San Bernadino shooting

[Qistina]

 

 

Seems this guy was radicalized by his wife.

 

They just got married and having 6 month old baby, nonsense

 

How come a woman who just 6 month after giving birth playng COD with the police?

 

 

Yet she was?

 

 

You are not a woman, so you don't know

[Drowsy Emperor]

So what are you implying, that he made her do it?

[Guard Dog]

I've found that a woman who was really... REALLY good in bed can talk a man into doing almost anything.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

I've found that a woman who was really... REALLY good in bed can talk a man into doing almost anything.

I don't think this thread is the place to talk about how you got the butterfly trampstamp.

[licketysplit]

Evidence seems to point to them being radical jihadists

 

With this in mind, I wonder if we'll start seeing more lone wolf attacks from jihadists rather than coordinated attacks?

 

That is potentially the new strategy of Isis, much easier than carrying out huge, coordinated attacks. I've no doubt Obama and all his libtard apologist cronies will drag their feet in response to each and every one.  

[Qistina]

So what are you implying, that he made her do it?

 

i am implying the whole thing is fishy and there is something wrong about it

[Guard Dog]

 

I've found that a woman who was really... REALLY good in bed can talk a man into doing almost anything.

I don't think this thread is the place to talk about how you got the butterfly trampstamp.

 

[Wrath of Dagon]

Neighbor didn't report suspicious activity for fear of being called racist : http://dailycaller.com/2015/12/03/shooters-neighbor-didnt-report-suspicious-activity-for-fear-of-being-labeled-racist-video/ Nice job CAIR!

 

CAIR blames the attack on the US for not doing enough to help Muslim Brotherhood : http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/12/04/muslim-leader-from-cair-tells-cnn-america-bears-some-blame-for-terror-attacks/?intcmp=hpbt1

[HoonDing]

Cherchez la femme.

 

How's that in Arabic?

[Malcador]

Neighbor didn't report suspicious activity for fear of being called racist : http://dailycaller.com/2015/12/03/shooters-neighbor-didnt-report-suspicious-activity-for-fear-of-being-labeled-racist-video/ Nice job CAIR!

 

CAIR blames the attack on the US for not doing enough to help Muslim Brotherhood : http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/12/04/muslim-leader-from-cair-tells-cnn-america-bears-some-blame-for-terror-attacks/?intcmp=hpbt1

Whoa..brown people getting packages and working in their garage. Very suspicious.

 

Hard to encourage vigilance like that without encouraging the wrong atmosphere.

[Wrath of Dagon]

Well, we've seen the result of the "right" atmosphere. Edit: Yes, working in their garage building pipe bombs.

Edited December 5, 2015 by Wrath of Dagon

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

So is the solution to call in every instance of package delivery and/or working in the garage?

[Wrath of Dagon]

If it looks suspicious, better safe than sorry. It's a Homeland Security slogan : "If you see something, say something", then they threaten to prosecute you if you do: http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/12/04/loretta-lynch-muslim-group-doj-investigate-arrest-clock-boy-ahmed/

[Hurlshort]

 

Seems this guy was radicalized by his wife.

 

I don't think he needed that much convincing. He did go to Saudi Arabia to find a wife.

 

 

So, totally not another Islamic terror attack huh?

 

>BUT LETS NOT CONDEMN AN ENTIRE GROUP OVER

 

 

 

Does it seem reasonable to condemn nearly 2 billion people every time there is an Islamic terror attack?

 

Is that going to solve any problems within Islam?  Is that going to stop Islamic terror attacks?

[Sakai]

 

 

Seems this guy was radicalized by his wife.

 

I don't think he needed that much convincing. He did go to Saudi Arabia to find a wife.

 

 

So, totally not another Islamic terror attack huh?

 

>BUT LETS NOT CONDEMN AN ENTIRE GROUP OVER

 

 

 

Does it seem reasonable to condemn nearly 2 billion people every time there is an Islamic terror attack?

 

Is that going to solve any problems within Islam?  Is that going to stop Islamic terror attacks?

 

Spoiler alert, it won't help.

[Drowsy Emperor]

 

 

Seems this guy was radicalized by his wife.

 

I don't think he needed that much convincing. He did go to Saudi Arabia to find a wife.

 

 

So, totally not another Islamic terror attack huh?

