MaxQuest

^ Holly Molly! ingameglobal.unity3d weights 80MB. There are hundreds of mono behaviors... - update - Luckily I've stumbled upon AttackData pretty fast. To answer your question: I use AssetBundleExtractor. It looks like this. The last things to figure out: - Why does crossbow reloading speed both in it's asset and in ingameglobal is set to 5.0. While frapsing does consistently show that it has 100 frames duration (i.e. 3.33s) - The mini idle delay (of ~0.2s) preceding each attack animation. Where does it come form?

I've managed to do just that. I.e. generate a *.pw.dll. You can take a look how I've modified the NotifyAttackComplete() method from AttackBase.cs, by download the project from the footer of this starting post.

Although each point of Dex does increase your attack, recovery and reload speeds by 3%, the relative gain is usually less. Check the following table for a visual representation: This is due to the following two factors: - the inter-action delay, which happens to be ~5 frames between any two actions. I don't know exactly how Unity works, but there seems to be some onUpdate schedule system which ticks periodically and checks for queued abilities, and that could be it's tick rate. If I am not mistaken it's possible to get into the same tick (i.e. get rid of the delay) but you would need to have 500+ dexterity. - the intristic diminishing returns. It's like: 3/2 > 4/3 > 5/4 > 6/5 and so on. Add a drop to a drop, and you get twice the amount; throw that drop into the sea, and nothing has changed.

