Politics 2017 Act 6

[Gromnir]

Two groups in a room, and the "investigators" wont believe either side.

actually, it sounds like the correct starting point for an investigation.

 

 

no doubt one o' the reasons the trump campaign switched from ronald reagan to andrew jackson as the role model for trump is 'cause trump voters is suspicious o' russia.  cold war soviet distrust is not forgotten particular 'mongst the alt-right crowd.  possible first thing one thinks o' when invoking reagan is the cold war conflict. trump's russian entanglements is arguable where he is most vulnerable with his core voters.   

 

regardless, go into an investigation believing everybody is gonna lie to you sounds like the reasonable pov. doubting thomas got a bad rap. such skepticism might be antithetical to questions o' faith, but am knowing we don't want the folks investigating to make judgments based on such elusive and ephemeral stuff as faith.

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Meshugger]

Russians always lie. 

[Gfted1]

 

 

"I spoke to him (Lavrov) today," a smiling Putin told a news conference with Italian Prime Minister Paolo Gentiloni in the Russian Black Sea resort of Sochi.

"I'll be forced to issue him (Lavrov) with a reprimand because he did not share these secrets with us. Not with me, nor with representatives of Russia's intelligence services. It was very bad of him."

 

I love that he just dngaf.

[Gfted1]

 

Two groups in a room, and the "investigators" wont believe either side.

actually, it sounds like the correct starting point for an investigation.

 

no doubt one o' the reasons the trump campaign switched from ronald reagan to andrew jackson as the role model for trump is 'cause trump voters is suspicious o' russia.  cold war soviet distrust is not forgotten particular 'mongst the alt-right crowd.  possible first thing one thinks o' when invoking reagan is the cold war conflict. trump's russian entanglements is arguable where he is most vulnerable with his core voters.   

 

regardless, go into an investigation believing everybody is gonna lie to you sounds like the reasonable pov. doubting thomas got a bad rap. such skepticism might be antithetical to questions o' faith, but am knowing we don't want the folks investigating to make judgments based on such elusive and ephemeral stuff as faith.

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

I suppose.

 

But not having any evidence of their own, and not believing either side, is pretty much the equivalent of pissing into a fan. Splashes everywhere but just gets you wet.

[Gromnir]

lack o' clear and convincing evidence at this time is why there should be an investigation.  not need an investigation if everything were simple and obvious.

 

famous athlete is at scene of a murder.  only witnesses is the athlete, the deceased, and members o' the athlete's entourage.  chicago tribune prints a story which indicates at least one witness, who remains unidentified for personal safety concerns, has fingered the athlete as the killer. the deceased ain't talking.  the athlete provides a narrative o' his innocence, a narrative which ain't actual consistent with the other witnesses.  nevertheless, everybody at the scene public claims the athlete is innocent.

 

case closed? given admitted limited facts, would gifted start with belief in the athlete's story, or would he be suspicious?

 

yeah, the folks in the room during trump's meeting with the russians is not gonna be subject to a real investigation.  ain't gonna be interrogations o' the president and kislyak. is unlikely we ever get a statement o' facts which is beyond question.  even so, we want investigators to be suspicious.  am thinking gifted, faced with similar circumstances not related to trump would be suspicious.  who wouldn't be suspicious?

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

ps at the coast guard grad commencement today, trump observed "No politician in history has been treated worse or more unfairly" than himself.

 

...

 

funny stuff.

Edited May 17, 2017 by Gromnir

[Gfted1]

Who is the shadowy informant in a room of Trump, Lavrov and Kislyak?

[Gromnir]

Who is the shadowy informant in a room of Trump, Lavrov and Kislyak?

were more folks in the room. were considerable more folks who would have at least second hand knowledge o' what were said.

 

http://www.cnn.com/2017/05/16/politics/trump-russian-officials-meeting-what-we-know/

 

*shrug*

 

HA! Good Fun!

