Moar Godlikes!

[Pallegina's Panties]

I mean, the possibilities are almost endless here. Like we have Earth(Nature) and Fire, but no Wind/Air/Lightning. Water? And since we have Avian you could have things like Reptilian and whatnot.

[injurai]

We aren't getting more options for player characters. We are getting new/better godlike heads and portraits.

 

I could see each existing theme getting expanded with maybe like you said, and Earth/Terra theme for nature. Or perhaps a different biome for nature. But adding new types means more writing paths. Which doesn't scale well for the team. So anything new will likely be a companion like Takehu or an NPC.

[Pallegina's Panties]

Well, that's a victory in itself, I guess. More heads (and more importantly, portraits that fit them).

[Messier-31]

I mean, the possibilities are almost endless here. 

 

Nope.

 

11 deities, 11 godlike types possible only.

 

But there will be no new godlikes in the game.

[Quillon]

I get a lil triggered when I see people don't get that this is a direct sequel with the same protag, not sure its the case here but as long as The Watcher is the main character for the games to come there won't be new godlikes/priest deities/paladin orders/spiritshift forms/animal companions/base classes/cultures/backgrounds for player character. 

 

There are nuff variety imo, its better they better/differentiate/facelift the current options.

[blotter]

Nope.

 

11 deities, 11 godlike types possible only.

 

It is true that the possibilities aren't endless, but if Tekehu is really an Ocean Godlike or whatever, that sets a precedent for different godlike based on individual portfolios. Since each god has 6-9 portfolios (potentially 10, depending on how things went in the White March expansions), that's room for a lot of different varieties of Godlike. Of course, in some cases, these varieties would become increasingly absurd, like Door Godlike, Apprentice Godlike, and Language Godlike, and others might be too abstract, like Relentlessness Godlike, Inevitability Godlike, Memory Godlike, or Invention Godlike. There's also the redundant ones, like Ocean Godlike vs Tide Godlike, Light Godlike vs Dawn Godlike, Cold Godlike vs Winter Godlike, Hunt Godlike vs Pursuit Godlike, and so on, but even taking all these cases into account that's still dozens more possible.

 

That's actually why I was terribly thrilled with the news that Tekehu was going have his own unique Godlike type because of the above: once you start parsing out different types of Godlike for the same god, it seems like it'd be hard to draw a non-arbitrary line on where to stop. That's also why I prefer more variety in appearance and racial talent options for the existing types rather than escalating subdivision of types in the vein of D&D elves and their myriad subraces in settings like the Forgotten Realms (edit: although on further consideration, I think the Godlike already have a comparable number of different types). 

 

Incidentally, the guidebook doesn't even specify these existing types as established categories and basically suggests there's an almost unbounded range of variation amongst them outside of some basic constants like having humanoid body structures and weird heads. In that sense, the concept of specific Godlike types may be more a matter of game convenience and subjective observer classifications that might vary from place to place rather than anything that represents the fundamental nature of the Godlike themselves.

Edited July 28, 2017 by blotter

[Sedrefilos]

Well, no new player Godlikes (as we know from day 1), but there is a water godlike companion.

[Heijoushin]

I wasn't a great fan of Godlikes in Pillars 1. Firstly because of the visuals and secondly because they seemed very "tacked on" to the story. However, having seen the new fire Godlike artwork (which looks super badass), I'm a bit more keen. And more options is always good.  

 

I think they stated somewhere that they were originally going to make more in Pillars 1 (perhaps for every God?) but it was cut down to the present types due to limited development time. 

 

I'd personally like to see a Rymrgand Ice Godlike or a Abydon Metal Godlike. 

[Pallegina's Panties]

The visuals are only "bad" in the original game because of how limited the actually customization is.

 

I hope they don't just stick you with a pre-packaged head and be done with it in the sequel, but actually allow you to pick a base head and then you have the various bits (such as horns and other bits and pieces) to pick from like how the other races pick from hairstyles. Or in the case of Nature Godlikes actually allow you to pick hairstyle rather than it being pre-set by the choice of head...

