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KOTOR3? Bioware Please

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Nice shot, Obsidian,

 

A good story, but poorly executed. It had unexplained plots and unfinished buisness. as many of you have already commented, it went downhill from the 'Counsil' Sequence.

 

Looking back at KOTOR1, we see excelent story in play and kick ass endings. wrapping up everything nicely. All hail Bioware. Come back to us, we miss you.

 

Does anyone else think Obsidion deserve another go? Or back to Bioware?

 

Remember Baldur's Gate.

 

i say give obsidian another chance. there's definately a lot of potential there. i liked the story, but the ending left something to be desired. seemed a bit rushed. give them the time they need and i'm sure they could make an excelent kotor 3.

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Obsidian made a great game, they just didn't get the chance to actually make that game. Assuming that Obsidian would have greater control over the production process and make the game they origionally designed, they would make a great KOTOR III.

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Bioware did a great job on K1! They single handedly revived my interest in Star Wars. Before K1, I could give a **** about Star Wars. Do you forget what it felt like when you found out you were Revan? I myself was in shock! The game had control of my life for a couple weeks.

 

Obsidian did a good job on K2. They weren't having to reinvent the wheel. I expected so much more. I was very disappointed, although I did enjoy the game. I just felt like maybe they were in over their heads and didn't manage their time or resources well enough.

 

THEN, the other day I see the thread about the things that were cut. WHAT!?!? Why would you cut those things? This totally changed my view on Obsidian. They have all the potential in the world to make the best Star Wars game ever, but that potential is stagnate. They had a great story, but couldn't see it through. Bioware, on the other hand, created a story and made it work. Because of this, Bioware should have control of the game. That would be the best business move.

 

Obsidian....you're fired! :wub:

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Dude... to reiterate my point on BGII's ending: THE ENDING CINEMATIC for the "Good Path"... doesn't it SCREAM OMG EVERYTHING IS FINE WITH THE UNIVERSE AND IT'S ALL BECAUSE OF YOU?

 

Seriously guys. BGII had a bloated and happy ending with no sign of the struggles that it took to get there.... like all of Bioware's games.


Word economics

To express my vast wisdom

I speak in haiku's.

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"doesn't it SCREAM OMG EVERYTHING IS FINE WITH THE UNIVERSE AND IT'S ALL BECAUSE OF YOU?"

 

No. Afterall, look at all the destruction caused.. lots of it in the player's name. How many people died because the UBG was trying to get to the PC? Lots. Not happy, happy.

 

You don't know the definition of Happy, Happy ity seems. Last i checked, Happy Happy doens't = thousands dying.

 

Keep spinning your fanboyish tales. It won't change anything.


DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.

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Yes, as I said. BG is not about fighting for a cause, but your own survival. You lived the life of continuously being chased, whenever you go, city burned and people die and river of blood. The ending in TOB or even SOA is just simply put an end to a threat of your life, and that's not happy, especially with the cost of what happenned.

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"doesn't it SCREAM OMG EVERYTHING IS FINE WITH THE UNIVERSE AND IT'S ALL BECAUSE OF YOU?"

 

No. Afterall, look at all the destruction caused.. lots of it in the player's name. How many people died because the UBG was trying to get to the PC? Lots. Not happy, happy.

 

You don't know the definition of Happy, Happy ity seems. Last i checked, Happy Happy doens't = thousands dying.

 

Keep spinning your fanboyish tales. It won't change anything.

 

You mean there were people who were actually surprised at being Revan?

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"doesn't it SCREAM OMG EVERYTHING IS FINE WITH THE UNIVERSE AND IT'S ALL BECAUSE OF YOU?"

 

No. Afterall, look at all the destruction caused.. lots of it in the player's name. How many people died because the UBG was trying to get to the PC? Lots. Not happy, happy.

 

You don't know the definition of Happy, Happy ity seems. Last i checked, Happy Happy doens't = thousands dying.

 

Keep spinning your fanboyish tales. It won't change anything.

 

You mean there were people who were actually surprised at being Revan?

 

Actually, I was surprised at Revan. It was great.

 

and White, the 'Good' Ending for BGII, was not a "OMG YOU WON THE WORLD! HURRAH!"

It was just your character continuing to live on to do great things, he didn't get crowned, the world didn't bow down, the character just walked off.

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Ok can someone pls tell me wat the main plot for KOTOR2 is?

Why the Sith wants the PC dead? Why Keria wants to save him?

If the PC is a wound in the force, why than can he still use force powers?

If he is healed, than is he a threat to other force users?

 

Have played the game and read/listened the dialogues? Those are all answered in the game.


This post is not to be enjoyed, discussed, or referenced on company time.