Edited May 17, 2017 by Gromnir

[Gfted1]

I see. I hate missing out on wildly speculative opinions so here's mine; Trump is secretly a conscientious "leaker" whos disclosing secret information to make the world a better place. You know, like Manning and Assange, he is doing yeoman's work.

[Gorgon]

jeez Grom, that was just an example. But I could (and have in the past) make an argument on who human medical care can and should work like Veterinary care where market forces and competition do help keep prices down. Particularly in routine care. Now, my pups get the best treatment I can find as I know yours do too. But that is a choice I make. I'd rather low cost/ low service places like Banfield exist to offer lower income families vet care than have the Government screw the whole thing up with program and price regulation that ruins the free market economics it does have. Without reduced cost clinics some family pets would, by necessity, get no vet care at all.

 

But as for drug prosecution I think education is great. I'm even in favor of using Federal money if it would help. But at the end of the day, teenager or adult, we are all solely responsible for the guy/gal in the mirror. I've never used any unprescribed drug stronger than Motrin or bourbon. And if it were legal today I still wouldn't use. But i would never presume to make that choice for someone else. If a teenager, against all better advice and teaching, wants to throw their life away on drugs, well it was their life to throw away. It always was.

 

The logic of the government makes no sense to me. To "save" said teenager from ruining their life with drugs we'll lock them up for 10-20 years and then send them back at age 30 with no education and a felony conviction. But hey... saved them from drugs.

 

They ought to make me the AG. No victim = No prison time.

 

 

Ok, so lets assume those two wait times (24h and 7y) represent extreme outliers in each direction. Can some of you guys from across the pond give me some more examples of typical wait times for various procedures?

Iirc my father had to wait two months to get his cataract surgery, my mother got her chemo for arthritis pretty quickly aswell.

 

Also

http://vantetider.se/Kontaktkort/Sveriges/SpecialiseradOperation/ Specialist surgery (Section "Hur länge har man väntat"=How long did they wait; Dagar=Days)

http://vantetider.se/Kontaktkort/Sveriges/SpecialiseradBesok/ Specialist treatment

 

The problem is that in the US there are too many people with their hands in the tin, people who have to find profit margins. Hospitals, insurance carriers, doctors, pharma companies. 

 

If you remove the profit incentive from hospitals and eliminate insurance carriers altogether there is just no way that the invisible hand of the market could manage anything like that effect.

 

It's very common everywhere to suggest that government is hopelessly ineffective compared to how things are run by private businesses, and I'm sure that's true, but that can't make up for having a parasite in the system, namely the insurance industry. Think of all the payments that just go to line their pockets and buy no healthcare for anyone. 

[Gromnir]

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/congress-shows-growing-concern-over-trump-controversies/ar-BBBemnV?li=AA5a8k&ocid=spartanntp

 

as an increasing number of republican Congressman question the wh handling of recent events, the big news of the day (so far) is the announcement comey has been invited to testify before the house oversight committee next wednesday.  public testimony.

 

http://thehill.com/policy/national-security/333870-chaffetz-to-invite-comey-to-testify

 

HA! Good Fun!

Edited May 17, 2017 by Gromnir

[Bartimaeus]

(for context, Comey said he would only testify if it were public)

[Agiel]

 

Two groups in a room, and the "investigators" wont believe either side.

 

 

no doubt one o' the reasons the trump campaign switched from ronald reagan to andrew jackson as the role model for trump is 'cause trump voters is suspicious o' russia.  cold war soviet distrust is not forgotten particular 'mongst the alt-right crowd.  possible first thing one thinks o' when invoking reagan is the cold war conflict. trump's russian entanglements is arguable where he is most vulnerable with his core voters.   