 

Oh and facial hair - how cool wouldn't it be to have a male Fire Godlike with a flowing, fiery beard?

[injurai]

I don't think anyone actually defends the 3D models as being "good" in the first game. We managed.

[smjjames]

 

I mean, the possibilities are almost endless here. 

 

Nope.

 

11 deities, 11 godlike types possible only.

 

But there will be no new godlikes in the game.

 

 

Which god would the nature godlike be for though? Galawain has an association with nature, but that's just by dint of being the patron of carnivores. There isn't any deity that specifically represents nature.

 

 

Well, no new player Godlikes (as we know from day 1), but there is a water godlike companion.

 

There has been some speculation that Takehu is actually a Galawain godlike, since there's already an Ondra godlike, the Moon godlike.

 

 

 

The visuals are only "bad" in the original game because of how limited the actually customization is.

 

I hope they don't just stick you with a pre-packaged head and be done with it in the sequel, but actually allow you to pick a base head and then you have the various bits (such as horns and other bits and pieces) to pick from like how the other races pick from hairstyles. Or in the case of Nature Godlikes actually allow you to pick hairstyle rather than it being pre-set by the choice of head...

 

Oh and facial hair - how cool wouldn't it be to have a male Fire Godlike with a flowing, fiery beard?

 

That kind of customization would definetly be awesome, though no hint or word of that so far.

Edited July 29, 2017 by smjjames

[Heijoushin]

The visuals are only "bad" in the original game because of how limited the actually customization is.

 

I hope they don't just stick you with a pre-packaged head and be done with it in the sequel, but actually allow you to pick a base head and then you have the various bits (such as horns and other bits and pieces) to pick from like how the other races pick from hairstyles. Or in the case of Nature Godlikes actually allow you to pick hairstyle rather than it being pre-set by the choice of head...

 

Oh and facial hair - how cool wouldn't it be to have a male Fire Godlike with a flowing, fiery beard?

 

Yeah, I would definitely sign up for a fiery beard. It would be nice to have enough parts that each custom character feels unique. 

 

Which god would the nature godlike be for though? Galawain has an association with nature, but that's just by dint of being the patron of carnivores. There isn't any deity that specifically represents nature.

 

Pretty sure that the nature godlike is for Galawain. Each of the deities have multiple associations. Galawain is carnivores, the hunt, nature etc.

[TheisEjsing]

Less godlikes! Is what I'd rather want. PoE had too many godlikes for my taste. They're are supposed to be rare, but every other backer npc was a godlike. I don't say OE should stop exploring godlikes, their lore and different variaties, but hopefully without all the backer npcs, there won't be so many of them all over the place. 

Oh yeah, and it would be cool if a few more of those remaining in PoE 2 were involved in quests.

[Pallegina's Panties]

... that's not what I meant when I said "moar Godlikes".

 

I do however agree with you - but you should blame the Backers for wanting their NPC to be "kewl and speushl", not the Godlikes themselves. If you look outside of Backer NPCs, they are indeed rare. In fact I can really only think of one on the top of my head - the Death Godlike who gives you the ring to get into the VIP room at the whorehouse.

[smjjames]

There's also Gramrfel the Wayfarer, that wierdo death godlike who can meet you at the crossroads of Magrans Fork after first visiting Defiance Bay. Also, I think one of this companions can also be a moon godlike, not sure. I looked at the godlike category on the PoE wiki and there are also two bounty targets who are godlikes.

 

Apart from the bounties, yeah, that older drunk and Gramrfel the Wayfarer are the only non-backer godlike characters that I know of.

[Pallegina's Panties]

There is also of course

 

 

Raedric v2.0

 

 

although I'm not sure if he is actually transformed into a Death Godlike or... something else. His Fampyr underlings, as well as his return from the grave seems to say otherwise but visually he does fit the part.

[Baltic]

There is also of course

 

 

Raedric v2.0

 

 

although I'm not sure if he is actually transformed into a Death Godlike or... something else. His Fampyr underlings, as well as his return from the grave seems to say otherwise but visually he does fit the part.