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well i thought obsidian did a good job overall, there were just minor things in the game that bothered me. like making battle meditation a common power. i can understand if only the exile was able to use it, but not the others. and getting broken items after bashing a container doesnt make any sense, you would be hitting the lock, not sticking a sword through the container and smashing the item to pieces. there were also too many items with a bunch of stat bonuses that you could use, it made the character a little too powerful. but it was a good idea to get experiance from opening locks and disarming mines. and also getting the attribute bonuses from party members.

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The ending in KotOR1 was great. However, the story was quite mediocre with a few real big highlights, and I felt it relied mainly on the "shock effect."

 

The ending in KotORII was horrid. Real horrid. However, the story was extremely well-done up until the end-game. I really loved the dialouge, and the options. It felt a lot more real and mature than the dialouge in KotOR1. Also, another plus about KotORII. The clothes. I just love the design on the various Jedi robes. It's simply delicious.

 

Needless to say, I would like to give Obsidian a second chance. I really like these guys writing a lot, and would love to see an actually finished story by them.


"When the foul sore of envy corrupts the vanquished heart, the very exterior itself shows how forcibly the mind is urged by madness. For paleness seizes the complexion, the eyes are weighed down, the spirit is inflamed, while the limbs are chilled, there is frenzy in the heart, there is gnashing with the teeth."

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Seriously, it would be best for those who do know what they are arguing about to post. Such people I can respect (even if I may not agree with them), but certainly not those who just lob in a complaint or two so self-righteously.

 

The twist in K1 was good, but some of us predicted it and saw it coming. K1 in general was an excellent game in that it revived interest in the SW universe and showed that LA is actually capable of releasing a game worthy of the X-wing related series and one dominating the RPG field.

 

K2 in my opinion was good as well. Certainly it had it's poorer points. Apart from a few, certain other insights on characters in K1 were never shown. Further the framerate issues on Dantooine was horrendous. But that could be fixed if you go to the graphics section and tweaked the options. A nuisance, but not th end of the world.

 

I agree with White on K1's ending. I may not have finished the BG or NWN series, but yes, K1's ending IS happy go lucky style. Many people have complained about its blandness following its release last year; almost as many complained as they did now. Personally, I feel more strongly with K2 in many respects.

 

It fleshed out the SW universe and showed how conflicting the ideals of Jedi/Sith, DS/LS of the Force can be. K1 lacked such blurring lines of truth and lies. Further the ending was poetic - akin to riding off into the sunset or unknown as this turns out. Maybe I'm just being sentimental, but it heightens anticipation for K3, and that is not such a bad thing, since some of us do yearn for a sequel.

 

One has to look from the perspective of the SW universe. The developers have their own share of previous Bioware games such as BG and NWN themselves, and further, in their diaries, expressed how they went to such lengths as to read all SW comics, novels and games, movies in order to flesh out K2 to the likes of what is truly 'Star Wars'.

 

Perhaps it may be better if people viewed K1 and K2 in the light of the original trilogy movies Ep 4,5 and 6. We get a happy happy ending with Yavin celebration at the end of A New Hope (of course, the deaths of thousands on the Death Star could hardly be said to be happy to some can it?). And of course, many people have alluded K2 to The Empire Strikes Back with its darker theme. In this way it makes sense - Han is lost and the Millenium Falcon sails into the nebula to rendezvous with the Jedi to save him. This theme is shown in K2 where the Ebon Hawk sails into the unknown to rendezvous with Revan.

 

If people are arguing for K2 to have an ending that gives it a sense of closure to be a game in its own right, then I suggest that they should not then compare it with K1 - such an argument is like a looping circuit with no end to it. Like others have said, we do not know what could've happened if Bio was given the job instead, and what would we have said if the developer was Bio in this case? Who would be now clamouring for Obsidian? I say give Obsidian a shot at K3 and see if we get a Return of the Jedi.

 

Cheers,

HC

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Yeah, let Obsidian have a shot at K3. The story of K2, even with the ending cut, has more meat than K1.

 

Both K1 and K2 have good and bad points. I thought the graphics of K1 on the Xbox were better than K2s (the latter doesn't seem to have the same level of detail). In K2, I love the fact that your actions and choice of words can influence NPCs.

 

Anyway, let's give all the feedback we can on bugs, inconsistencies, functionality, etc just to make sure the next KoTOR is better than the previous two... Hopefully.

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come on guys, remember Baldur's Gate 1, 2 + Expansion?

 

Bioware KNOW how to amke games, and more importantly, end them satisfactory.

 

 

if i remember well, for BG 1, 2 and expansion, "black isle" was there too.. . So you had a great story in these game.

