Purkake Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 Suspiciously like the elderly... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowtrain Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 Suspiciously like the elderly... That probably explains why I can't remember where I put my teeth. Notice how I can belittle your beliefs without calling you names. It's a useful skill to have particularly where you aren't allowed to call people names. It's a mistake to get too drawn in/worked up. I mean it's not life or death, it's just two guys posting their thoughts on a message board. If it were personal or face to face all the usual restraints would be in place, and we would never have reached this place in the first place. Try to remember that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raithe Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 That probably explains why I can't remember where I put my teeth. Eh,thats nothing. Start worrying when you forget where you put your enemies teeth.. "Cuius testiculos habeas, habeas cardia et cerebellum." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowtrain Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 That probably explains why I can't remember where I put my teeth. Eh,thats nothing. Start worrying when you forget where you put your enemies teeth.. Its dang hard to eat corn on the cob with someone else's teeth though, enemy or not. Notice how I can belittle your beliefs without calling you names. It's a useful skill to have particularly where you aren't allowed to call people names. It's a mistake to get too drawn in/worked up. I mean it's not life or death, it's just two guys posting their thoughts on a message board. If it were personal or face to face all the usual restraints would be in place, and we would never have reached this place in the first place. Try to remember that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sorophx Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 Point it's that on a stealth approach you handle fewer enemies. point is, I can take down everyone in the area and get 5x more xp, which is a serious problem imho Walsingham said: I was struggling to understand ths until I noticed you are from Finland. And having been educated solely by mkreku in this respect I am convinced that Finland essentially IS the wh40k universe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lexx Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 In DX3, if you don't kill anyone / don't get seen at all, you actually get the most xp. "only when you no-life you can exist forever, because what does not live cannot die." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hassat Hunter Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 Todays standards are usually a lot higher than they were 10 years ago. I was thinking quite the opposite. Withcer II is today's pinacle of RPG's. And it's not quite a DX/BG2/Vampire: Bloodlines/SS2 etc. Or is the standard of "good" graphics for you? (you didn't quite answer why DX is outdated). he said it was a very simplistic game HAH with no meaningful C&C whatsoever HAH. Sure, it's no AP/Witcher II though. after seeing the levels HAH. Seriously? What? The levelbuild is one of the best? and the enemies Again, what? I am still annoyed when people say DX or AP AI is bad, and cite a random FPS shooters AI as better. Without seemingly being able to understand that AP and DX AI is far more complex. Of course AI "looks" better if it's build without stealth in mind and always knows your exact position always, instead of being realistic and having to know you're there. *sigh* I am convinced, it's trash. Seriously, play it. You just sound like one of those whiny kids who come here saying AP is "horrible" and broken and filled with bugs and stupid and then admit they never played it but read it in a "review". what I can't comment on is this "multiple paths approach", I don't know what's that all about. a lot of shooters at the time had levels designed with detours and shortcuts, if that's what you mean No, no, they don't. Name me ONE other game in 1999/2000/2001 (to make it easier for you) who has a system like DX. SS2 doesn't count since it's older (and also, sadly, one of a kind). Yup, DX is often credited with an overabundance of C&C. For some reason. But it's really just the opposite. The story is pretty much on rails amd the choices that you do make through 95% of the game have extremely minor consequences. It's better than the railroad experiences shooters usually are these days, without any influence AT ALL. I seriously hope DX:HR does better in that regard... my friends thought System Shock 2 was a lot better. nobody liked DX, I'm quite surprised it's getting so much praise today Again, play it for yourself. Why are you bashing a game you even admit have no knowledge about. It shows you know... point is, I can take down everyone in the area and get 5x more xp, which is a serious problem imho The DX/TNM veterans over at Off Topic Productions agree with your assessement. That includes me . ^ I agree that that is such a stupid idiotic pathetic garbage hateful retarded scumbag evil satanic nazi like term ever created. At least top 5. TSLRCM Official Forum || TSLRCM Moddb || My other KOTOR2 mods || TSLRCM (English version) on Steam || [M4-78EP on Steam Formerly known as BattleWookiee/BattleCookiee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entrerix Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 i love system shock 2. but have no problem admitting that deus ex is at least as good, if not better. those two games are really in a league of their own. fingers crossed for the new deus ex though Killing is kind of like playin' a basketball game. I am there. and the other player is there. and it's just the two of us. and I put the other player's body in my van. and I am the winner. - Nice Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orogun01 Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 In DX3, if you don't kill anyone / don't get seen at all, you actually get the most xp. The "Ghost" and "Smooth Operator" bonuses I'd say the answer to that question is kind of like the answer to "who's the sucker in this poker game?"