REDUCING ACTION DURATION: - In order to increase your dps, you can do two things: increase your damage coefficient and reduce the time it takes an action to complete. - Various buffs, talents and enchants do affect different action phases, and we'll have to examine them each, one by one: ATTACK PHASE DURATION: - it might come as surprise, but not a single 'attack speed' buff, talent, enchant or modal does affect this phase. - duration of this phase is affected only by your dexterity modifier: StatAttackSpeedMultiplier = 1f + (float)(dexterity - 10) / 33.3f AttackDuration = BaseAttackDuration / StatAttackSpeedMultiplier; RECOVERY PHASE DURATION: - is affected by armor penalties and all the buffs, items and enchants that do state that they do affect "attack speed". - these effects can be grouped in several major categories, namely: ArmorSpeedFactor AttackSpeedMultiplier RateOfFireMultiplier (ranged only) - and for non-spells (i.e. for auto-attacks, primary-attacks and full-attacks), the following are also factored in: MeleeAttackSpeedMultiplier (melee only) RangedAttackSpeedMultiplier (ranged only) Single1HWeapRecovFactor + SingleWeaponSpeedFactorAdj (otherwise) * How exactly these categories influence the final recovery duration check the tables below. RELOAD PHASE DURATION: - is affected by armor penalties and all the talents, buffs and modals that do state that they do affect "reload speed". Specifically there are only 4 of them: Gunner (talent), Sure-Handed Ila (chant), Swift Aim (modal) and Vicious Aim (modal). - Swift Aim and Vicious Aim are mutually exclusive (i.e. cannot be enabled at the same time) - Swift Aim suppresses Sure-Handed Ila's reloading speed bonus. ^ These are factored multiplicatively. E.g. a blunderbuss has 5s (or 150 frames) reloading duration. A character with Gunner talent, Swift Aim and 20 Dex, will have following reloading duration: ReloadDuration = 150 / (1.2 * 1.5) / 1.3 = 64 frames A chracter with Gunner talent, Vicious Aim and 5 Dex, will have following reloading duration: ReloadDuration = 150 / (1.2 * 0. / 0.85 = 184 frames So, these are all speed related categories: And this is how durations are computed: The referenced image is the one that contains weapon base values from the top post: http://i.imgur.com/QqMIkII.png P.S. #forthehistory: Obsolete attack/recovery system can be found here. BASHING SHIELDS SPEED: - bashing shield acts like a weapon in your offhand - attack with your offhand does not suffer from Single1HWeapRecoveryFactor penalty (i.e. your hand with bashing shields attacks and recovers as fast as an offhand dagger while dual-wielding) - attack with your main hand (while you have bashing shield in the offhand) still does suffer from Single1HWeapRecoveryFactor penalty. - 1h + bashing_shield does not benefit from Two-Weapon Style talent. But yes, it does benefit from Weapon and Shield Style. FULL ATTACK ACTION: Some abilities are marked as full-attack actions. What does this mean is: - if you have a [1h + nothing], [1h + shield] or [2h]: your action consists of: weapon_attack followed by weapon_recovery. - if you have [1h + 1h] or [1h + bashing_shield]: your action consists of: offhand_attack, followed by main_hand attack and mainhand_recovery. I.e. you deal damage with BOTH weapons, and offhand recovery is skipped completely. (that's why if you have two weapons, and one of them has speed enchant, it's better to place it in main hand) [1H + NOTHING] vs [1H + SHIELD] vs [1H + 1H]DW vs [1H + BASHING_SHIELD] Imagine a naked 10 DEX character in following situations: 1. DW daggers: {[delay + MH attack + MH recovery] -> [delay + OH attack + OH recovery]} 2. Dagger + Bashing Shield: {[delay + MH attack + MH recovery] + [delay + OH attack + OH recovery]} 3. Dagger + Simple Shield: {[delay + MH attack + MH recovery]} -> {[delay + MH attack + MH recovery]} 4. Dagger + Nothing: {[delay + MH attack + MH recovery]} -> {[delay + MH attack + MH recovery]} {} - repeating sequence [] - full action V1. There are no buffs: 1. DW daggers: {[5f + 20f + 16.66f] + [5f + 20f + 16.66f]} (i.e. 41.66 frames action for MH, and same for OH) 2. Dagger + Bashing Shield: {[5f + 20f + 33.33f] + [5f + 20f + 16.66f]} (i.e. 58.33 frames action for MH, and 41.66 for Shield) 3. Dagger + Simple Shield: {[5f + 20f + 33.33f]} -> {[5f + 20f + 33.33f]} (i.e. 58.33 frames action for MH) 4. Dagger + Nothing: {[5f + 20f + 33.33f]} -> {[5f + 20f + 33.33f]} (i.e. 58.33 frames action for MH) V2. DAoM: 1. DW daggers: {[5f + 20f + 0f] + [5f + 20f + 0f]} (i.e. 25 frames action for MH, and same for OH) 2. Dagger + Bashing Shield: {[5f + 20f + 16.66f] + [5f + 20f + 0f]} (i.e. 41.66 frames action for MH, and 25 for Shield) 3. Dagger + Simple Shield: {[5f + 20f + 16.66f]} -> {[5f + 20f + 16.66f]} (i.e. 41.66 frames action for MH) 4. Dagger + Nothing: {[5f + 20f + 16.66f]} -> {[5f + 20f + 16.66f]} (i.e. 41.66 frames action for MH) V3. Zero Recovery (assuming you have achieved it in all 4 cases): 1. DW daggers: {[5f + 20f + 0f] + [5f + 20f + 0f]} (i.e. 25 frames action for MH, and same for OH) 2. Dagger + Bashing Shield: {[5f + 20f + 0f] + [5f + 20f + 0f]} (i.e. 25 frames action for MH, and 25 for Shield) 3. Dagger + Simple Shield: {[5f + 20f + 0f]} -> {[5f + 20f + 0f]} (i.e. 25 frames action for MH) 4. Dagger + Nothing: {[5f + 20f + 0f]} -> {[5f + 20f + 0f]} (i.e. 25 frames action for MH) Summary: 1. [1H + Nothing] - at zero recovery, is the best crit-based dps option, as you deal damage at the same rate as DW, while also having +12 acc and +15% hit-to-crit conversion from One-Handed Style. - it is the hardest setup to achieve zero recovery with - it is the worst setup for full attacks (alongside with [1H + Simple Shield]) 2. [1H + Simple Shield] - at zero recovery, you deal damage at the same rate as DW, but also have a bonus of having a shield, plus extra def and reflex via Weapon and Shield Style talent - it is easier to achieve zero recovery than with [1H + Nothing] because durganized shield reduces 1H recovery penalty - it is the worst setup for full attacks (alongside with [1H + Nothing]) 3. [1H + 1H] DW - is the easiest setup to achieve zero-recovery and Two-Handed Style helps to do it even faster - can keep Vulnerable Attack, without losing zero-recovery - is the best setup for full attacks, as you will strike with both weapons 4. [1H + Bashing Shield] - is a better setup for full attacks, than [1H + Nothing] or [1H + Simple Shield]. It's especially great if it has any procs attached to it, like Barricade does. - allows you to benefit from Shield defences, Durgan Enchant:Shield and Weapon and Shield Style talent - have the same attack/recovery as of small offhand weapon while dual-wielding; but has a higher interrupt duration 0.5 instead of 0.35 - cannot be echanted with weapon quality enchants or lashes. - at zero recovery, it is a clear dps loss (from auto-attack perspective) when compared with any other alternative. But it can be used by non-dps tanks, on whom you'd like to have some special effect, if present. - this setup can provide a dps-gain over [1H + Simple Shield], but mostly in the early game and vs very low crush-DR monsters; and yeah the biggest gain would be if you have no recovery reducing means except DAoM potion. CREDITS: This article was a community effort. As such, thanks to all contributors, testers, motivators, those who gave ideas or spotted relevant errors. Especially to Kaylon and his Attack Speed 2.0 thread were it all started, AndreaColombo, Boeroer, Loren Tyr, Elric Galad, JerekKruger, and others)