 

>BUT LETS NOT CONDEMN AN ENTIRE GROUP OVER

 

 

 

Does it seem reasonable to condemn nearly 2 billion people every time there is an Islamic terror attack?

 

Is that going to solve any problems within Islam?  Is that going to stop Islamic terror attacks?

 

 

It was a facetious post, making fun of the willfully blind attitude that Islam is not the problem in these attacks. It may not be the only problem, but it definitely is a part of it.

 

However, please tell me what your solution is, that you can prove has shown results. 

Edited December 5, 2015 by Drowsy Emperor

[Hurlshort]

 

 

It was a facetious post, making fun of the willfully blind attitude that Islam is not the problem in these attacks. It may not be the only problem, but it definitely is a part of it.

 

However, please tell me what your solution is, that you can prove has shown results. 

 

 

I'd probably go with a strong dose of commercialism.  Basically the Christmas model.  It's worked pretty dang well.

[Drowsy Emperor]

I don't know about that. The guy that did this shooting was a relatively well off US citizen. Living in about as commercial an environment as anyone can imagine. 

[Gromnir]

 

 

 

Seems this guy was radicalized by his wife.

 

I don't think he needed that much convincing. He did go to Saudi Arabia to find a wife.

 

 

So, totally not another Islamic terror attack huh?

 

>BUT LETS NOT CONDEMN AN ENTIRE GROUP OVER

 

 

 

Does it seem reasonable to condemn nearly 2 billion people every time there is an Islamic terror attack?

 

Is that going to solve any problems within Islam?  Is that going to stop Islamic terror attacks?

 

Spoiler alert, it won't help.

 

islam does have a problem.  is not as if other religions is free o' terrorists and extremists, but in 2015, it requires a special kinda obtuseness to ignore how much more common extremism is in islam compared to the world's other major religions.  in Gromnir's opinion, blame muslims as a whole is a mistake, but there is a correlation worthy o' inspection. our personal opinion is that poverty, lack o' education, denial o' basic human freedoms and geography is the primary causes o' prevalence o' extremism, but when the terrorists is quoting from their holy book as justifications for their murders and rapes, it is understandable that people will be seeing a connection.  there IS a correlation.  

 

point out branch davidians in texas or jonestown in guyana as examples o' christian nutters willing to shed copious blood in the name o' religion only highlights the problem that islam has.  christian extremism is far more rare, and people is being reasonable when they question why is so much more common with islam.

 

what  makes matters worse is when we hear from s'posed moderate muslims and we is confronted with their ignorance.  ignorant regarding personal freedoms in the west.  spout anti-semitic nonsense while decrying misunderstandings o' islam.  link to conspiracy nutters as sources o' proof o' western evils or angelic islam?  many o' the stereotypes we is told don't actual exist and is creations o' the media is validated for us, so...

 

am thinking it is right to not blame islam, 'cause actual problems is far more simple, but more pervasive and insidious.  however, am thinking we does a disservice to truth if we do not at least question the obvious and disproportionate correlation 'tween islam and violence when compared to other major religions.  the discussion should occur, but far too often in the west o' 2015, issues o' race and religion and even sex is too sensitive to be having frank and open discussions.   inability to discuss like rational folks for fear o' causing "disharmony" results in further polarization o' beliefs.

 

so, what happens now?  on almost same day obama tells folks that there is no credible threat from isis to americans in america, we got a mass shooting wherein at least one killer is posting her allegiance to isis via social media.  do we have open discussions and try to figure out why this tragedy happened in southern ca as 'posed to southern lebanon, or do we refuse debate, thereby contributing to increased polarization and distrust?  a week ago, a muslim in so cal shouting 'bout US support o' israel or continued presence o' american troops in the middle east woulda' gotten little reaction from most listeners.  today?  if even 5% o' listeners is more suspicious o' their muslim neighbors, that is a huge number given total populations we is talking 'bout.

 

hurl is a teacher o' middle school students, so am not expecting him to look for deep insights from his young students, but we has seen recent that it is difficult for teachers to have open discussions with students regarding matters o' race, sex and religion.  teachers need be extreme careful not to offend.  hurl is aware o' the student teacher who were chastised recently for asking students to create propaganda posters that support terror?  virtual every news agency and pundit opined that it were a bad idea to do such a thing.  am understanding why doing such a thing in this political climate is bad, but were the lesson bad? teacher wrong? show kids propoganda posters from ww1 and ww2 and a dozen other conflicts. have discussions 'bout the power and dangers o' propaganda.  ask students to write a paper on propaganda following a lesson on such would raise no eyebrows, 'but 'cause young teacher tries a more creative exercise, he/she were chastised publicly... nationally.  