* *If you can't tell, it's you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sorophx Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 you can take down everyone without being seen, you'll get 5x times the exp AND the smooth operator/whatever bonus Walsingham said: I was struggling to understand ths until I noticed you are from Finland. And having been educated solely by mkreku in this respect I am convinced that Finland essentially IS the wh40k universe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oner Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 Yep, you can even blow up mines, as long as you're not seen, you get the Ghost bonus. Giveaway list: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1DgyQFpOJvyNASt8A12ipyV_iwpLXg_yltGG5mffvSwo/edit?usp=sharing What is glass but tortured sand?Never forget! '12.01.13. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowtrain Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 i love system shock 2. but have no problem admitting that deus ex is at least as good, if not better. those two games are really in a league of their own. fingers crossed for the new deus ex though I think System Shock 2 is a better designed game than Deus Ex: more focused, more polished, better AI's, the Dark engine that it used along with Thief 1 and 2 was a fabulous engine for a stealth type game. Deus Ex, otoh, is a lot more complex a game than SS2: DX is less focused but there is much more to it in terms of possibliites of gameplay. The gameworld and levels are also more complex and interesting. SO really for me, it's close to a tie. I used to prefer DX over SS2, but in the end SS2 has had a longer shelf life for me than DX. Notice how I can belittle your beliefs without calling you names. It's a useful skill to have particularly where you aren't allowed to call people names. It's a mistake to get too drawn in/worked up. I mean it's not life or death, it's just two guys posting their thoughts on a message board. If it were personal or face to face all the usual restraints would be in place, and we would never have reached this place in the first place. Try to remember that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orogun01 Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 you can take down everyone without being seen, you'll get 5x times the exp AND the smooth operator/whatever bonus You can't, non lethal weapons are 1 shot only and before you get the silencers it's impossible. With the silencers it's close to impossible. I wouldn't recommend trying to take everyone out since it's next to impossible to do without being seen. I'd say the answer to that question is kind of like the answer to "who's the sucker in this poker game?"* *If you can't tell, it's you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entrerix Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 my favorite way of playing games with a stealth component is to try over and over and over again to clear each level of enemies, by lethal means, without being seen. MGS games its usually pretty possible to do this, but some areas can get tricky. I'm pretty sure I've done it in some levels of Deus Ex, but not all of them. I used to try and do this in hitman games, but don't think i was successful past the first few missions... Killing is kind of like playin' a basketball game. I am there. and the other player is there. and it's just the two of us. and I put the other player's body in my van. and I am the winner. - Nice Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sorophx Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 (edited) I wouldn't recommend trying to take everyone out since it's next to impossible to do without being seen. a-hem anyway, the scoped dart gun is silent, and you don't even need that most of the time, it's very easy to crouch behind enemies and take them out one by one with your bare hands The levelbuild is one of the best? DX's levels are friggin' awful. the gas station, french catacombs, liberty island... ugh! make me unsee it! huge areas, barely populated, single entry point, I don't think it's one of the game's strengths. the only actually good level was the last one where you had three different objectives and a number of secondary objectives. I admit, that one was awesome I am still annoyed when people say DX or AP AI is bad, and cite a random FPS shooters AI as better. well, the grunts in Opposing Force are a lot better than anything in DX Seriously, play it. I watched a very thorough let's play, 1000+ minutes of gameplay back to back. of course it doesn't substitute the actual experience from playing the game, but I think I can draw some conclusions It's better than the railroad experiences shooters usually are these days it's not "better", or "worse". it's different. it's not a regular shooter, I'll give you that. I still find HL a lot better in many ways. though DX did do something good (like I already said), the skill system looks pretty neat. the only game remotely similar to DX I've played was Shadowrun on the Genesis. and boy that game did a lot of things better. not to say DX is worse, but it could use a couple of elements from SR. in its current state DX isn't for me Edited June 17, 2011 by sorophx Walsingham said: I was struggling to understand ths until I noticed you are from Finland. And having been educated solely by mkreku in this respect I am convinced that Finland essentially IS the wh40k universe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nepenthe Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 (edited) Withcer II is today's pinacle of RPG's. I almost let out a throaty laugh and stopped reading at this point, but I'm glad you didn't. Everything else you say is