Raedric is a deathguard. You meet one down in the endless paths and it has the same model as Raedric. Whilst I don't have it on hand I think it's beastiary entry says it's a type of undead that comes back due to strong zeal or something similar

 

[blotter]

 

 

Galawain has an association with nature, but that's just by dint of being the patron of carnivores. There isn't any deity that specifically represents nature.

 

While being the god of the hunt, predatory beasts, and assassins is primarily what he's known for, that isn't the extent of his connection to nature. Galawain is specifically the god of the wilderness and the guardian of such areas. He's also responsible for the creation of the Great Western Stag, so the Nature Godlike's greater resemblance to prey animals isn't necessarily proof that they aren't related to him.

 

That said, I have seen it argued that they might actually be related to Eothas/Gaun in his capacity as a god of spring and harvest; there's a tendency to focus on his more dramatic role as a god of the light and the sun, but it is possible that the manifestations of godlike might be influenced by cultural emphasis on deity's aspects and in that sense one of Eothas' role in seeing to abundance in harvest/fertility in nature does seem like something that may be of much more practical importance to people who live or die based on their crops' yield.

[Hound]

The way I like to see these recommendations handled if for Obsidian to have a "go-to" designer that they can simply put up a donation page for. WHen the community shows interest in a fan suggestion a donation page can be put up to sponsor the idea into development. 

 

For Godlikes I would simply place a portfolio of work by a few featured artists and see if there is enough interest in the designer's work. Then the game designer gets a quote from the artist and ask them to showcase future complete work on this website so it will generate forum buzz and allow Obsidian's community manager more material to share with bloggers and  news sites.

[Wormerine]

Money is one thing but time is another. I am sure Dimitri and Josh have other things on their mind and defining all possible godlike, their theme, connection to Gods, gameplay mechanic and writing them intro the story is quite a bit of work. I am sure they would like to have more races/variants but the variety is already there an it would take time and manpower which could be invested elsewhere. It is not a case of how much you could add but how much you should add.

[Blades of Vanatar]

There's also Gramrfel the Wayfarer, that wierdo death godlike who can meet you at the crossroads of Magrans Fork after first visiting Defiance Bay. Also, I think one of this companions can also be a moon godlike, not sure. I looked at the godlike category on the PoE wiki and there are also two bounty targets who are godlikes.

 

Apart from the bounties, yeah, that older drunk and Gramrfel the Wayfarer are the only non-backer godlike characters that I know of.

Isn't there a moon godlike in the encounter to get Wael's Scroll?

[Osvir]

 

Galawain has an association with nature, but that's just by dint of being the patron of carnivores. There isn't any deity that specifically represents nature.

 

While being the god of the hunt, predatory beasts, and assassins is primarily what he's known for, that isn't the extent of his connection to nature. Galawain is specifically the god of the wilderness and the guardian of such areas. He's also responsible for the creation of the Great Western Stag, so the Nature Godlike's greater resemblance to prey animals isn't necessarily proof that they aren't related to him.

 

That said, I have seen it argued that they might actually be related to Eothas/Gaun in his capacity as a god of spring and harvest; there's a tendency to focus on his more dramatic role as a god of the light and the sun, but it is possible that the manifestations of godlike might be influenced by cultural emphasis on deity's aspects and in that sense one of Eothas' role in seeing to abundance in harvest/fertility in nature does seem like something that may be of much more practical importance to people who live or die based on their crops' yield.

 

A) Maybe there's a diety for the "Earth" that isn't that common in the Dyrwood/Eastern Reach? Although, that'd be a tad bit weird, I dunno, seeing as the Glanfathans reside there and all.

 

B) Nature Godlike, as their description, are:

- Not very liked socially, "diseased". "Disease" and "Famine" being a trait of Rymgrand but...

- Nature Godlike has "Wellspring of Life" as their passive, which doesn't fit at all with that but more towards Eothas... but...