 

so, we stay silent.  in effort not to offend, we ironically increase polarization o' belief.  in an effort to protect women and native americans and sikhs (is sikhs plural o' sikh... doesn't sound right) we discourage folks to speak that which might offend.  those compelled to stay silent 'cause o' social stigma are deprived o' the opportunity to change.  

 

"Those who won our independence by revolution were not cowards. They did not fear political change. They did not exalt order at the cost of liberty. To courageous, self-reliant men, with confidence in the power of free and fearless reasoning applied through the processes of popular government, no danger flowing from speech can be deemed clear and present, unless the incidence of the evil apprehended is so imminent that it may befall before there is opportunity for full discussion. If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."

 

we got real free speech here in the US.  however, the social pressures we willingly impose on ourselves is a far more immediate threat to truth and education than is the legal burdens.  admitted, those social limits is not necessarily a bad thing.  is the guys aspergers who cannot self censor, yes?  even so, the current political and social climate is such that far too many topics is functional verboten.

 

so, yeah, we agree that islam is not at fault, but we do believe that the frequent (not necessarily hurl) knee-jerk defense o' every religious and ethnic group is equal harmful.  far too often the suggestion that islam or the arab world has a problem is met with accusations o' racism or bigotry.  there is a correlation. discuss. if we don't educate now, we will only increase fear and polarization.

 

HA! Good Fun!

Edited December 5, 2015 by Gromnir

[Leferd]

 

 

 

 

Seems this guy was radicalized by his wife.

 

 

I don't think he needed that much convincing. He did go to Saudi Arabia to find a wife.

 

 

So, totally not another Islamic terror attack huh?

 

>BUT LETS NOT CONDEMN AN ENTIRE GROUP OVER

 

Does it seem reasonable to condemn nearly 2 billion people every time there is an Islamic terror attack?

 

Is that going to solve any problems within Islam?  Is that going to stop Islamic terror attacks?

Spoiler alert, it won't help.

islam does have a problem.  is not as if other religions is free o' terrorists and extremists, but in 2015, it requires a special kinda obtuseness to ignore how much more common extremism is in islam compared to the world's other major religions.  in Gromnir's opinion, blame muslims as a whole is a mistake, but there is a correlation worthy o' inspection. our personal opinion is that poverty, lack o' education, denial o' basic human freedoms and geography is the primary causes o' prevalence o' extremism, but when the terrorists is quoting from their holy book as justifications for their murders and rapes, it is understandable that people will be seeing a connection.  there IS a correlation.  

 

point out branch davidians in texas or jonestown in guyana as examples o' christian nutters willing to shed copious blood in the name o' religion only highlights the problem that islam has.  christian extremism is far more rare, and people is being reasonable when they question why is so much more common with islam.

 

what  makes matters worse is when we hear from s'posed moderate muslims and we is confronted with their ignorance.  ignorant regarding personal freedoms in the west.  spout anti-semitic nonsense while decrying misunderstandings o' islam.  link to conspiracy nutters as sources o' proof o' western evils or angelic islam?  many o' the stereotypes we is told don't actual exist and is creations o' the media is validated for us, so...

 

am thinking it is right to not blame islam, 'cause actual problems is far more simple, but more pervasive and insidious.  however, am thinking we does a disservice to truth if we do not at least question the obvious and disproportionate correlation 'tween islam and violence when compared to other major religions.  the discussion should occur, but far too often in the west o' 2015, issues o' race and religion and even sex is too sensitive to be having frank and open discussions.   inability to discuss like rational folks for fear o' causing "disharmony" results in further polarization o' beliefs.

 

so, what happens now?  on almost same day obama tells folks that there is no credible threat from isis to americans in america, we got a mass shooting wherein at least one killer is posting her allegiance to isis via social media.  do we have open discussions and try to figure out why this tragedy happened in southern ca as 'posed to southern beirut, or do we refuse debate, thereby contributing to increased polarization and distrust?  a week ago, a muslim in so cal shouting 'bout US support o' israel or continued presence o' american troops in the middle east woulda' gotten little reaction from most listeners.  today?  if even 5% o' listeners is more suspicious o' their muslim neighbors, that is a huge number given total populations we is talking 'bout.