 

 

 

The thing to me was that Trump's economic plan while on the campaign trail seemed not too far removed from the Soviet-style command economy at its most corrosive and unsustainable: Rampant protectionism? Check. Make-work public works projects building bridges to nowhere (metaphorically and literally)? Check. Artificially propping up failed, inefficient, and obsolescent industries? Check, check, and check. As Richard Aboulafia noted: "Trump may be a Republican, but he may govern less like Ronald Reagan and more like Juan Perón."

Edited May 17, 2017 by Agiel

[Gfted1]

Whew, I'm relieved that we don't really have infrastructure problems.

[HoonDing]

[Sarex]

Russians always lie. 

 

Americans too.

[Meshugger]

 

Russians always lie. 

 

Americans too.

 

 

Stop lying.

[Pidesco]

Whew, I'm relieved that we don't really have infrastructure problems.

It's a good thing Trump agrees with that then, as he wants to spend money on an ineffectual wall instead of actually needed and useful infrastructure.

[Gfted1]

Two birds, one stone!

[ShadySands]

Please feel free to throw away some money on our totally not crumbling infrastructure here in Denver

[Zoraptor]

Who is the shadowy informant in a room of Trump, Lavrov and Kislyak?

 

And McMaster and a Russian photographer for some of the time, at least.

 

Putin trolls beautifully. Everything from releasing the meeting pictures to offering a transcript is designed to get knees jerking through desks. And the funny thing is whatever he may or may not have done to 'subvert democracy' (lol) the US itself is doing a far, far better job than he could ever have imagined.

[Gfted1]

Although I poke fun at posts and subjects I feel like I should set the record straight for any of the uninitiated:

 

1) Trump is a dumpster fire. You know whos a worse dumpster fire? Pence. Be careful what you wish for.

2) I dont care about a wall. Not because I think it would be ineffective, Israel proves otherwise, but because Im for open immigration. The more peeps we make legal, the more we all benefit as a group.

3) I had something else for here but now Ive forgotten.

 

EDIT: Oh yeah, now I remember. Spend, spend, spend on infrastructure! Start with the IL highways pls. 

[Leferd]

Former FBI Director Robert Mueller appointed special counsel by Deputy AG Rosenstein.

 

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/special-counsel-will-take-over-fbi-russia-campaign-interference-investigation-n761271

 

Can't come up with a better pick.

[Valsuelm]

Russians always lie. 

 

Tell me lies...

 

Tell me sweet little lies...

 

Natalia...

 

[Gromnir]

 

2) I dont care about a wall. Not because I think it would be ineffective, Israel proves otherwise, but because Im for open immigration. The more peeps we make legal, the more we all benefit as a group.

 

Former prime minister Ariel Sharon began constructing the barrier in June 2002, at the height of the Second Intifada, to prevent the infiltration of suicide bombers into Israel. So far, just over 62% of the planned 708-kilometer (440-mile) barrier has been completed, at an estimated cost of nearly NIS 11 billion ($3 billion) as of late 2013, according to Finance Ministry data published by Israeli NGO B’Tselem. The entire barrier has been extended very little since 2007.

completed less than 300 miles in more than 10 years, though there has been recent attempts to finish the wall, a wall which is mostly fencing. the us boarder with mexico is longer and geographic different with large obstructions such as rivers complicating construction. the whole reality o' the gulf o' mexico and pacific ocean bordering vast stretches o' mexico, areas where us coast guard can't patrol, also complicates things, no?

 

oh, btw, gaza were complete enclosed by wall before the most recent troubles.  remember the gaza kerfuffle, yes? recall how the isd operation in gaza were initiated in part to collapse the extensive tunnels which were making a mockery o' wall?

 

if the goal were to reduce suicide bombers coming 'cross the border from mexico...

 

*shrug*

 

as for the appointment o' mueller, one hopes senior wh aides will stress to trump how bad it would look for him to demand the special counsel's loyalty.

 

 

HA! Good Fun!

Edited May 17, 2017 by Gromnir

[Hurlshort]

Israel also has a slightly different relationship with Palestine than the US does with Mexico.