Attack Speed Calculator version 1.0.5, PoE v3.06 compliant PREFACE: - When I have just introduced myself to PoE, I quickly noticed that something feels strange. Weapon tooltips are vague. Attack speed bonuses are providing non-uniform gains. Also there have appeared many questions when it came to the build optimizations. If you are interested in attack speed mechanics behind the game facade, than here it is, the aggregated info on this topic. NOTE: - This is still a WiP. Additional sections/explanations will be added over time. BASICS: - One of staple notions in PoE is [action]. Action is character's activity, be it a swing, pistol fire or spell cast. - Every action consists of minimum two phases: [attack] which included the attack animation per se, and [recovery] which role-playing speaking is the duration for your character catching his breath and getting ready for the next attack. - A specific set of ranged weapons, namely: crossbow, arbalest, pistol, blunderbuss and arquebus have an additional phase called [reloading] during which the character reloads the weapon in question. The phases go one after another. And visually a full action cycle can be presented in the following manner: RANGED: MELEE: * As you have noticed there is also a small delay between two actions. Tbh I haven't found any trace of it in the source code, but it's always there when you doing frapsing tests. It has a value of 5-7 frames which corresponds to 0.166-0.233 seconds. Most likely it is related to UnityEngine itself and the way it periodically checks for the events; with 1-2 frame variance coming from stuttering in case Unity was busy with something. BASE VALUES: - When trying to decide which weapon to choose, an important factor is how fast each weapon is. UI Tooltips are not providing the exact values. And those categories are actually quite inaccurate. So: WEAPON BASE VALUES: DRUID FORMS BASE VALUES: ANIMAL COMPANIONS BASE VALUES: Speadsheets: link P.S. If you want to check these base values yourself, feel free to use a simple mod I've made for this purpose. It will print some extra data in the combat log, each time any party member is performing an attack: (it will also 'catch' existing recovery modifying talents/buffs/armor; but unfortunately not the weapon enchants; at least not yet) Installation is quite simple, as it was made to work with IEMod Framework. - download IEMod. 5.1.0-beta Launcher for 2.03.0788 ZIP content preview will suit. - copy the INFOMod.pw.dll in the same /Mods folder, where IEMod.pw.dll is - launch PatchworkLauncher - add the mod in active mods (you can leave IEMod unchecked) - select "Launch with Mods" The dll can be downloaded here: INFOMod.pw.dll Or you can download the project itself: link

No. The formula for reloading duration is completely different. reloading_duration = base_reloading_duration / (1 + b1) / (1 + b2) / .. / (1 + bn) / (1 + bonus_dex) With those talents/dex you would get: reloading_duration = base_reloading_duration / 1.5 / 1.2 / 1.3 = base_reloading_duration * 0.42 In case of pistol that would mean 150 reloading frames => 64.

