Elric Galad

After 2.03, the problem with fighters has been slightly reduced. They are still UP compared to paladins and monks, but now it is mostly due to their excellent WM new abilities (iron wheel, dichotomous soul and immolation). What fighter currently misses the most is this.

Rogues and Rangers have both a couple of spike abilities but most of their DPS is completely sustainable. What they miss is durability (even if pet is a decent offtank with infinite health in 2.0+). Monk are really cool as "durable" DPS by the way. They really rock and have a lot of great abilities. But I don't think they're on par with rangers and rogues, especially because their DPS is a bit conditional. On another topic, I think ranger'pet should be added to ranger's damages count. Currently they are not (tested) and it's misleading to calculate the true DPS of rangers.

Hey good work ! I'm not sure to be enthusiastic about immunities ^^, but it's good to see the game keeping evolving.

The fact that rogue could defeat rogue at 1vs1 does not mean he/she has more dps. You are seriously understimating pet by the way. Wolf does almost as much damage as a 2-hander and can stack 175% bonus damage with 8DR bypass on endgame. That is for sure not on par with rogues (120% bonus from abilities + strength + magic weapons + crit), but rangers also does damage (twin arrows...). And pet is currently a good offtank too (yes, also in potd), at least as much as melee rogue. So don't tell me it gets killed everytime.

Prone immunity is a real serious concern because it affects fighter and monk crowd control (and ranger's pet). This makes their CC circonstancial and renders one of their (few) abilities useless in many cases. A single boss with immunity is not a pb, but an entire category of ennemies is one. Wizard, cipher, druids and cipher also have prone abilities but they are able to cast other spells...

Good thing I beat the Adra Dragon before this patch then, because I have no idea what kind of strategy I'd use with all those immunities. Paralysis (fetid caress, hold beast - dragon is a beast), stun (storm or ranger double shots)... maybe confusion... stil a couple of tricks can work.

"Good Old Vessel status immunity" would kill the fun. "Adra dragon status immunity" would kill the party.

I have just decided that I am NOT going to install the 2.03 in my current playthrough. My concerns are about CC immunities for 2 reasons : I am not sure my current party would have the tools to kill some boss (basically Adra dragon) if immune to all CC. A couple of immunities is not a problem. This would be less a concern without those stupid insta-kill Adra dragon attack... Second is more about fun to play : if a type of CC used by one of my martial character (currently that means Stun and Stuck from my ranger) is too frequently resisted, it would kill the fun of the builds I've made. I'll check again when you will have a list. I'm currently having fun with my party, I don't want to take the risk to loose this.

I have just looked at the 2.03 patch note... Honnestely, I am a bit disappointed by fighter changes. They are still subpar compared to monks (and their new iron wheel that makes them superior tanks...). Obs just turned a few useless skills into mehish skills. Of course it's a bit better but I still can't think in a reason to include a fighter in my party.

And salty mast price increase for death godlike ! Not for fire godlike by the way. Some like it hot. It does not fit Obs will to have maximum build flexibility. But more specific dialogues would have been fun.

There are 2 different problems with casters : versatility and raw power. Vesatility by itself would not be such a problem without immunities. It could be counterbalanced by less raw power (or lower ressources). Versatility is caster's trademark and it should stay like this. However, increasing the advantage of versatility by introducing immunities does not sound very good for me. For caster CC, I think the problem is more about a few spells that everyone knows: Confusion Call to slumber (IMHO, this one is the winner, better than Gaze in most cases. It is just too convenient.) Gaze of the Adragan Ringleader Amplified wave Relentless storm Repulsing seal (crazy accuracy) Those plus slicken spamming from level 9. Single target spells are less a trouble. It's not even their durations, it is that they are just too reliable. Graze mechanism is one of the biggest problem here... Nerfing the accuracy of AoE CC may solve this issue. But honnestly, as long as I stick to "low rest" meta, it is not so much a concern... except maybe for per encounter spells... but that's another topic. Currently, I just play in PotD without wizard, and that basically makes the game more interesting.

+1 for melee druids. I believe that Priest can be OK too. Priest can wield a shield without affecting too much his/her spell casting. A priest specialized in Buff needs only some Intelligence and a bit of dexterity. Might is for healing spells, but they are not that much important IMHO (They are sometimes useful, but not as much as buff spells). As long as you don't target foes, you will not need Perception. As you don't need so much other stats, you can allocate some points to Resolve. Skaen priest can have a talent that give them Baby Sneak Attack and +10 Accuracy with Clubs and Stylettos. I don't say it would be optimal, but at least it would work. After all, Durance has 19 Resolve...

