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I guess that's why Obsidian didn't bother. I just think it super unbalanced that ciphers get 10 focus, Paladins et al. get 1 Zeal and Wizard/Druid/Chanter get 1 spell use per spell tier (wtf?). I personally would change Brilliant to +5 INT and +3 to all PL (upgrade from Acute which does +1 PL). Problem solved, still great buff and not much work. But I can already hear the lament.

@Phenomenum: Wait, before I vote: I thought the duration that SoT adds is not affected by neither INT nor Power Level? Has that changed? I don't think so... If not: why nerf it in the first place? The SoT+Brilliant cheese is not caused by SoT, it's caused by Brilliant. Next you'd have to nerf Wall of Draining... If you want to nerf something it's Brilliant. Just make it a bit slower for spell replenishment (12 secs instead of 6) so that you can't chain SoT anymore. Remember that Brilliant replenishes only 1 resource (like Discipline) per 6 seconds but 1 spell use for ALL spell levels. This is not fair at all AND is the problem that causes the SoT/WoD/Brilliant cheese.

I did. If you make a dedicated trinket for every Priest subclass and not make it swappable this will lead to a situation where a Priest of Magran always stays with this trinket. Wasn't our motivation to invent trinkets that the Priest (and Druid) always picks the same spells and doesn't have the flexibility that a Wizard has? He will then again not use Prayers/Litanies and otehr spells which are more situational and so on. I thought giving several (different) trinkets that provide some bonus spells that you can cast and which are swappable would solve this exact problem. Why complicated? If the bonus spells just get added to your spell portfolio (like Grimoirs do it) you don't get access to those spells unless you have the right Power Level. So if there's a PL 8 spell on the trinket but you are PL 6 you can't cast it (yet). I don't want to add the spells as 1/encounter abilites because it causes problems. I'd like them to be like grimoires "light" with fewer spells (because priests (and druid) already get bonus spells at level up) and other nice bonuses like we write above.. Yes, but those are a) crap and b) not class specific. The intentional idea with trinkets was that every class gets special ones. As I said I would keep it smiple and maybe only do ones that alter passives or so. Like +10% to Sneak Attack or stuff like that. Obviously this has very low priority... Concerning auto-casts: ok. I find the idea nice but it may be a bit too good.

By the way I would have no problem with basic, non-swappable trinkets for every class. If we keep it real simple and don't devide by subclasses (e.g. trinket for Fighters just improves one single ability like raise Armored Grace from 25% to 30% or just gives +1 discipline or adds a single passive) then I think it wouldn't be too much work... They don't need modals, just an icon and short description. Maybe I would make them all about altering passives as the general approach?