- They also have traits from plants and animals, "plants" being more of a correlation to "Spring" (blossoming of flowers and such, which relates to Eothas), but Animals relates to Galawain... BUT!

- I looked up the symbolism of "Stag" (which I think the Nature Godlike horns are most similar too) and the Stag is the "Protector of the Forest" or even "The King of the Forest", which is quite not what Galawain stands for... but at the same time he does. It's a bit of an oxymoron. Sure, I believe he wishes to preserve the forest, in terms of the "Hunt". And he is the Lord of all Beasts. But the Stag isn't a "Beast" in the predatory sense.

 

Sure, Galawain is all about nature, in terms of the aspect of "the Hunt". Animals in nature hunt each other, constantly, cycle of life and all that. Which isn't so much about "protecting" anything, it's simply "the hunt" in its "purest form" (paraphrasing). Predatory, not Protectory (is that a word? xD). Hence, I personally believe that Nature Godlike is not Galawain's children, but at the same time it could very well be. Brainstorming: The Stag being a protector of the wild, protector of the "hunt", in some shape or form.

 

With all that said, I still I like blotters theory that it could actually be Eothas children.

 

Finally, I'm curious whether Godlikes can have different physical traits. Does all Moon Godlike have a growth on their forehead? Are they all born to be all blue? Could they be different? Could some look like fish? Or like water? Could they be glowing white, like the moon?

 

Does all Fire Godlike burn? Or are some burnt out? Ash Godlikes? Or perhaps even overflowing with Lava?

 

In Galawain's picture we see him standing with 3 different animals by his side, does all of his children have different traits? As in, could one be a Wolf Godlike? Bear Godlike?

 

Hyleas children, are they all covered in feathers? Are there some who have feathers from an Eagle? Or a Mockingbird? Or are there some who have scales, like a dragon?

 

Get what I'm saying? One God, many children. I'm speculating lorewise, not playerwise. Is it possible? I asked Josh the question on his Tumblr but never got an answer (I was somewhat obviously fishing for Tekehu's parents). I also wondered if a child could have two parents (in this instance, Galawain father and Ondra mother). But oh well, we'll see at some point I suppose.

 

EDIT: Err, thinking about it and looking up some portraits on Nature Godlike, I guess they could also have Goat horns and/or Gazelle horns (which has the symbolism of liveliness and such). But one thing just stroke me and that's again Rymgrand, and one of his portfolio traits "Bad Luck". I'd say it's bad luck to be born a Nature Godlike, when the stigma is that they are diseased, and many are killed off at birth because of it (it's in their description). But again, it doesn't make sense, because Rymgrand is about winter and cold~ even has the alias "Beast of Winter", and Nature Godlikes are born with moss and fungi and has the whole sense of "Life" about them... *shrug*

 

BUT! Rymgrand is also the only Diety that has a symbol of a horned animal (albeit, it is a tad bit far-fetched)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aurochs

 

It might also be that the Dieties of Eora aren't as straight-forward and simple to understand, and hasn't had enough exposition to be understood completely either.

Edited July 31, 2017 by Osvir

[smjjames]

Actually, I had asked a question to the devs (I forget what thread though) about Moon godlikes having fin thingies on their forearms and they said no, which rules out Tekehu being a variant of Moon godlike.

 

Still, that's some interesting speculation with godlikes having varying appearances. The only thing stopping Obsidian from doing that is time and money.

[Osvir]

Actually, I had asked a question to the devs (I forget what thread though) about Moon godlikes having fin thingies on their forearms and they said no, which rules out Tekehu being a variant of Moon godlike.

 

Still, that's some interesting speculation with godlikes having varying appearances. The only thing stopping Obsidian from doing that is time and money.

Not speculating graphical investment, but rather... well... lore? Text based. Of course, that costs money too, but not as much as 3D models and similar. An entry in a lorebook, or revealed in dialogue and such.

[blotter]

A) Maybe there's a diety for the "Earth" that isn't that common in the Dyrwood/Eastern Reach? Although, that'd be a tad bit weird, I dunno, seeing as the Glanfathans reside there and all.