Nice Interesting what exactly will they choose from the list of rogue/barb suggestions ^^ (I mean besides Riposte) P.S. If Combusting Wounds are going to get fixed, it would be great to also update it's description, to know exactly how it is supposed to work. (i.e. deep mechanics) As of now, those 5 burning damage over 20s, could just be eaten by enemy DR. If CW follows the rules of any other DoT: 20s duration means that there are 7 ticks with a 3s interval, and the last 8th tick is dealt after 2s more, for 2/3 damage: ticks (s): 0, 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 18 | 20 damage: 5~= 0.65x7 + 0.43 And than those under 1 dmg ticks are going against 1/4 of target's burning DR...

Oh my Guys you do have valid points, and majority are right in a certain way. Except that dex is never useless. It keeps increasing your dps. But by how much exactly, and is it worthy to stack it, requires a longer explanation. Look, your dps is defined by how high do you hit, and by how fast are your hits delivered. Damage values aside, we are interested in the interval between two consecutive hits. This interval is as long as the duration of full action cycle, i.e.: [attack_phase + recovery_phase + reload_phase] plus inter-action delay. Dex reduces the duration of each action phase. And it does so from the very start (i.e. it doesn't "kick-in" once your recovery reaches zero). Example: Pistol (at 10 dex) has: 45 attack frames, 75 recovery frames and 150 reloading frames. So your shots will be delivered every 270 frames (+5-8 delay) At 20 dex it would become: 34.6 + 57.7 + 115.4 = 207.7 Now imagine if you had zero recovery: At 10 dex: 45 att + 150 rec = 195 frames At 20 dex: 34.6 att + 115.4 rec = 150 frames Yes, it's still a 30% speed up in action duration. (195 / 150 = 1.3) So far so good. But there are 3 rough moments. First: linear gain is subject to slight diminishing returns. Example: Going from 10 dex to 20, brings you from 270.0 frames to 207.7 Going from 20 dex to 30, brings you from 207.7 frames to 168.75 Where 207.7/168.75 = 1.23. I.e. you've got less relative gain, for the last 10 DEX points than you did for the first 10. ------ Second: the inter-action delay. The frapsing tests so fast have been quite controversial. Delay wasn't changing from 10 DEX to 40 DEX. Yet somehow it was going down to 1-2 frames on DEX over 300. But at the moment (and until more tests are performed) I chose to think that it is a static value of 5 + 0-3 overhead frames depending on how busy Unity was in meantime. What does it mean is, that (if delay is not affected by DEX) as more you speed-up the slightly lesser gain you get. It won't be that perceived in case of a slow reloading weapon, but let's take a dagger. At zero recovery and 10 DEX it would hit every [6-7 delay + 20 attack] frames. At zero recovery and 24 DEX it would hit every [6-7 delay + 14 attack] frames. That's a x1.3 gain instead of x1.42. Of course it's still good, but less than one could expect. ------ Third: opportunity cost. Imagine there are 4 characters, all wielding great swords (30 att, 50 rec): Andy, Bob, Charlie and Dave. Andy has 10 DEX and no speed buffs: 5d + 30 + 50 = 85 Bob has 20 DEX and no speed buffs: 5d + 23 + 38.5 = 66.5 Charlie has 3 DEX and zero recovery: 5d + 38 = 43 Dave has 20 DEX and zero recovery: 5d + 23 = 28 Erick has 10 DEX and zero recovery: 5d + 30 = 35 What Boeroer meant by flat numbers: is that even Charlie can be a somewhat decent (auto-attacking) dps'er despite his low DEX. Of course he is not that good as Dave, but he for sure is better than Bob who has ignored all the speed increasing stuff. And the opportunity cost I meantioned is: [28] vs [43] or [x1.50 efficient speed increase] vs [17 attribute points] and [28] vs [35] or [x1.25 efficient speed increase] vs [10 attribute points] So to resume: - Is DEX useless? A: No. - Can a 3 DEX character be a somewhat decent fighter? A: suddenly Yes. (but he needs zero recovery) - DEX is especially useful on reloading and hard-hitting ranged weapons. - Maxing DEX to the roof is of less priority on fast melee weapons, provided there are no high damage modifiers. I.e. non-rogues might want a more balances stat-spread when using daggers, stilettos, clubs, rapiers and alike.

