Namutree

Fan fiction, and Mods!

Hiro, I'll try to answer your question. The reason why developers anthropomorphise and sexualise non-human npcs is to try and create the illusion that the npcs are real. People have sexual aspects to them, so when they sexualise npcs; they can seem more human. That makes role-playing more convincing for some people. There are also strong emotions that can easily be brought out through sexuality. Those feelings can make a player feel connected to a world. To put it bluntly; adding sexuality to a npc is an easy way to manipulate a player's emotions and create a connection to the game world.

If you had just said this from the beginning your argument with Hiro probably would have been shorter.

I've been thinking about this for a while now and I want to announce a change in opinion! I used to think that Obsidian made the right call in not including romance, but thought they should include it in the sequels. Now I think Obsidian made the right call in not including romance, and think they shouldn't add them the sequels. Here is why: 1- Modders will do this anyway, and Obsidian would best spend their time building new areas and core mechanics. Those features would better suit Obsidian's skills, and are hard to mod in according to Josh. 2- Good romances are hard to make, and bad ones really hurt the game. See Primejunta's earlier ME2 example for reference. I would hate to see poe2 tarnished by poorly implemented romances, and by avoiding romances Obsidian avoids this risk. 3- Adding in romances at the expense of other content would make poe2/poe3 too much like a bioware game; we have plenty of those and there will be plenty more to come. Obsidian should be Obsidian; not Bioware jr. I still like the romance model I established here and on other threads, but will leave them to modders.

That something it lacks is NOT Romance, however. It was Party member interaction outright. So you're not making any sort of on-topic point here at all. Although I do take issue with the notion that anything in IWD was soulless. IWD is a dungeon crawler, and every feature it had was designed towards that end. Any deviation from that formula would have felt out of place. Just think about it. Your Party enters Kresselack's tomb: Protagonist: Hmm... Nice dungeon Cleric: It's a tomb. I bet there's undead here. Protagonist: You're right. I'll prepare accordingly. Thank you! Cleric: any time <<blushes>>> And don't worry, I won't let anything bad happen to you. Protagonist: I.... I didn't know you cared Cleric: Of course I do! Here look, we're conveniently in front of an ancient but empty coffin... you wanna... Protagonist: I thought you'd never ask ::::fade to black:::: :::vomiting ensues:::: No, Romances wouldn't have worked for Icewind Dale, would they. They would have killed the atmosphere and the entire game would have followed suit. That would have been incredibly amusing.

Well, but orcs are so cool too.. There's something "strenght and honor"ish about them.. You can apply that strength and honor to some new race and there you go. Personally I think it be funny to see a highly intelligent chimpanzee race inspired from planet of the apes. Not related at all to human races in origin and are total **** to colonists they capture and humiliate with chimp grunts and throwing poop at them. Basically a goofy playful monkey race. I'd like to see a monkey race inspired by Sun Wukong. Give em a boost to agility and a slight resistance to elemental magic, but lower concentration and a slight weakness to non-elemental magic. They could look like this:

No way need Louie Anderson to voice the main villain and Gilbert Gottfried to voice all female characters.

I had a similar experience sadly...

Never knew Tom Sawyer was in an interview with poe as the topic. Mark Twain must have been a prophet.

The Aumaua are like fish Orcs.

Hm funny how it's always the man that is "gross." Are there any fairy tales with gross ladies, I'd like to know. Plenty of fairy tales with gross ladies, but they are always villains or at least creepy. I think you're trying to point out a double standard where men can be very unattractive, but still sympathetic; whereas women must be pretty to be considered good. If that is what you are trying to point out it's definitely true. I for one think an ugly female romance could be kinda interesting; especially if the woman had self-esteem issues because of it. Bioware should definitely give a romance like that a whirl. I wouldn't recommend Obsidian do something like that though.

I have a feeling that poe will be designed to require more teamwork than the IE games, and when Josh said it would be easier than IWD2; he probably had full teams in mind. Soloing in the old IE games usually involved either making an incredibly powerful character; which will almost certainly not be possible in the more balanced poe, or involved game exploits which likely won't be as common in poe as they were in the IE games. I'm betting soloing will be possible, but MUCH harder.

