constantine

I agree with @mazeltov, there's too much for me in the game already ! I remember having played 50+ hrs, just entering Act II, being somewhere around 5-6 lv, while feeling overwhelmed by the content ! Naturally, I didn't do it all (im not a completionist). I select to leave out whole chunks of content, so that there are many new things to see when doing another playthrough. That's how I've also been playing the old ie games all those years (and i reckon there are still things i've never done in BG2, though only few :D )

I still don't understand why we want to discourage movement at all. I've been slowly replaying BGTutu over the past couple of weeks, and movement ends up being one of the more dynamic and interesting parts of combat (and the loss of movement or control of movement is a huge risk). Engagement strikes me as ever more pointless. Ability to move free was the root of the problem for the old games and led to most of the known combat exploits. @View619 is right on his statement that engagement is too punishing and his suggestions to remedy the issue strike the right note (i remember others and myself making similar suggestions during game development). So far, our voices haven't been heard. However, if I had to choose between punishing engagement or no engagement at all, i d prefer things stay as they are.

It's not sales that concerns me. I find the supposed review too provocative to ignore. But then, that is what it was intended to do in the first place. In the end, one angry rant of a review will not change the tide.

Pillars of Eternity on Metacritic: 90/100 based on 59 critic reviews 85/100 based on 1525 user reviews :D I think this speaks louder than any rpg codex review.

I have a 19 MIG, 19 INT 2handed dps+ disabling Fighter, 10 to all other attributes. Did I dump anything ?

I don't see a huge problem, since I never intend to complete all quests available in PoE and never did for old ie games too. This added to replayability for such games. Now for the completionist, after reaching the level cap, he would still get his reward by completing stuff, right ? And get better loot along the way. But I would prefer quest exp be lessened, somewhere along the lines that it would require the player to complete 3/4th of them to reach the level cap.

And I would have to disagree with you. You can have your maxed INT/MIG wizard, another can have Aloth, another can have a DEX/RES wizard, interrupting blows talent and get more interrupts. Why not ? All of them work as intended.

Yes, makes enough sense to me. Is there a forum rule against it ? What is important to me is that people who haven't played the game yet and stumble into the RPGCodec Review #1 topic, can later check that one- the truth about it.

I had to, or else my words would end up buried in 45something pages of poster vs poster arguments. And there isn't a matter of importance, rather than every man stating their views and be criticised for them.

First, it is not a reviewer's job to painstakingly observe and report whether or not a feature is working as the developers intended. Second, a criticism of a crap mechanic does not need to take developer reasoning in mind. For example, When Bioware decided to implement parachuting mob waves in DA2, we didn't NEED to discover the reasoning behind such crap design before concluding that it was a f*cking Crap design. Third, as anyone who took part in PoE's 6-month-long public Beta process will tell you, the Attribute system has gone though countless iterations (even some totally fundamental changes). In their first incarnation, the attributes flat out didn't carry any penalties at all (Dumping Might to 3 resulted in a +3% damage BONUS. And that was the intention). Another version of the Beta saw Accuracy tied to perception. etc. So citing developer intentions here is kinda pointless anyway. They've been constantly changing their intentions. They've been changing their intentions based on backer's feedback, trying to reach that gold point. Truth is, PoE's attributes is among its greatest achievements: no godly attribute for any class, so you are free to explore the many build possibilities- dmg builds, fast-attacking, interrupt builds, duration builds, tanky ones. This is reinforced by the fact that attributes have less impact, so you are encouraged to try combinations without losing much. In the same time the player who enjoys min-maxing will get sth out of it. The best of both worlds. It has come to be almost suspicious that you PoE haters fail to see all that- you continue to argue just for the sake of it. Is it about engagement maybe? You'll never get over it, will you.

