. Just because the official announcement came recently doesn't mean they weren't already teamed up.

 

 

 

"so I am not sure that Bioware owns the rights to Kot0R, for I believe they sold the development of the franchise to Obsidian Entertainment."

 

You believe wrong. BIO cna't sell the KOTOR rights to *anyone* as LA owns them. LA hired Obsidian to make KOTOR2 after BIO said no. BIO, on the other hand, does own the KOTOR series engine, and they licensed that to Obsidian/LA. LA cna pretty much do what they want with the KOTOR IP.

[Deadly_Nightshade]

Sorry, I meant the development rights. That is what transferred, correct?

[Volourn]

LA owns the KOTOR IP. Both publishing and developing rights. They could choose to develop KOTOR3 on their own if they so wish (they nearly did on their own; but canceled it awhile back).