@Phenomenum: I don't know if I want to follow a too rigid pattern with the priests' trinkets. Your examples are cool - but you already see upcoming problems due to the structural uniformity: e.g. you can't immediately find fitting auto-casts for every subclass. Which is a minor problem of course, but still... Since trinkets can be very different in shape and effect I think we should emphasize on that. I'm totally in for giving each Priest subclass a special trinket though. One that contains the additional spiritual weapon. But maybe they don't need to all follow the same pattern? One the other hand it's much easier to actually finish this stuff if we follow such a rigid pattern you suggested. Use it as a guideline. And as you said: it's better to do something than to endlessly speak about it and not knowing what we want to do actually. So maybe we take this as a good starting point and see where it's going. Nobody will stop use from adding more (and more "unique" or "weird") trinkets later (like relics from the church's saints or something like univeral prayerbook that only contains prayers/litanies) or to change the behaviour of the initial ones after actual playtesting. So - cool. Let's see what my take on this would be: First of all I would like to be able to switch those trinkets from Quick Slots like you can with grimoires. Did you plan to make them "fixed" or non-swappable during encounter? Most spells you suggested so far are nice. What about PL 8 and 9 stuff for SC priests? I feel we should at least include one spell of 8 or 9 per trinket. But I would add the bonus spells like a grimoire does it: you add the spell to your actual portfolio but you don't gain a spell use. So no 1/encounter stuff. Because I guss those also wouldn't scale with PL, right? Since cast from items and not cast from character. However, a trinket may add a spell use to spell tiers - for example if the bonus spells are a PL 2 spell and a PL 5 spell the trinket could grant one additional spell use of PL 2 and one of PL 5. Then you are not as "locked" into using those exact spells in every encounter. I mean IF you want to allow a bonus spell use in the first place. Wizards only get this through the whole spell tier board from Grimoire of Vaporous Wizardry - and it's OP basically. Rymrgand: spiritual weapon: I'd vote for a two handed battle axe. He seems to be all about axes - his minotaurs have them and so on. bonus spells: Iconic Projection (healing is not Rymrgand's favorite domain), Winter Wind (PL 1), Hailstorm (PL 4) auto cast: maybe "Entropy" on knock out? I fits so beautifully and you don't need to create a foe-only version of Freezing Pillar. auto-cast alternative: when receiving crit in combat: retaliate with Kalakoth's Sunless Grasp or Fetid Caress (1/encounter)? Gaun: spiritual weapon: a scythe (weapon proficiency pollaxe). I fear there's no model for this (maybe there are Roparu who have scythes)? But it would be so good for reaping and all... Lord Darryn's Voulge would maybe the closest that we have when it comes to "scythish" blades. auto-cast: Watchful Presence a the start of combat? or instead give higher light radius even without a lantern or St. Drogga's Skull? Woedica: spiritual weapon: Executioner's sword (use the model of Naga Great Swords which looks fitting, weapon proficiency Great Sword). spiritual weapon alternative: scepter (I mean rulership and queen and all that) auto-cast: Searing Seal when bloodied (burned queen) (1/encounter)? Wael: auto-cast: is Shadowing Beyond that easy? Where/how do you place the target? I would suggest Smoke Veil. Skaen: spiritual weapon: no additional - Skaen already got his two PoE-weapons (stiletto and club). What he lost was his Lesser Sneak Attack (+20%). I would give him that as passive - but non-scaling. spiritual weapon alternative: whip ("today my master chokes on his own whip"). Or chain. Weapon proficiency flail. Unfortunately we don't have whip models. But maybe one can turn flail heads invisible? Would look cool maybe? Berath: spiritual weapon: single mace in main hand. Dual wielded mace is kind of weird and also if somebody wants to play a "Pallid Knight" sort of priest mace and shield make more sense. Makes room for some cool summoned/non summoned weapon setups. auto-cast: Finger of Death on knockout would be so cool. Wouldn't even be very powerful since it's unlikely that the enemy is near death as well. But if he is... Barring Death's Door seems to be too good? It comes with Nemnok's Cloak as well. auto-cast: Reviving Exhortation on knockout on self (possible)? 1/encounter. Refuses to stay dead like several Death Guards have done (in PoE as well as in Deadfire).

Now stop it already. Else I have to spend all my limited likes for today on you.

Most mature post of today - and I guess at least of the whole next week, too. Not that I generally dislike immature stuff... just saying.

I agree. Also good point pro trinkets (vs. additonal "native" ability): you'd need to spend an ability point on the latter while you would get it "for free" with the trinket. What we do want achieve is to give Priests and Druids a bit of the advantages that Wizards have with grimoires (not the same ones because Priests and Druids already get bonus spells). So more "unique" thigs in trinkets is cool with me. But I'm not opposed to adding a native ability that adds a second spiritial weapon choice either. I mean it's not that most players woul choose both spiritual weapon options I guess...? But leaning towards "additional spiritual weapons on trinkets". You can do a lot of awesome stuff with a trinket (adding a bit of description, a "theme", even a bit of lore or story if you want). Adding an additional ability to the tree is just that. Quite limited experience all in all. One could do one "spiritual weapon" trinket for every subclass, sure. And nothing says they couldn't look like mini-versions of the weapons or something. Or a magranite priest's essay about warfare that contains the spell - whatever.