 

B) Nature Godlike, as their description, are:

 

- Not very liked socially, "diseased". "Disease" and "Famine" being a trait of Rymgrand but...

 

- Nature Godlike has "Wellspring of Life" as their passive, which doesn't fit at all with that but more towards Eothas... but...

 

- They also have traits from plants and animals, "plants" being more of a correlation to "Spring" (blossoming of flowers and such, which relates to Eothas), but Animals relates to Galawain... BUT!

- I looked up the symbolism of "Stag" (which I think the Nature Godlike horns are most similar too) and the Stag is the "Protector of the Forest" or even "The King of the Forest", which is quite not what Galawain stands for... but at the same time he does. It's a bit of an oxymoron. Sure, I believe he wishes to preserve the forest, in terms of the "Hunt". And he is the Lord of all Beasts. But the Stag isn't a "Beast" in the predatory sense.

 

 

It might be the case that while some godlike are commonly associated with a particular god as far as people in Eora are concerned, that the different types in the game aren't necessarily tied exclusively to one god or another. Just as there are different gods associated different aspects of death, there might be individual death godlike whose characteristics lean more towards the distinct representations of death that Berath, Gaun, or Rymrgand cover, for example. Similarly, some nature godlike might have closer ties to Eothas' spring and fertility aspects than Galawain's nature as survival of the fittest paradigm.

 

One thing that I do want to point out, though, is that when I called Galawain the guardian of nature, those weren't my words aside from a little paraphrasing (the exact words from the first guidebook were "he is also protector of wild places and untamed wilderness, where the hunt manifests in its purest form as a daily struggle for survival"). And while he's the god of the hunt, that doesn't make him exclusively tied to hunters per se: remember that he also delights in shifts and reversals in the predator-prey dynamic, so he's someone the hunted might also turn to for guidance and inspiration. The orlans are some of his most ardent followers and they represent this blurring of the lines pretty well: while predominantly centered around nomadic hunter-gatherer lifestyles themselves, they often find themselves the prey of other kith both in the sense that outside their own environments they're often relegated to slavery or worse and in the sense that in many cases they literally have to adopt the techniques and mindset of prey animals to avoid this fate.

 

 

With all that said, I still I like blotters theory that it could actually be Eothas children.

 

 

It's someone else's theory, I just paraphrased it.

 

 

Finally, I'm curious whether Godlikes can have different physical traits. Does all Moon Godlike have a growth on their forehead? Are they all born to be all blue? Could they be different? Could some look like fish? Or like water? Could they be glowing white, like the moon?

 

 

Godlike can have different traits. Like I mentioned earlier, the guidebook's race entry for them doesn't even specifically call out godlike by the types they're classified into in the game, so the idea that those types are particularly meaningful outside of what's convenient for the game or definitive of how they actually "work" in Eora general may be misleading: a godlike with ties to Ondra might exhibit affinities for her moon goddess aspect and her sea goddess aspect, but in that case it may be more productive to simply described the godlike as being tied to Ondra rather than trying to pin them down as a moon godlike or sea godlike. The pnp stuff they come up with may clarify this further as well, as may dialogue with Tekehu.

 

In any case what the guidebook has to say on the subject of godlike is this: 

 

 

It's not accurate to say that there is only one ethnicity of godlike because most godlike are fundamentally unique. Even if there are physiological similarities between two godlike, the circumstances of their birth and upbringing mean those similarities don't mean much.

There are only two constants for godlike. First, the shape of their heads is distinctly and obviously unlike any other kith. It's virtually impossible for them to conceal their nature without drawing an enormous amount of attention.

Second, godlike limbs are always covered in some sort of growth (scales, feathers, talons, etc.) or energy that is also obviously not like other kith (...)

 

 

Then it goes into features that carry over from their parent races and examples of variations in godlike features, like some having goat eyes or appearing to have gold for skin (which sounds like a recipe for a short and miserable life; I wonder how much gold godlike skin sells for...)