 

hurl is a teacher o' middle school students, so am not expecting him to look for deep insights from his young students, but we has seen recent that it is difficult for teachers to have open discussions with students regarding matters o' race, sex and religion.  teachers need be extreme careful not to offend.  hurl is aware o' the student teacher who were chastised recently for asking students to create propaganda posters that support terror?  virtual every news agency and pundit opined that it were a bad idea to do such a thing.  am understanding why doing such a thing in this political climate is bad, but were the lesson bad? teacher wrong? show kids propoganda posters from ww1 and ww2 and a dozen other conflicts. have discussions 'bout the power and dangers o' propaganda.  ask students to write a paper on propaganda following a lesson on such would raise no eyebrows, 'but 'cause young teacher tries a more creative exercise, he/she were chastised publicly... nationally.  

 

so, we stay silent.  in effort not to offend, we ironically increase polarization o' belief.  in an effort to protect women and native americans and sikhs (is sikhs plural o' sikh... doesn't sound right) we discourage folks to speak that which might offend.  those compelled to stay silent 'cause o' social stigma are deprived o' the opportunity to change.  

 

"Those who won our independence by revolution were not cowards. They did not fear political change. They did not exalt order at the cost of liberty. To courageous, self-reliant men, with confidence in the power of free and fearless reasoning applied through the processes of popular government, no danger flowing from speech can be deemed clear and present, unless the incidence of the evil apprehended is so imminent that it may befall before there is opportunity for full discussion. If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."

 

we got real free speech here in the US.  however, the social pressures we willingly impose on ourselves is a far more immediate threat to truth and education than is the legal burdens.  admitted, those social limits is not necessarily a bad thing.  is the guys aspergers who cannot self censor, yes?  even so, the current political and social climate is such that far too many topics is functional verboten.

 

so, yeah, we agree that islam is not at fault, but we do believe that the frequent (not necessarily hurl) knee-jerk defense o' every religious and ethnic group is equal harmful.  far too often the suggestion that islam or the arab world has a problem is met with accusations o' racism or bigotry.  there is a correlation. discuss. if we don't educate now, we will only increase fear and polarization.

 

HA! Good Fun!

Thank you Gromnir. We share the same feelings on the matter but you put it in a far more clever and nuanced manner than I would even begin to try.

[Tigranes]

I have little issue with posts like Gromnir's. There is no question of 'defending Islam' here. Islam deserves neither defense nor villification. The problem is that thoughtless people who get bug-eyed yelling ITS AN ISLAM INVASION think that everyone who disagrees with them are Islam-loving America-hating "but it's the guns it's got nothing to do with them being Muslim" people. The truth is that both extremes are terrible.

 

Here, let's make it simple. Some killers are Muslim extremists. Other killers are white supremacist / right-wing extremists. Yet other killers have ambiguous or unknown ideological motives, but are clearly extremist in their application. What is the number one thing you want to tackle there? Extremism. You don't get rid of them all by deporting all the Muslims, and you don't get rid of them all by deporting all white people. 

 

There is, as Gromnir says, a need to speak clearly, honestly, and reasonably about issues - without being afraid to be 'offensive' to Muslims or Christians or whoever else. And you know what? The first step is to take all the ridiculous blanket "I know the answer [islam/Guns/X] is just terrible" statements and throw them out of the room. We have a problem of lots of individuals going on killing sprees. That's the problem that needs to be solved. You want to focus on the Muslim extremist killers and solve that problem? OK, let's talk about it. And if Islam as a whole needs to be brought to the table so be it. But a lot of people - including people in this thread - just use someone else's death as an excuse to indulge their illogical and contemptible opinions like the wife being ugly or people who go to Saudi to get a wife asking for it. That kind of pollutant is the first thing we need to get rid of to have a proper conversation in this country. Not because it's anti-Islam or anti-guns or whatever, who cares, but because it stops people from figuring out ways to stop attacks in the real world.

[Meshugger]

 

 

 

 

Seems this guy was radicalized by his wife.

 

I don't think he needed that much convincing. He did go to Saudi Arabia to find a wife.

 

 

So, totally not another Islamic terror attack huh?

 

>BUT LETS NOT CONDEMN AN ENTIRE GROUP OVER

 

 

 

Does it seem reasonable to condemn nearly 2 billion people every time there is an Islamic terror attack?