To clarify things, Darth Roxor's essay about PoE cannot be considered a 'review', despite the author names it such, if only for the staggering amount of spoilers it contains. A reader has to avoid/skip sentences or be spoiled of the acts of the main quest, certain sidequests and encounters of the game. Now to the essay itself. The long, tiring to read block of text boils down to this: 'I wanted a crpg with Baldur's Gate's (..BG2, IWD1,2) mechanics.' A.The author claims PoE's character development (talents, abilities) offers blunt, unmeaningful choices. An accuracy bonus of +10 in PoE equals to +2 in the old games, which is considerable. He chooces to lie in our faces about that game department b/c... He wanted BG mechanics. B.The author thinks Attributes in PoE do not offer considerable bonuses, then proposes to the reader min-maxing attribute options for various character combat roles, in essence contradicting himself, while proposing a certain power-gaming playstyle in a review. It is true that Attributes in PoE have lesser impact, which is in fact an achievement. That way one player's Aloth with his 'crap stats' wouldn't fall that much behind a min-maxed wizard another player hired. At the same time, a player who loves min-maxed attributes will get something out of them. It's the best of both worlds. Also, attributes offer various choices: dmg builds, duration, interrupt, fast-attacking, tanking builds that the player is encouraged to explore as there is not a godly attr. for any of the classes, but the author again chooses to lie in our faces about it b/c... He wanted BG mechanics. C.The author claims encounters in PoE are uninterested, easily exploited and fall into MMO-like resolutions. Those statements are not entirely false, but the typical player, who doesn't specifically look to cheat the game, *will* have a vastly different experience. And since the author judges PoE from the old games perspective, it is another insult to the reader's face to choose to ignore how broken, unbalanced and full of exploits combat was in those games. No need to detail here, those issues are known for years. Mind you, I still love and play the old games, but I intentionally hamper myself to enjoy challenge in combat. However, the author again chooses to lie in our faces b/c... He wanted BG mechanics. D.The author is not satisfied with role-playing elements in dialogue choices, PoE's reputation system and world reactivity to player's action. Again, judging the game from the perspective of the old games, he continues to blatantly lie. The old games (save PS:T) had zero reactivity and only an illusion of rp, most of the part occuring in the player's head, since the actual games (almost) never delivered. Mind you, I love the old games, but one has to give credit where is due (unlike the RPG Codex's 'reviewer'). PoE is tons more rpg than the old legendary ie rpgs. But Darth Roxor again ignores that fact b/c he is so butt-hurt he didn't get his realible BG mechanics. E.Then there are some parts about the 'review' that are plainly mean. Darth Roxor must really hate some Obsidian people to throw so much vile. He is unfair about the quality of writing, quest content and resolution and the thematics of the main quest. But I can guess he acts so b/c... He wanted BG mechanics. I personally have every right to express my opinion since RPGCodex's post was forwarded to these forums, so, in conclusion, reading Darth Roxor's post about PoE I have this to say: where are great things, petty acts will try to undermine them.

Still, this is your opinion, critique, review. It is subjective, speaks true for you and a bunch of like-minded people. As I know I am being subjective when I say I don't like ES titles, DA:I or D:OS (for reasons I guess none here care to know, but of course I can elaborate if asked to). How a game is designed may not be our kind of poison. The 'review' you shared with us in the OP has no right to be called such, as is a collection of angry, often misplaced runts. A reviewer needs be objective above all, or not review at all. Not that is a surprise to me though, as in my many years of rpg gaming i've never held the rpg codex any respect or credibility to their opinions.

From a veteran and huge fan of the D&D ie games and the original Fallouts (i've also played DA:O, which i've found decent, and D:OS which i didn't like at all): PoE is a great game. The campaign will draw you in right from the beginning, the atmosphere, music strike the right note. The story manages to make you involved, much like the BG games. It has the element of mystery that makes you carry on. The classes are better than d&d 2nd and feel much more different playing each. Magic abilities are divided between the casters, no wizard can do every spell. Magic system is inferior to d&d, but still very interesting. Companions are good- some are fun, some quite mysterious, but not as good as BG2 or DA:O. However, they are very likeable and make you want to see more of them, possibly in PoE2. Combat is very different from ie games, but really good in its own way- tactical, punishing to the unwise and.. faster ! To sum it up, although inspired from the legendary old games, PoE has its own identity, which is its greatest achievement. It is an instant classic.

You can spit your poison, oh PoE backer-haters, but this is where this poison will stay- for your voices of vile and outrage are just drops in the ocean. The latest Obsidian rpg is a success, whether you refuse to acknowledge the fact. If you want Baldur's Gate, play Baldur's Gate. Same with IWD and Planescape. This is PoE.

All I can say for this review is this: unthankfulness There you go, burn on the stake Obsidian's sincere effort to bring back things we love, if it makes you feel good. And let the rpg genre involve to crap like DA:I and ES titles.

So how did you do fights like the first level of the lighthouse in Ondra's Gift? Or any fight then? How do you 'tank and spank' when enemies come at you from different directions and don't attack the 'tank'? I'm really curious because I find quite a few fights challenging and satisfying when I eventually win. What are these people who complain the game is too easy etc doing differently, or just doing, that makes it so easy? What am I not doing that I should be? I'm with you, philby. I find the game enjoyable, and fairly often challenging as well. You and I must be playing it wrong. Me too guys ! Maybe some1 of the 'complainers' can help us carry out those strategies, teach us how to engage 6-8+ mobs with a tank, let alone to survive the beating on hard or higher difficulty. The only predictable about PoE's combat is how much some of you resented it from the start and never gave it a chance. It's NOT Baldur's Gate ! -which has mediocre combat btw- have you played it recently or is your opinion a result of how you remember struggling with BG's combat during your childhood ?