I strongly suspect that this thread is coming from Trolloland by the way ! "My hyperoffensive character is UP because he died once in PotD Trial of Iron" does not seem a real concern.

In PotD trial of Iron, melee rogue may not be viable. But seriously, the game is not balanced for trial of Iron.

CC is for Crowd Control. "Crowd Control" are spells or effects that disable ennemies or weaken their offensive capabilities. For example, paralysis or blindness are crowd control effects. CC immunities means for example that an ennemy could be immune to charm or blind effects. Don't worry. I'm not a native english speaker either. But not understandind "CC" only means that you're not a "native gamer forum" speaker ^^

It sounds good, not OP. I'm just concerned about CC immunities for martial class : a caster could just choose another spell, but martials would "loose" some of their abilities against some monsters. They already have few so it could be a problem.

You just don't know how to play if you don't think rangers are good. It's not like you were using arguments to prove your point. Pet's damage is currently great, and their survivability is far enough if you can properly manage them or buff them. The aggressiveness of your expression seems to indicate you're not exactly a rational person anyway. So I'm not going to bother arguing with you. Your topic might not be stupid, by the way. But I sincerely doubt that debating with you could lead to any interesting exchange about balance.

This is an interesting topic. Basically, I miss the BG2 legendary items and how some builds were a bit OP. I appreciate also the more modern approach of balance in PoE where all class are more or less equal. I do miss multiclass powergaming builds. I like having a lot of choices for party composition without feeling gimped by subpar options. Finally, I'm running in parallel BG2 and PoE runs so I can get enough balance and imba stuff at the same time.

They should just add an option to turn off per encounter spells. Obsidian will never find a solution that makes everyone happy. Everyone has its own opinion. Better to let players decide. It is a single player game, after all.

By the way chanter scales horribly for now and is a bit UP. They are also quite boring to play (which is the main problem if you want a character as fun as good old bard). You CAN summon a dragon except you are able to do it only once or twice... It was my first PC and I never included one again in my party. However, chanter class concept is really nice. So maybe one day, they will be fixed and will be really fun...

Mine has might 14, dex 15 and per 15. It is working fine in PotD. I think Dex is nice for melee cipher because might stacks additively with other bonus damage (cipher got a lot of them) while dex stack multiplicatively. Your cipher will probably do slighly less melee damage (so less focus) but will have slightly better spell damage and Crowd Control. He wears a leather armor and gets knockdowned from time to time but it's ok. Shield reduce your DPS (and focus), I would avoid it, but it is probably viable. For talent, draining whip is a must, interrupting blow unecessary (but with high per, it is indeed nice) and bloody slaughter is meh. Superior deflection is also great for any melee. Soulbound weapons works with ANY weapon focus. You don't have to take peasant weapons, it might not be the best focus. But if you keep single handed style, there is one totally customizable spear that is great ; you can get it only if you choose a specific story option, so if you mind to spoil I suggest you to googlelize it.

Anyone knows what White March part 2 will be about ? Readceras and finding out what was the mess about St Waiden could have nice. But just for an expansion. A farmer land converted in a theocracy does not seem to be too attractive.

Go Sagani. Spam echopsychic echo on Ituumak, which is basically a damaging leash. Send it behind the lines. It's called the dog walker cipher build. Plus : did you ever played with a mother of 5 children in your party ? Yeah giving birth is pretty epic.

Ressource usage is the major topic of gamedesign nowadays. Take the example of how Diablo 3 failed miserably at creating different ressources : they are all just mana variants. PoE had some nice ideas. Monks design was very criticized in the beginning, but it's now very well accepted. Ciphers are cool. Chanters are cool too, but their scaling is broken. Yes, it's very hard to design original ressource mechanics that are not too "circonstancial". I loved cooldown, especially in Guild Wars 1. This could have been included in PoE. The only things that currently look like CD are chanters... And people backed for BG nostalgia. It might be a "mispelled wish" but it's what they wanted. I like the vancian system, maybe for bad reasons but I like it. It is in line with my meta, so I feel it is ok. There might be different playstyle, of course. I don't hope so much for PoE changes, but there might be one day a PoE mod that will just be the most perfect design ever... let's hope...

Except paladin's aura are spell like abilities that does not stack with spells. Paladin's aura are far better than any other martial class abilities. As an example, monks gets +2 speed for 1 ability, paladin gets +2 party wide for 1 ability. On the other hand critical focus is a passive that stacks with everything. 5% party wide hit to crit is a decent passive. Not incredible of course, but decent.