 

Is that going to solve any problems within Islam?  Is that going to stop Islamic terror attacks?

 

Spoiler alert, it won't help.

 

islam does have a problem.  is not as if other religions is free o' terrorists and extremists, but in 2015, it requires a special kinda obtuseness to ignore how much more common extremism is in islam compared to the world's other major religions.  in Gromnir's opinion, blame muslims as a whole is a mistake, but there is a correlation worthy o' inspection. our personal opinion is that poverty, lack o' education, denial o' basic human freedoms and geography is the primary causes o' prevalence o' extremism, but when the terrorists is quoting from their holy book as justifications for their murders and rapes, it is understandable that people will be seeing a connection.  there IS a correlation.  

 

point out branch davidians in texas or jonestown in guyana as examples o' christian nutters willing to shed copious blood in the name o' religion only highlights the problem that islam has.  christian extremism is far more rare, and people is being reasonable when they question why is so much more common with islam.

 

what  makes matters worse is when we hear from s'posed moderate muslims and we is confronted with their ignorance.  ignorant regarding personal freedoms in the west.  spout anti-semitic nonsense while decrying misunderstandings o' islam.  link to conspiracy nutters as sources o' proof o' western evils or angelic islam?  many o' the stereotypes we is told don't actual exist and is creations o' the media is validated for us, so...

 

am thinking it is right to not blame islam, 'cause actual problems is far more simple, but more pervasive and insidious.  however, am thinking we does a disservice to truth if we do not at least question the obvious and disproportionate correlation 'tween islam and violence when compared to other major religions.  the discussion should occur, but far too often in the west o' 2015, issues o' race and religion and even sex is too sensitive to be having frank and open discussions.   inability to discuss like rational folks for fear o' causing "disharmony" results in further polarization o' beliefs.

 

so, what happens now?  on almost same day obama tells folks that there is no credible threat from isis to americans in america, we got a mass shooting wherein at least one killer is posting her allegiance to isis via social media.  do we have open discussions and try to figure out why this tragedy happened in southern ca as 'posed to southern lebanon, or do we refuse debate, thereby contributing to increased polarization and distrust?  a week ago, a muslim in so cal shouting 'bout US support o' israel or continued presence o' american troops in the middle east woulda' gotten little reaction from most listeners.  today?  if even 5% o' listeners is more suspicious o' their muslim neighbors, that is a huge number given total populations we is talking 'bout.

 

hurl is a teacher o' middle school students, so am not expecting him to look for deep insights from his young students, but we has seen recent that it is difficult for teachers to have open discussions with students regarding matters o' race, sex and religion.  teachers need be extreme careful not to offend.  hurl is aware o' the student teacher who were chastised recently for asking students to create propaganda posters that support terror?  virtual every news agency and pundit opined that it were a bad idea to do such a thing.  am understanding why doing such a thing in this political climate is bad, but were the lesson bad? teacher wrong? show kids propoganda posters from ww1 and ww2 and a dozen other conflicts. have discussions 'bout the power and dangers o' propaganda.  ask students to write a paper on propaganda following a lesson on such would raise no eyebrows, 'but 'cause young teacher tries a more creative exercise, he/she were chastised publicly... nationally.  

 

so, we stay silent.  in effort not to offend, we ironically increase polarization o' belief.  in an effort to protect women and native americans and sikhs (is sikhs plural o' sikh... doesn't sound right) we discourage folks to speak that which might offend.  those compelled to stay silent 'cause o' social stigma are deprived o' the opportunity to change.  

 

"Those who won our independence by revolution were not cowards. They did not fear political change. They did not exalt order at the cost of liberty. To courageous, self-reliant men, with confidence in the power of free and fearless reasoning applied through the processes of popular government, no danger flowing from speech can be deemed clear and present, unless the incidence of the evil apprehended is so imminent that it may befall before there is opportunity for full discussion. If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."

 

we got real free speech here in the US.  however, the social pressures we willingly impose on ourselves is a far more immediate threat to truth and education than is the legal burdens.  admitted, those social limits is not necessarily a bad thing.  is the guys aspergers who cannot self censor, yes?  even so, the current political and social climate is such that far too many topics is functional verboten.

 

so, yeah, we agree that islam is not at fault, but we do believe that the frequent (not necessarily hurl) knee-jerk defense o' every religious and ethnic group is equal harmful.  far too often the suggestion that islam or the arab world has a problem is met with accusations o' racism or bigotry.  there is a correlation. discuss. if we don't educate now, we will only increase fear and polarization.