I like romance in some games, but not in others. In the Mass Effect series it was pretty bad. They really should have focused on quality over quantity in that case. Somehow people liked them, but I felt I was on the love boat; not the Normandy. If Obsidian chooses to add romance to poe2 I hope they do so in an interesting and mature way.

My impression has been that the game will not be too difficult to Mod in Npcs, quests, and dialog. Areas however, are another story. Don't expect maps comin' from mods.

I agree with many of the posters here that the dating sim style of romance isn't very good for role-playing. I think it would be best if the issue wasn't which choice gets you the girl/guy, but instead focusing on how you want to get him/her. Let's say in poe2 Pallegina returns and can be romanced. If your protagonist has high RES then he can win her over with his strength of personality, or if his RES is low he can attract her using his MIG; girls love a guy with big muscles. It wouldn't be a mini-game as much as a reflection of your pc's values. I also think that Obsidian should adopt Jade Empire's style of romantic timing. Romantic moments don't just happen anywhere; the time and place need to be appropriate.

I think it can be okay to add romance even if it's not a plot driver, but it does have to conform to the plot. You are absolutely right about ME2; the lack of discipline on the Normandy was downright silly. I hope Bioware will get it's act together and not allow romances to contradict the plot. I think poe is the kind crpg that a romance would be good for. I think it would be best if they followed the model I established in other threads. poe1: No romances, but a hint of flirting possible. poe2: Romances possible, but not spammed ME2/ME3 style. No more than 4 romances possible. Returning characters start a romance mid game, but new characters start a romance late game. poe3: Import data from poe2 into poe3 in order to continue romances. No new romances in poe3. Existing romances face some kind of conflict, and the player chooses how to resolve it. Decisions made through the games effect the ending of course; that applies to the main plot and the romances.

Let's wait 'till the game is released and we know it's good before we go around marketing it. If poe is good I'll do whatever it takes to get a sequel, but until I know for sure that poe is in fact a good game; I won't be advertising it.

Hypothetically they could be role playing. Lets say a girl could be romanced, but there was more than 1 way to do so. If you had high RES you could convince her to love you by being a smooth talker, but if not you might have to impress her with your big muscles a la MIG. It wouldn't be as much of a matter of CAN you convince her to like you, but instead HOW you get her to like you. I also feel they can give you a greater sense of purpose in your decision making. In Bg2 TOB: I was planning on becoming a god, but the thought of leaving Anomen behind made me a bit sad. When it came time to choose whether or not to ascend at the end; it really felt like a tough decision.

They both have the same amount of content. I mean, you said so yourself. So, if they both have the same amount of content... one doesn't automatically have MOAR content because they have different content. You're making huge, absolutist claims while at the same time saying that you're not. That's no way to discuss anything. No, they don't!! XD How is it possible that they do have the same amount of content? Both have let's say 5000 lines of content for friendships and the second one has 3000 more for romances (just examples). They definitely don't have the same amount of content. Maybe you are reading what I am saying as claims but I assure I am only trying to express what I think and what is only my opinon. That's all. They have limited development time for the game. Every moment they spend on romance lines comes at the expense of something else. So, what would you sacrifice for romance? That is the crux of the issue. I doubt many would object to romance if it were cost free.

I hope invisible helmets are an option, but if not; expect a mod to deal with them.

I'd like to see bromances, but I have a question. What would you call a bromance between females? Lephys, give me a good answer please.

namelesstree I think you didn't understand the implication of my second point. Remember that poe is only the first third of your hero's story; don't be too upset that you can't start a romance in the first act of three.

I also went ahead and compared Fallout 3 to Fallout: NV. The mechanics were similar, but not quite the same. The game experience was similar, but not quite the same. I doubt that was a coincidence.

The game mechanics are central to the experience. Change the mechanics; get a different experience. My impression is that you don't care for the game-play; and that's fine, but that doesn't at all change the importance of the race/class/level progression system because you'll still be dealing with them. Take those out, and all you have is a choose your own adventure style visual novel, and that isn't a game at all. If I wanted a sub-par book, I go to the library and get one for free. Obsidian is making a video game, and the mechanics matter most; even if you don't like them. No cover based shooter could create the experience the IE games can.

How is the race/class/level progression system irrelevant? It's the core of the game. Without them, Obsidian wouldn't have much of a game.