Hmm. Their cost being 8 wounds make it look like this: Dichotomous Summon or 8 x Torment's Reach + talent point. That's no deal twins for me. Agreed with your choice. High Per and have stunning weapons? A: Enervating Blows (as the debuff is applied before the damage, and it will be easier to stun the target on the same hit). Otherwise: Turning Wheel for the extra damage.

^ At 30 fps and normal game speed, it does.

Made a quick check: - just critical focus - focus + gaze - focus + gaze + blessing Critical Focus does stack with both. Merciless Gaze doesn't stack with Dire Blessing. The later suppresses the former.

Most likely most of team were moved to the new project. Some designer plus few juniors might be left working on the minor, asset-related issues. But without programmers, they might not be able to tune the values, or fix the code which goes into Assembly-CSharp.dll. There goes stuff like: Riposte, def+reflex stacking on quick save/load, double proccing of spell-holding effects. Although that's just speculation and rationalization.

Well he's a fox So it kind of fits him. But, iirc, he has a lower Con. I was thinking to aggregate all the findings in a separate thread. But few more testings have to be done first. Also, I still don't know where does the inter-action delay come from. ---- update ---- Posted it here.

You are welcome Huh, interesting... Have checked and can confirm that:

Have tried a few. It seems that it was said wrong) - Pet attacks are considered single-weapon - Pet attacks suffer from a 40% armor penalty - They do benefit from Dex - Different companions have different Dex. Exact stats here. Indeed they are considered DW and cat/stelgaer forms attack the fastest. Although boar form potentially might be also worthy of class builders' attention, due to it's damage over time. P.S. More registered weapon data:

Who cares. I would consider even a wand barbarian aka ferocious fairy, if it would proc carnage

Well, statistically he might get interrupted once on a slow attack, or thrice on fast attacks that are three times faster. Another thing to consider: plate doesn't hinder dps of reloading weapons that much. And you could up DEX to 14 at the expense of Resolve. Btw, anyone knows how does interruption work exactly? I was under impression that when you get interrupted, a quick interruption animation is played. If you was going through attack phase you will have to start over again. If you was mid-recovery, you continue further. In any case the recovery duration is getting increased as interruption duration (those 0.5, 0.75 numbers from weapons) are appended to it's end. Or it's not so? Btw, I do like Boeror's suggestion for going DW in order to capitalize on FoD attacks. Two average melee weapons will provide dmg close to that of an arquebuss (depending on target DRs), on the full attacks. Double Whispers, double Resolutions, double Bittercuts or Shatterstar + Strikehard/Godansthunyr (for dwarf thematics) could work really well for that.

Viable? Yes. Optimal? Not sure... There are only two FoD attacks per encounter. This makes you want to use the slowest and the hardest-hitting weapons. Specifically arquebuses or at least pistols/arbalests. Actually you could use these weapons while standing in the frontline too and target the far standing ranged enemies, who tend to have lower deflection and lower fortitude (which is handy in case you will choose arbalests) So a variant could be: a frontline paladin with hard-hitting reloading weapons, who has high Con to compensate for the lack of shield (in easy-medium) encounters, who makes great use of FoD alpha-striking. And who is switching to 1h+shield tanking during boss encounters. High fort and reflex (i.e. high Con, Might and Dex) do greatly help at that. Although you'll have to monitor how does AI behave in the absence of disengagement penalty. Btw, you have mentioned several times that you like resolve for the provided concentration. But could you elaborate on why does the weapon speed matter?

So far, only two ways do come in mind: - either you get high Con to make him a main tank. A study fellow who will tank the dragons for you. With high fortitude and reflex. Resolve can be lowered to 10. And tbh you won't be missing those 5 deflection that much. - or you try to workaround some low defenses and capitalize on pain link and retaliation items.