 

Bioware made alone NWN and you have a very short and not original story, but a nice game engine.

 

Sorry but Bioware know how to make game in term of game engine.

 

obsidian => some old devs from "black isle".

 

For a KOTOR 3 i am agree with another post here : BIOWARE and OBSIDIAN, not only one of them

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There are not many lose ends in KOTOR II unless you miss tying them up (which you can easily do). It's really that simple. KOTOR II dosnt hand you the plot on a plate and illuminate it with a neon sign like KOTOR does.

 

As for the end there isnt a huge ammount of difference. The end of both games were a slog through uninteresting and at that point unchallenging foes till you meet the apprentice and then the master.

 

KOTOR was good but once you knew the twist(which I figured out around planet II then had no choice to play ignorant till the game caught up) that was it as far as I was concerned no motivation to ever play the game again.

 

I've played KOTOR II 4 times and now my wife has it , so I know which has given us the best value for money.


I have to agree with Volourn.  Bioware is pretty much dead now.  Deals like this kills development studios.

478327[/snapback]

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KoTOR had a good ending??? :wub: A thirty second cutscene of either a speach or a celebration doesn't qualify as a "good ending" to me.

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if i remember well, for BG 1, 2 and expansion, "black isle" was there too.. . So you had a great story in these game.

 

 

Black Isle had no input on the BG story at all. Check the credits. All the designers are Bio staff.

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I'd rather see Obsidian do the third one.

It's more complicate, interesting with twited plots you just see through the lines.

 

Kotor 1 was good, but there was less feeling that the story was part of a big scheme that is more intricated.

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i would like both these companies to carry on making the kotor series as both games are good no matter of the end. but both know that bioware's original story of revan is the key to the story of the kotor and obsidian made a good effort with tsl to make sure that he was.

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I would prefer it if BioWare made KotOR3 as it's pretty evident that Obsidian doesn't even like the Star Wars franchise, mocking some parts of KotOR1 and the movies on occasions.

 

They should stick with their trolls and fairies, and the gloomy cynisism fits better in radioactive wastelands than the (mostly) optimistic Star Wars universe..

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I would prefer it if BioWare made KotOR3 as it's pretty evident that Obsidian doesn't even like the Star Wars franchise, mocking some parts of KotOR1 and the movies on occasions.

 

They should stick with their trolls and fairies, and the gloomy cynisism fits better in radioactive wastelands than the (mostly) optimistic Star Wars universe..

 

Where have they mocked KotOR I or Star Wars? And even if they did, it doesn't mean they don't like it. I mock RPGs all the time, yet I love them.

 

On top of that, Star Wars is often pretty gloomy.

 

What Obsidian does need to do is another Planescape game. To bad that will never, ever happen.

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And where is optimism rife in the Star Wars universe? The glactic empire has enslaved the galaxy in the first films, there's a small pocket of resistance that isn't expected to last much longer and from all we've seen so far, the events leading up to such circumstnaces involve a republic that was failing its citizens for a long time anyway

 

There's not a lot to be optimistic about in the Star Wars universe until the end of Ep 6 IMO

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And where is optimism rife in the Star Wars universe?  The glactic empire has enslaved the galaxy in the first films, there's a small pocket of resistance that isn't expected to last much longer and from all we've seen so far, the events leading up to such circumstnaces involve a republic that was failing its citizens for a long time anyway

 

There's not a lot to be optimistic about in the Star Wars universe until the end of Ep 6 IMO

 

Nah, only ESB was a bit gloomy. Episode III might be even more so, who knows. The other movies were quite cheerful despite the state of the galaxy. And even in ESB there was always a feeling of hope, though. It wasn't cynical, like this K2 depressiveness.... "Yeah, you saved the galaxy from the Sith in K1 but here they are again only 5 years later, killing an entire planet that incidentally had most of the remaining Jedi Order on it. Nothing like a bit of adversity to make you feel good about yourself when you've beaten the game."

 

"Also, Revan left his love interest from K1 behind after less than a year, we felt it was essential to the plot of K2 to smash your happy ending from K1 to pieces too."

 

"Don't do good, it will make the weak weaker".

 

"Btw, your Han Soloish NPC actually used to torture and kill Jedi. Except he couldn't do it anymore because a Jedi woman he killed showed him the force and also what it felt like to be on the receiving end and he loved her for it. I mean he loved to kill her. But he still left the Sith so it was all good! :rolleyes: "

 

Then you finally get some hope when you gather all the Masters on Dantooine, These nice(well maybe not Vrook) masters will surely help me against the Sith. Oh wait, they all turn on me. And now Kreia kills them! Actually their state is worse than death!. Yeah why not.

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