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

 

Throwing some gasoline to Gromnir's fire.....

 

From what we can see is that in regions in Asia such as The Philippines and Thailand, it is local issue of minority muslims wanting to live in separate societies with their own laws. In Europe, like in Albania, Bosnia and Kosovo (and it is brewing in The former Jugoslav Republic of Macedonia) it is more a cultural thing, as like minded people wanting a place of their own with their peers, but without separate laws in practice compared to neighbouring countries. In Sub-Saharan Africa it's simply pure tribal brutality no matter what religion you adhere to, Islam is just one of many. All while in middle east it is a matter of re-establish a caliphate and out-islaming one another. The common thread, while manifested differently in different regions due to local culture and ethnicity, is that it seeks to separate if it is a minority and dominate if it is in majority and that pretty much colludes with the western idea of freedom of association and social mobility. This has to be allowed to openly discussed and debated on how that can have anything to do within western society.

 

While Islam in itself is not the culprit, it is as i said before, it is working as a magnet for people with violent, bigoted and sadistic tendencies with it's message of submission, justified warfare, acceptance of death for apostacy and apologetical view of slavery. That has to be openly discussed and debated on how it can have anything to do within western society.

 

Note that i base this on the main two branches, Sunni and Shia. There's also Sufi, which is i think the only possible version of Islam that works with the modern world, as it is about meditation, dancing and aspiring to be closer to God. They reject Jihad, Taqiya, and don't see Muhammed's life as anything to aspire to when it came to worldly matters, which pretty much throws the multiple wives, slavery and warfare out of the window. Kinda like hippies really. This kind of Islam needs to be promoted IMO. 

 

 

That being said, this is based on Islam in modern times. there's some interesting moments in its history. For example, the black stone of Kaaba in Mecca was once stoled by a sect of militant vegetarians, called the "The Qarmatians"

 

 In January 930, it was stolen by the Qarmatians, who carried the Black Stone away to their base in Hajar (modern Bahrain). According to Ottoman historian Qutb al-Din, writing in 1857, Qarmatian leader Abu Tahir al-Qarmati set the Black Stone up in his own mosque, the Masjid al-Dirar, with the intention of redirecting the hajj away from Mecca. However, this failed, and pilgrims continued to venerate the spot where the Black Stone had been.  

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaaba

[Malcador]

Well, we've seen the result of the "right" atmosphere. Edit: Yes, working in their garage building pipe bombs.

Sadly that is the price of a free society, though. No one wants to live in a place where you have to live in fear of your neighbours ratting you out to the State, I would hope. I feel that regardless of who ever the target might be. Hard to believe getting a lot of packages and working in their garage alone is suspicious, no ?

[Volourn]

Funny whenever I ehar that we wouldn't villify all white people for the crimes of some single white person it makes me chuckle at the irony bull**** that people will spew without thought. ARE YOU KIDDING ME?

 

'White guilt' exists for a reason.Ask anyone who is guilty of slavery and they'll say all white people. I have never owned, purchased or beat a slave. I have never harmed  an Indian/ Native yuet somehow I am blamed for all the wrongs done to them in the past and/or others.

 

Just check Kanada now. Lots of hoopla about native women going missing (majority of which are linked directly to other natuives) yet somehow it is the white man's fault. COME ON.

 

But, hey, let's continue to make excuses for Extremist Islam.  Blame everyone but  what is responble. Blame the guns but guns did not teach these two to eb full of hate. That was Islam.

 

DEAL WITH THAT UGLY TRUTH.

[Wrath of Dagon]

 

Well, we've seen the result of the "right" atmosphere. Edit: Yes, working in their garage building pipe bombs.

Sadly that is the price of a free society, though. No one wants to live in a place where you have to live in fear of your neighbours ratting you out to the State, I would hope. I feel that regardless of who ever the target might be. Hard to believe getting a lot of packages and working in their garage alone is suspicious, no ?

 

No, it's a price of a stupid, PC society. You live in fear of your neighbor? You think this is Stalin's Soviet Union, where the next day you're reported you disappear forever? At most the FBI would run you through their database, and probably not even that. The neighbor thought it was suspicious, you don't need to have iron clad proof to be suspicious, it's not the same as a conviction.