Afaik DID is just the newer, more accurate and scientific term for what was once named Multiple Personality Disorder.

@Phenomenum: Yes, something like that. To bring back a bit of PoE nostalgia (and options for Priests). Just an idea though - but since our trinkets are not yet set in stone and we might need some more ideas for trinkets in general... @AndreaColombo: would also be a possibility. I was just searching for more "themes" for trinkets. To make them unique and interesting. I do miss my Priest of Magran with an Arquebus.

@Phenomenum: I asked because of the post above (that I wrote yesterday).

@Phenomenum: Do you know if it's possible to add the visual effects of the spiritual weapons to other weapons models via mod? In order to create otjer variants of spiritual weapons? I read about that Aldris Blade of Captain Crow sabre i the mod forum (the one whose grip'n stuff looks like a chicken ribcage with wings) and for example the wings could be made invisible. So... I guess there are some things that one can do...?

So, you'll never accidentially play a Tactician? Brilliant is by far the strongest of all inspirations - I think nobody denies that. Why it replenishes 1 spell use of each tier per tick is totally beyond me. Who thought that this would be a balanced 3rd INT inspiration tier? Then they realised that it might be a bit strong when auddenly all those "unlimited resources" Chanter/X builds popped up - but instead of nerfing Brilliant (e.g. making it slower for spell regeneraion - or just giving it a high PL bonus instead) they took it away from the Chanter (and nerfed tons of other stuff that was not nearly as OP - Baubles of the Fin whoohee). Then they put in on a cloak and designed a whole subclass around that... SoT wouldn't be so OP if Brilliant wouldn't allow to spam it in less than 10 sec. If Brilliant would instead replenish 1 single spell use per tick (like Blood Sacrifice) there would be not much of a problem. Or if it didn't tick every 6 secs but ever 12 (for spells - for resources 6 secs is fine). This SoT/Brilliant or Wall of Draining/Brilliant abuse is so obvious - I don't get why nobody at Obsidian saw this coming. This is the first thing I think about when reading about a spell that prolongs buffs for 10+ seconds and an effect that makes you regain spell uses every 6 secs. Now all Ultimate runs either include Tactician or Shroud of the Phantasm... I wonder why...?

The problem is Brilliant, not Salvation of Time.

https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0039279 It basically says that you can determine if somebody fakes that disorder or not - with neurobiology.

Schizophrenia and Multiple Personality Disorder are two completely different things. Both are very real things though.

Yes, you would need to reinstall. Adding mods to your game is pretty easy. Search for the "override" folder in your Deadfire directory and place the mod folder in there.

Back to trinkets: how about some that bring back the good old Priest weapons from PoE1? In PoE a Priest of Magran could get +10 ACC with Sword and Arquebus, Wael got Quarterstaff and Rod, Berath Great Sword and Mace, Eothas Morningstar and Flail and so on. Most spiritual weapons in Deadfire miss one of those. Magran got Sword + Pistol (why?) but no arquebus, Berath Great Sword (no Mace), Wael has Rod (no Quarterstaff)... So what about trinkets that add a spell like "Spiritual Mace" for a Priest of Berath for example (same bonuses)? Only question is: would it be possible to achieve the same look? And if not: is that a problem?

They kept stiletto AND club from the PoE Priest of Skaen. Would have been cool to make two spiritual weapon spells per Subclass: e.g. Spiritual Sword and Spiritual Arquebus for Magran. If you want both you'd have to pick both. Then you'd have the same options as in PoE bus consistent with Deadfire. Hm... maybe worth a mod. Although I don't know if you could replicate the "spiritual weapon look" for weapons like arquebus, quarterstaff etc.

Berserker/Stalker gets +3 AR when frenzied, even +4 vs. pierce/slash/crush with Thick Skinned. That is a lot if you combine it with a decent armor. The Confusion can get resisted with Devil of Caroc's Breastplate or Modwyr - or lots of Luminous Lobster. Self damage is rel. ok if you use Savage Defiance. Corpse Eater/Stalker also fits thematically - but I guess Furyshaper woul be more effective. Don't pick Furyshaper/Ghost Heart: Wards count as summons as does the animal companion. You only can have one summon on the field at a time...