pretty much right on the money. of course it doesn't substitute the actual experience from playing the game, but I think I can draw some conclusions Well, either it doesn't enable you to draw conclusions, or you have piss-poor taste in games. Or both. I mean, whining about the gas station?! If you're on such a nit-picking spree, I think the monkies at the local zoo could use some delousing! Edited June 17, 2011 by Nepenthe You're a cheery wee bugger, Nep. Have I ever said that? Reapercussions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sorophx Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 I mean, whining about the gas station?! riiight anyway, disliking something isn't indicative of poor taste Walsingham said: I was struggling to understand ths until I noticed you are from Finland. And having been educated solely by mkreku in this respect I am convinced that Finland essentially IS the wh40k universe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majek Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 I prefer System Shock over its sequel or Deus Ex. 1.13 killed off Ja2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orogun01 Posted June 18, 2011 Share Posted June 18, 2011 I wouldn't recommend trying to take everyone out since it's next to impossible to do without being seen. a-hem anyway, the scoped dart gun is silent, and you don't even need that most of the time, it's very easy to crouch behind enemies and take them out one by one with your bare hands No, the energy cells are spent after you do. Max of 4 cells with energy regen maxed it will still take you about 30 secs after you are completely spent, any enemy at that point that it's still alive can see the corpses and set the alarm. Plus guards are hardly ever alone. Trust me, you can't kill everyone and get the bonuses. I'd say the answer to that question is kind of like the answer to "who's the sucker in this poker game?"* *If you can't tell, it's you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hell Kitty Posted June 18, 2011 Share Posted June 18, 2011 I'm really not fussed about having all play styles perfectly balanced in single player games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nepenthe Posted June 18, 2011 Share Posted June 18, 2011 anyway, disliking something isn't indicative of poor taste If it's Deus Ex, yes it is. That gas station has two major elements of reactivity that in normal games would've been met with a "game over" screen. Bet you can't name them. You're a cheery wee bugger, Nep. Have I ever said that? Reapercussions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sorophx Posted June 18, 2011 Share Posted June 18, 2011 (edited) of course I can't, these elements somehow make the gas station a brilliantly designed area? Trust me, you can't kill everyone and get the bonuses. trust me, you can if you're careful enough (at least in the first chapter) oh, and chocolate bars restore energy. oh, and you can hide the body after you take a guard out Edited June 18, 2011 by sorophx Walsingham said: I was struggling to understand ths until I noticed you are from Finland. And having been educated solely by mkreku in this respect I am convinced that Finland essentially IS the wh40k universe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hassat Hunter Posted June 18, 2011 Share Posted June 18, 2011 DX's levels are friggin' awful. the gas station, french catacombs, liberty island... ugh! make me unsee it! huge areas, barely populated, single entry point, I don't think it's one of the game's strengths. the only actually good level was the last one where you had three different objectives and a number of secondary objectives. I admit, that one was awesome Since when are big areas a con? Do we need hallways that are crawling with thugs. Did that make DX:IW so much better, corridor running? Much re-loading due to the small maps? Also, what kind of bizarre logic is "single entry point" as a con? Does HL allow that? No? Any game that does that? Sure, DX:IW did depending on your pilot, but I hardly see that as making maps more interesting. Every level needs a start. If you mean "can only enter Liberty Statue/Gas Station a single way", then, hell, are you misinformed. well, the grunts in Opposing Force are a lot better than anything in DX They are, as said, also a lot more simplistic. A pure FPS can allow that, but in DX Stealth also has a factor, so unlike HL foes first there's exploring sounds and actually knowing where you are before going over into action. I can't recall a moment in Half-Life where the Combine and such didn't know magically your location immediately as they snoop in. the only game remotely similar to DX I've played was Shadowrun on the Genesis. So you didn't even play System Shock II either? Your missing out... ^ I agree that that is such a stupid idiotic pathetic garbage hateful retarded scumbag evil satanic nazi like term ever created. At least top 5. TSLRCM Official Forum || TSLRCM Moddb || My other KOTOR2 mods || TSLRCM (English version) on Steam || [M4-78EP on Steam Formerly known as BattleWookiee/BattleCookiee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raithe Posted June 18, 2011 Share Posted June 18, 2011 Whether you liked it or hated it, Deus Ex has a place in gaming history. When combined with the likes of System Shock, it had an awful lot of influence on games and the people who develop them in the decade since its release. Live with it. "Cuius testiculos habeas, habeas cardia et cerebellum." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sorophx Posted June 18, 2011 Share Posted June 18, 2011 Live with it. do I sound like I can't live with it? Walsingham said: I was struggling to understand ths until I noticed you are from Finland. And having been educated solely by mkreku in this respect I am convinced that Finland essentially IS the wh40k universe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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