Judging from your poll, all the negativity in the air belongs to a small minority. PoE is a great game, an instant classic. There is little room to argue this fact. What would be a great achievement is if this game spins off more games of this style, not by Obsidian necessarily. It's high time we see the ressurection of a D&D crpg :D

How do I rationalize it ? I'm not a slayer looking to wipe out populations, instead I'm a rational person who doesn't look for fighting. That said, I don't go through maps on stealth- if I meet hostile beings, I'll defend myself. Then we may stealth, especially if the area seems extremely hostile. If I see an encounter I can avoid and not miss on anything, I will avoid it. To sum it up, the no-combat-XP system gives me the incentive to role-play adventuring and exploring, which is great. And to think I was very against that design decision when it was discussed during development. In most other rpgs I've played, I feel compelled to clear all enemies and grind XP. PoE has again shown me how much more of a rpg than others is, by giving me incentive to rp

Unfortunately, there is a lot of that, like you said. Many of those who helped this game be possible act like spoiled children, whining about the smallest detail or refuse right-out the way game mechanics handle things. Fortunately, they are the minority, as the game is a huge success ! I too will have to wholeheartily agree with the OP- I open the game and it's like travelling to Eora! The love that has been poured into this game Hopes up for more of this wonderful franchise !

No flames. The ADnD 2nd Edition is the greatest RPG ruleset ever made. Everything since then has been MMO influenced munchkinism. No game today could compare with the tactical variety of BG2 I've been an advent supporter of AD&D even after 3rd, 3.5 and 4th (bleeeeh) editions, however, late 5th ed hits home, being largely influenced by old AD&D while doing a whole lot of things better (the classes being where it excels) also avoiding being 'gamey' as it's even more 'down-to-earth' than 2nd ed. I look forward for a (worthwhile) rpgame using 5th ed ruleset. In the meantime though, I very much enjoy playing pen'n'paper :D Where I'm gonna ask... when will more campaign rulebooks, adventures and supplements be released for 5th ???

You mean easier to exploit. Easier to exploit because of the engagement mechanic (and the group stealth mechanic). Have you....played PoE? Most encounters in PoE have intelligent positioning (reminding me of IWD times) and occur in open enough spaces to prevent choking. Also, enemies team up on the fight even though they are blocked by fog of war. Do you to play specifically looking for exploits to the systems ? Of course you are going to find some, as you could very easily find in the old games. Why is it so hard for every1 to actually play around how the game is designed to ? I did so in the AD&D games and that game and, newsflash, they are much more enjoyable that way.

This is not a matter of "degeneration". The Elder Scrolls Series as been a financial overachiever for the RPG genre since about 1993. Daggerfall outsold the all the Goldbox games. Morrowind came out during the Heyday era of Baldurs Gate and Icewind Dale, and outsold all 4 of those titles combined. Skyrim is just the latest.Anyway, ES managed once again to bring us apart in this topic. In the end, it comes down to personal preference. For me, ES games are the devil and the bane of the rpg genre. A flow I watched becoming the trend all those years, branding such open world games as role-playing. I've been trying to like them since back the days of Morrowind. Never did they manage get me invested in the world, offer memorable NPCs or make me feel my actions have impact. Maybe other people are more imaginative and are ok with what the game shows, I'm not. And the games certainly are a large pot offering a big mix of things. I was never content, I prefer a game to do 2 things right than 10 things mediocre. And, in the end, I'm disappointed ES popularity has been shaping up the rpgames of today and tomorrow.

I think it's funny that you criticize it, yet you mention no less than three distinct ways to deal with them. Three ways out of a small mountain. In PoE? What do you do? You.. tank them, and spank them. Preferably in a doorway. Shall we begin talking about doorways and choke points in the old games ? At least in PoE encounter design and enemies speed-engagement makes it harder to exploit. Yes, harder, not impossible. Anyways, fighting in doorways has always been a valid tactic, I even try to do it in pen-and-paper D&D. My ultimate point is, PoE is not the enemy, it does some things different- why not try to accept them and move on and enjoy the game ? After all, we were all aware that there wasn't time to develop enemy AI.

Coming from a Baldur's Gate I,II veteran, who finds difficulty in those games very easy: I'm playing on hard. It's not hard, it's 'just right'. I'm playing with Obsidian companions, not an optimised party, and also a six-man party (b/c I want to exp the character quests/interractions). The difficulty raises considerably should you choose to go for a 4-man party, and even so of you go for less. Also, try to mix between advancing the main path and exploring/doing side-quests instead of clearing everything the moment it becomes available, to avoid being over-leveled for the content. When it comes down to the kind of exp you want from the game, I suggest a 5-6 man party at normal to people looking for a easy-going exp, while to those looking for a moderate challenge a 5-6 man party on hard and 4 or less party members on PotD for a serious challenge. But keep in mind that even PotD gets much easier if you are over-leveled for the content.

Some magazines report that Skyrim sales on all platforms have reached 20m. Even assuming PoE should reach 1m after a few years, which I feel is optimistic... something about that ratio is terribly depressing . It often seems that the worse the game, the better the sales. probably 20 m across all consoles. also skyrim have alot more budget than PoE and it is watered down, simplified RPG that cater to the less intelligent mass, of course it sells more Such a shame, what the genre has degenerated into, that games like Skyrim sell that high, and the insult that they are consindered rpgames. I would be fine with a gaming industry where ES games appealed to a minority of the gamers, but such games being the trend... If I could describe it with 1 word, that would be 'disappointment'.