Sure they are. Didn't you get the memo?

Most of those All of those things above affect all characters and creatures, be it allies or enemies. A few are cipher specific (Pain Link, Amplified Wave, Mindweb, Tactical Meld) So one could make the argument that all classes are weaker if you compare them to PoE1. But so are the enemies. Overall the gameplay was made slower and all CC effects (including enemies') were made less impactful.

I don't have that impression. On PotD at least (where PEN issues are common) Ciphers are on par with Wizards due to certain key abilites such as +PEN passives and powers - and of course because they are the only class that can "spam" effective Mind Control which still is the most effective CC option in the game. Besides that they also are able to buff themselves up pretty nicely (e.g. Psychovampiric Shield, Borrowed Instincts, Time Siphon) and others (Ancestor's Memory ftw). Also when soloing o PotD (where fights take a lot longer) it's way easier with a Cipher since he can replenish his resources while Wizards(exept Bloodmage), Fighters (except Tactician), Paladins, Barbarians, Druids, Rogues and Priests cannot. They are also more fun than in PoE1 for me - because the subclasses influence the way you play your Cipher a lot more that Wizard's subclasses change the way you play your Wizard. Beguiler, Soulblade, Ascendant and Psion have pretty unique changes to their mechanic or role in combat. Also while they start with less focus, the generation of focus is much faster, especially if you take Draining Whip (which even doubles it). And attack/casting time got increased for everybody, that's not putting he cipher apart from the rest. In fact with a patch those initial long casting times got reduced so that the cipher is one of the "casters" with the fastest offensive spell pool on average (casting time and recovery combined). They work very well with muticlassing - but are also very good as single class characters. Reasons for that are the truly great passives of the highest power levels but also some very strong powers like Driving Echoes (which, cast on your party's nuker, makes a huge difference), Time Siphon (which stacks with itself to ridiculous amounts as long as you can infect a lot of enemies with one cast - especially bonkers with Ascendant) and Reaping Knives (which is especially crazy if you use with with a Soul Blade). Wizards have the HUGE advage over all other classes that they have potential access to all spells via grimoire and grimoire switching. You don't need to pick up a single spell at level up to be able to cast them. Just equip up tp 6 grimoires and get 12 free spells at your disposal. At level up only pick passives if possible or non-wizard-stuff if you are multiclassing just pick the good stuff from the second class. That's why I would argue that, generally speaking, a Wizard is more suited for multiclassing than a Cipher (although there are exceptions like Soulblade getting a boost from Rogue for example).

We are doing that with the upcoming "Community Patch" (it's basically a mod) which not only fixes some leftover bugs (as long as fixable by modding), polishes some abilities (includes mild buffs and also nerfs, based on a community poll), adds unique icons for all passive abilities but also will introduce some trinkets for priests and druids (which you'll be able to get rel. early in the game). And while will be based on grimoire mechanics, they don't give the exact same bonuses (+2 spells per PL - since both classes already gain a bonus spell per PL) but can grant a broader variety of bonuses such as +Power Level for certain keywords, some bonus spells (fitting the theme of the trinket - e.g. prayerbook) and so on. More about that in the "Deadfire Polishing" threads (discussion thread and poll). Those things will be spread out to seperate mods though (basic polishing, extended polishing, passive icons, trinkets...) so that you can decide what you want to use and what not.

Maybe... maybe not. I know a lot of people, non-religious and religious (no fanatics though), and none of them decides between "like you" or "dislike you" based on that. But I'm living in a bubble - so maybe it's true in general. Additionally: Xoti's is not even a real religion. Reactions to that should be a bit softer. She may be zealous, but it's not dominating her. She is a bit ridiculous though. Still: if I would be an atheist (I am) and because of that would dislike religious characters/people (I don't) I'd still have to distinguish between "I don't like the character because she is religious" and "she's badly written".