Yeap. It's easier to note it that way. Or x5/3 for single weapon. x5/6 for dw. To be more exact: 20/33 for fast melee weapons 30/50 for average melee, slow melee and fast ranged weapons 45/75 for average, slow, very slow and extremely slow ranged weapons Yeah. To stay in touch with empirical tests, it should be 6 frames for daggers and 7-8 for sabres/ranged weapons... Found these values in the weapon asset files: Arquebus: float ReloadTime = 6.800000 (or 204 frames) Arbalest: float ReloadTime = 6.000000 (or 180 frames) Blunderbuss: float ReloadTime = 5.000000 (or 150 frames) Crossbow: todo For reference, frapsing has yielded: Arquebus: 189 frames Arbalest: 167 frames Blunderbuss: 150 frames And 0-15 frames error stays in limit of the aforementioned 0.5s threshold.

Good news guys, I've managed to patch the assembly dll and log the exact values for attack and recovery durations. Here they are (for some weapons, I had time to check so far): Few interesting things: - the game doesn't seem to use "frames" anywhere in the code. All durations are in seconds. - there is a consistent relation between attack and recovery duration, namely recovery factor. RecoveryFactor = 1.2 Single1HWeapRecovFactor = 0.5 - When you dual-wield, the default factor is used, and attack duration is divided by it in order to get the recovery duration (e.g. dw sabres: 1/1.2 = 0.833; dw daggers: 0.666/1.2 = 0.555). - When you have only one weapon equipped, an additional division by 0.5 is performed (e.g. War Bow: 1.5/1.2/0.5 = 2.5) And to answer one of my previous questions ("why does DEX doesn't affect reload duration uniformly, and why I was often getting results 0-12 frames off"): Because reloading animation is a looped one. The game periodically calls an Update() method and checks how much animation is there left to play. If it is less than hardcoded 0.5s than it sets the loop to false and plays one fragment more. Thus was emerging a possible 0-15 frames error in reloading duration. ToDo: - lookup for the inter-action delay. - check if attack phase has "animation-rounding" mechanism somewhere, like reloading phase does.

The tests do show that speed enchantment on a weapon, does affect only that hand/weapon. Also durgan-refined shield does provide extra 15% to the main hand. The main benefit of DW is that you already start with a 50% bonus, and have access to Two-Handed Style talent. Which might be important in the early-mid game, before you could durganize the equipment.

I am probably blind... I have inspected every single asset from the /assetbundles/prefabs/objectbundle/global.unity3d bundle. Have found weapon clips/audiobanks, textures, world time, etc; but couldn't find any AttackData like base attack time, base recovery time, the overridden values for Single1HWeapNoShieldAccuracyBonus and alike...

Just checked it ingame. If you'll mouseover the damage value from the tooltip, it will display: 30 base +5 every 3 levels after 1. That's not quite true. I've checked the values on each level (at 10 MIG / 10 INT): lvl 1: 30 lvl 2: 30 lvl 3: 30 lvl 4: 40 lvl 7: 50 lvl 10: 60 lvl 13: 70 lvl 16: 80 It's actually +10 --------- And here are some enemies hp (on potd) taken from bestiary, for reference: - Unstable Construct: 165 - Rotting Flesh Construct: 627 - Fampyr: 480 - Battery Shieldwall/Defender: 142 - Animated Weapon: 206 - Adra Animat: 220 It is still so. The Dazed effect from Interdiction gets +25 acc bonus. The Weakened effect from Painfull Interdiction gets only +15 acc bonus. Without Empowered Interdiction both have +15.

Na, I didn't confuse it. I've checked both spell tooltip and Suen's explanation before posting ^^ The original spell has an AoE radius, and is capable of hitting multiple targets (even through not simultaneously). That's why I do refer to it as AoE spell. I do totally understand that it should not hit 4 targets in the same instance of time. And indeed that x2 effect does not account for it. But to check a wild guess: did you see in slow-mo, all 4 being hit right at the same moment, or first two targets are hit and 1s later the other two? If so, it could be related to intellect. And it would be interesting to test this at 9, 11, 21 and 31 INT. I understand your argument. But, uhm, don't find it completely fire-proof. Because original Soul Shock spell damages those around the target. While original Returning Storm damages those around the caster. So RS proc may or may not be centered around the target.